₦airaland Forum

Sir, Jesus never said the sword was for the event you claimed. If so, then I ask you again, what about the other items he mentioned (purse and bag)? We're they also used that night? The context was the journey his disciples are about to begin without his physical presence (like weaning a baby or freeing an apprentice). They must take up certain responsibilities as enabled by God. Your kind of interpretation of scripture is what landed the church in a state of always looking up for things God already placed withing our reach. We are meant to grow and not remain babies. That growth is all encompassing. Jesus was, and still is preparing his followers for a hostile world.

Kobojunkie:
Pay attention to actual context of the events of that night...

Jesus Christ said all that to alert to the fact that very night- the now - that scripture was to be fulfilled. That which was written in Isaiah about Him was to be fulfilled that same evening.
He requested they get the sword for that very event.

Gagare1:
Sir, Jesus never said the sword was for the event you claimed. If so, then I ask you again, what about the other items he mentioned (purse and bag)? We're they also used that night? The context was the journey his disciples are about to begin without his physical presence (like weaning a baby or freeing an apprentice). They must take up certain responsibilities as enabled by God. Your kind of interpretation of scripture is what landed the church in a state of always looking up for things God already placed withing our reach. We are meant to grow and not remain babies. That growth is all encompassing. Jesus was, and still is preparing his followers for a hostile world.

Do you understand Jesus' words much more than his first century disciples?

Because according to the account of Act of Apostles they never defended themselves from attacks, in fact they were all killed and there was no record of their use of weapons to defend themselves!

Jesus' instruction that they should get purses, food and sword is something you need to be enlightened on what he meant so if you want to understand that part i'm here with you because according to that part the Apostles said they had TWO swords with them while Jesus said each of them should get his own sword, and they are ELEVEN in number.
So how could TWO swords be enough for ELEVEN people when their master just told them each must have his personal sword?

Well i am Maximus, one of Jehovah's Witnesses, if you're interested in knowing what Jesus meant in that place i can help you but if you're not interested no wahala!

Kobojunkie:
Jesus Christ didn't redeem mankind with His blood. Instead He provided for mankind a path to redemption by the shedding of His blood which is completely different from what you claimed.

U lie.

Gagare1:
Sir, Jesus never said the sword was for the event you claimed. If so, then I ask you again, what about the other items he mentioned (purse and bag)? We're they also used that night? The context was the journey his disciples are about to begin without his physical presence (like weaning a baby or freeing an apprentice). They must take up certain responsibilities as enabled by God. Your kind of interpretation of scripture is what landed the church in a state of always looking up for things God already placed withing our reach. We are meant to grow and not remain babies. That growth is all encompassing. Jesus was, and still is preparing his followers for a hostile world.

I see you are still refusing to pay attention to the context which was the NOW that Jesus Christ spoke of to His disciples that very night.

That night the disciples were almost arrested as criminals, so the bags and purses were for when they instead ran away and went into hiding.

The sword however was what made them criminals that night, this in order that what Isaiah spoke of Jesus Christ in Isaiah 53 vs 12 was fulfilled, just as Jesus Christ said.

Truvelisback:
U lie.

Read what Jesus Christ Himself said in Matthew 26 vs 28 - 30 about the reason for the shedding of His blood.

Read what the same Jesus Christ said of who He infact is in John 14 vs 3 - 7, " I am The Way, the Truth and the Life!. No one comes to the Father except through Me..."

Jesus Christ is The Way, God's path to redemption for those who will choose to come to Him, God.

Kobojunkie:
I see you are still refusing to pay attention to the context which was the NOW that Jesus Christ spoke of to His disciples that very night.

That night the disciples were almost arrested as criminals, so the bags and purses were for when they instead ran away and went into hiding.

The sword however was what made them criminals that night, this in order that what Isaiah spoke of Jesus Christ in Isaiah 53 vs 12 was fulfilled, just as Jesus Christ said.

When Jesus mentions a principle, practice, or anything of sort that was held in the past, then said "but now I tell you" it means means he is giving a new principle, practice, or anything of sort that should have been in the place of the former. He came to restore our ability to rule over the earth in all ramifications (lost at the fall). He is telling them "Guys, I footed all the bills while I was physically with you, but from now hence forth, you have what it takes to do what I did". So make provision for your safety and welfare. You have Kingdom resources at your disposal and a physical body to act it out.
If you still don't get it, then you need that picture you pasted at my mention so much more than I do.
I'm done here.

Gagare1:
1. When Jesus mentions a principle, practice, or anything of sort that was held in the past, then said "but now I tell you" it means means he is giving a new principle, practice, or anything of sort that should have been in the place of the former.

2. He came to restore our ability to rule over the earth in all ramifications (lost at the fall).

3. He is telling them "Guys, I footed all the bills while I was physically with you, but from now hence forth, you have what it takes to do what I did".

4. So make provision for your safety and welfare. You have Kingdom resources at your disposal and a physical body to act it out.
If you still don't get it, then you need that picture you pasted at my mention so much more than I do.
I'm done here.

1. Let's assume for one second that what you said of principles makes sense, then where do you place Jesus Christ's direct answer to the question that was asked by His disciples then?

47 While Jesus was speaking, a crowd came up. It was led by Judas, one of the twelve apostles. He came over to Jesus to kiss him.
48 But Jesus said to him, “Judas, are you using the kiss of friendship to hand over the Son of Man to his enemies?”
49 The followers of Jesus were standing there too. They saw what was happening and said to Jesus, “Lord, should we use our swords?”
50 And one of them did use his sword. He cut off the right ear of the servant of the high priest.
51 Jesus said, “Stop!” Then he touched the servant’s ear and healed him.

52 Jesus spoke to the group that came to arrest him. They were the leading priests, the older Jewish leaders, and the Jewish soldiers. He said to them, “Why did you come out here with swords and clubs? Do you think I am a criminal?
53 I was with you every day in the Temple area. Why didn’t you try to arrest me there? But this is your time—the time when darkness rules.” - Luke 22 vs 47 - 53

Jesus Christ's answer was "Stop", after which He proceeded to mend the damage inflicted by one of His own. If He had been teaching a principle as you claim, surely it would make sense to observe that His answer was a No to violence, or does that not work at all with the spin you have of that night's events?

Also pay attention to what Jesus Christ said there in verse 52 which I highlighted.

2. Jesus Christ never said He came to restore man's ability to rule the earth.

Of what use is this ruling the earth when you are no longer of the earth the moment you become born-again and are hence to focus on becoming a trusted and faithful servant for your master who is instead of the Kingdom of God??

3. And what Jesus Christ did was serve men, not fight or rule. He told His followers to serve as He did - Matthew 20 vs 24 - 28

4. Jesus Christ taught His followers that it is those who loose their life that will save it whereas those who save their lives will loose it. I guess that teaching of His also went over your head since here you all but conclude that when Jesus Christ explicitly commanded His followers not to fight back, He, Jesus Christ lied..

Kobojunkie:
Read what Jesus Christ Himself said in Matthew 26 vs 28 - 30 about the reason for the shedding of His blood.

Read what the same Jesus Christ said of who He infact is in John 14 vs 3 - 7, " I am The Way, the Truth and the Life!. No one comes to the Father except through Me..."

Jesus Christ is The Way, God's path to redemption for those who will choose to come to Him, God.

U are just confusing urself. Without Shedding of Blood, there is no Remission of Sins.

Truvelisback:
U are just confusing urself. Without Shedding of Blood, there is no Remission of Sins.

The sins of the Jews - those who were sinners whom Jesus Christ came to call - who decided to become Christians were remitted, this altogether by His Death, not just the shedding of His Blood.

You were born a Gentile, so Remission of Sins(Old Covenant Sins) does not apply to you. Instead, what Jesus Christ provided you, along with everyone else is the Way to redemption through God's New Covenant/Law.

Gagare1:
When Jesus mentions a principle, practice, or anything of sort that was held in the past, then said "but now I tell you" it means means he is giving a new principle, practice, or anything of sort that should have been in the place of the former. He came to restore our ability to rule over the earth in all ramifications (lost at the fall).

On the contrary Jesus warned his own disciples not to participate in world politics {John 17:14-16} because they're not part of the world under Satan's control {John 14:30; 2Corinthians 4:4; 1John 5:19} they can't rule the world where satanists wins the largest population and still remain spotless!

He is telling them "Guys, I footed all the bills while I was physically with you, but from now hence forth, you have what it takes to do what I did". So make provision for your safety and welfare. You have Kingdom resources at your disposal and a physical body to act it out.

Jesus never carry any money after he left his carpentry work that's why he had to send them to go catch a fish when they were charged to pay the temple tax {Matthew 17:17-24 compare to Exodus 3:13-14} in fact everything they needed was provided by their fellow Israelites who knew God's law that they must be kind to strangers {Leviticus 19:34; Deuteronomy 10:19} God purposely gave them this law in preparation for the time the Christ will visit them in their homes! Luke 19:9

If you still don't get it, then you need that picture you pasted at my mention so much more than I do.
I'm done here.

So when Jesus sent his disciples to go only to the Israelites {Matthew 10:6} they were well treated due to provisions for strangers according to God's laws. Luke 9:2-3 compare to Luke 22:35
But now that they are to go abroad such they shouldn't expect such provisions because they are crossing the boarders of Israel where the laws that protect the interest of strangers don't exist.

So Jesus is hereby telling them that they must provide for their sustenance (food bags and extra sandals)
What did Jesus meant by SWORD?
Well it's not physical swords but the spiritual sword (scriptures) Ephesians 6:17 compare to Hebrew 4:12
WHY did they need it handy as in each of them ?
Well it's because the Jews are familiar with all the scriptures so anytime a fellow Jew quotes a scripture they can't deny it, all they can do is go and ask their Rabbis how such scripture should be practically applied.
But now that they're going out of Israel they need the scriptures to help them reason well with none-Israelites.
That's why each of them must have his own copy of the scriptures just as each Jehovah's Witness do have today!

So when he realized that they're still lacking in understanding he said "it's enough" after all God's Holy Spirit will teach them other sacred secrets that Jesus doesn't have enough time to disclose to them after they've received it! John 16:12-13