₦airaland Forum

Maynman:
The greek god is called zeus!

I think you need to be careful with the Zeus thing though, because Zeus being king of the Olympian gods is not said to be the origin of all other existence in the way that the Abrahamic god is presented or in the way that we understand the word "God" as the source of all existence. Indeed, in Greek mythology, Zeus had a father, who he killed and overthrew, thereby releasing his siblings from the fathers stomach. Zeus is also presented as a being full of mischief himself, and never tired of sexual adventures. There was also an entire set of beings which preceded the gods of Olympus, of which Zeus is just one.

DeepSight:
Kindly refer me to the Sura and verse, I have a Quoran right here, let me look it up

First look up the origin of the word allah!

DeepSight:
I think you need to be careful with the Zeus thing though, because Zeus being king of the Olympian gods is not said to be the origin of all other existence in the way that the Abrahamic god is presented or in the way that we understand the word "God" as the source of all existence. Indeed, in Greek mythology, Zeus had a father, who he killed and overthrew, thereby releasing his siblings from the fathers stomach. Zeus is also presented as a being full of mischief himself, and never tired of sexual adventures. There was also an entire set of beings which preceded the gods of Olympus, of which Zeus is just one.

Understand the context i was trying to make.
In Abramaic religion, both allah/elohim, yahweh, baal etc are sons to EL

Maynman:
First look up the origin of the word allah!

I have to drop this since you are not speaking about Islam.
The way your post was, somehow I thought you were referring to Islam.

Nonetheless let me just say that I still believe you need to be careful with the etymology of names you are drawing up, especially if you understand that even where some people may deploy a particular name (Allah in this case), they yet have a completely different understanding of the attributes of the entity they have in mind.

Maynman:
Understand the context i was trying to make.
In Abramaic religion, both allah/elohim, yahweh, baal etc are sons to EL

I doubt this but perhaps I should drop it since it begins to appear you are referring to something possibly even pre-Abrahamic.
PS: Elohim, I do not think ever referred to a single entity.

DeepSight:
I have to drop this since you are not speaking about Islam.
The way your post was, somehow I thought you were referring to Islam.

Nonetheless let me just say that I still believe you need to be careful with the etymology of names you are drawing up, especially if you understand that even where some people may deploy a particular name (Allah in this case), they yet have a completely different understanding of the attributes of the entity they have in mind.

Listen to your advice, you don’t even know the etymology of allah

DeepSight:
I doubt this but perhaps I should drop it since it begins to appear you are referring to something possibly even pre-Abrahamic.
PS: Elohim, I do not think ever referred to a single entity.

And allah refers to a single deity?

Maynman:
And allah refers to a single deity?

In Islam, yes.

DeepSight:
In Islam, yes.

In Hebrew bible, elohim is also a single deity.
Cherry Picking when to use etymology? Lol

Maynman:
Listen to your advice, you don’t even know the etymology of allah

I will be glad to be educated on it.
PS: The extract you attached said nothing useful (unless I missed it and you may draw my attention to what therein specifically spoke to your point).

Maynman:
In Hebrew bible, elohim is also a single deity.
Cherry Picking when to use etymology? Lol

I doubt this very much and I believe there has been much mistranslation involved. Interestingly, just yesterday I listened to a Professor of the Hebrew Language (who advised the Vatican for years on Hebrew Translations) on this very point - Elohim. He absolutely demonstrated that it does not refer to a single person.

DeepSight:
I will be glad to be educated on it.
PS: The extract you attached said nothing useful (unless I missed it and you may draw my attention to what therein specifically spoke to your point).

You don’t know the etymology of allah that’s why.
The god you worship in islam is called Hubal or Hubaal.
People worship allah before mohammed was born

Maynman:
Listen to your advice, you don’t even know the etymology of allah

Did you get my point that same name (or derived name) may not mean same attributes?

DeepSight:
I doubt this very much and I believe there has been much mistranslation involved. Interestingly, just yesterday I listened to a Professor of the Hebrew Language (who advised the Vatican for years on Hebrew Translations) on this very point - Elohim. He absolutely demonstrated that it does not refer to a single person.

I said in the hebrew bible that’s TANAKH, elohim is a single deity.
Allah is also gotten from hebrew language. But you said in quran he is a single deity.
Why are you cherry-picking when to use etymology?

Maynman:
I said in the hebrew bible that’s TANAKH, elohim is a single deity.
Allah is also gotten from hebrew language. But you said in quran he is a single deity.
Why are you cherry-picking when to use etymology?

This is exactly why I said that same name or derived name does not mean same attributes.

DeepSight:
Did you get my point that same name (or derived name) may not mean same attributes?

Did you get my point that you don’t know the etymology of Allah?

DeepSight:
This is exactly why I said that same name or derived name does not mean same attributes.

They are semitic languages and they mean same thing except in hebrew bible and quran.

Maynman:
Did you get my point that you don’t know the etymology of Allah?

I have since invited you to school me on it. I am happy to learn.

I have also pointed out severally that notwithstanding the etymology, various people can and in fact do have different attributes in mind.
This occurs even among the denominations of Christianity where you have Trinitarians and Non-Trinitarians.

Maynman:
They are semitic languages and they mean same thing except in hebrew bible and quran.

Okay then, fair enough: I think the point is settled here since you say "except in (the) hebrew bible and quran."

DeepSight:
I have since invited you to school me on it. I am happy to learn.

I have also pointed out severally that notwithstanding the etymology, various people can and in fact do have different attributes in mind.
This occurs even among the denominations of Christianity where you have Trinitarians and Non-Trinitarians.

The trinity was created by Tertulian during the Nicene council and has nothing do with etymology or you mean the etymology of the latin word “trinity”?
And not to forget Tertulian is a montanist
Allah and elohim mean same thing and they are sons to EL.
Etymology means ORIGIN of the word, people in their MIND can create opinions of that word but the fact and origin of that word remains unchanged.

DeepSight:
Okay then, fair enough: I think the point is settled here since you say "except in (the) hebrew bible and quran."

They are product of Judaism. Father of judaism is Abraham. And you are worshipping one of the Abrahamaic gods right?
The god you worship in islam is Hubal, you’ll know that if you know the etymology of Allah.

Maynman:
The trinity was created by Tertulian during the Nicene council and has nothing do with etymology or you mean the etymology of the latin word “trinity”?

No I mean the fact that people can use the same words and yet have different concepts of the attributes of the deity they refer to with the same word.

Etymology means ORIGIN of the word, people in their MIND can create opinions of that word but the fact and origin of that word remains unchanged.

Islam, which is what I was referring to, does not teach that Allah has children. However you have clarified that you are not referring to Islam.

Maynman:
They are product of Judaism. Father of judaism is Abraham. And you are worshipping one of the Abrahamaic gods right?
The god you worship in islam is Hubal, you’ll know that if you know the etymology of Allah.

I do not subscribe to any religion. Frankly, I detest religion.

DeepSight:
No I mean the fact that people can use the same words and yet have different concepts of the attributes of the deity they refer to with the same word.



Islam, which is what I was referring to, does not teach that Allah has children. However you have clarified that you are not referring to Islam.

The example You used for trinity is error, you’ve seen the person that created it. Trinity means tripleness EVERYWHERE.
A word has his origin, people using it doesn’t change that, rather people using the word should know the origin and not bask in ignorance.
Allah and Elohim mean same thing they are the sons of EL

Before Islam was created, Allah existed.
The god they worshipping in islam is hubal.
Allah is not an arabic word
Go read up on pre Islamic practice, again the deity they worship in kabba is Hubal.
Founder of Islam is from where?

DeepSight:
I do not subscribe to any religion. Frankly, I detest religion.

Regardless
Islam and Christianity are product of Judaism. Father of judaism is Abraham.
The god they worship in islam is Hubal, you’ll know that if you know the etymology of Allah.
In the Hebrew bible, elohim is a singke deity just like in quran allah is a single deity.
But just like the professor you watched Elohim and Allah are not single deity.

Ok, Maynman, I no gree, but I don hia.
Thanks for your time.

DeepSight:
Ok, Maynman, I no gree, but I don hia.
Thanks for your time.

They are facts brother, you agreeing or not won’t change it or the etymology. The hebrew professor didn’t mention all these?
Well, Allah and Elohim even go far beyond hebrew language, which is under semitic languages.

Maynman:
They are facts brother, you agreeing or not won’t change it or the etymology. The hebrew professor didn’t mention all these?
Well, Allah and Elohim even go far beyond hebrew language, which is under semitic languages.

I really dont know what you are pressing, when I have told you that two people can use the same name, or derived name, and have two different things in mind. You still missed the point even with the example of the Trinity. I used it to show you how people using the same name for God can think of him with different attributes. Its really simple. I see nothing more here to debate.

DeepSight:
I really dont know what you are pressing, when I have told you that two people can use the same name, or derived name, and have two different things in mind. You still missed the point even with the example of the Trinity. I used it to show you how people using the same name for God can think of him with different attributes. Its really simple. I see nothing more here to debate.

Allah is not 2 people, allah means gods and it’s evident.
Allah and Elohim means same thing.
The trinity you mentioned has nothing to do with the discussion, it’s a created concept by tertulian when they were establishing the Christian doctrines.
Should we go to emperor Constantine and the Catholic so you can understand how trinity came to be?
And besides “god” is a title not a person. Just as deity is a title not a person!

Maynman:
Allah is not 2 people, allah means gods and it’s evident.
Allah and Elohim means same thing.
The trinity you mentioned has nothing to do with the discussion, it’s a created concept by tertulian when they were establishing the Christian doctrines.
Should we go to emperor Constantine and the Catholic so you can understand how trinity came to be?

I know how the Trinity came to be, thanks very much.
If you are unable to see the point I make, thats fair enough.
Thanks again for your time.

DeepSight:
I know how the Trinity came to be, thanks very much.
If you are unable to see the point I make, thats fair enough.
Thanks again for your time.

You are not making any point, And i doubt you know the origin of trinity.
The Christianity practiced now is called NICENE CHRISTIANITY.
And besides “god” is a title not a person, you writing capital G doesn’t change that.

You are welcome.

Maynman:
You are not making any point, And i doubt you know the origin of trinity.
The Christianity practiced now is called NICENE CHRISTIANITY.

You are welcome.

Okay, thanks all the same.
You do presume quite a bit though. But as we say - it is well.
Thx again.