₦airaland Forum

Amayabor1:
Not all Nigera kings. The Oba of Benin is in a class of his own.

The Oba of Benin doesn't get his staff of office from the Governor of Edo State?

Lanre1st:
Sure Oluwo not suppose to say it out because it’s secret, but he said the truth.
Most of those practices that they use to scar people are lies but they made it a secret from the populace. Something like ORO, have you seen where ORO carry person, never it’s those doing it that we arrest the victim claiming ORO has carried him. IFA picked, it’s like rolling dice. It’s the elder consensus IFA will pick but they make it a secret. They we put sacrifices for deity to eat but it’s animals you will see going their to eat it up. All these traditional practices has over stay in our society, it high time to reform them

Ah! God eh!

One can't just reason with folks on Niaraland.

Who said it's a secret. How is it a secret. Guy, it's no secret.

I said the Oluwo said it as if it's a norm (normal thing/normal way) of having a Yoruba monarch on the throne; which is not.

Amayabor1:
What is this one saying. You talking about about what it ought to be, the Olowu is talking about what it really is. Is the Olowu right or wrong? Is it a lie that governors are the ones that appoint traditional rulers in yoruba land?

Why are you confusing yourself bro?

Your questions are unnecessary. My comment did not mentioned that Oluwo lied. As you said, I commented on what ought to be. Did you disregard that?

Amayabor1:
Lol. Who goes to Ile-Ife before anything can be done? The oba of Benin? You are a joker! . A big clown!

Maybe you don't know that your oba of lagos traced his origin to Benin and in times past, the Oba of lagos used to be buried in Benin.

You are full clown go and ask your people very well they will tell you full details about tradition I repeat it again before anything pertaining to Oba can be done in Benin they must first come to ile ife fir consultation and approval either for Oba's installation or burial

Wetin be Ifa? Lol

Westman001:
Ah! God eh!

One can't just reason with folks on Niaraland.

Who said it's a secret. How is it a secret. Guy, it's no secret.

I said the Oluwo said it as if it's a norm (normal thing/normal way) of having a Yoruba monarch on the throne; which is not.

Guy, either you want to accept or not, it’s normal way for stakeholders (either elder, government or community) to choice King but they will put into IFA mouth to pronounce it so it will look as if it’s divine. IFA see nothing more than what stakeholders want, it a kind of gesting game.

Its only in African Magic that Ifa picks the king.
The North is the worst; governors pick and dethrone easily. Emirship is basterdised.

Dancebreaker:

You need to understand that as a crown prince, Oba of Benin would have already known most of the leaders of Nigeria today. Either doing something for Nigeria at the UN or as an ambassador to countries. So, Oba does not see any of these 9ja politicians as a big deal. Unlike a king that one governor suddenly picked. He would be pinching himself when invited to Abuja. Remember the topic here is that governors pick Yoruba kings. The revelation is not new but a great disservice to tradition when confirmed by a king this way.

As a crown prince, the father of current Oba of Benin ran the govt cabinet office of Gen Yakubu Gowon as Perm Sec. He also represented Nigeria to train officials of Papua New Guinea for their independence from Australia in 1975.

You seem to forget that fall of Benin made creating what became Nigeria possible. Since colonial times, Benin has been a reluctant participant in the Nigerian experiment. An experiment that has failed woefully so far. Yet, if a Benin prince is required to do any job for the people abroad or govt, he would put in his best efforts. Even if only for his family name.

Oba of Benin finds it far more important to attend to matters affecting citizens locally. Faaji and gallivanting has never been Oba of Benin's attribute. Since time immemorial. You think Oba doesn't know the houses of prominent people? But he would not go. Unless out of courtesy when as a guest of Alake of Ake in Abeokuta, he was prevailed on to follow him to visit Obasanjo for OBJ's birthday.

Whatever corrupt Nigerian politicians believe is irrelevant to Benin. The only Yoruba Kingdom Benin has ever truly respected for gallantry in war is Oyo. Warriors respect fellow warriors.

Awo's govt elevation of Ooni, the priest at Ife, above Alaafin, is not our matter. By the way, politicians always like pliant people, be they king or any regular sycophant.

But my simple take is that, these obas picked under the cover of darkness at night should be careful not to totally ruin the traditional institution. They should be very wary of politicians. Politicians only know of self-interest. They can use and rubbish anyone no matter how highly placed.

My point is that all obas be it the one in Benin city and those ones in Benin republic have their root from ife or Yoruba,
Even the great alaafin of Oyo empire you talked about came from ife as a son of oduduwa before he became very powerful militarily in Yoruba land and use the military power for his own advantage.
There is no way you twisted the story to cut oba of Benin from his Yoruba root, those directly concerned at the top know the right thing which they have done, it's people like you that are always bringing up a done and settle matter.
If oluwo that brought up this matter said govt picked him, that is for him, that doesn't mean governors pick all obas in Yoruba land,
For example, governor doesn't pick oba in Ibadan till today, that is why the person that always emanates as oba in Ibadan is always very old, as one oba is installed in Ibadan, the next knows themselves.
I'm also sure of ooni that it is not governor that picks him and some obas in Yoruba land.
Ooni holds a very important position in Nigeria and Yoruba land, so he will always be in involved and be invited to many governmental and non-governmental programme unlike other traditional rulers.
You don't expect him to stay put in the palace throughout the year without attending functions and activities when he is not an idol, he is still human and that has not reduced his position as the first in Nigeria because he is a life Co chairmen of traditional rulers in Nigeria. Ooni deserves it because of historical background and not because he knows politians.
I know if this status is given to your oba, you will not allow us to hear word as you people always talk about ur oba,
but now you are claiming ignorantly that ooni is being helped by government.

TOPMAN4LIFE:
Continue to deceive yourself, even your oba of Benin knows ooni is above him.
How many traditional rulers are under oba of Benin kingdom compare to the large number of obaship kingdoms under ooni in Yoruba land,
If Benin is not from Yoruba, they will not be using oba title that belongs to Yoruba and you people will not use words that are taking from Yoruba,
Even Yoruba obas from Benin republic admitted they are from Yoruba and ife.
Yoruba even extends as far as itshekri and that is why they too have some of their words similar to Yoruba, for example the title 'Olu' of itshekri was taken from Yoruba land because many traditional rulers in Yoruba use it like Olu ilaro, Olu Ibadan, Olu Iwo etc
There is no how you lie, ooni is the head .
The traditional rulers concerned know this and they know their individual place when government is dealing with them

and the one that became ooni of ife, fell from the sky with chain abi? make una sofri lie abeg.

TOPMAN4LIFE:
Continue to deceive yourself, even your oba of Benin knows ooni is above him.
How many traditional rulers are under oba of Benin kingdom compare to the large number of obaship kingdoms under ooni in Yoruba land,
If Benin is not from Yoruba, they will not be using oba title that belongs to Yoruba and you people will not use words that are taking from Yoruba,
Even Yoruba obas from Benin republic admitted they are from Yoruba and ife.
Yoruba even extends as far as itshekri and that is why they too have some of their words similar to Yoruba, for example the title 'Olu' of itshekri was taken from Yoruba land because many traditional rulers in Yoruba use it like Olu ilaro, Olu Ibadan, Olu Iwo etc
There is no how you lie, ooni is the head .
The traditional rulers concerned know this and they know their individual place when government is dealing with them

This has already been debated several times, but it seems we keep seeing Yoruba people trying to start the debate right from the beginning.
Look, we can't continue having the same argument until we die !
For more than ten years, there is always a Yoruba who reopens this already settle matter.

1) Ife was built in 1912 by the British, previously it was just a small and impoverished settlement.
2) Benin was already an empire in the 1400s
3) locate Bight of Ife or bight of oyo (I can locate Bight of Benin)
4) locate Ife Republic or oyo Republic (I can locate Benin Republic)
5) the word Oba is the official title of the Oba of Benin, just like the word Oni is the official title of the Oni of Ife
6) around 1930, Oni adesoji aderemi who was previously referred to as "Oni of Ife, sir adesoji aderemi" changed his name to "Oni of Ife, Oba adesoji aderemi", therefore copying the title of the Benin emperor as a replacement to a British nobility word (sir). From there on all Yoruba monarchs copied the word "Oba" into their name, it became a trend, just like many other things with yoruba culture of copy and paste.
7) your concept of "Yorubaland" is not historical, 200 years ago, many of those lands you now call "Yorubaland" didn't identify as such
8 ) many monarchs who now identify as Yoruba have been involved over the decades in changing their original titles, for example the "olubadan" used to be the "bale of Ibadan"
9) every kingdom which was originally ruled by a person with the Olu title used to be part of Benin empire
10) please before opening such a debate, just take a look at what has already been said on the topic right here on nairaland. The reason people are not engaging you Yoruba when you open this debate again and again and again is that we are starting to think you are only doing this to generate traffic. How can people just keep opening the same debate over and over for decades ?

It seems you want to create an argument and you throw the same bates all the time. Look, why don't you guys find some other people to talk about ? Why always Benin ? It is like all Yoruba were born into this world to talk about Benin. Your obsession with proving your superiority to Benin only proves your inferiority complex.

I know in some months time or perhaps even less, an other Yoruba will reopen the debate and ignore facts and what was said previously. I think Yoruba should just focus on themselves and stop yapping about Benin all the time !

TheFreshVanilla:
I'm disappointed. So most of our traditional beliefs are scam. Only created to control gullible masses.

What tradition beliefs are you talking about ?
I personally don't have beliefs, I double check everything.

Holluwhakemmy:
You are full clown go and ask your people very well they will tell you full details about tradition I repeat it again before anything pertaining to Oba can be done in Benin they must first come to ile ife fir consultation and approval either for Oba's installation or burial

Lol. Look at this female ode! Every rites and tradition that involves installation and burial of a Benin Oba are done in Benin and there are specific places in Benin they are done.

Nor be like efulefu obas for Yoruba land.

airsaylongcome:
The Oba of Benin doesn't get his staff of office from the Governor of Edo State?

Getting your staff of office from the governor is only ceremonial. Even the queen or king of England gets his/her staff from the prime minister.

The question you should ask yourself is this; is the installation of the Oba of Benin open to political manipulation as it occurs in yoruba land? The answer is no. The next of oba of Benin (just like the next king of England) is already known and that is the first son of this current Oba. Nothing in this life can change it. That is how it has been for centuries. That's what we call "heritage"

Stoplying:
This has already been debated several times, but it seems we keep seeing Yoruba people trying to start the debate right from the beginning.
Look, we can't continue having the same argument until we die !
For more than ten years, there is always a Yoruba who reopens this already settle matter.

1) Ife was built in 1912 by the British, previously it was just a small and impoverished settlement.
2) Benin was already an empire in the 1400s
3) locate Bight of Ife or bight of oyo (I can locate Bight of Benin)
4) locate Ife Republic or oyo Republic (I can locate Benin Republic)
5) the word Oba is the official title of the Oba of Benin, just like the word Oni is the official title of the Oni of Ife
6) around 1930, Oni adesoji aderemi who was previously referred to as "Oni of Ife, sir adesoji aderemi" changed his name to "Oni of Ife, Oba adesoji aderemi", therefore copying the title of the Benin emperor as a replacement to s British nobility word (sir). From there in all Yoruba monarchs copied the word "Oba" into their name, it became a trend, just like many other things with yoruba culture of copy and paste.
7) your concept of "Yorubaland" is not historical, 200 years ago, many of those lands you now call "Yorubaland" didn't identify as such
8 ) many monarchs who now identify as Yoruba have been involved over the decades in changing their original titles, for example the "olubadan" used to be the "bale of Ibadan"
9) every kingdom which was originally ruled by a person with the Olu title used to be part of Benin empire
10) please before opening such a debate, just take a look at what has already been said on the topic right here on nairaland. The reason people are not engaging you Yoruba when you open this debate again and again and again is that we are starting to think you are only doing this to generate traffic. How can people just keep opening the same debate over and over for decades ?

It seems you want to create an argument and you throw the same bates all the time. Look, why don't you guys find some other people to talk about ? Why always Benin ? It is like all Yoruba were born into this world to talk about Benin. Your obsession with proving your superiority to Benin only proves your inferiority complex.

I know in some months time or perhaps even less, an other Yoruba will reopen the debate and ignore facts and what was said previously. I think Yoruba should just focus on themselves and stop yapping about Benin all the time !

You people like to lie to yourself, bight of Benin and republic of Benin is for our neighboring country called Benin republic with capital Cotonou,
Your own spelling were "Bini" before you changed it to Benin so that you can confuse ignorant people that bight of Benin and republic of Benin is for Bini in Edo,
That's kind of lies you have been telling yourself,
Obas in Benin republic far away from Nigeria affirmed that they are from Yoruba and ife but you people like to twist history because of pride and lack of submission to your root.
I will not continue to argue with you because government who has all the historical facts has placed ur oba in his rightful place and nothing will change his place .
You can continue to argue and brag over nothing
Next time traditional rulers are holding meeting, he will sit behind ooni or he stays at home

Amayabor1:
Getting your staff of office from the governor is only ceremonial. Even the queen or king of England gets his/her staff from the prime minister.

The question you should ask yourself is this; is the installation of the Oba of Benin open to political manipulation as it occurs in yoruba land? The answer is no. The next of oba of Benin (just like the next king of England) is already known and that is the first son of this current Oba. Nothing in this life can change it. That is how it has been for centuries. That's what we call "heritage"

Please never ever say in public again that the English Sovereign gets a staff from the Prime Minister. The Sovereign NEVER goes to the prime minister for ANYTHING. The prime minister ALWAYS goes to the Sovereign.

About Yoruba vs Benin kingship. Understand that succession by primogeniture does not invalidate other types of succession.

TOPMAN4LIFE:
You people like to lie to yourself, bight of Benin and republic of Benin is for our neighboring country called Benin republic with capital Cotonou,

"The problem in this world is that smart people are full of doubts whereas dumb people are full of confidence"

1) Benin kingdom appears on Precolonial maps (even from the 1400s)
2) Bight of Benin appears in Precolonial maps (from the 1400s)
3) Benin Republic was only named as such in the 1970s, it was previously known as Dahomey.

You guys who call yourselves "Yoruba", you know nothing about history and you just keep jumping around repeating your uneducated beliefs with fanatism just like boko haram repeats that the earth is flat.
When I correct one of you with logic, he insults me and some times goes away (sometimes continues in his delusion). One thing is for sure, not long after, an other Yoruba comes with the exact same claims and ignores whatever was said previously on the topic.
Giving knowledge to you guys seems pointless, like trying to empty a river by drinking it's water.

Why are so many Yoruba this ignorant, you guys are fed with fairytales which seem to talk about Benin a lot and seems to make Ife the centre of the world, but actual history, you know none of it.

Stoplying:
"The problem in this world is that smart people are full of doubts whereas dumb people are full of confidence"

1) Benin kingdom appears on Precolonial maps (even from the 1400s)
2) Bight of Benin appears in Precolonial maps (from the 1400s)
3) Benin Republic was only named as such in the 1970s

You guys who call yourselves "Yoruba", you know nothing about history and you just keep jumping around repeating your uneducated beliefs with fanatism just like boko haram repeats that the earth is flat.
When I correct one of you with logic, he insults me and some times go away (sometimes continues in his delusion). One thing is for sure, not king after, an other Yoruba comes with the exact same claims and ignores whatever was said previously on the topic.

You were known to be Bini before you changed it, republic of Benin is not for Bini in Edo state,
Funny that you also claiming republic of Benin for yourself, joke of the century
The bight you are talking about doesn't even have any tangible meaning than curve and bend,
All the years you were mentioning are all lies,

TOPMAN4LIFE:
You were known to be Bini before you changed it,

Look, I'm smarter and more educated than you, and you are wrong on the topic. That is the origin of your current frustration.
When were we known to be "Bini" and when did we "change it". Provide dates and proof.

"The problem in this world is that smart people are full of doubts whereas dumb people are full of confidence"

https://gallica.bnf.fr/ark:/12148/btv1b8595583b.r=Benin?rk=150215;2

These Yoruba guys think history is transmitted through DNA.

Stoplying:
Look, I'm smarter and more educated than you, and you are wrong on the topic. That is the origin of your current frustration.
When were we known to be "Bini" and when did we "change it". Provide dates and proof.

"The problem in this world is that smart people are full of doubts whereas dumb people are full of confidence"

continue to rate urself high more than you know, the same thing you have been doing with your oba and he is still far behind,
Use your google and you will see Bini all over,
You changed it to modernize the name just like eko was changed to Lagos.

TOPMAN4LIFE:
Use your google and you will see Bini all over,
You changed it to modernize the name just like eko was changed to Lagos.

Look, provide the dates. You make the claim that we "used to be known as Bini and changed it", you provide no date as to when we were known as "Bini" and no date as to when we "changed it", yet you want me to go through Google and provide the date for you and also provide proof for you...
Is this how you imagined debates took place ? You thought you didn't have to make precise claims and the other side would help you make your claims more precise and also help you to prove your own incomplete claims? 🤣
Just say you were wrong. You probably know it by now that you know nothing about history.

https://gallica.bnf.fr/ark:/12148/btv1b8595583b.r=Benin?rk=150215;2

Stoplying:
Look, provide the dates. You make the claim that we "used to be known as Bini and changed it", you provide no date as to when we were known as "Bini" and no date as to when we "changed it", yet you want me to go through Google and provide the date for you and also provide proof for you...
Is this how you imagined debates took place ? You thought you didn't have to make precise claims and the other side would help you make your claims more precise and also help you to prove your own incomplete claims? 🤣
Just say you were wrong. You probably know it by now that you know nothing about history.

https://gallica.bnf.fr/ark:/12148/btv1b8595583b.r=Benin?rk=150215;2

Read for yourself

TOPMAN4LIFE:
Read for yourself

The problem with your "logic" is that any person can make up a lie and when asked for proof, he just tells you to "read for yourself".
In your case, you make an incomplete claim, you are unable to complete it, and you expect me to not only complete it, but to prove it for you 🤡
I'm still waiting for the dates in which we were "known to be Bini" and the date we "changed it" according to your claim. I am also waiting for proof. Meanwhile:

https://gallica.bnf.fr/ark:/12148/btv1b532480446/f1.item.zoom#

Amayabor1:
Lol. Look at this female ode! Every rites and tradition that involves installation and burial of a Benin Oba are done in Benin and there are specific places in Benin they are done.

Nor be like efulefu obas for Yoruba land.

from your comment (female ode) I knew already that you are not well trained or you refused to be trained

Stoplying:
The problem with your "logic" is that any person can make up a lie and when asked for proof, he just tells you to "read for yourself".
In your case, you make an incomplete claim, you are unable to complete it, and you expect me to not only complete it, but to prove it for you 🤡
I'm still waiting for the dates in which we were "known to be Bini" and the date we "changed it" according to your claim. I am also waiting for proof. Meanwhile:

https://gallica.bnf.fr/ark:/12148/btv1b532480446/f1.item.zoom#

Just hold on, l am trying to upload, l thought it has uploaded that is why I said read for yourself, don't think u can feed anyone with lies without exposing you

TOPMAN4LIFE:
Just hold on, l am trying to upload, l thought it has uploaded that is why I said read for yourself, don't think u can feed anyone with lies without exposing you

What lies have I told ?
Point to a lie which I told.
Is it my question for the dates which is a "lie" ?

TOPMAN4LIFE:
Just hold on, l am trying to upload, l thought it has uploaded that is why I said read for yourself, don't think u can feed anyone with lies without exposing you

Where is the document which you are quoting ?
When was the document written?
Who wrote the document?

You basically quoted a fairytale written on the internet.
Let me explain to you how history research is done:
1) you look for documents which were written by eyewitnesses
2) you need to know the date of publication of the documents
3) knowing the author is a plus.

Given how you reason, I can deduce that you are a kid. Let me inform you that not everything written in the internet is true. If you look closely then you will see that the person who wrote what you quoted wrote it with a computer, that person is probably still alive, that person certainly did not witness the 1400s.

Stoplying:
What lies have I told ?
Point to a lie which I told.
Is it my question for the dates which is a "lie" ?

All what u have been are lies,
U that claimed republic of Benin is for Bini in Edo

Stoplying:
Where is the document which you are quoting ?
When was the document written?
Who wrote the document?

Are you not seeing it

TOPMAN4LIFE:
Are you not seeing it

Where is the document which you are quoting ?
When was the document written?
Who wrote the document?

You basically quoted a fairytale written on the internet.
Let me explain to you how history research is done:
1) you look for documents which were written by eyewitnesses
2) you need to know the date of publication of the documents
3) knowing the author is a plus.

Given how you reason, I can deduce that you are a kid. Let me inform you that not everything written in the internet is true. If you look closely then you will see that the person who wrote what you quoted wrote it with a computer, that person is probably still alive, that person certainly did not witness the 1400s.