₦airaland Forum

SIRTee15:
This is truth from Jesus own mouth. Let Jesus speak.

Jesus said 'This is my blood of the covenant, which is poured out for many for the forgiveness of sins.
Matthew 26.28

There's nothing that can save either in heaven or earth except the blood of Jesus.

Sin is building up like a stench on Muslims because they were deceived to think they can work out their way out of sin.

AntiChristian:
So was Jesus joking when he said:

For if you forgive men their trespasses, your heavenly Father will also forgive you. But if you do not forgive men their trespasses, neither will your Father forgive yours. Matthew 6:14-15

You need to explain the verse above in relation to what Paul said!

SIRTee15:
What's my business with what Paul said when Jesus said this...

Jesus said 'This is my blood of the covenant, which is poured out for many for the forgiveness of sins.
Matthew 26.28

Let Jesus speak.

Remove the letters of Paul from the bible and the article of Christian faith remain the same.

Nothing can save either in heaven or earth except the blood of Jesus.

AntiChristian:
But the thread is comparing Jesus vs Paul, you want to start your own thread again here?

SIRTee15:
Ok didn't know you are slow to grasp rebuttal.

I'm showing U that Paul taught exactly what Jesus teach.
No difference. Paul's teaching didn't contradict Jesus.

Jesus said his blood is required for forgiveness of sins.
Paul said only blood of Jesus can save

Jesus said salvation is by faith. Paul said the same thing.

So where did Paul preach against Jesus.
Go back to Paul's letter and show me where he contradicted Jesus teaching

The problem with Muslims is they have e never read the gospel from cover to cover.
If they do, they will know Paul and Jesus preached the same thing.

That's why I said remove the letters of Paul and the article of Christian faith remain the same.

AntiChristian:
No he didn't!

No, it is different. The criminal crucified with Jesus didn't believe in any blood! So this is essentially false! And Jesus didn't tell the rich ruler about any blood salvation!



Paul contradicted Jesus in the fact that no blood is needed to forgive sins!
For if you forgive men their trespasses, your heavenly Father will also forgive you. But if you do not forgive men their trespasses, neither will your Father forgive yours. Matthew 6:14-15

So anyone who forgives men's trespasses will be forgiven too!

SIRTee15:
Are U blind or deaf?
Didn't U read where Jesus said his blood is for forgiveness of sin?

This is my blood which is the new agreement that God makes with his people. This blood is poured out for many to forgive their sins.
Mat 26.28

The Father forgives sin through the blood of Jesus.
Christian asks the Father for forgiveness of sin through atonement by the blood of Jesus.

AntiChristian:
Of course i am not blind nor deaf?

Jesus promised the criminal crucified with him paradise without the believe in any blood or holy spirit or trinity or Jesus as God!
Jesus did not tell the rich ruler who came to ask him about eternal life about blood redemption, trinity or accepting Jesus as Lord and savior!
Jesus didn't tell them father forgives sin through the blood of Jesus!

You remember the guy Jesus told "Your sins are forgiven" before healing him? Which blood was involved?

You are a scam!

SIRTee15:
Now that you've been trapped, next thing is to be running all over the place...

this topic is about what Paul said and what Jesus said . Did Paul teach a different doctrine from Jesus.
Now that I have shown u that Jesus verbally agreed with what Paul taught.
next thing is jumping to trinity, holy ghost, Jesus is God, Jesus is Lord, blood redemption. that's the trick of muslims polemics, once they realise they argument is nonsense they jump to next topic.
My friend stick to your own topic. DID JESUS AGREE WITH PAUL?

Christ laid down the principle of salvation in the gospel which is based on the covenant he brought. repentance and salvation through Christ Jesus with the reward of eternity. simple.

The criminal on the cross acknowledged his sin, confessed it and turn to Jesus for salvation to enter eternity. That's what Christianity is all about.
The criminal had surrendered all to Jesus and has embraced everything that Jesus stood for including his divinity and atonement through his blood.
That there should be prior knowledge of all these b4 coming to christ is willful ignorance on the covenant of grace.

and that's why I've been asking u a question since yesterday but u shamelessly chose not to answer because u know it will expose scam in Islam.
if a man comes to mosque to say the shahada and few minutes later, had an heart attack and died.
will he enter paradise.
This new muslim did no work and didnt obey any commandment. will he still enter paradise just by believing in allah and muhammed.

AntiChristian:


Paul didn't agree with Jesus. Paul's mantra is grace and believe in the death of Jesus to get forgiveness! Jesus on the other hand forgave someone without blood!

SIRTee15:
AntiChristian, admit Paul and Jesus said the same thing and I will address your other points- what Jesus said and the actions of Jesus.

If U are stuck with your own topic, admit defeat and throw in the towel.

AntiChristian:
Paul said a different thing to what Jesus said!

Paul never met Jesus so he brought a new religion which surpressed whatever Jesus preached!

SIRTee15:
Boring 🥱🥱🥱🥱🥱🥱

Na U dig pit, na U carry yourself enter pit.
When U ready to get out of the pit...ask for help.
Until then topic is done and dusted.

Wetin Paul talk wey Jesus no talk? Fellow Muslims can help antiChristian out..

AntiChristian:
Of course his matter is with Allah! Pharoah said something like the Shahadah before he died. But his destination will be hell to abide forever! As regards the man we'll wash him and perform the funeral prayer on him then bury him as a Muslim. But only Allah has the right to determine his destination. We can only judge him by his appearance. Allah sees beyond that!

And We took the Children of Israel across the sea, and Fir'aun (Pharaoh) with his hosts followed them in oppression and enmity, till when drowning overtook him, he said: "I believe that La ilaha illa (Huwa): (none has the right to be worshipped but) He," in Whom the Children of Israel believe, and I am one of the Muslims (those who submit to Allah's Will)." Yoonus 10:30

It goes beyond just saying the Shahadah!
One must truly know the Shahadah, be sincere, honest and certain about it. And work with it!
You must also love, obey and accept it.

SIRTee15:
If I say Islam no make sense now, Muslims will say I'm insulting their religion.
How can Allah send someone to hell because he couldn't fulfil the works obligation because of untimely death.
How can someone be guilty of something he has no control over.

A Muslim confessed his faith in islam, then Allah killed him( Allah is responsible for all death in islam). Now same Allah is telling him he can't enter paradise because he did no work.

Sorry but this doesn't make sense.

I will ask other Muslims to answer the question.
Honesttalk, Qasim6, AbuTwin, Expanse, Ohyoudidn't, Lukuluku69, LegalWolf.

If a man comes to mosque and says the Shahada and actually believed in his confession; but on his way out had an heart attack and died.
He didn't do any work and didn't obey any commandment. He only had faith.

Will Allah allow him into paradise. He had faith but no work- will he enter paradise?

AntiChristian:
Where did Allah say all these?



Allah will allow him into paradise if He wills.
We have no access to his heart if he truly believes in the Shahadah!
Allah has all access to whatever is hidden so He will judge as He deem fit.
Since he converted to Islam we'll take him as a Muslim, pray for him and bury him as a Muslim.

Assuming he wasn't a Muslim, we won't pray for him nor bury him as a Muslim.

So we judge by what is apparent.

SIRTee15:
Ar e U saying if his faith is genuine he will enter paradise.

So if I guess U right. Allah will allow him into paradise if he has faith without any work.
Is that what U saying ?

AntiChristian:
Of course na!

Anyone who has even the smallest faith in Allah will enter Jannah even if he is punished for a while in hell.
In his case he reverted to Islam so all his previously sins are already wiped out!

So Jannah should be easy for him.

SIRTee15:
So how is this different from what Paul teach.
Paul aldo said the exact same thing.
That what U need to enter heaven is faith and not works.

Your works won't get U into heaven, it's your faith that happens the door of paradise for U.

Is that not what U said above antichristian, so how come U arguing with Paul when U both said the same thing.

FAITH AND NOT WORKS IS WHAT WILL GET YOU TO HEAVEN.

U even said by his faith, his sins will be wiped out by Allah.
Holy Christ, is that not what Paul also teach. That we become righteous by faith. We become saved by faith.

So where is all this anti-Paul coming from when U even agree with his teaching.

U Muslims are very confused. U guys should swallow your pride and come to Christ.
It's obvious Muslims are realising the islamic teaching makes.no sense.

SIRTee15:
This is truth from Jesus own mouth. Let Jesus speak.

Jesus said 'This is my blood of the covenant, which is poured out for many for the forgiveness of sins.
Matthew 26.28

There's nothing that can save either in heaven or earth except the blood of Jesus.


Sin is building up like a stench on Muslims because they were deceived to think they can work out their way out of sin.

sonmvayina:
Save from what?
Did God not forgive , Ninevah when they accepted Jonah's message?
Was there any human sacrifice involved?

Human blood or sacrifice is an abomination in God's sight. The only God that accepted human sacrifice in Bible was a demon called Molech..maybe that's who you are referring to...
Not the creator of heaven and earth. What he needs is a contrite heart. 2nd chronicles 7:14.

sonmvayina:
Save from what?
Did God not forgive , Ninevah when they accepted Jonah's message?
Was there any human sacrifice involved?

Human blood or sacrifice is an abomination in God's sight. The only God that accepted human sacrifice in Bible was a demon called Molech..maybe that's who you are referring to...
Not the creator of heaven and earth. What he needs is a contrite heart. 2nd chronicles 7:14.

AntiChristian:
Is the thread comparing Paulinity to Islam?

SIRTee15:
So how is this different from what Paul teach.
Paul aldo said the exact same thing.
That what U need to enter heaven is faith and not works.

Your works won't get U into heaven, it's your faith that happens the door of paradise for U.

Is that not what U said above antichristian, so how come U arguing with Paul when U both said the same thing.

FAITH AND NOT WORKS IS WHAT WILL GET YOU TO HEAVEN.

U even said by his faith, his sins will be wiped out by Allah.
Holy Christ, is that not what Paul also teach. That we become righteous by faith. We become saved by faith.

So where is all this anti-Paul coming from when U even agree with his teaching.

U Muslims are very confused. U guys should swallow your pride and come to Christ.
It's obvious Muslims are realising the islamic teaching makes.no sense.

SIRTee15:
Pls don't derail this thread. I do t want that Muslim guy to hide under U.
He's about to be exposed.
If U have a problem with Jesus teaching, open another thread and let me know.

sonmvayina:
He has openly and continuously told you that both Paul and Jesus preached different things...you keep ignoring it...

Forgiveness does not involve human blood. But Paul said otherwise....

Why are you not seeing it.?

Qasim6:
There is no confusion there.

The case of a man that died shortly after shahada is a different case, he doesn't have time to put in the work. All that matter is the sincerity of his shahada.

Qasim6:
It is faith and work that give you paradise in Islam and I believe that's exactly what Jesus preached as in the case of the man in Mathew 19 16-26.

Qasim6:
If the same man meet Paul at a later time and ask the same question about salvation, do you think Paul would give the same answer as Jesus?

Qasim6:
Which also begs the questions

If Jesus is going about telling people to follow the commandments as a way to salvation then why exactly did he need to die?

Qasim6:
Teaching people the Lord's prayer "And forgive us our trespasses, as we forgive those who trespass against us" why exactly did he need to die?

SIRTee15:
Since U want to be his advocate

Explain why Jesus said his blood is for forgiveness of sin
That's what I kept asking him and he couldn't answer.
So help him to answer.

Mat 26.28

For this is my blood, which confirms the covenant between God and his people. It is poured out as a sacrifice to forgive the sins of many.

Oya Mr advocate, the floor is yours.

This is what Jesus said about his death.....
Mark 10.45


For even the Son of Man came not to be served but to serve others and to give his life as a ransom for many.”

So Jesus said clearly that his death and blood is for redemption of mankind.

Now since U want to chook nose into what's not your business , help your pagan friend out.

AntiChristian:
No he didn't!

No, it is different. The criminal crucified with Jesus didn't believe in any blood! So this is essentially false! And Jesus didn't tell the rich ruler about any blood salvation!



Paul contradicted Jesus in the fact that no blood is needed to forgive sins!
For if you forgive men their trespasses, your heavenly Father will also forgive you. But if you do not forgive men their trespasses, neither will your Father forgive yours. Matthew 6:14-15

So anyone who forgives men's trespasses will be forgiven too!