₦airaland Forum

jaephoenix:
What is this one saying

Leave that one, e go just dey yarn okpats. LoLz.

Image123:
The Bible is about 66books, not one verse in Genesis. Planning, preparation, wisdom are integral preachings and commands in the Bible, i didn't add them.

Your own na 66! Some own na 73 books!

So where did God talk about multiply and plan exactly?

AntiChristian:
Your own na 66! Some own na 73 books!

So where did God talk about multiply and plan exactly?

You'll probably need to do a word search on that, depending on the Bible you are using. i can hint you on KJV, search "multiply", "wisdom", and "prepare". You'd be surprised how much you learn by a self Bible study.

LordReed:
What does the ancient book teach about pouring away sperm?

The Bible, which is newer than tomorrow's newspaper, teaches next to nothing about pouring away sperm. You apparently missed the point. It's like one alluding that the Bible is against touching carts on cows when you read the account of Uzza in Kings or Chronicles. The 'ancient' folks then were smart enough to understand and adjust accordingly.
The account of Judah referenced in Genesis 38 shows a seriously flawed family, not just Onan (or Er as someone mentioned). All the sons of Jacob were on a different wavelength, compared to their fathers Abraham, Isaac, and even Jacob. Their flaws had been showing from earlier chapters, where the 1st born lost the right of the first born by sleeping with his father's wife. Then the 2nd and 3rd born sons led their brothers to murder a town, losing their place. And then 4th born Judah went to do the exact thing that they killed people for (marrying Canaanites). Their case was more of a full cup waiting to spill or, like we say, a keg of gun powder. And you know the story, but let me summarize. Judah got 3 sons from the Canaanite. These were apparently supposed to be the ones to inherit firstborn rights and that Jesus Christ should come through. Er married Tamar, he got killed for wickedness. His brother Onan was going to be sleeping with the widow for free, he also got killed. Judah somehow ended up impregnating the widow and she got our lovely twin great grandfathers.
It's a story with many important lessons, none of the lessons has to do with pouring away sperm. You all need the Spirit of God, you would see.

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The Bible, which is newer than tomorrow's newspaper, teaches next to nothing about pouring away sperm. You apparently missed the point. It's like one alluding that the Bible is against touching carts on cows when you read the account of Uzza in Kings or Chronicles. The 'ancient' folks then were smart enough to understand and adjust accordingly.
The account of Judah referenced in Genesis 38 shows a seriously flawed family, not just Onan (or Er as someone mentioned). All the sons of Jacob were on a different wavelength, compared to their fathers Abraham, Isaac, and even Jacob. Their flaws had been showing from earlier chapters, where the 1st born lost the right of the first born by sleeping with his father's wife. Then the 2nd and 3rd born sons led their brothers to murder a town, losing their place. And then 4th born Judah went to do the exact thing that they killed people for (marrying Canaanites). Their case was more of a full cup waiting to spill or, like we say, a keg of gun powder. And you know the story, but let me summarize. Judah got 3 sons from the Canaanite. These were apparently supposed to be the ones to inherit firstborn rights and that Jesus Christ should come through. Er married Tamar, he got killed for wickedness. His brother Onan was going to be sleeping with the widow for free, he also got killed. Judah somehow ended up impregnating the widow and she got our lovely twin great grandfathers.
It's a story with many important lessons, none of the lessons has to do with pouring away sperm. You all need the Spirit of God, you would see.

Thank you for making my point. Your favourite book of ancient tales is useless in this matter.

LordReed:
Thank you for making my point. Your favourite book of ancient tales is useless in this matter.

It appears useless in every matter to you. It's useful in all matters to many others, including me. If it was against pouring of semen, i would be among the first to pour it all in. i am certain Isaac would not score just two(one) goals all his life if he poured it all in. We actually study this book, not just look for random information.

Image123:
It appears useless in every matter to you. It's useful in all matters to many others, including me. If it was against pouring of semen, i would be among the first to pour it all in. i am certain Isaac would not score just two(one) goals all his life if he poured it all in. We actually study this book, not just look for random information.

OK another question to see how useful it is. What does the ancient book teach about intrauterine device (IUD)?

Image123:
You'll probably need to do a word search on that, depending on the Bible you are using. i can hint you on KJV, search "multiply", "wisdom", and "prepare". You'd be surprised how much you learn by a self Bible study.

So you mean the verse be "fruitful and multiply" in KJV?

I can also go Hebrew if you want!

AntiChristian:
So you mean the verse be "fruitful and multiply" in KJV?

I can also go Hebrew if you want!

It's one of the many verses you'll find if you do a proper study. The study is for you, not me(not a matter of if i want). If Hebrew or your local language helps you more, all the better.

LordReed:
OK another question to see how useful it is. What does the ancient book teach about intrauterine device (IUD)?

How many people even know what the word means for it to be termed useful? Do you realize that billions of human beings don't know this "useful" word that you speak of? Why then do you think that it has to be found in the Bible for the Bible to qualify as useful? You don't even need this word to pass O'level or A' level Biology. What the Bible teaches about planning is clear, whether family planning or any other kind, it is universally applicable. If a man does not plan, people will laugh at him, it's clear encompassing Bible advice.

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How many people even know what the word means for it to be termed useful? Do you realize that billions of human beings don't know this "useful" word that you speak of? Why then do you think that it has to be found in the Bible for the Bible to qualify as useful? You don't even need this word to pass O'level or A' level Biology. What the Bible teaches about planning is clear, whether family planning or any other kind, it is universally applicable. If a man does not plan, people will laugh at him, it's clear encompassing Bible advice.

Oga just answer my question honestly.

LordReed:
Oga just answer my question honestly.

i did already, just that you don't like the answer. You asked what the Bible teaches about intrauterine device. i showed you that an intrauterine device is used for family planning, a name which the majority is familiar with. And the Bible is littered with instructions and exhortations to plan, prepare and make ready. To build a home, the planning is non-negotiable. i can give a 3hour talk on it.

Pro 24:27 KJV Prepare thy work without, and make it fit for thyself in the field; and afterwards build thine house.

A Christian is instructed to be wise. A wise person must plan. You can't build a family without proper family planning.

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i did already, just that you don't like the answer. You asked what the Bible teaches about intrauterine device. i showed you that an intrauterine device is used for family planning, a name which the majority is familiar with. And the Bible is littered with instructions and exhortations to plan, prepare and make ready. To build a home, the planning is non-negotiable. i can give a 3hour talk on it.

Pro 24:27 KJV Prepare thy work without, and make it fit for thyself in the field; and afterwards build thine house.

A Christian is instructed to be wise. A wise person must plan. You can't build a family without proper family planning.

I didn't ask about family planning I asked about IUD. If someone has concerns about its use just like the OP is asking about condoms how does this help?

Besides a generic "be wise" response can be had for a dime a dozen, it doesn't require a special ancient book.

LordReed:
I didn't ask about family planning I asked about IUD. If someone has concerns about its use just like the OP is asking about condoms how does this help?

Besides a generic "be wise" response can be had for a dime a dozen, it doesn't require a special ancient book.

IUD didn't exist when the Bible was written, but wisdom and planning did. While you would not find the word IUD, you would find the exhortation and instructions to plan, provide for your family, and be wise. Wisdom is wide or generic like you said because it's personalized in Jesus Christ. What is wise for you to do, may not be wise for me to do. For instance, some people need more sugar, others need less. i would not advice a woman
looking for a child to use IUD, but there are
some other women that may be so advised by the same me. We're not all the same. Life is not confined to a laboratory or exactitude, even though they have their place and use.
The Bible is a compendium of wisdom, and millions of people can readily be fed wisdom from it, so it's an extremely useful tool. It's like education or certifications. Some argue that it is needless and a scam. While everyone may not need 'education or certifications' to make it, millions of others do. God has been so gracious to give us numerous sources of wisdom, like our brains, or sources of nutrients, water, etc. Everyone does not have to fetch from the stream to drink.

Image123:
IUD didn't exist when the Bible was written, but wisdom and planning did. While you would not find the word IUD, you would find the exhortation and instructions to plan, provide for your family, and be wise. Wisdom is wide or generic like you said because it's personalized in Jesus Christ. What is wise for you to do, may not be wise for me to do. For instance, some people need more sugar, others need less. i would not advice a woman
looking for a child to use IUD, but there are
some other women that may be so advised by the same me. We're not all the same. Life is not confined to a laboratory or exactitude, even though they have their place and use.
The Bible is a compendium of wisdom, and millions of people can readily be fed wisdom from it, so it's an extremely useful tool. It's like education or certifications. Some argue that it is needless and a scam. While everyone may not need 'education or certifications' to make it, millions of others do. God has been so gracious to give us numerous sources of wisdom, like our brains, or sources of nutrients, water, etc. Everyone does not have to fetch from the stream to drink.

Then the Bible offers nothing with respect to the question, simple. A doctor will better advice a person who is contemplating using an IUD and neither the doctor nor the patient need to consult your favorite ancient book.

LordReed:
Then the Bible offers nothing with respect to the question, simple. A doctor will better advice a person who is contemplating using an IUD and neither the doctor nor the patient need to consult your favorite ancient book.

In reality, millions of people will gladly and tenaciously do family planning when taught it from the Bible than the nonchalance and ignorance we see prevalent in many places today. Some even call it a conspiracy or something to do with NWO, Bill Gates plan, etc. i know people who didn't need a doctor to plan their families, they simply got wisdom from the Bible. Nonetheless, i agree with you that doctors are qualified to preach it.

Image123:
In reality, millions of people will gladly and tenaciously do family planning when taught it from the Bible than the nonchalance and ignorance we see prevalent in many places today. Some even call it a conspiracy or something to do with NWO, Bill Gates plan, etc. i know people who didn't need a doctor to plan their families, they simply got wisdom from the Bible. Nonetheless, i agree with you that doctors are qualified to preach it.

Actually the reason why people seem to be so carefree is because they are ignorant and the ignorance tends to be perpetuated by outdated superstitions like from your ancient book. Instead of using a condom, they think some peeping tom deity is spying on them to know if they raw dogged or nutted into a plastic sack so you get poverty stricken people with too many kids or people with unwanted pregnancies. Many religious people condemn the use of prophylactic methods citing your favorite ancient storybook, that is a huge problem.

Guess which set of people more readily believe in conspiracy bullshit. Hint: it's the ones who already believe in unseen and unevidenced things aka believers in ancient stories.

LordReed:
Actually the reason why people seem to be so carefree is because they are ignorant and the ignorance tends to be perpetuated by outdated superstitions like from your ancient book. Instead of using a condom, they think some peeping tom deity is spying on them to know if they raw dogged or nutted into a plastic sack so you get poverty stricken people with too many kids or people with unwanted pregnancies. Many religious people condemn the use of prophylactic methods citing your favorite ancient storybook, that is a huge problem.

Guess which set of people more readily believe in conspiracy bullshit. Hint: it's the ones who already believe in unseen and unevidenced things aka believers in ancient stories.

Ignorance is caused by lack of education, usually due to poverty, lack of information, political and leadership failure, etc. Not reigion. Correct me if i am wrong, but i don't know of any mainstream christian denomination that is against family planning. If some few people think it is against God's Word to plan their family, it is a personal decision they decided to have. It is NOT something taught in the Bible. The Bible and religious places remain the easiest, straight-forward, and most effective places to teach people family planning and get immediate and lasting acceptability.

Image123:
Ignorance is caused by lack of education, usually due to poverty, lack of information, political and leadership failure, etc. Not reigion. Correct me if i am wrong, but i don't know of any mainstream christian denomination that is against family planning. If some few people think it is against God's Word to plan their family, it is a personal decision they decided to have. It is NOT something taught in the Bible. The Bible and religious places remain the easiest, straight-forward, and most effective places to teach people family planning and get immediate and lasting acceptability.

Is Deeper Life in favour of using condoms? What of MFM? Catholics certainly do not support the use of condoms and that is by far the biggest Christian denomination.

I didn't say ignorance is caused by religion, I said ignorance tends to be perpetuated by outdated superstitions like from your ancient book. Which in other words is, ignorance is encouraged by belief in ancient superstitious tales.

Sure a church would be a great place to teach people family planning but they won't be taught how to use a condom from the Bible nor will the advice for how to decide if an IUD is needed come from it.

LordReed:
Is Deeper Life in favour of using condoms? What of MFM? Catholics certainly do not support the use of condoms and that is by far the biggest Christian denomination.

I didn't say ignorance is caused by religion, I said ignorance tends to be perpetuated by outdated superstitions like from your ancient book. Which in other words is, ignorance is encouraged by belief in ancient superstitious tales.

Sure a church would be a great place to teach people family planning but they won't be taught how to use a condom from the Bible nor will the advice for how to decide if an IUD is needed come from it.

i've been around churches and listened to several messages for decades, i've also read the Bible thoroughly a couple of times. And i make bold to say that there are no restrictions on family planning in the Bible, nor have i ever heard it. i don't think Deeper Life has anything against condoms. i personally know a trusted Deeper Life leader that sells condoms even. i am sure she wouldn't dare if her church was against it. i have also listened to pastor Kumuyi a healthy lot, i have not heard such. i can't vouch for MFM though, they tie all kinds of things to the spirit world and have a lot of fight with virtually everything. It may be a possibility but i have never heard it. i have also listened to Dr. Olukoya as well though not very much. i remember online there was a talk about him speaking against mouthaction or so, i don't know about condoms.
Like i have maintained, such teaching is NOT something taught in the Bible. As for the other global mainstream churches, i found this online

Catholic

The Catholic Church continues to uphold the practice of natural family planning since it maintains the unitive aspect of the sexual union while still bolstering an openness to procreation.

They are against condoms but practice what they call natural family planning. The natural family planning is in itself unbiblical, as the Bible is against denying your married partner of sex.

Mainline Anabaptist denominations—have adopted statements indicating approval of modern methods of contraception.

Anglicanism
the responsibility for deciding upon the number and frequency of children was laid by God upon the consciences of parents "in such ways as are acceptable to husband and wife"

Baptists
prominent SBC leaders have spoken against a "contraceptive culture", affirming that nothing is inherently wrong with contraceptives, but encouraging couples to still have children and to view them as a blessing instead of an inconvenience.

Lutheranism
The Evangelical Lutheran Church in America allows for contraception in the event the potential parents do not intend to care for a child.

Methodism
The United Methodist Church holds "each couple has the right and the duty prayerfully and responsibly to control conception according to their circumstances".

Continental Reformed Churches
In 2003, the CRC synod declared that a married couple's decision whether or not to use birth control is a private, disputable matter. The church urges married couples to consider the size of their families prayerfully and encourages them to be motivated by a desire to glorify God and further his kingdom in their family planning.

Presbyterian Churches
The Presbyterian Church (USA) supports "full and equal access to contraceptive methods".

The United Church of Christ (UCC), a denomination of the Congregationalist tradition, promotes the distribution of condoms in churches and faith-based educational settings.

The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints
The LDS Church's current stance is to leave birth control up to the discretion of individual couples:

Jehovah's Witnesses allow married couples to use birth control:

Evidently, the majority have nothing against birth control. Even the Catholics that seem to have encourage their form of family planning.

Image123:
i've been around churches and listened to several messages for decades, i've also read the Bible thoroughly a couple of times. And i make bold to say that there are no restrictions on family planning in the Bible, nor have i ever heard it. i don't think Deeper Life has anything against condoms. i personally know a trusted Deeper Life leader that sells condoms even. i am sure she wouldn't dare if her church was against it. i have also listened to pastor Kumuyi a healthy lot, i have not heard such. i can't vouch for MFM though, they tie all kinds of things to the spirit world and have a lot of fight with virtually everything. It may be a possibility but i have never heard it. i have also listened to Dr. Olukoya as well though not very much. i remember online there was a talk about him speaking against mouthaction or so, i don't know about condoms.
Like i have maintained, such teaching is NOT something taught in the Bible. As for the other global mainstream churches, i found this online

Catholic

They are against condoms but practice what they call natural family planning. The natural family planning is in itself unbiblical, as the Bible is against denying your married partner of sex.

Mainline Anabaptist denominations—have adopted statements indicating approval of modern methods of contraception.

Anglicanism
the responsibility for deciding upon the number and frequency of children was laid by God upon the consciences of parents "in such ways as are acceptable to husband and wife"

Baptists
prominent SBC leaders have spoken against a "contraceptive culture", affirming that nothing is inherently wrong with contraceptives, but encouraging couples to still have children and to view them as a blessing instead of an inconvenience.

Lutheranism
The Evangelical Lutheran Church in America allows for contraception in the event the potential parents do not intend to care for a child.

Methodism
The United Methodist Church holds "each couple has the right and the duty prayerfully and responsibly to control conception according to their circumstances".

Continental Reformed Churches
In 2003, the CRC synod declared that a married couple's decision whether or not to use birth control is a private, disputable matter. The church urges married couples to consider the size of their families prayerfully and encourages them to be motivated by a desire to glorify God and further his kingdom in their family planning.

Presbyterian Churches
The Presbyterian Church (USA) supports "full and equal access to contraceptive methods".

The United Church of Christ (UCC), a denomination of the Congregationalist tradition, promotes the distribution of condoms in churches and faith-based educational settings.

The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints
The LDS Church's current stance is to leave birth control up to the discretion of individual couples:

Jehovah's Witnesses allow married couples to use birth control:

Evidently, the majority have nothing against birth control. Even the Catholics that seem to have encourage their form of family planning.

I specifically mentioned condom and the Catholic church does not support condom use. All those denominations combined are not more than Catholic church in size.

LordReed:
I specifically mentioned condom and the Catholic church does not support condom use. All those denominations combined are not more than Catholic church in size.

i initially said "Correct me if i am wrong, but i don't know of any mainstream christian denomination that is against family planning."
The Catholic church is one mainstream denomination and it is not against family planning, but against condoms. They also teach some other things that many Christians don't agree with. They are not the standard, the Bible is. At least, it appears all the churches are agreed on one form of family planning or the other.

OP, family planning is wisdom and prudence for this present epoch that is dominated by Satan and his dogs, but their epoch is dying, and we are returning to better times when the earth will be better ruled and ordered and everything will return to God's default settings, and there will be no more need for family planning.

But for this present time, it is wisdom and prudence not to bring unnecessary pressure on yourself and children not to birth more children than you can comfortably take care of, in the light of present but transient economic realities.

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i initially said "Correct me if i am wrong, but i don't know of any mainstream christian denomination that is against family planning."
The Catholic church is one mainstream denomination and it is not against family planning, but against condoms. They also teach some other things that many Christians don't agree with. They are not the standard, the Bible is. At least, it appears all the churches are agreed on one form of family planning or the other.

Never said they were against family planning. I said the Catholic Church is against condom use. Doesn't matter if they are the standard or not, the fact remains more than half of all Christians worldwide are Catholics. Which means possibly more than half of all Christians are against condom use. Which again furthers my point that belief in ancient storybooks is used to perpetuate ignorance.

LordReed:
Never said they were against family planning. I said the Catholic Church is against condom use. Doesn't matter if they are the standard or not, the fact remains more than half of all Christians worldwide are Catholics. Which means possibly more than half of all Christians are against condom use. Which again furthers my point that belief in ancient storybooks is used to perpetuate ignorance.

The Catholic belief or practice against condom is not based on the Bible. There is no such word there, their belief in this is not Bible based. We have planning in the Bible, and the Catholics believe in some sort of family planning. Anything can be used to perpetuate ignorance.

Image123:
The Catholic belief or practice against condom is not based on the Bible. There is no such word there, their belief in this is not Bible based. We have planning in the Bible, and the Catholics believe in some sort of family planning. Anything can be used to perpetuate ignorance.

It is based on the Bible, specifically their own interpretation of the Onan story.

Not everything but more importantly ancient superstitious tales are more prone to being used.

LordReed:
It is based on the Bible, specifically their own interpretation of the Onan story.

Not everything but more importantly ancient superstitious tales are more prone to being used.

i don't understand you again. You were trying to prove that the Bible is useless in these things or not reliable?

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i don't understand you again. You were trying to prove that the Bible is useless in these things or not reliable?

I think I have shown it is useless and unnecessary in these matters.

LordReed:
I think I have shown it is useless and unnecessary in these matters.

But you insist that it is prone to being used. Can something be useless and still be used?

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But you insist that it is prone to being used. Can something be useless and still be used?

It is used to perpetuate ignorance is not the same as being useful.

LordReed:
It is used to perpetuate ignorance is not the same as being useful.

You're straddling here. Useless means having or being of no use. You can't claim something is useless and still insist that it's been widely used. The reality is that the Bible is and can be widely used to encourage family planning. i can practically stand from my congregation and open passage after passage, exhorting people to plan their families and use contraceptives and other inventions that are not sinful or unhealthy. That someone else picks up a knife to kill and fight doesn't make knives useless to me.

Image123:
You're straddling here. Useless means having or being of no use. You can't claim something is useless and still insist that it's been widely used. The reality is that the Bible is and can be widely used to encourage family planning. i can practically stand from my congregation and open passage after passage, exhorting people to plan their families and use contraceptives and other inventions that are not sinful or unhealthy. That someone else picks up a knife to kill and fight doesn't make knives useless to me.

A thing can be useless in one way and useful in a different way. A spoon is useless as telecommunications device but useful for eating and other culinary related uses.

The Bible is useless as an instruction manual for knowing whether to use a condom or an IUD or a morning after pill or a hormonal patch. It can't because it's a bunch of ancient tales.