₦airaland Forum

AmazonTopaz:
Because that's unfortunately how the system was set up. If women however didn't advocate for a change there would not be any.

Men didn't give women rights, women fought for it. You don't get to water down our struggles to soothe your ego.

No I am not trying to water the struggle down.
Just so you know: I love women!!!

raumdeuter:
It's the same in many cases. The harder the work is, the harder it is to get people to fill it and the more compensation they get to do what most people either can't do, don't want to do or don't have the aptitude to do

Is aptitude something people work (hard) for or is it something they are gifted with? Is a student who is naturally smart at math working harder than a student who struggles?

And who determines that a CEOs work is worth 300 times more than the worker‘s who actually produces something of value?

budaatum:
To add to your link, here's another.

https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0049089X20300144

The fact that women had traditionally been barred from working at all in most societies, and couldn't inherit and get a degree or a bank account till relatively recent, adds a lot to the gap in pay for the same job, note, as no sensible person expects equal pay for different jobs.

Feminism has thankfully narrowed the gap, with more women entering STEM today than men.

Nonsense. Utter nonsense.

cococandy:
Thank you!!

Because that one argument Ibe made about more self made men billionaires compared to women almost made me grind my teeth. I didn’t even know if I should go into replying him or not.

How are we completely ignoring the fact that women in america (since that’s the society we based the income inequality on ) couldn’t get access to credit and loans until the 1974.

How were they supposed to fund the billion dollar businesses and catch up to centuries of men’s unfettered access to collectively owned natural resources?

If we had sufficient collective mental capacity, we'd be discussing how Africa could catch up to western societies after years of suppression, especially in these days of tariffs, which should make us wonder if and why African economies have been tariffied into poverty. Instead, we are finding excuses to justify and perpetuate female oppression.

Same people will of course argue against a woman aborting because she doesn't want her pay hampered by a pregnancy and a toddler. She must identify into the role "nature" has set for her they'd claim, whether she likes it or not and despite having a choice these days.

Thankfully, these, to be men, must first feed on a tit, and along with that can come the ideology they shall live by, which makes it the woman's duty to breed men instead of pigs, just as Eve bred sense into that ignorant naked enslaved Adam and made him the mythical father of humans.

The intellectual level of the conversation on this thread has grown way past that which a stupid idiot can follow and you now feel left out and irrelevant as most have learnt to ignore you.

Up your game, and mind!

raumdeuter:
It's the same in many cases. The harder the work is, the harder it is to get people to fill it and the more compensation they get to do what most people either can't do, don't want to do or don't have the aptitude to do

https://www.livemint.com/companies/news/intel-ceos-sudden-exit-pat-gelsinger-to-get-12-million-as-payout-firms-regulatory-filing-shows-11733233247713.html

Pat Gelsinger, who recently resigned as CEO from the struggling US chipmaker Intel Corp, could get as much as $12 million as payout, the company’s regulatory filing showed on Tuesday.

https://economictimes.indiatimes.com/news/new-updates/after-cost-cutting-and-15000-layoffs-intel-reintroduces-free-tea-and-coffee-to-boost-employees-morale/articleshow/115160990.cms?from=mdr

are the 15,000 people laid off also getting a golden parachute? what responsiblity did the ceo of intel actually bear for the series of fups over the last five years ?


https://www.reuters.com/business/aerospace-defense/departing-boeing-ceo-gets-nearly-33-million-2023-total-compensation-2024-04-05/

Departing Boeing CEO gets nearly $33 million in 2023 total compensation

https://apnews.com/article/boeing-layoffs-washington-california-aerospace-96cac1eac4b0035d5475dba8f81ae646

Boeing lays off hundreds in Washington and California as part of cuts announced previously

the hardworking ceo gets a golden parachute for fking up a company but the front line workers get what? when it is the ceo who created the culture that led to the demise in the first place?

this ceo worship and veneration is an american hypercapitalism

https://www.forbes.com/sites/alexanderpuutio/2024/03/24/how-japanese-ceos-continue-to-lead-with-empathy-and-sacrifice/

Far from the scrying eyes of Western consumers, Japanese CEOs have been rewriting the playbook on corporate leadership for decades.

Opting for empathy over austerity, they often make bold moves to showcase their commitment to their customers and staff: a popsicle company's heartfelt price hike apology, Nintendo's president cutting his salary to protect jobs, and an airline CEO's pay reduction to steer clear of layoffs.

Leading with empathy and sacrifice instead of mass-layoffs via Zoom exhibits a rare kind of commitment to community and long-term vision over immediate gains which every CEO should consider emulating.

americans could take lesson from japanese and other asians. but then again - america is all about shareholder value and bloated ceo compensation

the veneration of the ceo class is why real reason the middle class is shrinking and people dont have any faith in the future.

the only ceo of recent memory who has actually bore full responsibility for his incompetence and bad decisions was the ceo of oceangate - that is come real hardwork there -

budaatum:
The intellectual level of the conversation on this thread has grown way past that which a stupid idiot can follow and you now feel left out and irrelevant as most have learnt to ignore you.

Up your game, and mind!

You are wicked.

Maeve7:
You are wicked.

Only to those who reserve it I hope.

budaatum:
Only to those who reserve it I hope.

I hope so too.

In America when CEOs fail, they get bonuses and pats on the back. If they cause the whole country to go into recession, Our govt bails them out with billions of dollars and the world keeps spinning.

They use part of the financial rewards they get to create more propaganda around how ordinary citizens need to work harder and pull themselves up by their bootstraps. They find more ways to avoid paying for services they’ve charged for just so their bottom line remains intact.

If CEOs made 10-20x heck even 50x what the average American worker made, I don’t think people would be bitter at them.

People don’t hate all billionaires. Only the exploitative ones. Which unfortunately leaves very few of them unaffected. And they know it.

GloriousGbola:
https://www.livemint.com/companies/news/intel-ceos-sudden-exit-pat-gelsinger-to-get-12-million-as-payout-firms-regulatory-filing-shows-11733233247713.html





are the 15,000 people laid off also getting a golden parachute? what responsiblity did the ceo of intel actually bear for the series of fups over the last five years ?


https://www.reuters.com/business/aerospace-defense/departing-boeing-ceo-gets-nearly-33-million-2023-total-compensation-2024-04-05/

https://apnews.com/article/boeing-layoffs-washington-california-aerospace-96cac1eac4b0035d5475dba8f81ae646



the hardworking ceo gets a golden parachute for fking up a company but the front line workers get what? when it is the ceo who created the culture that led to the demise in the first place?

this ceo worship and veneration is an american hypercapitalism

https://www.forbes.com/sites/alexanderpuutio/2024/03/24/how-japanese-ceos-continue-to-lead-with-empathy-and-sacrifice/


americans could take lesson from japanese and other asians. but then again - america is all about shareholder value and bloated ceo compensation

the veneration of the ceo class is why real reason the middle class is shrinking and people dont have any faith in the future.

the only ceo of recent memory who has actually bore full responsibility for his incompetence and bad decisions was the ceo of oceangate - that is come real hardwork there -

budaatum:
The intellectual level of the conversation on this thread has grown way past that which a stupid idiot can follow and you now feel left out and irrelevant as most have learnt to ignore you.

Up your game, and mind!

😮‍💨

budaatum:
Same people will of course argue against a woman aborting because she doesn't want her pay hampered by a pregnancy and a toddler. She must identify into the role "nature" has set for her they'd claim, whether she likes it or not and despite having a choice these days.

Thankfully, these, to be men, must first feed on a tit, and along with that can come the ideology they shall live by, which makes it the woman's duty to breed men instead of pigs, just as Eve bred sense into that ignorant naked enslaved Adam and made him the mythical father of humans.

Which is why I don’t even honor them with a conversation about abortion.

cococandy:
Sorry I missed this.

It's fine 💛.

IjeBos:
You seem to be unpurposefully or purposefully conflating multiple things.
If I jump off a 20 story building, the consequence is I will die.
What is the consequence to me or society if I choose to say I am a woman?

And honestly, I feel some of these arguments were used back in the days to justify racism and sexism. Especially the ordered and stabled society argument.



Let me delineate the argument again for you.
I believe there are primarily two sexes.
I do not believe in preferred pronouns and don't believe anyone should be forced into using them.
I don't care what you call yourself or how you live your in your personal life. Dress up as a cow for all I care.
I care only in so far it affects me, forces me into using preferred pronouns, etc.
I think that's part of the liberty the US was founded on.

I feel you are making me defend Trans and I'm not a proponent. I just think we have to be careful in dictating how people choose to live their lives.

Kindly indulge me. Biology is an empirical science, although evolving, why should there be a "I believe" and "Don't believe"? It's not religion.

budaatum:
To add to your link, here's another.

https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0049089X20300144

The fact that women had traditionally been barred from working at all in most societies, and couldn't inherit and get a degree or a bank account till relatively recent, adds a lot to the gap in pay for the same job, note, as no sensible person expects equal pay for different jobs.

Feminism has thankfully narrowed the gap, with more women entering STEM today than men.

This is another nonsense.

Maeve7:
Are you sure? How much harder does a company‘s CEO work than the average worker to earn up to 300 times more? How much does the Shell company CEO make compared to those who do the drilling? Are workers compensated for the value they produce? Pulease! Don’t get me even started.

Do you understand how compensations and benefits work?

Do you understand the actual job of a CEO?

Cococandy, Magnoliaa. Buda, Maeve, etc and all the Amazonia - bless you all.

To the Great guys! Keep it up.

Waiting for January to hurry up. Let's the shits fly up and hit the ceiling

Some people can't wait for this great nation to be like where they live or came from. The funny thing is, they can't even go to Russian or China.

America America!!!
God bless America!
God bless our Troop!
SemperFi!!

Oh beautiful for spacious skies
For amber waves of grain
For purple mountain majesties
Above the fruited plain!

America! America! God shed His grace on thee
And crown thy good with brotherhood
From sea to shining sea
O beautiful for patriot dream
That sees beyond the years!!!

Bros is now forming and bragging to use PAC on GOP who refuses to play the game.

This is America, thank goodness. Not SA.

Ms. Adetshina, thank you for shining the light.

Hope he can create A.I robots to vote.

armyofone:
God bless America!
God bless our Troop!
SemperFi!!

And God bless Oduduwa Republic, Biafra, Arewa Nation and all the Indigenous inhabitants of an ex-British colony joined by two 'Y'-forming rivers. 😹

bukatyne:


Do you understand how compensations and benefits work?

Do you understand the actual job of a CEO?

No but I‘m sure you’re going to educate me now and then explain how your questions answer mine.

Magnoliaa:
And God bless Oduduwa Republic, Biafra, Arewa Nation and all the Indigenous inhabitants of an ex-British colony joined by two 'Y'-forming rivers. 😹

Iseeeee! Pouring palm wine on the ground.

If they get what they voted for, they will be very very unhappy.

They’re already making plans to cut social security, Medicare and Medicaid.

I thought his big lie then was that he will increase the money social security recipients get by removing taxation on it. Now he’s saying cutting it is on the table.

I guess he lied AGAIN. No surprise

armyofone:
To the Great guys! Keep it up.

Waiting for January to hurry up. Let's the shits fly up and hit the ceiling

Some people can't wait for this great nation to be like where they live or came from. The funny thing is, they can't even go to Russian or China.

Magnoliaa:
And God bless Oduduwa Republic, Biafra, Arewa Nation and all the Indigenous inhabitants of an ex-British colony joined by two 'Y'-forming rivers. 😹

I didn’t know you’re like this 😩

raumdeuter:
I am on mobile and can't structure the replies better. Your wage is dependent on what you negotiate at hiring.


Some women are not really aggressive at negotiation and end up leaving money on the table. As an employer I will not pay you 100k if you say you are okay with 80k. It's just business.
I have been on negotiation table and coached my friends to push harder. I've seen the way men take it and women are not really comfortable pushing that hard because what they are offering is already okay to her. In my small experience some women are okay with non monetized benefits (quality of life things and convenience) while men will ask for the benefit to be monetized

I have seen someone take over 100k less because they will buy her flight tickets and hotel anytime she has to travel to work as she lives out of the state fly into North Dakota twice a month doing a 7 days on, 7 days off schedule. while a guy in the same place simply said give me the money I'll buy my own tickets and hotel. Even when she was told she was like she can't deal with the inconvenience


There was a friend post medical school and residency he got an offer in Arkansas his colleague from medical school a Camerounian got an offer too from the same hospital. Which was base salary plus sign on bonus. The Cameroonian guy signed up immediately as this was over 300k base which is already generous by all standards. My Naija friend who negotiated harder got more he was able to get student loan repayment in addition to the hospital covering his malpractice with tail, up to 105k production and clinical efficiency bonus. The 2 guys will do the same job but get paid differently

Those countries are not America, they do not have 300m people and they are nowhere as prosperous as America. There is a reason why America is the desired destination for majority of the world including people from those countries

The maternity leave thing is also part of taking responsibility for your life and action. If you are a woman you want to have a big family and another woman who doesn't want to have kids. You have to plan with your partner and decide what works best for you. Having children is a personal decision or ambition and there are costs to it which you have to be okay with everything that comes with your decision

The 3 months leave its someone paying for it. If govt mandates it, then will the govt pay employers to keep employees on payroll. And where will the govt get that money from? Govt doesnt pluck money from the sky. Are you okay with increasing your taxes so they can provide 3 months maternity to every woman? Will it be fair to Include those men and women who chose not to have kids to have their taxes increased to pay for maternity leaves for those who chose to

US has the richest and most prosperous individuals because the govt doesn't tax us like in those countries. Will you be okay with paying 50 to 60% taxes to get all these utopia of what and what govt should be doing? Top earners in states like California already pay 37% federal, 13% state which adds up to 50%. Are you okay with an extra 10% making 60% of your total income to pay for these stuffs Democrats want govt to further take on their bloated plates? I am not comfortable with it. I am okay with small govt

@bold:

I disagree.

The US is rich enough to pay her mothers for three months to increase her human resources.

Even Nigeria with all its sshenanigans can 'afford' at least 3 months paid mat leave.

Federal and state governments do 6mths & 4mths with other benefits upon resumption.

Maeve7:
You said they invest their money. If they are not the owners, they don’t need to invest money so your argument to justify the huge income disparity between CEOs and workers doesn‘t hold.

Now tell me where the money these CEOs get comes from.

There are companies whose owners are the CEOs so they invest their own money or credit to get things running

There are CEOs appointed by shareholders to manage the money invested by shareholders

Maeve7:
Is aptitude something people work (hard) for or is it something they are gifted with? Is a student who is naturally smart at math working harder than a student who struggles?

And who determines that a CEOs work is worth 300 times more than the worker‘s who actually produces something of value?

Aptitude is a combination of both nature and nurture. You are gifted and you apply yourself rigorously

The CEO and board determines the ratio. If its easy let the worker put his money down and start his own business so he can take the 300 times pay

GloriousGbola:
https://www.livemint.com/companies/news/intel-ceos-sudden-exit-pat-gelsinger-to-get-12-million-as-payout-firms-regulatory-filing-shows-11733233247713.html





are the 15,000 people laid off also getting a golden parachute? what responsiblity did the ceo of intel actually bear for the series of fups over the last five years ?


https://www.reuters.com/business/aerospace-defense/departing-boeing-ceo-gets-nearly-33-million-2023-total-compensation-2024-04-05/

https://apnews.com/article/boeing-layoffs-washington-california-aerospace-96cac1eac4b0035d5475dba8f81ae646



the hardworking ceo gets a golden parachute for fking up a company but the front line workers get what? when it is the ceo who created the culture that led to the demise in the first place?

this ceo worship and veneration is an american hypercapitalism

https://www.forbes.com/sites/alexanderpuutio/2024/03/24/how-japanese-ceos-continue-to-lead-with-empathy-and-sacrifice/


americans could take lesson from japanese and other asians. but then again - america is all about shareholder value and bloated ceo compensation

the veneration of the ceo class is why real reason the middle class is shrinking and people dont have any faith in the future.

the only ceo of recent memory who has actually bore full responsibility for his incompetence and bad decisions was the ceo of oceangate - that is come real hardwork there -

If its easy let everyone be a CEO and apply their own money and acumen to run the business. Thats why its America, you can start your own and give yourself 300 times the pay

I have run a business before for over 5yrs I was pouring personal funds into it, I never got anything from it but all my staff never missed a paycheck before I shut it down

If for some reason the business turned around the staff who never missed a paycheck when I was going hungry will now ask why I am getting paid 300 times of his own take home?

Let him go start his own

bukatyne:
@bold:

I disagree.

The US is rich enough to pay her mothers for three months to increase her human resources.

Even Nigeria with all its sshenanigans can 'afford' at least 3 months paid mat leave.

Federal and state governments do 6mths & 4mths with other benefits upon resumption.

Where does the US get the riches from? The US is currently in debt, Will the citizens agree to increased taxes to care for those social programs like paid parental leave

raumdeuter:
There are companies whose owners are the CEOs so they invest their own money or credit to get things running

They are small business owners then.

On a scale of harm versus good, those kinds do more good than harm. They might be providing employment for 50-100 people in their community.
They’re not buying mom and pop stores out of business and pushing inferior products at 100% profit after they’ve capture the market. They are also not making 300% of what their average employees make.

When we boycott Kellogg’s and dem for example, those are the people we encourage others to buy from.

You know that’s not who we’re talking about when we talk about CEOs.

cococandy:
They are small business owners then.

On a scale of harm versus good, those kinds do more good than harm. They might be providing employment for 50-100 people in their community.
They’re not buying mom and pop stores out of business and pushing inferior products at 100% profit after they’ve capture the market. They are also not making 300% of what their average employees make.

When we boycott Kellogg’s and dem for example, those are the people we encourage others to buy from.

Musk is the CEO of Tesla and the owner. I dont think you will call him a small business

Did you charge insurance and then refuse to pay out when the insured came to make a claim thereby letting them die so that you could increase your wealth? Those are the examples of people who were talking about.

Those type of CEOs come in every sector not just the health sector. Their massive successes often comes from others’ sweat not because they worked so hard. As you can attest, you didn’t become Elon from working hard. Elon didn’t become Elon by working hard. They succeed because they screw people over. Over and over until the point of death.

Right now, planning as the pseudo president that he is, to cut people’s healthcare and veterans’ benefits to “minimize waste”. Veterans who fought for this country are going to die because Elon will fvck them over with Trump’ blessing. Then he’ll turn around and accept billions in subsidies from the govt because he’s a CEO who’s “providing value”.

raumdeuter:
If its easy let everyone be a CEO and apply their own money and acumen to run the business. Thats why its America, you can start your own and give yourself 300 times the pay

I have run a business before for over 5yrs I was pouring personal funds into it, I never got anything from it but all my staff never missed a paycheck before I shut it down

If for some reason the business turned around the staff who never missed a paycheck when I was going hungry will now ask why I am getting paid 300 times of his own take home?

Let him go start his own

raumdeuter:
Musk is the CEO of Tesla and the owner. I dont think you will call him a small business

Fair point

raumdeuter:
Where does the US get the riches from? The US is currently in debt, Will the citizens agree to increased taxes to care for those social programs like paid parental leave

Reduce defence budget,mind their business, and clean up the current welfare system.

Nigerians pay way less taxes than Americans yet the government can afford 6mths paid mat leave despite the trillions siphoned and the debt owed.

The US Government collects more taxes, do not steal their citizens blind like in Nigeria yet cannot pay 3mths mat leave?

Where do their priorities lie mbok?