₦airaland Forum

Truthseeker10:
🤣🤣🤣🤣 at the bolded.

So let us see a diagram of light and heat being part of the sun before coming to earth.

Dumb! Dumb! Dumb!
There are constant nuclear reactions at core of the sun resulting in light and heat!

Nachmonides:
.

It says he became flesh, how does a spirit son explanation tally with this?

A spirit means, we know it is not flesh, or tangible.

Please show me in your bible whether it says spirit son, or what dots you connected to come to the conclusion of a spirit son.

DaddyCoool:
Dumb! Dumb! Dumb!
There are constant nuclear reactions at core of the sun resulting in light and heat!

Oga show us the diagram of trinity of light and heat before being sent to earth. I am not asking you to teach me science.

Truthseeker10:
Oga show us the diagram of trinity of light and heat before being sent to earth. I am not asking you to teach me science.

You've made many dumb statements durring this discussion but this one takes the cake.
Are you saying sun did not have light and heat before there was earth?

Nachmonides:
.
It says he became flesh, how does a spirit son explanation tally with this? A spirit means, we know it is not flesh, or tangible.

Nachmonides:
Please show me in your bible whether it says spirit son, or what dots you connected to come to the conclusion of a spirit son.

You asked for EXPLANATION which is not word for word rather how we understood what John penned down so you can't see "spirit son" just as you can't find "TRINITY" written anywhere in the Bible.
The idea of SPIRIT SON came as a result of what Jesus himself said about his coming to the earth:

"No man has ascended into heaven but the one who descended from heaven, the Son of man" John 3:13

“You are from the realms below; I am from the realms above. You are from this world; I am not from this world" John 8:23

In heaven only angels live with God as His sons {Job 38:7} they are spirit beings so if Jesus came from their it simply means his life was transformed into an embro in the womb of the girl Mary therefore he became human as God purposed! Isaiah 9:6

DaddyCoool:
You've made many dumb statements durring this discussion but this one takes the cake.
Are you saying sun did not have light and heat before there was earth?

Ah OK oo mr cake....it had. Kindly draw the diagram that shows how the Sun(father), light(son) and heat(holy spirit) combine at the core to form One Sun(God) in heaven just as the diagram that I showed you shows how the father, the son and holy spirit combine at the core to form one 'God' in heaven.

MaxInDHouse:
You asked for EXPLANATION which is not word for word rather how we understood what John penned down so you can't see "spirit son" just as you can't find "TRINITY" written anywhere in the Bible.
The idea of SPIRIT SON came as a result of what Jesus himself said about his coming to the earth:

"No man has ascended into heaven but the one who descended from heaven, the Son of man" John 3:13

“You are from the realms below; I am from the realms above. You are from this world; I am not from this world" John 8:23

In heaven only angels live with God as His sons {Job 38:7} they are spirit beings so if Jesus came from their it simply means his life was transformed into an embro in the womb of the girl Mary therefore he became human as God purposed! Isaiah 9:6

Alright, I now understand what you mean by the Spirit Son.

What can you say about John 1:1?

Nachmonides:
I think the best thing is to hear what they have to say about John 1:1-14


Let's hear their own conclusion from reading the verses.

all the one you heard, what did you do with it, you ignored it, and yoh want a repeat again.

Heb 11:3 Faith convinces us that God created the world through his word....

So from the beginning the word was with God and in God was the word which is life, and that life WAS light to men, not because the word stopped being light but because the light had returned back to God. And while the light was here, John the Baptist bore witness to it, that he John wasn't the light but Jesus.
Now though God created the world through Jesus, the world did not know him nor receive him but to all who believed him, accepted him he gave them the power to become children of God. Children not born carnally but born of God and so the Word became flesh and dwelt among us, and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father, full of grace and truth.

Nachmonides:
You are unwise. I am using what science has gotten from their findings.

I wouldn't know of those stories save science which has branches such as Geology, Archaeology, and Geography. And they have told us about the stories of several cultures depicting a flood.

And you are pretty disingenuous by telling me geology is what made us to know about those stories. Geology has nothing to do with mythologies and geologists have NEVER found any evidence of a global catastrophic flood. Nor have archeologists but go on keep making a fool of yourself.

LordReed:
And you are pretty disingenuous by telling me geology is what made us to know about those stories. Geology has nothing to do with mythologies and geologists have NEVER found any evidence of a global catastrophic flood. Nor have archeologists but go on keep making a fool of yourself.

I meant that, as a whole, they tell us about geologic formations and the stories of several cultures depicting a flood.

DaddyCoool:
I have to assume you are NOT really dumb but only acting dumb.
I already told you there is nothing in our reality that can analogize God and his manifestations.

I'm sure you instinctively know that God is unknowable to us. He is a capital MYSTERY that we only vaguely sense through his effects. God is pure spirit, totally immaterial, and if we only knew how laughable are our feeble attempts to represent Him in illustration!

This diagram below is as good as any we can come up with

so at some point the sun didn't shine light till Jesus came, and then there had been no heat till the Holy Spirit came.

Now is the light the sun, or the heat the sun?

Yeshua is God indeed

Truthseeker10:
The diagram is clear. GOD consist of three Persons (the Father, the son, the holy spirit) simultaneously. The three persons combine simultaneously to form the word 'GOD'. The diagram shows that there cannot be a 'GOD' without the three persons combining.

the question they have to answer now is, did God split into three persons having the same essence which is what they believe trinity means

The father is God, the son is God, the Holy Spirit is God and all three are one God

Here's how Deeper Life put it

They believe in Trinity that is three distinct personalities in Godhead, the father, the Son Jesus Christ and the Holy Spirit. The father is God, The son is God and the Holy Spirit is God and yet there is one God.

The question is if God split into three, then trinity is a believe that GOD YHVH doesn't exist anymore.

This is why it's a lie, a heresy, a blasphemy and a doctrine of idolatry.

SonofElohim1379:
Yeshua is God indeed

The Almighty God? Yes or no?

Truthseeker10:
The Almighty God? Yes or no?

Yes

gohf:
the question they have to answer now is, did God split into three persons having the same essence which is what they believe trinity means

The father is God, the son is God, the Holy Spirit is God and all three are one God

Here's how Deeper Life put it

They believe in Trinity that is three distinct personalities in Godhead, the father, the Son Jesus Christ and the Holy Spirit. The father is God, The son is God and the Holy Spirit is God and yet there is one God.

The question is if God split into three, then trinity is a believe that GOD YHVH doesn't exist anymore.

This is why it's a lie, a heresy, a blasphemy and a doctrine of idolatry.

That is the problem that they have. They do not know how to split the core essence into three seperate parts because that will mean that the essence(God) does not exist anymore.

Nachmonides:
Alright, I now understand what you mean by the Spirit Son.
What can you say about John 1:1?

Jesus WAS God in the sense that he performed as God during creation and when he walked the earth.
The title GOD has many meanings the only one that Jesus can't claim is SUPREME BEING.
WHY?
As someone who WAS with God in the beginning and given the assignment to create all things surely he did the work of God but according to him he is taking orders from someone else and there are things he doesn't know like when badness will end completely since the order to end badness must come from his superior who has not revealed it to anyone! Matthew 24:36
So if you ask a Christian in the first century whether Jesus is God they will tell you that he never claimed so but he performed great signs that they are confused about who he really is.
Today what we found in the Bible that makes us conclude that he must be the Archangel Michael was written by prophet Daniel:

During that time Miʹcha·el will stand up, the great prince who is standing in behalf of your people. And there will occur a time of distress such as has not occurred since there came to be a nation until that time. And during that time your people will escape, everyone who is found written down in the book. And many of those asleep in the dust of the earth will wake up, some to everlasting life and others to reproach and to everlasting contempt. Daniel 12:1-2

According to this prophecy one of the Princes in heaven will stand up for the salvation of God's people and he will become a saviour as many will escape condemnation through what Michael will do he will resurrect those who have died for judgment.
All these things are what Jesus promised to do and to couple it all John said the person who led the angels in heaven to send Satan away from heaven is the same Michael! Revelations 12:7-12
So if Michael is the one who stands for the salvation of obedient mankind and that's exactly what Jesus did we come to the conclusion that Jesus is the same Archangel Michael who controls all the heavenly armies! Revelations 19:13-14

SonofElohim1379:
Yes

Explain John 1:18. Who is the 'God' that no one has seen?

Truthseeker10:
Ah🤣🤣🤣.... so you cannot draw out a flawless analysis of your Trinity concept but you want us to accept it. The same you is telling us not to accept the another drawing of another Trinity concept because the drawing is flawed. Are you not an hypocrite?🤣🤣🤣

he or she is @daddycoool is a hypocrite

A flawless analysis would have been: GOD, His Son and His Spirit. 😀

But they want to draw triangle and prism and all kinds of diagrams and shapes to bend and blend it all in.

Truthseeker10:
That is the problem that they have. They do not know how to split the core essence into three seperate parts because that will mean that the essence(God) does not exist anymore.

@ Nachmonides aka Mr.Essence

Truthseeker10:
Ah OK oo mr cake....it had. Kindly draw the diagram that shows how the Sun(father), light(son) and heat(holy spirit) combine at the core to form One Sun(God) in heaven just as the diagram that I showed you shows how the father, the son and holy spirit combine at the core to form one 'God' in heaven.

No need to draw, you can imagine it yourself. Your problem is that you're not humble enough to admit you can't draw Trinity - that there are limits to your knowledge!

gohf:
he or she is @daddycoool is a hypocrite

A flawless analysis would have been: GOD, His Son and His Spirit. 😀

But they want to draw triangle and prism and all kinds of diagrams and shapes to bend and blend it all in.

Yes oo....so they have to defend whatever analogy or diagram that they come up with.

SonofElohim1379:
Yes

and many false christs will arise

could you please tell us why you accepted to become a false Christ?

DaddyCoool:
No need to draw, you can imagine it yourself. Your problem is that you're not humble enough to admit you can't draw Trinity - that there are limits to your knowledge!

🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣so you've been stuck in imagination 🤣🤣🤣Why did you not also imagine when the light and heat was sent to earth na🤣🤣🤣? Na wa oo🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣

gohf:
so at some point the sun didn't shine light till Jesus came, and then there had been no heat till the Holy Spirit came.

Now is the light the sun, or the heat the sun?

Do you people at all think b4 you write.
Just as they were always with the Father, heat and light were always with the sun.

DaddyCoool:
Do you people at all think b4 you write.
Just as they were always with the Father, heat and light were always with the sun.

You that think you can't answer simple question

"is the light the sun, or the heat the sun?" Yes or No

gohf:
he or she is @daddycoool is a hypocrite

A flawless analysis would have been: GOD, His Son and His Spirit. 😀

But they want to draw triangle and prism and all kinds of diagrams and shapes to bend and blend it all in.

Of course from human perspective it is. But these things are not of human perspective. These are things that exist outside our dimension, outside time and space

Truthseeker10:
Yes oo....so they have to defend whatever analogy or diagram that they come up with.

I'm the one that told you all the analogies are flawed while you were the one saying water was perfect

DaddyCoool:
I'm the one that told you all the analogies are flawed while you were the one saying water was perfect

Madam go and sleep. I've proven that You've failed in all your analogies and concepts. Bye bye.

Truthseeker10:
🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣so you've been stuck in imagination 🤣🤣🤣Why did you not also imagine when the light and heat was sent to earth na🤣🤣🤣? Na wa oo🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣

Genius, I dif not draw that. I found it on the web

MaxInDHouse:
Jesus WAS God in the sense that he performed as God during creation and when he walked the earth.
The title GOD has many meanings the only one that Jesus can't claim is SUPREME BEING.
WHY?
As someone who WAS with God in the beginning and given the assignment to create all things surely he did the work of God but according to him he is taking orders from someone else and there are things he doesn't know like when badness will end completely since the order to end badness must come from his superior who has not revealed it to anyone! Matthew 24:36
So if you ask a Christian in the first century whether Jesus is God they will tell you that he never claimed so but he performed great signs that they are confused about who he really is.
Today what we found in the Bible that makes us conclude that he must be the Archangel Michael was written by prophet Daniel:

During that time Miʹcha·el will stand up, the great prince who is standing in behalf of your people. And there will occur a time of distress such as has not occurred since there came to be a nation until that time. And during that time your people will escape, everyone who is found written down in the book. And many of those asleep in the dust of the earth will wake up, some to everlasting life and others to reproach and to everlasting contempt. Daniel 12:1-2

According to this prophecy one of the Princes in heaven will stand up for the salvation of God's people and he will become a saviour as many will escape condemnation through what Michael will do he will resurrect those who have died for judgment.
All these things are what Jesus promised to do and to couple it all John said the person who led the angels in heaven to send Satan away from heaven is the same Michael! Revelations 12:7-12
So if Michael is the one who stands for the salvation of obedient mankind and that's exactly what Jesus did we come to the conclusion that Jesus is the same Archangel Michael who controls all the heavenly armies! Revelations 19:13-14

Thank you for your detailed response.


I have some observations and questions I'd like for you to address if you will:



+ "Jesus WAS God but not the Supreme Being":

John 1:1 states, "In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God." How does this align with the claim that Jesus was not the Supreme Being but only performed as God?

In John 20:28, Thomas explicitly calls Jesus "My Lord and my God," and Jesus does not correct him. If Jesus is not God in the fullest sense, why does He accept this declaration?

Philippians 2:6-7 explains that Jesus, "being in very nature God, did not consider equality with God something to be used to his own advantage." How does this passage fit the claim that Jesus cannot claim the title of Supreme Being?


+ "Jesus does not know the hour (Matthew 24:36)" :

This is often cited to argue that Jesus is subordinate to the Father. However, Colossians 2:9 declares, "For in Christ all the fullness of the Deity lives in bodily form." How does this square with the assertion that Jesus lacks divine attributes like omniscience?

Is Jesus’ statement about not knowing the hour reflective of His human limitations during His earthly ministry (Philippians 2:7), rather than His divine essence?


+ "Jesus is the Archangel Michael":

Hebrews 1:5-6: "For to which of the angels did God ever say, 'You are my Son; today I have become your Father'? Or again, 'I will be his Father, and he will be my Son'?" How can Jesus be Michael when the writer of Hebrews explicitly states that Jesus is superior to all angels?

Revelation 19:13 describes Jesus as "The Word of God" leading the heavenly armies, but nowhere does it equate Him with Michael. Why is this association made when the text separates Jesus from angelic beings?


+ "Daniel 12:1 and Revelation 12:7-12 link Michael to Jesus" :

Daniel 12:1 refers to Michael as "the great prince who protects your people." While Michael has a specific role, where in Scripture does it explicitly state that Michael is the same as Jesus?

Revelation 12:7-12 describes Michael leading angels in a heavenly battle, but this passage never attributes Michael’s actions to Jesus. Why should these roles be conflated when Revelation consistently identifies Jesus by titles like "The Lamb" or "The Word"?

John 5:28-29 says Jesus will raise the dead, but it never mentions Michael. Why is Michael credited with this role instead of Jesus?


+ First-Century Christian Beliefs About Jesus:

John 10:30: Jesus says, "I and the Father are one." How does this align with the claim that first-century Christians were confused about His identity?

Acts 7:59: Stephen prays to Jesus, saying, "Lord Jesus, receive my spirit." Would a devout Jew pray to anyone other than God?

DaddyCoool:
Of course from human perspective it is. But these things are not of human perspective. These are things that exist outside our dimension, outside time and space

Father God = sun
The Christ = light

You believe Christ is God
So, is light the sun?