₦airaland Forum

QuinQ:
✓ Seems this is Maxindhouse alternate moniker.
I'll assume it is.
Mr Max you here's the question you're afraid to answer - answered by AI

Again, read my input clearly so you understand how you are definitely terribly mistaken in your assertion above.

Kobojunkie:
The story of Lazarus and the rich man is an allegory used by Jesus Christ of Israel to make clear the message that no man would be sent back from the dead to warn the living. The mention of Abraham and all the other details were merely to help drive home the main message which is found at the end of the story. That is simply what that tale is about.

Kobojunkie:
Again, read my input clearly so you understand how you are definitely terribly mistaken in your assertion above.

Mr Max saying the story didn't actually happen is stating the obvious. Whoever said it did?
So in your honest opinion the point of the whole "On earth he was rich and Lazarus was poor but when they died the roles reversed" was to say that no one can come back from dead

QuinQ:
➜Mr Max saying the story didn't actually happen is stating the obvious. Whoever said it did?
So in your honest opinion the point of the whole "On earth he was rich and Lazarus was poor but when they died the roles reversed" was to say that no one can come back from dead

To your question, my answer would be yes, since, again, Jesus Christ of Israel who told said story is also reported to have made clear that all of the stories were told in such a way as to keep in persistent darkness those who are ignorant(blind) to the Truth of God of Israel. In addition, many of the details you seem consumed by from that one tale are details that contradict the very Law and Truth of YHWH in the land of Israel(Judah at that time). Jesus Christ of Israel — again, I stress the of Israel part— did not come with teachings to contravene that set forth by YHWH in the land but to expose additional Truths of YHWH.

Kobojunkie:
To your question, my answer would be yes, since, again, Jesus Christ of Israel who told said story is also reported to have made clear that all of the stories were told in such a way as to keep in persistent darkness those who are ignorant(blind) to the Truth of God of Israel. In addition, many of the details you seem consumed by from that one tale are details that contradict the very Law and Truth of YHWH in the land of Israel(Judah at that time). Jesus Christ of Israel — again, I stress the of Israel part— did not come with teachings to contravene that set forth by YHWH in the land but to expose additional Truths of YHWH.

Well, God was also God of Israel. So what?
So additional truth Christ revealed in this parable is that those who died won't come back while he himself said he was coming back?

QuinQ:
➜Well, God was also God of Israel. So what?
➜So additional truth Christ revealed in this parable is that those who died won't come back while he himself said he was coming back?

1. Jesus Christ of Israel worshipped YHWH, God of Israel, and so would not have made pronouncements against that which had been declared by the God of Israel.

2. Again, the message is, "No one will be sent back from the dead to warn the living." Jesus Christ of Israel died, but He rose — of His own ability(He was not sent back by anyone)—, not to warn the living but to claim His throne as King over the Kingdom of God.

Kobojunkie:
1. Jesus Christ of Israel worshipped YHWH, God of Israel, and so would not have made pronouncements against that which had been declared by the God of Israel.

2. Again, the message is, "No one will be sent back from the dead to warn the living." Jesus Christ of Israel died, but He rose — of His own ability(He was not sent back by anyone)—, not to warn the living but to claim His throne as King over the Kingdom of God.

1) You keep emphasizing that Christ was OF ISRAEL when everything was also of Israel including God.

2. You are not being honest. If that were the message why drag Lazarus into it? The parable would have been "a man died and begged that someone be sent to warn his relatives but was told it was impossible".
Besides, whoever thinks someone can come back from the dead? Do you know any religion or group that believes that?

QuinQ:
1) You keep emphasizing that Christ was OF ISRAEL when everything was also of Israel including God.
2. You are not being honest. If that were the message why drag Lazarus into it?
➜ The parable would have been "a man died and begged that someone be sent to warn his relatives but was told it was impossible".
➜ Besides, whoever thinks someone can come back from the dead? Do you know any religion or group that believes that?

1. Because Jesus Christ made clear He was sent by His Father, YHWH, only to the Lost of Israel — the bloodline of Jacob. So, yes, He is Jesus Christ of Israel.

2. Lazarus was a character created for the story.

3. Again, the story is not a parable but an allegory!

An allegory is a narrative where characters, settings, and events represent abstract ideas, often with a hidden meaning. A parable is a short story used to illustrate a moral or spiritual lesson, typically with a more straightforward meaning. While allegories can be complex and require interpretation, parables are generally more concise and have a clearer, single message.

4. The same books speak of instances of people being raised from the dead either during the time of the Prophets or during Jesus Christ of Israel's time. The raising of the dead in the land of Israel was not an out-of-place occurrence.

5. Many religions believe in the dead being able to come back.

QuinQ:
Mr Max saying the story didn't actually happen is stating the obvious. Whoever said it did?
So in your honest opinion the point of the whole "On earth he was rich and Lazarus was poor but when they died the roles reversed" was to say that no one can come back from dead

Sorry i was busy, so where were we?

.

Kobojunkie:
1. Because Jesus Christ made clear He was sent by His Father, YHWH, only to the Lost of Israel — the bloodline of Jacob. So, yes, He is Jesus Christ of Israel.

2. Lazarus was a character created for the story.

3. Again, the story is not a parable but an allegory!


4. The same books speak of instances of people being raised from the dead either during the time of the Prophets or during Jesus Christ of Israel's time. The raising of the dead in the land of Israel was not an out-of-place occurrence.

5. Many religions believe in the dead being able to come back.

1. Of course. Where did you expect God OF ISRAEL to send someone? To lost sheep of Iran?

2. There is no need for Lazarus in the story if it were just to show people can't come back from the dead.

3. The Bible calls it a parable. You can't know better than the Bible

4. Raised from the dead is not same as come back from the dead, neither is reincarnation. Come back means someone who died 4 years ago coming back looking exactly as they did.
No group or religion believes that to be possible - that's what the rich man wanted from father Abraham

QuinQ:
1. Of course. Where did you expect God OF ISRAEL to send someone? To lost sheep of Iran?
2. There is no need for Lazarus in the story if it were just to show people can't come back from the dead.
3. The Bible calls it a parable. You can't know better than the Bible
4. Raised from the dead is not same as come back from the dead, neither is reincarnation.
➜ Come back means someone who died 4 years ago coming back looking exactly as they did.
➜ No group or religion believes that to be possible - that's what the rich man wanted from father Abraham

1. I like to emphasize this fact since we have 3 whole religions out there that believe Jesus Christ of Israel was sent to bloodlines outside of the one chosen by YHWH, God of Israel.

2. Jesus Christ felt there was a need to add the mentions of Lazarus and even of Abraham in driving His point home. Why do you reject His freedom to do so?

3. Where does your copy of the Bible state that the story of Lazarus and the rich man was a parable?

4. Huh? I think you are losing me since I am not exactly sure what you are getting at.

Again, the message is that no person would be sent back from hell or from heaven to warn the living of what awaited them on the other side. Jesus Christ of Israel, the only one who came back from the dead, did not come back to warn anyone but rather to claim His throne after He triumphed over death.

5. Seems you have never read Matthew 27 vs 50 - 54 before now.

6. Again, some groups back then believed in those tales. The Greeks, Babylonians, Persians, and even some of the Romans, Irish, etc., have tales of people journeying into the underworld and returning after a period. I just spent some of my morning watching some TED-ED videos on some of these tales, too. These are stories from many beliefs around the world. I could share some links to the ones I watched this very morning, if you want.

Kobojunkie:
1. I like to emphasize this fact since we have 3 whole religions out there that believe Jesus Christ of Israel was sent to bloodlines outside of the one chosen by YHWH, God of Israel.

2. Jesus Christ felt there was a need to add the mentions of Lazarus and even of Abraham in driving His point home. Why do you reject His freedom to do so?

3. Where does your copy of the Bible state that the story of Lazarus and the rich man was a parable?

4. Huh? I think you are losing me since I am not exactly sure what you are getting at.

Again, the message is that no person would be sent back from hell or from heaven to warn the living of what awaited them on the other side. Jesus Christ of Israel, the only one who came back from the dead, did not come back to warn anyone but rather to claim His throne after He triumphed over death.

5. Seems you have never read Matthew 27 vs 50 - 54 before now.

6. Again, some groups back then believed in those tales. The Greeks, Babylonians, Persians, and even some of the Romans, Irish, etc., have tales of people journeying into the underworld and returning after a period. I just spent some of my morning watching some TED-ED videos on some of these tales, too. These are stories from many beliefs around the world. I could share some links to the ones I watched this very morning, if you want.

1. Once God of Israel became God of the whole world, so also Christ

2. Once again you're being dishonest. You know full well (since it's obvious) that the message of the parable is that the rich and poor would trade places in the afterlife

3. My Bible calls it parable. Yours apparently is the only Bible to call it allegory. No wahala

4. People don't see people who died 4 years ago walking around

5. But you that read it understand the central message to be "people can't come back from dead"!

6. No group ever believed that someone can be dead and buried and after a while come back as themselves - or we'd have a bunch of dead people walking around

QuinQ:
1. Once God of Israel became God of the whole world, so also Christ
2. Once again you're being dishonest. You know full well (since it's obvious) that the message of the parable is that the rich and poor would trade places in the afterlife
3. My Bible calls it parable. Yours apparently is the only Bible to call it allegory. No wahala
4. People don't see people who died 4 years ago walking around
5. But you that read it understand the central message to be "people can't come back from dead"!
6. No group ever believed that someone can be dead and buried and after a while come back as themselves - or we'd have a bunch of dead people walking around

1. Well, YHWH, who gave Himself the title "God of Israel," never changed that title to "God of the world." There is no record of that ever happening in the Books of Israelite Scriptures.

2. I know no such bullsheet that you claim.

3. Where does the book tell you that the story is a parable, though?

4. This is about what people believed, and we know for a fact that many different cultures/religions believed in this idea; the Israelites, not excluded from that list.

5. Wait a second...so you are telling me that against even against the declarations of YHWH in His very Law of Moses— let's not worry about Jesus Christ of Israel at this point—, you literally believe what is written in Matthew 27 vs 50-55 did take place? 😩😩😩😩

6. I just explained that various cultures had their own tales of people coming back from the dead, some even after everyone else was dead and gone, but here you continue to assert that these beliefs were not held by any group. For what purpose is this?

Kobojunkie:
1. Well, YHWH, who gave Himself the title "God of Israel," never changed that title to "God of the world." There is no record of that ever happening in the Books of Israelite Scriptures.

2. I know no such bullsheet that you claim.

3. Where does the book tell you that the story is a parable, though?

4. This is about what people believed, and we know for a fact that many different cultures/religions believed in this idea; the Israelites, not excluded from that list.

5. Wait a second...so you are telling me that against even against the declarations of YHWH in His very Law of Moses— let's not worry about Jesus Christ of Israel at this point—, you literally believe what is written in Matthew 27 vs 50-55 did take place? 😩😩😩😩

6. I just explained that various cultures had their own tales of people coming back from the dead, some even after everyone else was dead and gone, but here you continue to assert that these beliefs were not held by any group. For what purpose is this?

1. So who is God of the world who created everything, and who did he send to cleanse people from their sins?

2. Of course you do know, you're just pretending not to. Father Abraham even told the rich man he was suffering because he had it good on earth

3. My Bible (and all Bibles I have ever seen with headings) headline it "parable of the rich man and Lazarus. Yours call it allegory. No problem

4. No one has ever seen people who died long ago come back and living amongst people as themselves

5. Please explain how this has anything to do with this discussion

6. Give one example of long dead people come back as their old selves

QuinQ:
1. So who is God of the world who created everything, and who did he send to cleanse people from their sins?
2. Of course you do know, you're kust pretending mot to. Father Abraham even told the rich man he was suffering because he had it good on earth
3. My Bible (and all Bibles I have ever seen with headings) headline it "parable of the rich man and Lazarus. Yours call it allegory. No problem
4. No one has ever seen people who died long ago come back and living amongst people as themselves
5. Please explain how this has anything to do with this discussion
6. Give one example of long dead people come back as their old selves

1. According to the book, YHWH created everything, but then YHWH decided that when it came to men and the world, He would only focus on the people of Israel and the nation of Israel as His only inheritance. Is there a law or ordinance against YHWH doing that?

2. Please stop bullsheeting already! You are not making sense to me since I have instead made clear to you what I, in fact, know.

3. Again, what chapter and verse in your Bible tells you that the story is a parable... I am not asking you about the particular title specially inserted by the one who edited the pages of your own.

.... I am not in the mood to argue in circles regarding this. When you are ready to honestly tackle the subject, wake me up.

Kobojunkie:
1. According to the book, YHWH created everything, but then YHWH decided that when it came to men and the world, He would only focus on the people of Israel and the nation of Israel as His only inheritance. Is there a law or ordinance against YHWH doing that?

2. Please stop bullsheeting already! You are not making sense to me since I have instead made clear to you what I, in fact, know.

3. Again, what chapter and verse in your Bible tells you that the story is a parable... I am not asking you about the particular title specially inserted by the one who edited the pages of your own.

.... I am not in the mood to argue in circles regarding this. When you are ready to honestly tackle the subject, wake me up.

1. Inheritance from whom? Who is He inheriting from? Is there a law against God becoming God of everything he created instead of just Israel?

2. You have no point. The Central lesson of the parable is clear

3) Everyone calls them parables. Show where ANYONE called them allegories

QuinQ:
... 3) Everyone calls them parables. Show where ANYONE called them allegories

. So, because everybody calls them parables, I should ignore established language rules in order to call it a parable too? Some of you are too far gone down the delusion tunnel to be rescued from it. 🙄🙄🙄🙄

Kobojunkie:
. So, because everybody calls them parables, I should ignore established language rules in order to call it a parable too? Some of you are too far gone down the delusion tunnel to be rescued from it. 🙄🙄🙄🙄

Established by whom? Language is by usage. Hence some things are correct in US but wrong in UK solely because of usage. That's also how Language evolves. 17th century English is different from today's NOT because anybody set up committee to change the language.

QuinQ:
➜Established by whom? Language is by usage. Hence some things are correct in US but wrong in UK solely because of usage. That's also how Language evolves. 17th century English is different from today's NOT because anybody set up committee to change the language.

Human language has existed since humans began communicating with each other. The use of rhetorical and figurative language tools has endured for that long. These tools are not used by specific languages but rather by humans in expressing themselves across most human languages. So, this isn't about the English language.

Also, if you ever took time out of your particular religious delusion, you would find that the Bible contains several other examples of these parables, allegories, dirges, etc. It is all over the many books for those who are really curious.

Kobojunkie:
Human language has existed since humans began communicating with each other. The use of rhetorical and figurative language tools has endured for that long. These tools are not used by specific languages but rather by humans in expressing themselves across most human languages. So, this isn't about the English language.

Also, if you ever took time out of your particular religious delusion, you would find that the Bible contains several other examples of these parables, allegories, dirges, etc. It is all over the many books for those who are really curious.

What has any of this to do with the fact that "CORRECT" LANGUAGE IS DETERMINED BY USAGE? Once usage has established what is "correct", the authorities and dictionaries will follow. Not the other way round!. If most people start spelling kitchen as kichen (without t), very soon kitchen will be considered archaic spelling, and kichen the correct spelling.
That's how language works!!!

QuinQ:
✓ What has any of this to do with the fact that "CORRECT" LANGUAGE IS DETERMINED BY USAGE?
✓ Once usage has established what is "correct", the authorities and dictionaries will follow. Not the other way round!.
✓ If most people start spelling kitchen as kichen (without t), very soon kitchen will be considered archaic spelling, and kichen the correct spelling.
That's how language works!!!

1. Correct language is determined by usage? 🤔🤔

2. What in the world are you going on about now? 🙄🙄🙄

3. Nonsense! 🙄🙄🙄

Kobojunkie:
1. Correct language is determined by usage? 🤔🤔

2. What in the world are you going on about now? 🙄🙄🙄

3. Nonsense! 🙄🙄🙄

You know EXACTLY what I mean, and you know I am 100% right.

BTW I have determined that you and Maxindhouse are not the same person. You registered this account in September 2007. That's 2007!! While he registered his in September 2020. Also I think he is a Jehovah's Witness while you're not...
Then again, that doesn't necessarily prove you're not the same person. Hmmm...

QuinQ:
✓ You know EXACTLY what I mean, and you know I am 100% right.
BTW I have determined that you and Maxindhouse are not the same person. You registered this account in September 2007. That's 2007!! While he registered his in September 2020. Also I think he is a Jehovah's Witness while you're not...
Then again, that doesn't necessarily prove you're not the same person. Hmmm...

I am not a mind-reader for Pete's sake and you are also not one, so stop playing silly already! 🙄

Kobojunkie:
I am not a mind-reader for Pete's sake and you are also not one, so stop playing silly already! 🙄

Correct language is determined solely by what vast majority of people deem to be correct language. Example, "none of us are" is now correct because too many people now say it,
when before it used to be incorrect Also, "momentarily" can now mean "in a moment" when before it couldn't.

QuinQ:
✓ Correct language is determined solely by what vast majority of people deem to be correct language. Example, "none of us are" is now correct when before it used to incorrect - because too many people now use it. Also, "momentarily" can now mean "in a moment" when before it couldn't.

What in the world are you going on and on about correct language? Would you please stop deviating already!

Kobojunkie:
What in the world are you going on and on about correct language? Would you please stop deviating already!

Jesus's stories are PARABLES because that's what the vast majority of people call them.
That's how language works!

QuinQ:
➜Jesus's stories are PARABLES because that's what the vast majority of people call them.
That's how language works!

Nonsense! 🤔

May God deliver the church from all these rogues with titles!