₦airaland Forum

RayRay06677:
I tactically refused to join that discussion.

I am here for treasury bills.
This is a pro-tbills forum.
We equally have threads for construction and properties etc, if you wish to take a deep dive into properties, please do so in the right forum.

It's insane that we will invade tbills sanctuary and start talking down on tbills.

Meanwhile, we all have our reasons for investing. Tbills fits what I want(to count billions in physical cash).

I have stated here before that it took me years to sell a twin 3 bedroom in a federal government estate for less than 10m, an investment I held ffor about a decade that returned less than a million naira in rent and a police case.

Land banking is great but must it be great for everyone? You might be that exception just like I was check well and do not allow the bandwagon effect catch up with you.

From my experience, land is not easy to sell except maybe you are a professional agent and if you are not then expect the agents to squizz you off your earnings.

I am not saying you shouldn't buy properties but I am saying don't believe if you have a surgery to undergo, you will sell that land next week and cash out.

I pray tbills remain around 20℅, go and buy your land and make all the money, we ain't competing.

KingCassy:
Yield? Now I’m more confused…. What’s the difference.. and I thought Tbills interest is payed upfront, do they have option for interest at maturity.

Please in simple terms.. with this picture I posted below, how much will I be paid if I invest in primary auction of TB

Grupo:
Please can I have the link?

emmaodet:
Exactly bro.
Exactly.
All these rubbishing the TB regularly should just stop.
You know quiet well before clicking on the thread that it is a TB group, so why come to rubbish it.
I am even okay with TB up to 15% provided interest rate/lending rate falls close to 20% too.
Below 15%, i will half my investment and put the other half in dollar mutual fund at 10% per annum to diversify but won't leave the naira investment totally.
You won't appreciate liquid investments like mutual funds, TB and bonds until you meet yourself in urgent emergencies then you will know solid cash like land may land you in problem to quickly and easily convert back to liquid cash to solve your problems.
The agents would smell your desperation and starts giving you shitty prices. Bring buyer today to inspect to come next week with cash which he will disappoint. Some will even say they only have 3m on ground for a 5m bargained land, out of desperation, you will say Yes only for them to say it is even 1.5m cash that is on ground to pay the rest in 6 months etc.
Also, let's be careful on this group, apart from land agents, so many scammers are on nairaland looking for who to dupe. It is an anonymous group and anybody can claim to be what they are not...rich, have large investment in TB, bought this land for this price to sell for this price etc all just to lure unsuspecting members with cash to contact them privately on how to help them.

emmaodet:
Exactly bro.
Exactly.
All these rubbishing the TB regularly should just stop.
You know quiet well before clicking on the thread that it is a TB group, so why come to rubbish it.
I am even okay with TB up to 15% provided interest rate/lending rate falls close to 20% too.
Below 15%, i will half my investment and put the other half in dollar mutual fund at 10% per annum to diversify but won't leave the naira investment totally.
You won't appreciate liquid investments like mutual funds, TB and bonds until you meet yourself in urgent emergencies then you will know solid cash like land may land you in problem to quickly and easily convert back to liquid cash to solve your problems.
The agents would smell your desperation and starts giving you shitty prices. Bring buyer today to inspect to come next week with cash which he will disappoint. Some will even say they only have 3m on ground for a 5m bargained land, out of desperation, you will say Yes only for them to say it is even 1.5m cash that is on ground to pay the rest in 6 months etc.
Also, let's be careful on this group, apart from land agents, so many scammers are on nairaland looking for who to dupe. It is an anonymous group and anybody can claim to be what they are not...rich, have large investment in TB, bought this land for this price to sell for this price etc all just to lure unsuspecting members with cash to contact them privately on how to help them.

freeman67:
To my understanding true yield is the complete return on investment. Yes, TB interest is paid upfront. However, if you are are not in urgent need of that money, you may still reinvest. Meaning there is an option of reinvestment of interest with some bank while investing and if you do that, you will get the true yield on that investment.


You did not include the amount and tenure you are looking to invest even with that picture but let's say you intend to invest the sum of N100,000 for 364 days.

In my layman's calculation that will be 100,000÷100x 19.5600 = N19,560.
Meaning at current stop rate of 19.5600% your interest on 100k for 364 days is 19,560 which will be paid upfront barring commissions and charges. Then your 100k will be paid back to you at the end of the tenure.

However, if you decide to ask them to now reinvest your principal with interest now, meaning instead of paying you upfront you decide that you want to collect it at maturity, that 19,560 will still yield something. That's the true yield.

freeman67:
To my understanding true yield is the complete return on investment. Yes, TB interest is paid upfront. However, if you are are not in urgent need of that money, you may still reinvest. Meaning there is an option of reinvestment of interest with some bank while investing and if you do that, you will get the true yield on that investment.


You did not include the amount and tenure you are looking to invest even with that picture but let's say you intend to invest the sum of N100,000 for 364 days.

In my layman's calculation that will be 100,000÷100x 19.5600 = N19,560.
Meaning at current stop rate of 19.5600% your interest on 100k for 364 days is 19,560 which will be paid upfront barring commissions and charges. Then your 100k will be paid back to you at the end of the tenure.

However, if you decide to ask them to now reinvest your principal with interest now, meaning instead of paying you upfront you decide that you want to collect it at maturity, that 19,560 will still yield something. That's the true yield.

Ajibade123:
Please sir, how do I get started as a layman

freeman67:
Nothing hard. If you already have the funds you intend invest just go to your bank and tell them you want to invest in Treasury Bill.

There is secondary market where you can invest every working day through banks or other investments houses mostly between 10+12:00 so long as it's available. Then primary where the government issue through banks and other investments houses fortnightly ( Every 2 weeks) except for few occasions where it's auctioned at the adjacent week. The primary market issues the investment for 91 (3 months) , 182 (6 months) and 364 (1 year) only while in the secondary market you can find other tenure available. You can see 54 days, 20 days, 289 days etc according to what's available but not not more than 364. Infact most not upto.

There is usually a calender for the Primary Market. You ask for the calender here for who has it to help you post it.

From my personal experience the banks you can easily subscribe/invest through is FBN and Stanbic IBTC. If you have other areas of doubt, ask questions. As you as do, more experienced people around will contribute and enlighten you more.

Ajibade123:
Thank you very much sir
my best best is the secondary market then since I can't afford the primary market amount

KingCassy:
I sent you a dm bro

KingCassy:
Yield? Now I’m more confused…. What’s the difference.. and I thought Tbills interest is payed upfront, do they have option for interest at maturity.

Please in simple terms.. with this picture I posted below, how much will I be paid if I invest in primary auction of TB

USA2019:
Offer: The amount the CBN intends to sell or puts on offer.
Subscription: The amount that people actually requested for.
Allotment: The amount the CBN finally issues and got.

Yield is the equivalent of the rate you get if your interest is paid at the end of your investment tenor (90-, 180-, 0r 364-day). The stop rate is the maximum (cutoff) interest rate that the CBN was willing to sell to bidder. Some bidders must have made bids below and some others above the stop rate, but he CBN only decides what rate they would not go beyond based on the various bids they received and the amount they want to raise. The stop rate is the equivalence of your annual interest rate that you'd normally get after your investment tenor. '

You must pick a definitive rate because the bank must specify to the CBN what rate they are bidding at--they cannot give a range.

Ivan18888888888:
Hello everyone, please I need help. I’m about to invest in treasury bills but I’m really confused.

I keep seeing 19% and 24% being mentioned here and there , and it’s not clear to me what the actual return is.

So here’s my question, based on the picture below:

If I invest 50m annually,
Am I getting:
₦12 m, which would be 24% return? (Yes or No?)

Or
₦9.5m, which would be around 19% return? (Yes or No?)

Please, someone with clear understanding of this should help me out. I need a direct answer. Thank you!

NL1960:
You will get N9.5m. The N9.5m will be given to you upfront. So effectively, you are giving the government N40,500,000 (N50m-N9.5m). At maturity, the government gives you N50m. So it is actually 24% on N40,500,000.

Ivan18888888888:
This whole thing just dey confuse me o. I no go lie, I still no understand how dem dey calculate that 24% return. From wetin I dey see, e no dey add up unless I dey miss something serious.

Maybe person wey dey work directly with Treasury Bills fit come explain am better

Everything for this country just dey

zigzag

vanvickie:
If you an open an account with stanbic IBTC... It'll be good. They have the best rates for both primary and secondary market (as much as I can tell) and the best thing about stanbic is they have a link u can use to access tbills auction (both primary and secondary market) from the comfort of ur home, also... U can do primary market tbills for less than 50m as against some banks that insist on 50m threshold for primary market.

And yes, I've done all these with them, so it's not hearsay.


PS: I don't work with stanbic nor am I affiliated to them. I'm just a satisfied customer.

NL1960:
Lesson 1

I = PTR/(Year * 100)

I = Interest
P = Principal
T = Tenor
R = Interest Rate
Year = Days in Year = 365 (366 if a leap year)

In your post we have:

P = 50m
T = One Year(365)
R = 19%.

I = (50m * 365 * 19 ) / (365 * 100)

I = 346,750,000,000/36,500

I = 9,500,000.

So if you invest N50m at 19% for one year, you immediately get an interest of 9,500,000. This is called upfront interest.

So you give the government, N50m and they give you back 9,500,000 immediately meaning the bank will debit you for N50m and credit you with 9,500,000.

So if you check your account, you will see 9,500,000 there.

This effectively means that you gave the government N40,500,000(N50m - N9,500,500)

Now at what rate did you actually give this N40,500,000 to government?. This is what is called the True Yield

Lesson 2

We need to now find the rate at which you gave the government N40,500,000.

I = PTR/(Year * 100)

(I * Year * 100) = PTR

R = ( I * Year * 100) / PT

R = (9,500,000 * 365 * 100) / (40,500,000 * 365)

R = 346,750,000,000 / 14,782,500,000

R = 23.45679012345679

If you aproximate:

R = 23.46

R = 23.5

R = 24.

QED(Quod Erat Demonstrandum)

kristien4:
Can i have the link for tbills??

Ivan18888888888:
So pls going by this


If I decide to invest 50 million annually

How much will be my profit then

I keep seeing 19.4% and 24.5% here , I am kinda confuse

USA2019:
You'd receive approximately N9.7M (N50M * 0.194), less fees and charges, at the time of investment. The true yield is 24.5%, representing your total gain or profit on the principal when you reinvest the paid interest immediately upon receipt.

NL1960:
Lesson 1

I = PTR/(Year * 100)

I = Interest
P = Principal
T = Tenor
R = Interest Rate
Year = Days in Year = 365 (366 if a leap year)

In your post we have:

P = 50m
T = One Year(365)
R = 19%.

I = (50m * 365 * 19 ) / (365 * 100)

I = 346,750,000,000/36,500

I = 9,500,000.

So if you invest N50m at 19% for one year, you immediately get an interest of 9,500,000. This is called upfront interest.

So you give the government, N50m and they give you back 9,500,000 immediately meaning the bank will debit you for N50m and credit you with 9,500,000.

So if you check your account, you will see 9,500,000 there.

This effectively means that you gave the government N40,500,000(N50m - N9,500,500)

Now at what rate did you actually give this N40,500,000 to government?. This is what is called the True Yield

Lesson 2

We need to now find the rate at which you gave the government N40,500,000.

I = PTR/(Year * 100)

(I * Year * 100) = PTR

R = ( I * Year * 100) / PT

R = (9,500,000 * 365 * 100) / (40,500,000 * 365)

R = 346,750,000,000 / 14,782,500,000

R = 23.45679012345679

If you aproximate:

R = 23.46

R = 23.5

R = 24.

QED(Quod Erat Demonstrandum)

Ivan18888888888:
Thanks so much for the response and getting back to me.
Pls Which banks offer the 19.4% rate? I’d like to spread the funds and not use just one bank.
Also, can I reinvest the ₦9.5 million?

Ivan18888888888:
Thanks so much for the response and getting back to me.
Pls Which banks offer the 19.4% rate? I’d like to spread the funds and not use just one bank.
Also, can I reinvest the ₦9.5 million?

Ivan18888888888:
Thanks so much for the response and getting back to me.
Pls Which banks offer the 19.4% rate? I’d like to spread the funds and not use just one bank.
Also, can I reinvest the ₦9.5 million?

Ivan18888888888:
Thanks so much for the response and getting back to me.
Pls Which banks offer the 19.4% rate? I’d like to spread the funds and not use just one bank.
Also, can I reinvest the ₦9.5 million?

NL1960:
I do not know. The rate is not static. It is a Bid and Offer issue. It is the CBN that determines the rate after every auction. A bank can fail and a bank can succeed. For example, if a bank bids 19.4% during a particular auction and the CBN releases a rate of 19.3%, the banks bid rate is above the CBN rate and the bank's bid will fail and its customers will not be allocated any TBs. The option left for the customers is to go for secondary market. You might or might not get a rate of that in the secondary market and you might not get a tenor of 364(a year).

As for reinvestment of the N9.5m, it is not automatically done. You will have to buy a secondary market with the amount. Rates and tenors are not fixed in the secondary market.

kristien4:
......Does it mean one can lose both interest and capital??