musKeeto:

These are solely my views. I will post a link to a thread where this issie was discussed in detail.

Good/bad are subjective. Whatever we sense is necessary for our immediate survival instincts would ne regarded as good. What threatens it is regarded as evil.
Morality evolves over time just like everything else.

It is like language. Humans agree a sound or word has a meaning and then we agree to stick to it. It is also subject to change overtime and can be influenced by other cultures.

I do not believe there is an objective morality, some divine moral code we are obliged to follow or obey.
I hope this helps. I will post the link I mentioned later. A bit busy these days.

How u dey? long time..

Hmmm...
Oukei I thought you must be very busy too.

I'll read the thread later, just clicked on the link now.

Wait, are you saying, that our innate desire for morality stems from our need to survive?
You should see this - www.bethinking.org/morality/did-morals-evolve

---

Owh, me?
I'm fine!

Been busy in romance section.
Miss NL pageant just kicked off
I'm one of the judges.

You should come around and show some love

musKeeto:

You've gotta be kidding me.

musKeeto:

These are solely my views. I will post a link to a thread where this issie was discussed in detail.

Good/bad are subjective. Whatever we sense is necessary for our immediate survival instincts would ne regarded as good. What threatens it is regarded as evil.
Morality evolves over time just like everything else.

It is like language. Humans agree a sound or word has a meaning and then we agree to stick to it. It is also subject to change overtime and can be influenced by other cultures.

I do not believe there is an objective morality, some divine moral code we are obliged to follow or obey.
I hope this helps. I will post the link I mentioned later. A bit busy these days.

How u dey? long time..

Weah96:


Women are stoned to death for adultery in Muslim countries. Now I don't condone martial promiscuity in the least, but that's a bit too harsh, if you ask me. Some of them are sexy chicks too, getting their heads bashed in because Mr. Imam was wasn't handling his business like a man.

Stoning is a family event in those countries. Sometimes the children are dressed in their best clothes to attend the event with their parents. I even heard that the ice cream guy makes a killing there, no pun intended.

Good and bad are subjective, but they're often along cultural lines in cases where religion is absent. It's very difficult to unravel, tbh.

musKeeto:


I agree. We are social beings, so in most cases, the interest of the group is put above that of the individual. Life has a lot of complexities indeed.

Also -- and I think mizmycoli would love to answer this -- if there is objective morality, are good actions good intrinsically or are they good because God says so?

musKeeto:


I agree. We are social beings, so in most cases, the interest of the group is put above that of the individual. Life has a lot of complexities indeed.

Also -- and I think mizmycoli would love to answer this -- if there is objective morality, are good actions good intrinsically or are they good because God says so?

qstar:


The SPAG theory comes to mind

MizMyColi:


What's SPAG theory?

mazaje:

It is called self projecting yourself as god(SPAG). . .It is the phenomenon through which believers, when trying to ascribe a personality and wishes to their chosen god, tend to arrive at something that is oddly similar to what they themselves think and feel. The bible contains a lot of paradoxical statements, conflicting accounts that cannot be unraveled and many contradictions. It also has commands that some christian do not wish to obey and descriptions of god that the some christian do not want to worship so the christian will now have to formulate a way to accpet the bible without rejecting it completely because of the very strong indoctrination that was imposed on him/her. . . .What each Christian is telling you in her or his own way, is that he or she is god because christians can’t reject the bible entirely.

Here is how it goes. . . .

OLADEGBUU believes god is a judging and harsh god. He searches the scriptures and finds evidence of this god and so evaluates those scriptures that back up his belief as more important doctrinally than those scriptures that do not espouse this view point.

Jesoul believes god is a caring and loving "mothering" type of god. She finds scriptures that support her supposition and considers those scriptures more important than all others in a doctrinal sense. Her view of god is supported by scripture but also by her own view of "who god should be" and "what behavior god should exhibit".

Both OLADEGBUU and Jesoul believe that their view is correct. They believe that god is the way he is because it is the type of god they have "sought out" of the scripture. In actuality they have SPAGed or self-projected as god. They have put their own desires and values onto their deity. They then have found "evidence" of this type of god in whatever holy book they think is accurate.

This is proved by looking at what type of church people choose to attend. No one goes to a church with which they disagree. Everyone goes to the type of church that they most agree with. A church where the pastor and most members SPAG in a similar way to themselves.

This is the only "true" god. The SPAGed one. It (god) exists within the imagination of the god-believer. Thus the many christians who claim others (who don't have a similar doctrine to theirs) are not true christians while other christians (who do believe similarly to them) are in fact, true christians.

musKeeto:
That spag theory has to be one of the most incisive and lethal post on this forum. Epic to the power infinity.

mnwankwo:
@OP
The purpose for which God created us is to find supreme joy and radiant happiness. The power of GOD did not only create the worlds but drives its birth, growth, maturity, death, decay and renewal or rebirth. The power of GOD ensures that at each stage in the cosmic cycle, all creatures including man is given the opportunity to find supreme happiness and radiant joy. Man can only evolve into this supreme happiness if all his activities (words, action, imagination, thoughts, intent and intuition) are in sync with the will or laws of GOD. To enable man to know of these laws and indeed adapt to them, GOD sends his servants to this world to teach men the truth and also give them the power to adhere to this Truth if they so desire. These servants of GOD were sent to different cultures and at different epochs with the message of GOD specifically adapted to the spiritual maturity of the people. Moses, Hjalfdar, Krishna, Buddha, Laotse, Moha.med, John the Baptist, Lorber, Rudolf Stainer, etc were some of these messengers. They brought to their people, the truth about GOD that was adapted to the spiritual maturity of their various people. Had their message been kept pure by their followers, their messages will not contradict each other as it is apparent today but will form a single flight of steps leading to GOD.
All that is subsequently created (all material universes and its physically invisible counterparts) follow a cycle of birth, childhood, adolescence, adulthood, old age , senescence, death and rebirth. The earth was a training ground for human spirits who once left the spiritual kingdom of GOD as spirit seeds. Experiencing in the material creations including the earth will enable these spirit seeds to evolve into an image of the image of GOD with consciousnesses and a name. Supreme happiness can only become an intrinsic "part" of the human spirit when it has evolved into the likeness of the image of GOD. This natural spiritual evolution is only possible as long as material creations remain in existence. There is a a cosmic funnel above the physically invisible part of material creation where seeds that will evolve into material universes are spewed out while the rear of this cosmic funnel draws all that has decayed or died into disintegration so that they are again spewed out for a new birth. Now the power of GOD drives all that is is of matter to this cosmic funnel. Our universe and all the is in it will one day pass through this purifying cosmic funnel. Due to sin (a consequence of the fall of man), our earth become ethereally dense and was heading for a premature disintegration, a process that would have terminated the development of a majority of the human spirits and literally effaced them from the book of life.
The power and the strength of the messengers of GOD were insufficient to stop the premature disintegration of our earth. Here and there, their are few souls who are yearning for salvation in the midst of suffocating darkness. The love of GOD will not allow even one soul that is yearning for salvation to perish. It is because of these few souls that GOD incarnated a "living part of Himself in male sex" who thus became a son of GOD for he is one and inseparable from GOD the father. Thus Jesus, being the living Light, anchored the light of GOD on earth as well as established a direct path of the light from the earth to GOD the father. The unsubstaantiate power emanating from the Living light (Jesus Christ) forcefully pulled our earth from its premature disintegration, giving humanity more time to save themselves from the darkness that they have created. With his words Jesus also gave men the path leading to his father and by his power, he gave those who are willing the strength to follow this path. Jesus can only show men the path to his Father and the power to follow it but cannot force it on anyone.
To answer your question, Jesus have saved the world by preventing the earth (our school) from premature disintegration and by showing us the path to the Truth as well as the power to follow that path and find supreme happiness. Not even GOD can abrogate the freewill of man and thus, the son of GOD will not force men to follow the path of Truth. It is left for each individual to live in the sense of the Truth that Jesus brought to us or live in opposition to them. That choice is free but the consequences are irrevocable. With our free will, we can have the radiant bliss of heaven or the darkness of hell. Stay blessed.

mnwankwo:
@
These servants of GOD were sent to different cultures and at different epochs with the message of GOD specifically adapted to the spiritual maturity of the people. Moses, Hjalfdar, Krishna, Buddha, Laotse, Moha.med, John the Baptist, Lorber, Rudolf Stainer, L Ron Hubbard, J.K Rowling, George Lucas, Joseph Smith, Guru Maharaji, TB Joshua, Ayatollah Khomeine, Kim il Sung etc were some of these messengers.

Martian:

As usual, verbose nonsense. I like how you show the greatness of GOD by capitalizing the word GOD. Let me stop before GOD decides to disintegrate the universe out of anger.
At least your god.......excuse me, GOD, sends messengers to everyone. Forgive me, I took the liberty of adding some names to your list.

qstar:



Never knew it had been discussed in this forum. I first came across it in another forum, not Nairaland.

Then, in this forum, i bumped into a thread where someone said that Mazaje has a PHD. Is his PHD in religion/theology?

"Mazaje", you could also answer, pls

mnwankwo:

Hi Martian. You are free to do whatever you want with my submission. That is the beauty of free will..

mnwankwo:
I am absolutely indifferent to how discussants see or interpret my submissions. I am unmoved either by mockery or praise to my posts..

mnwankwo:
Let each person make out of it whatever he or she wants to make out of it. As always, stay blessed.

musKeeto:



https://www.nairaland.com/1156627/atheists-please-tell-us-conversion/2#13776719

LoL
That was good on paper and I share some of his sentiments.

Cool

However, consider this opposing opinion by Richard:

Sometimes I hear the concern from critics that those who advocate for the non-violent nature of God are just projecting their own ideas and desires onto God. But, here is the thing. Left to my own nature and personality, I definitely AM an eye-for- an-eye guy. I grew up wrestling in school and fighting in bars. I both drew blood and lost blood. So, my own natural bent toward reactionary violence is quite
honed, hostile and ever-ready. And, engaging in the verbally violent cross-examinations that practicing law demands has done nothing but show me how
to even more effectively shred people who are attacking my clients.


My point is that it's counter-intuitive and contrary, at least in my case, for my nature and personality to project non-violent attributes onto God. For me to advocate a non-violent image of God is not projection at all since I am not that way by inclination. Projection is a psychological transference of our OWN qualities or faults onto our image of another. In fact, in a way, its Jesus who isprojecting His own divine qualities ONTO and INTO us. And that's a good thing.

mazaje:


Nope my PhD is in information systems. . . .

MizMyColi:


LoL
That was good on paper and I share some of his sentiments.

Cool

However, consider this opposing opinion by Richard:




Having read that and this.

I have come to the conclusion that LIFE as we know it, is what we make it.
Yes, we're that powerful.

qstar:


Hey MizMyColi, Good day.

As often as you rely on someone else (Richard &co) to make your point, the more your intellectual independence appears shaky. I do not want to pass it on as insulting, but that's what it reverberates to me. My opinion though!

MizMyColi:


LoL
I feel like rambling sir, hope I'm allowed.

He quoted someone as a reply, I did the same because I really don't know much on the topic.

When you have thoughts forming in your head and you lack the right words and presentation, it is okay, imo, to duly reference others.

You prolly think I'm living their dogmas when you say intellectual indepence and shaky.
That's what it might seem like to lotsa people too.

As often as...

MizMyColi:

However, I see your angle on this clearly......
Thanks.

MizMyColi:


I am more a fan of Godwithin.
The powerful dimension, resident in all humans.

What differentiates is how much awareness we muster in living out our divine realities even in this world as we know it.

adexsimply:
well, pardon me. I could be a bit slow, and I hate making wrong deductions. Could you please throw some light on the texts I quoted?

MizMyColi:


Well, we were taught about God as being in heaven, the sky.
We were told he's mad at us, and if it weren't for Jesus, we wouldn't have access to him.
There are lotsa dogmas and rules which you might be aware of.

But what if there's no God in the sky?
What if the kingdom of heaven is within every individual.
What if it behooves on us to birth a new age?

No need for epistles yet, but the thing is, I am more inclined to the God/Power/Dimension/Source that lives within me.

Most of the miracles transformations I've known in my life didn't come form the sky or some heaven that is above.
They were inner workings from within me, which manifested in the physical.

By awareness...
Check out this analogy.
A prince who doesn't know his heritage is likely to behave like a servant.
but a prince who walks in the awareness of who he is, how much power and influence he wields, is in a better position to make things happen for himself and those around him.

You get?

adexsimply:

I just wanted to be sure I got what you meant by your previous post.
Well, you're still theistic to some extent just that your own god resides in you. I take it you don't really want to come out clean(I understand though). If I may ask, what makes you REJECT the assertion of the existence of a sky-daddy? I'm assuming you came from a Christian home?

I dabbled into Atheism for a bit.
Well, Sky God stopped making sense to me.

Owh yes, I believe in God....okay maybe itshis real name or nomenclature is not God...maybe.
But I know there's a higher power within everyone....one that sometimes manifests in the physical.
Most times, without a concrete awareness on my pert.

After all is said and done, to each his own path.

Yeah...I used to be a bible believing, zealot, staunch, fire brand, prayer warrior Christian

MizMyColi:


Thank you Chibwike.
I guess I've been caught in this trap, this trap of trying to have it all figured out, trying to make sense of things, trying to have a lot of answers, if not all the answers.

I am helped.

Isaacmacdon:
Hmmm... lots of answers?? Striking resemblance... hold on to wat chibwike said... Free Ur self from knowing too much... Ur aim should be inner peace... at least d lil u know shud push u forward.... [size=14pt]Honesty,truthfulness,humility,love,peace,patience[/size]... dese r d fruits of d holy one... U nid it .... an eye catching topic I must say... buh on my part I think d bible has d answer to every question whatsoever...

MizMyColi:


I dabbled into Atheism for a bit.
Well, Sky God stopped making sense to me.

Owh yes, I believe in God....okay maybe itshis real name or nomenclature is not God...maybe.
But I know there's a higher power within everyone....one that sometimes manifests in the physical.
Most times, without a concrete awareness on my pert.

After all is said and done, to each his own path.

Yeah...I used to be a bible believing, zealot, staunch, fire brand, prayer warrior Christian

adexsimply:
lol@ prayer warrior. So you found out prayer doesn't work? MFM?
What makes you think there's a higher power within you? How does it manifest in the physical? Do you have absolute control over it ? Does it influence your daily activities ? Do you communicate with it/him/them? What form does the power assume ?

I know where you're headed.
I'm not indulging you