Bobbysworld28:

I dont get. Who is d fool? The pedophile or the clown who follows him?

onetrack:
Atheist here. This whole issue of Muhammad marrying a 6-year-old girl is not a big deal from a historical perspective, as it is rightly pointed out that many cultures have accepted child marriage until quite recent times. I personally do not use the 'Muhammad-as-pedophile' approach, as he was a man of his time.

The problem is that Muslims hold up Muhammad as the role model for all of humanity for all time.

Whether or not some European ruler married a 6 year old back in the year 1400 doesn't really matter because nobody would consider him to be best man in history, worthy of being imitated until the end of time, unlike Muslims who are expected to try to imitate the life of Muhammad as the proper way of living. As a result, any Muslim who is against child marriage could be rightly criticised from a strict Islamic point of view. The Quran even gives instructions on how to divorce your pre-pubescent wife. Considering that Islam is considered to be final and unchangeable, this means that child marriage can never really be outlawed in an Islamic state. That, in my view, is a problem.

I would note that Christianity does not actually forbid child marriage either, and that neither religion forbids slavery.

Appreciate your openness. That is why i would reply you and ignore the other rants.
Your line of argument is quite impressive but you made major errors. In Islamic law, issues are divided into two: Religious and Mundane. We are bound to follow the Prophet in religious issues. In mundane issues, everyone is free to follow what he or his current society deems right.
Of course, you do not see Muslims riding horses and camels; you do not see Muslims living in deserts nor do you see Muslims wearing izhar (ancient Arab wrapper). These are mundane issues which are not legislated by Islam, rather, regulated. But in religious issues, they are both legislated and regulated. We HAVE TO pray the same way He prayed, fast the same way He fasted, on and on...

The issue of woman's marry-able age is the focal point of this discussion. As said earlier

The principle here is that you marry according to the definition of maturity in your locality.

This is because this issue is mundane.
Please note the difference.

Thanks for your openness, i wish it would lead you to guidance.
Goodluck to the evil ranters, i hope they would also get guided.

iboladeji:


Appreciate your openness. That is why i would reply you and ignore the other rants.
Your line of argument is quite impressive but you made major errors. In Islamic law, issues are divided into two: Religious and Mundane. We are bound to follow the Prophet in religious issues. In mundane issues, everyone is free to follow what he or his current society deems right.
Of course, you do not see Muslims riding horses and camels; you do not see Muslims living in deserts nor do you see Muslims wearing izhar (ancient Arab wrapper). These are mundane issues which are not legislated by Islam, rather, regulated. But in religious issues, they are both legislated and regulated. We HAVE TO pray the same way He prayed, fast the same way He fasted, on and on...

The issue of woman's marry-able age is the focal point of this discussion. As said earlier

This is because this issue is mundane.
Please note the difference.

Thanks for your openness, i wish it would lead you to guidance.
Goodluck to the evil ranters, i hope they would also get guided.

The issue of child marriage is not and can never be a mundane issue. It is a very deplorable, disgusting and ignominious act that should NEVER be tolerated in any sane society. It is a criminal act and who ever indulges in it should be condemned even if such a person claims to be a prophet.

PastorKun:


The issue of child marriage is not and can never be a mundane issue. It is a very deplorable, disgusting and ignominious act that should NEVER be tolerated in any sane society. It is a criminal act and who ever indulges in it should be condemned even if such a person claims to be a prophet.

Oga pastor, which one na. Na you go teach me my religion?

iboladeji:


Oga pastor, which one na. Na you go teach me my religion?

Child marriage is not just about religion but how sane people behave in a civilised society. It is a highly deplorable thing that must condemned without any equivocation.

If one married a nine year today and had intercouse with her he would go in for a long stretch of time.
Allah all knowing,the creator looks like he did not know that civilised societies 1300 years later would jail his prophet.
Do I doubt Allah? Yea on this he failed

PastorKun:



Child marriage is not just about religion but how sane people behave in a civilised society. It is a highly deplorable thing that must condemned without any equivocation.

mister, now go defend man-god and stop talking irrelevancies here. I have posted scholarly research on this issue on previous page. Read it or leave op alone and go to Vatican and preach to them to stop sexual assault on boys in the name of holy nonsense. You always talk about this when you can't defend your theology.

basilico:
If one married a nine year today and had intercouse with her he would go in for a long stretch of time.
Allah all knowing,the creator looks like he did not know that civilised societies 1300 years later would jail his prophet.
Do I doubt Allah? Yea on this he failed

No comment, other than PLEASE READ THROUGH PREVIOUS POSTS!!!
Talking with ignorance breeds disgusting feelings

I also do not see any reason to answer the Pastor..., it is clear that he and his friends cannot discuss on an intellectual level. Just hate-filled rants from premeditated ideas.
Can't we just discuss open-mindedly?

iboladeji:


Appreciate your openness. That is why i would reply you and ignore the other rants.
Your line of argument is quite impressive but you made major errors. In Islamic law, issues are divided into two: Religious and Mundane. We are bound to follow the Prophet in religious issues. In mundane issues, everyone is free to follow what he or his current society deems right.
Of course, you do not see Muslims riding horses and camels; you do not see Muslims living in deserts nor do you see Muslims wearing izhar (ancient Arab wrapper). These are mundane issues which are not legislated by Islam, rather, regulated. But in religious issues, they are both legislated and regulated. We HAVE TO pray the same way He prayed, fast the same way He fasted, on and on...

The issue of woman's marry-able age is the focal point of this discussion. As said earlier

This is because this issue is mundane.
Please note the difference.

Thanks for your openness, i wish it would lead you to guidance.
Goodluck to the evil ranters, i hope they would also get guided.

My training and my work are in the field of history so I hope I have some historical perspective of events.

I can agree with much of what you wrote. Of course Muslims are not obligated to marry a child just because Muhammad did. Every religion adapts itself to the culture of the time (obviously the Salafists would disagree with that). A Muslim being against child marriage is kind of like a Christian being against slavery: there is no clear religious basis to be against either one and there are specific passages in the holy scriptures permitting them, but few people (such as atheists ) would call a Christian out for being against slavery when the Bible permits it.

Christians should also be against almost all divorce and loaning money at interest, but you know how that works--there's always away around such rules. Regarding Islam, there are other things to criticize and I think that focusing on things other than the age of Aisha is more interesting.

onetrack:


My training and my work are in the field of history so I hope I have some historical perspective of events.

I can agree with much of what you wrote. Of course Muslims are not obligated to marry a child just because Muhammad did. Every religion adapts itself to the culture of the time (obviously the Salafists would disagree with that). A Muslim being against child marriage is kind of like a Christian being against slavery: there is no clear religious basis to be against either one and there are specific passages in the holy scriptures permitting them, but few people (such as atheists ) would call a Christian out for being against slavery when the Bible permits it.

Christians should also be against almost all divorce and loaning money at interest, but you know how that works--there's always away around such rules. Regarding Islam, there are other things to criticize and I think that focusing on things other than the age of Aisha is more interesting.

Briefly, let me point out another error.

Every religion adapts itself to the culture of the time (obviously the Salafists would disagree with that).

This is not wholly correct. Referring you back to a previous post

In Islamic law, issues are divided into two: Religious and Mundane. We are bound to follow the Prophet in religious issues. In mundane issues, everyone is free to follow what he or his current society deems right.
Of course, you do not see Muslims riding horses and camels; you do not see Muslims living in deserts nor do you see Muslims wearing izhar (ancient Arab wrapper). These are mundane issues which are not legislated by Islam, rather, regulated. But in religious issues, they are both legislated and regulated. We HAVE TO pray the same way He prayed, fast the same way He fasted, on and on...

Cultural issues only come into play in MUNDANE aspects of Islam. In religious aspects, you have no room for guesswork e.g A Chinese Muslim dare not pray/fast... differently from a Kanuri Muslim. Except for heretics of course.
Also, salafists and other adjectives are just names used to cause confusion. The religious rules are clear, those that follow strictly do and some decide to innovate. Muslim na Muslim, but quality differs based on conformity to dictates.

iboladeji:


Briefly, let me point out another error.

This is not wholly correct. Referring you back to a previous post

Cultural issues only come into play in MUNDANE aspects of Islam. In religious aspects, you have no room for guesswork e.g A Chinese Muslim dare not pray/fast... differently from a Kanuri Muslim. Except for heretics of course.
Also, salafists and other adjectives are just names used to cause confusion. The religious rules are clear, those that follow strictly do and some decide to innovate. Muslim na Muslim, but quality differs based on conformity to dictates.

As always, the 'devil' is in the details. Defining what is mundane vs. what religious is even itself subject to debate (hence the salafists). In any case Muslims are fond of saying that Islam is a complete way of life, and for many that means that every behavior is regulated by Islam. Other, not so strict Muslims, like sufis, would have a broader view of what is mundane and not regulated by religion. Even the Shia have quite different beliefs (praying only 3 times a day, for example).

Also, salafists and other adjectives are just names used to cause confusion.

No, they give clarity so that people can have some idea what type of Islam a person practices. If someone tells me they are just a Muslim, about the only thing I can really assume about them is that they accept Muhammad as a prophet and believe that the Quran is the word of God. If they tell me they are salafist or sufi, I can get a much better idea of their approach. In any case, your own prophet Muhammad said that the Muslims would divide into 73 sects, who are you to say that there are not really any divisions in Islam?

iboladeji:


Briefly, let me point out another error.

This is not wholly correct. Referring you back to a previous post

Cultural issues only come into play in MUNDANE aspects of Islam. In religious aspects, you have no room for guesswork e.g A Chinese Muslim dare not pray/fast... differently from a Kanuri Muslim. Except for heretics of course.
Also, salafists and other adjectives are just names used to cause confusion. The religious rules are clear, those that follow strictly do and some decide to innovate. Muslim na Muslim, but quality differs based on conformity to dictates.

So you believe hadith about prophet's 'marriage' to Aisha is valid?

Link where d catholic said marry married at d age of 12! Lol, islam looking for partners in crime . Fvck islam fvck muhammed(disaster be upon him)

Redoil:
if this is the way you reason then i give up.

U simply have nothing to say

Redoil:
such calender have been in exsistence for more than 2000years. So what is ur point exactly

There was no december 2000 Years ago, Please look for info urself n avoid misleading urself further

Bobbysworld28:

U actually wrote this? All by urself? U need to return ur school fees sharply because education has been wasted on u

Most educated Professor. Please go n get a new professorship

Bobbysworld28:

But then Solomon was not Christ. So solomon is ur standard now? I am a Christian not a Solomonite

So things that are not sin in the eyes of God later becomes sin centuries later. lol.