₦airaland Forum

agaugust:
Post citation for your percentages then, show us a weblink source to prove it , I DARE YOU !!!!!!
.

I have.

Last time we had this debate.

We are repeating ourselves.

I posted my citations and proved my percentages.

You refused to post anything for your decoys and still claimed they would defeat "all missiles"

Stop wasting my time, post your citations.

patches689:
So what?

Does Nigeria have submarines?

No?

Ok then.

# @Patches Surrenders In Shame ! South African Super Lynx have ZERO sonar and ZERO torpedoes !

.

patches689:
I have.

Last time we had this debate.

Nope you NEVER did. Show me source of your percentages or another disgrace for @Patches, second time in 5 minutes.

It's a bad weekend for you dude !

Your attempt to be fraudulent about Nigerian navy Lynx has ended up opening a new can of worms on this forum....

South African Super Lynx helicopters have ZERO sonar ZERO torpedoes ZERO Anti-Submarine Warfare !!!!!

South Africa spent $40 million to buy Super Lynx helicopter that is just ordinary patrol/rescue version = Nigeria's $10 million AW 109 helicopter

All Southies will hate you for this Patrick ! You exposed a big hole in your navy's sea capability, you wrecked your country !

[size=13pt]South African Super Lynx helicopters have ZERO sonar ZERO torpedoes ZERO ASW [/size]
.

agaugust:
Post citation for your percentages then, show us a weblink source to prove it , I DARE YOU !!!!!!
.

Before the war, France sold Argentina's military junta five Exocet missiles
http://www.bbc.com/news/magazine-17256975

Ships hit by exocets:

- HMS Sheffield
- Atlantic Conveyor (2 hits)
- HMS Glamorgan

4/5 Exocets hit their targets

This is 80%

See, you ask me for citations, I provide them.

Now, chaff decoys effectiveness please

agaugust:
[s]Nope you NEVER did. Show me source of your percentages or another disgrace for @Patches, second time in 5 minutes.

It's a bad weekend for you dude !

Your attempt to be fraudulent about Nigerian navy Lynx has ended up opening a new can of worms on this forum....

South African Super Lynx helicopters have ZERO sonar ZERO torpedoes !!!!!

All Southies will hate you for this Patrick ! You exposed a big hole in your navy's sea capability, you wrecked your country ![/s]
.

Augustus

You demand citations from me but refuse to post your own?

Post citation for your Lynx Sonar please, stop trying to change the argument.

Thank you

agaugust:
# @Patches Surrenders In Shame ! South African Super Lynx have ZERO sonar and ZERO torpedoes !

.

Does Nigeria have submarines?

I am not surrendering, I simply refuse to allow you to change the argument - I know your tactics, I know how you operate.

I have you right where I want you, desperate to change the topic to avoid the pain I am inflicting on you.

Now:

1. no one is talking about South African Lynxes - we are talking about Nigerian Lynxes.

So, CItation for Nigerian Lynx sonar please

2. no one is talking about Exocet missiles - we are talking about Nigerian decoy launchers

So Citation for Nigerian decoy launchers please

patches689:
Before the war, France sold Argentina's military junta five Exocet missiles
http://www.bbc.com/news/magazine-17256975

Ships hit by exocets:

- HMS Sheffield
- Atlantic Conveyor (2 hits)
- HMS Glamorgan

4/5 Exocets hit their targets

This is 80%

See, you ask me for citations, I provide them.

Now, chaff decoys effectiveness please

There are NO percentages for missile effectiveness in your source ! You invented the figures at home

Show me official manufactuer's figures or technical data sheet figures.

Then your story is 1982 war 33 years ago, HP-J 14 is a modern day 2014 decoy, so how does it compare with your old school Exocet missile? They are not same generation. Your argument therefore goes to the garbage bin.

Show me manufacturer specs for effectiveness of your missile, or else you get another shame this morning
.

agaugust:
[s]There are NO percentages for missile effectiveness in your source ! You invented the figures at home

Show me official manufactuer's figures or technical data sheet figures.

Then your story is 1982 war 33 years ago, HP-J 14 is a modern day 2014 decoy, so how does it compare with your old school Exocet missile? They are not same generation. Your argument therefore goes to the garbage bin.

Show me manufacturer specs for effectiveness of your missile, or else you get another shame this morning [/s]
.

80% of Exocets fired in war have hit their target - fact

Now show us manufacturer specs for your decoy launchers

I have provided citations, now provide yours

I am not going to argue with you. I am not going to discuss anything with you. I want to see your citations, or, you are going to remove your claims.

agaugust:
Nope you NEVER did. Show me source of your percentages or another disgrace for @Patches, second time in 5 minutes.

It's a bad weekend for you dude !

Your attempt to be fraudulent about Nigerian navy Lynx has ended up opening a new can of worms on this forum....

South African Super Lynx helicopters have ZERO sonar ZERO torpedoes !!!!!

South Africa spent $40 million to buy a Super Lynx helicopter that is just basic patrol/rescue version = Nigeria's $10 million AW 109 helicopter.

All Southies will hate you for this Patrick ! You exposed a big hole in your navy's sea capability, you wrecked your country !

[size=13pt]South African Super Lynx helicopters have ZERO sonar ZERO torpedoes[/size]
.

I have every reason to believe you since they can't prove it.

Secondly, their Frigate carry no torpedoes which means they had no plan for ASW.

Thirdly, the only reason jln115 have to prove that lynx have sonar is because of the round object underneath their lynx.

Fourthly, everything equipment they buy is not of full capabilities.

Finally, you have to prove your Gripens have aerial refueling capability.

patches689:
So what?

Does Nigeria have submarines?

No?

Ok then.

Wow, Patrick. You have ,unwittingly, showed us how defenceless your navy really are. .

And your online persona as a fraud is gradually coming off.

Try having the grace of owning up when you're outwitted and out proved. You waste our time and render your reputation as debate-unworthy.

Finally, it has been settled that your navy is no more than a surveillance outfit

agaugust:
Personal opinion demonstrated again, no single source or citation to prove all your tales by moonlight story telling.

Anyway thanks for finally admitting that Col. Eben is NOT in your SANDF and not a military man anymore, he is a civilian.

#Suicide Comment Of The Week
.

No one ever claimed that private contractor or mercenary was in the SANDF.


There are many like him in SA.

He held a rank of Lieutenant Colonel not Colonel in the SA military. Never dealt with strategic matters of the wars SA was involved in during the cold.

agaugust:
Nigerian navy has fired missiles, Otomats in sea exercises before, no navy does it all the time, SAN too did it only once with Valour frigates or you fire missiles every year like a ritual?

In your dreams right.

From interceptor boats?

When was the last time your navy combat officers were at sea being drilled?

No platform.

agaugust:
There are NO percentages for missile effectiveness in your source ! You invented the figures at home

Show me official manufactuer's figures or technical data sheet figures.

Then your story is 1982 war 33 years ago, HP-J 14 is a modern day 2014 decoy, so how does it compare with your old school Exocet missile? They are not same generation. Your argument therefore goes to the garbage bin.

Show me manufacturer specs for effectiveness of your missile, or else you get another shame this morning
.

When were real missile performance percentages ever available on the net?

And you realise the missile is different right?

agaugust:
Nope you NEVER did. Show me source of your percentages or another disgrace for @Patches, second time in 5 minutes.

It's a bad weekend for you dude !

Your attempt to be fraudulent about Nigerian navy Lynx has ended up opening a new can of worms on this forum....

South African Super Lynx helicopters have ZERO sonar ZERO torpedoes ZERO Anti-Submarine Warfare !!!!!

South Africa spent $40 million to buy Super Lynx helicopter that is just ordinary patrol/rescue version = Nigeria's $10 million AW 109 helicopter

All Southies will hate you for this Patrick ! You exposed a big hole in your navy's sea capability, you wrecked your country !

[size=13pt]South African Super Lynx helicopters have ZERO sonar ZERO torpedoes ZERO ASW [/size]
.

No navy in Sub Saharan Africa has modern helicopter launched light torpedoes.

The SAAF Super Lynx helos come with stuff maritime surveillance radar, data link, FLIR etc they're the most advanced in Sub Saharan.

Nigeria has near zero anti-submarine capabilities. In a war the NN can easily be contained denied sea mobility and destroyed if needed.

iblawi:
I have every reason to believe you since they can't prove it.

Secondly, their Frigate carry no torpedoes which means they had no plan for ASW.

Thirdly, the only reason jln115 have to prove that lynx have sonar is because of the round object underneath their lynx.

Fourthly, everything equipment they buy is not of full capabilities.

Finally, you have to prove your Gripens have aerial refueling capability.

The Valour class can carry light torpedoes.

That houses part of the maritime surveillance imaging and tracking radar system.

That's because we don't buy things off the shelf we have the opportunity to tailor our equipment for our needs.

And what is "full capabilities"?

Aerial refuelling capability? you mean the probes?

iblawi:
I have every reason to believe you since they can't prove it.

Secondly, their Frigate carry no torpedoes which means they had no plan for ASW.

Thirdly, the only reason jln115 have to prove that lynx have sonar is because of the round object underneath their lynx.

Fourthly, everything equipment they buy is not of full capabilities.

Finally, you have to prove your Gripens have aerial refueling capability.

Gripen C/D normally is built to do aerial refuelling, but South Africa has NO air refueling tanker, their old tanker is displayed in a museum

Look brah, the Southies know their Super Lynx has NO sonar, NO torpedo, NO anti-submarine warfare capability, they don't have courage to challenge us with any fake proof, SIPRI and other global sources I have checked all say they imported ordinary, powerless, and harmless patrol/rescue unarmed version of the Super Lynx, it's as harmless as a Nigerian AW 109 naval helicopter for basic sea patrol.

@Patches annoyed me with the rubbish he was saying about Nigerian navy Lynx ASW helicopter, when sources clearly prove it is ASW, then he kept trying to rubbish other people's weapons, not knowing that those people can retaliate and show him the garbage in his own backyard.

The South Africans have been deceiving us and lying to us for 5 years on this forum, the whole of South African army, navy and air force have NO SINGLE ANTI-SUBMARINE capability on ship or aircraft or helicopter !

They have been fraudulently showing their Super Lynx to us as an Anti-Submarine Warfare helicopter....ALL NA BIG LIE DEM DEY TALK

SAAF + SAN + SANDF = ZERO ASW CAPABILITY

South African military Super Lynx = civilian Coast Guard helicopter ......the truth has finally blown out today....SAN is bursted !
.

(2) For 2009-10, the number of security guards increased from 194,525 to 387,273 – 3 security guards for every police officer. Government even employs security companies for the protection of government itself. When the private sector and civil society engage security companies for street level protection, government has abandoned the single most important core function of a state as outlined in the constitution: protection of its citizens.

(3) The final account for the arms purchase will be R47.2bn. The initial cost in 1998 was R30bn. Some 20% of the accompanying logistical support for the three submarines is still missing. One of the subs has been in the dry dock since 2006 and may be there until 2013. The last support for the Agusta helicopters is still outstanding, as well as 11 Gripen fighters[b]. The military has troops, but cannot deploy them.[/b]

HIV/Aids has devastated the army and information about infection levels is a no-go area. In 2005 a cursory reference said 48%. The UN has determined that the level of infection in the armies of Southern Africa is basically four times the average of the national level. If this is true of South Africa, the country no longer possesses the capability of a fighting force – it has degenerated into a welfare society.

MikeCZAR:
No one ever claimed that private contractor or mercenary was in the SANDF.


There are many like him in SA.

He held a rank of Lieutenant Colonel not Colonel in the SA military. Never dealt with strategic matters of the wars SA was involved in during the cold.

Cool, so Nigerian army 72 mobile strike force was trained in COIN by a civilian head of a private military company and NOT South African army, so you finally come to your senses after all the gibberish you wrote here since last year about Col. Eben and the 120 men of NA he trained.

Meanwhile South African air force is being trained by Cuban air force, not a private military company in Cuba, the real Cuban air force of tiny Cuban Island nation is training big fat South African nation's pilots on how to fly an aircraft.....reason.....simple reason is that Cuban teenage pilots defeated Soth African pilots in Angola Bush war and you have decided to go back to your masters on that tiny Island to finish learning your lessons there in Cuba
.

agaugust:
Cool, so Nigerian army 72 mobile strike force was trained in COIN by a civilian head of a private military company and NOT South African army, so you finally come to your senses after all the gibberish you wrote here since last year about Col. Eben and the 120 men of NA he trained.

Meanwhile South African air force is being trained by Cuban air force, not a private military company in Cuba, the real Cuban air force of tiny Cuban Island nation is training big fat South African nation's pilots on how to fly an aircraft.....reason.....simple reason is that Cuban teenage pilots defeated Soth African pilots in Angola Bush war and you have decided to go back to your masters on that tiny Island to finish learning your lessons there in Cuba
.

Who received he's military training in South Africa.

A former SA military officer he's knowledge in COIN warfare comes from the SA military.

Cuba never really fought in Angola by the time their division fully deployed the conflict was now being fought by diplomats.

MikeCZAR:
No navy in Sub Saharan Africa has modern helicopter launched light torpedoes.

The SAAF Super Lynx helos come with stuff maritime surveillance radar, data link, FLIR etc they're the most advanced in Sub Saharan.

Nigeria has near zero anti-submarine capabilities. In a war the NN can easily be contained denied sea mobility and destroyed if needed.

Nigeria has helicopter launched AS244 light torpedoes, we purchased them from Italy and we have them. We are the only ones in Sub-Saharan Africa.

Nigeria has Lynx ASW helicopter and NNS Aradu frigate ship ASW as our reserve anti-submarine warfare platforms, we have them in reserve and can use them if a submarine threat arises, BTWN the NNS Aradu refit is about to start and she will return to sea from reserve to full operations.

Meanwhile, South Africa has ZERO anti-submarine warfare capabilities.

If you threaten us at sea, we can decide to use our reserve ASW platforms by bringing them out of reserve, or we put our ships safe in harbour, shielded by anti-submarine and anti-torpedo nets, then we wait for your Submarine to part-surface in 2 days to recharge it's battery for survival, then we send Alpha jets and CH-3 guided air lto surface missile armed drones to destroy your submarine.

Those Nigerian navy small boats you underrate are very very dangerous in littoral warfare to protect Nigerian territorial waters, Nigerian Shaldag Ocean Interceptor armed radar guided cannon gunboat speed runs twice faster than your torpedo and Shaldag almost does not stay on water, it almost skims and flies in the air and our X-38 automatic grenade launcher armed Stealth combat Catamarans are almost invisible to radar plus high speed and low noise near silent mini engine so hard for sonar to detect as they almost fly on sea surface, they are also equipped with echo sounders to detect underwater objects.

Nigeria can also deploy 50 armed Shaldags and Stealth Catamarans to sea, to deny your Submarine a chance to part-surface and snorkel, fear will not let your submarine snorkel, and lack of oxygen will kill Soweto sailors inside their unlucky submarine after 2 days, your maximum submarine time under water is a short and brief 2 days or else your Submarine battery will die and the submarine will perish with all the sailors inside it choked to death, and down to the sea bed sinks Mandela's Submarine, wasted $300 million sub in one day.

Meanwhile, Valour frigates will die from Nigerian coastal artillery or F-7 jets rockets and Alpa jets carpet bombing harassment.

See, it is technically impossible for South Africa to blockade Nigeria at sea, we are too powerful for that kind of game, get it ?
.

MikeCZAR:
The Valour class can carry light torpedoes.

Shuut Up and stop lying you fraud !

South African Valour frigates have NO SINGLE torpedo purchased for them. So eat the humble pie

Nigerian Navy is the only navy with ship and helicopter torpedoes in the whole sub-saharan Africa
.

agaugust:
Nigeria has helicopter launched AS244 light torpedoes, we purchased them from Italy and we have them. We are the only ones in Sub-Saharan Africa.

Nigeria has Lynx ASW helicopter and NNS Aradu frigate ship ASW as our reserve anti-submarine warfare platforms, we have them in reserve and can use them if a submarine threat arises, BTWN the NNS Aradu refit is about to start and she will return to sea from reserve to full operations.

[s]Meanwhile, South Africa has ZERO anti-submarine warfare capabilities.[/s]

If you threaten us at sea, we can decide to use our reserve ASW platforms by bringing them out of reserve, or we put our ships safe in harbour, shielded by anti-submarine and anti-torpedo nets, then we wait for your Submarine to part-surface in 2 days to recharge it's battery for survival, then we send Alpha jets and Missile armed drones to destroy your submarine.

Those Nigerian navy small boats you underrate are very very dangerous in littoral warfare to protect Nigerian territorial waters, Nigerian Shaldag Ocean Interceptor boat speed runs twice faster than your torpedo and Shaldag almost does not stay on water, it almost skims and flies in the air and our X-38 Stealth combat Catamarans are almost invisible to radar plus high speed and low noise near silent mini engine so hard for sonar to detect as they almost fly on sea surface.

Nigeria can also deploy 50 Shaldags and Stealth Catamarans to sea, to deny your Submarine a chance to part-surface and snorkel, fear will not let your submarine snorkel, and lack of oxygen will kill Soweto sailors inside their unlucky submarine after 2 days, your maximum submarine time under water is a short and brief 2 days or else your Submarine battery will die and the submarine will perish with all the sailors inside it choked to death, and down to the sea bed sinks Mandela's Submarine, wasted $300 million sub in one day.

Meanwhile, Valour frigates will die from Nigerian coastal artillery or F-7 jets rockets and Alpa jets carpet bombing harassment.

See, it is technically impossible for South Africa to blockade Nigeria at sea, we are too powerful for that kind of game, get it ?
.

1. Aradu and your Lynx are non operational - thus you have no capabilities

2. Our subs can hunt and destroy enemy submarines while the Valour Class is fully equipped for ASW capabilities

3. Shaldag poses no real risk to the Valour Class or Heroine Class - the subs can completely ignore it and the Valour class will swat it aside without any thought

4. No, the Shaldag will not prevent the Heroine Class from snorkeling.


5. Coastal artillery will not do anything to the Valour Class as I have shown in the past, while the Valour Class air-defence systems are more than enough to cope with air attack

Yet again, you fail so pathetically.

Nigeria does not posses a navy, only a coast guard

agaugust:
Shuut Up and stop lying you fraud !

South African Valour frigates have NO SINGLE torpedo purchased for them. So eat the humble pie

Nigerian Navy is the only navy with ship and helicopter torpedoes in the whole sub-saharan Africa
.

Good thing no one in sub-saharan Africa has submarines

What you keep trying to avoid is that you have NO ASW capabilities and that we have a submarine... and not the other way around

SAAF Air Capability Demo - 09/09/15

...09/09/15 Continued

.

[size=13pt]South Africans ...Bwhahahahaha

Desperate Southie people, when Naija people wreck their military with facts, they start posting random photos .

# Defeated SAAF has ZERO anti-submarine helicopters...Proved, Mandela's Super Lynx is NOT Super [/size]
.

The point has apparently been reached where the SA Air Force (SAAF) is aware it cannot fulfil its defence
obligations and the airborne arm of the SANDF has turned to pilots flying for the national carrier, SAA, for
assistance.
The Afrikaans Sunday paper Rapport said it has a copy of a memorandum sent to South African Airways
(SAA) pilots last week. It asks them to help out as reserve pilots at a “few SAAF squadrons”. The paper
points out the “emergency call” came in the same week the National Sea Rescue Institute (NSRI) informed
Parliament it could not depend on the air force in the event of a major shipping disaster, such as the
Oceanos sinking in 1991.
Dr Cleeve Robertson, NSRI chief executive, told Parliament’s Portfolio Committee on Transport 22
Squadron can “at best” put a pair of Oryx helicopters in the air to assist in sea rescue. He put it that the
AFB Ysterplaat-based unit could “hardly” be called a squadron any longer.
The squadron apparently does not have any pilots currently qualified to land on vessels at sea. This has
been put down to the non-availability of a platform for practice. The SA Navy supply vessel, SAS
Drakensberg, is the preferred platform for this training but she has been out of commission for about 18
months undergoing a major refit and accompanying maintenance. She is now back in the water but has
yet to be commissioned as fully seaworthy following the refit.
According to Rapport the memorandum issued by SAA Flight Operations is looking for pilots to increase
“capacity” at certain squadrons. It goes on to state timescales will be finalised in the near future and, as
soon as further information is available, this will be circulated......

.......Going back 10 years, 22 Squadron would be able to put six Oryx into the air while the squadron’s current
situation is such it has one, possibly two, of the rotary-winged workhorses available at any given time.

tsk tsk tsk
#facepalm. Very unpatriotic force. SANDF.


www.defenceweb.co.za/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=40595&catid=74&Itemid=30

agaugust:
.
[size=13pt]South Africans ...Bwhahahahaha

Desperate Southie people, when Naija people wreck their military with facts, they start posting random photos .

# Defeated SAAF has ZERO anti-submarine helicopters...Proved, Super Lynx is NOT Super [/size]
.

[size=13pt]The irony of this post

Still waiting for your citations on your non-operational Lynx sonar

Your attempts at changing the topic are so pathetic

o, and here are my citations:
http://www.agustawestland.com/product/helicopters/superlynx300
[/size]

dragon2:
The point has apparently been reached where the SA Air Force (SAAF) is aware it cannot fulfil its defence
obligations and the airborne arm of the SANDF has turned to pilots flying for the national carrier, SAA, for
assistance.
The Afrikaans Sunday paper Rapport said it has a copy of a memorandum sent to South African Airways
(SAA) pilots last week. It asks them to help out as reserve pilots at a “few SAAF squadrons”. The paper
points out the “emergency call” came in the same week the National Sea Rescue Institute (NSRI) informed
Parliament it could not depend on the air force in the event of a major shipping disaster, such as the
Oceanos sinking in 1991.
Dr Cleeve Robertson, NSRI chief executive, told Parliament’s Portfolio Committee on Transport 22
Squadron can “at best” put a pair of Oryx helicopters in the air to assist in sea rescue. He put it that the
AFB Ysterplaat-based unit could “hardly” be called a squadron any longer.
The squadron apparently does not have any pilots currently qualified to land on vessels at sea. This has
been put down to the non-availability of a platform for practice. The SA Navy supply vessel, SAS
Drakensberg, is the preferred platform for this training but she has been out of commission for about 18
months undergoing a major refit and accompanying maintenance. She is now back in the water but has
yet to be commissioned as fully seaworthy following the refit.
According to Rapport the memorandum issued by SAA Flight Operations is looking for pilots to increase
“capacity” at certain squadrons. It goes on to state timescales will be finalised in the near future and, as
soon as further information is available, this will be circulated......

.......Going back 10 years, 22 Squadron would be able to put six Oryx into the air while the squadron’s current
situation is such it has one, possibly two, of the rotary-winged workhorses available at any given time.

tsk tsk tsk
#facepalm. Very unpatriotic force. SANDF.


www.defenceweb.co.za/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=40595&catid=74&Itemid=30

Its a developing story

All we have is the allegations of the NSRI

SAAF trying to make use of SAA pilots is common practice amongst airforces around the world.

Americans are trying to do exactly the same thing
http://www.airforcetimes.com/story/military/2015/04/20/airlines-increase-pilot-hiring-threaten-af-retention/25941529/

While the SAAF has made extensive use of civilian pilots since its very inception
http://www.af.mil.za/reserves/reserves.htm

You are desperatly trying to create controversy where there is none

patches689:
Its a developing story

All we have is the allegations of the NSRI

SAAF trying to make use of SAA pilots is common practice amongst airforces around the world.

Americans are trying to do exactly the same thing
http://www.airforcetimes.com/story/military/2015/04/20/airlines-increase-pilot-hiring-threaten-af-retention/25941529/

While the SAAF has made extensive use of civilian pilots since its very inception
http://www.af.mil.za/reserves/reserves.htm

You are desperatly trying to create controversy where there is none

lol give me a break. You dare to compare the size of the US air force to yours? Your people simple prefer to drink than fight. Your pilots run to the civies once the get trained because there is no iota of patriotism.

dragon2:
lol give me a break. You dare to compare the size of the US air force to yours? Your people simple prefer to drink than fight. Your pilots run to the civies once the get trained because there is no iota of patriotism.

1. No, I am not comparing the size of our airforce to theirs. Please learn how to read.
2. "Your pilots run to the civies once the get trained because there is no iota of patriotism" WHICH IS THE EXACT SAME PROBLEM THE AMERICANS ARE HAVING YOU CLOWN

In future:
- read my post
- understand my post
- reply accordingly

Congratulations on making a fo.ol of yourself.

patches689:
Its a developing story

All we have is the allegations of the NSRI

SAAF trying to make use of SAA pilots is common practice amongst airforces around the world.

Americans are trying to do exactly the same thing

http://www.airforcetimes.com/story/military/2015/04/20/airlines-increase-pilot-hiring-threaten-af-retention/25941529/

While the SAAF has made extensive use of civilian pilots since its very inception
http://www.af.mil.za/reserves/reserves.htm

You are desperatly trying to create controversy where there is none

patches689:
1. No, I am not comparing the size of our airforce to theirs. Please learn how to read.
2. "Your pilots run to the civies once the get trained because there is no iota of patriotism" WHICH IS THE EXACT SAME PROBLEM THE AMERICANS ARE HAVING YOU CLOWN

In future:
- read my post
- understand my post
- reply accordingly

Congratulations on making a fo.ol of yourself.

Fraud, you are a fraud !!!

Stop lying, America is not doing the same foolish thing that SAAF is doing, it's actually the exact opposite in America.

Your own source says USAF military pilots are so many and so good technically, that commercial airlines want to employ them and offer higher salary.

"This is sort of low-hanging fruit," Harvey said. "We've got amazing individuals coming out of the military, that are ready and excited and passionate about starting a career, or continuing a career, that we can utilize and capitalize on their experience. We have to look at every pipeline available."

The commercial airlines hope to lure military pilots away by offering hefty salaries, extensive benefits and job security without having to deploy, a Rand Corp. study found."

http://www.airforcetimes.com/story/military/2015/04/20/airlines-increase-pilot-hiring-threaten-af-retention/25941529/

I am using your own source to prove you a fraud as usual.

South African air force is having current shortage of pilots today 2015 and are asking South African airways a commercial airline for help

SAAF is dead, I have always said it.....September 2015 news reports proves us to be right !
.