₦airaland Forum

proudkafir:
Domestic violence is a common thing in most homes today, be it a christian home, muslim home, bhudist home, hindu home, etc. There is no people of any religion thats is excluded from domestic violence, especially against the women.

However, what makes islamic domestic violence different is that, while other faith does not specifically sanctioned domestic violence against women, the islamic faith does. I know this will surprise and embarass many muslims, but that is the truth. We will consider the quranic verse(s) and al-hadith that sanctioned domestic violence against women.

In quran 4:34, muslims are enjoined to punish their wife if\when they misbehave. In fact part of the punishment recommended is beating (some western quranic versions render it beating lightly, what is the parameter to measure the extent or effect of beating?). And as usual, many muslim apologist will argue that mohammed never beat or hit any of his wives. However the alhadith below showed that bodily harm to women, in order to correct them, is perfectly acceptable in islam:

Sahih Bukhari (72:715) - A woman came to Muhammad and begged her to stop her husband from beating her. Her skin was bruised so badly that it is described as being "greener" than the green veil she was wearing. Muhammad did not admonish her husband, but instead ordered her to return to him and submit to his sexual desires.

Bukhari (72:715) - "Aisha said, 'I have not seen any woman suffering as much as the believing women (muslim women)'" Muhammad's own wife complained of the abuse that the women of her religion suffered relative to other women.

Muslim (4:2127) - Muhammad struck his favorite wife, Aisha, in the chest one evening when she left the house without his permission. Aisha narrates, "He struck me on the chest which caused me pain."

Muslim (9:3506) - Muhammad's fathers- in-law (Abu Bakr and Umar) amused him by slapping his wives (Aisha and Hafsa) for annoying him. According to the Hadith, the prophet of Islam laughed upon hearing this.
These are few alhadith that serve as a guide to how muslim men can discipline their disobedient wives.

In the western world, a husband merely hitting his wife can land him in jail but in a muslim world, wife-beating in part of the sunnah of the prophet and perfectly acceptable. As a matter of fact, an abusive husband can never go to jail in a country like saudi arabia or Iran. Why is this so It is in the quran and the hadith.

We, as decent and normal human, must not allow the culture of the arabs dictate the relationship we must have with our wives. Women, in the bible, are described as 'weaker vessels' and anything weak or fragile must be handled with care and respect.

Of course some women are sturborn and can make a man lose his temper, however a religious book must not sanction wife-beating the way islamic religious books do, it is immoral and unacceptable in a civilize and decent society. There are many ways of correcting an insurbordinating wife without physically harming her. What if it is the man that is the problem in the house, should the woman also beat the man for him to behave?

Men should show love and care for their wives and not follow the quranic advise of wife-bearing or the sunnah of the islamic prophet on how to maltreat a supposedly sturborn wife. Men should know what makes their wife rebelious and maturedly reach a compromise in order to build a happy home and a healthy society.

Mty4real:
Been a country like Saudi Arabia does not mean they are immuned from making mistakes, this is grievously wrong if at all there is an iota of truth in what you were saying, to curtail Muslim sisters in fire just for them to get burnt whereas DOCTRINE OF NECESSITY under Islamic law has been totally ignored, it is even a SIN to submit to demise where you can circumvent it. For instance it is a SIN to fast ramadan where you know that you have chronic Ulcer. And with regards to my friend, all the hadith you have cited are summarized very wrongly and inaccurate, because using them as your headlines to fit in your argument is very wrong, now I have checked the full of it and I can see that Aisha was just provoked to have said that when she sees a woman beaten up by her husband, but she later understood what actually happened in which you suppose to bring it up on this page if at all you are not malicious

Mty4real:
Someone will now agree with me on the defective nature of jesus not getting married, now tell me how can you restrict a man with a woman, this is unrealistic looking at what is obtainable at the moment, some developed countries were now suffering from this selfish law of one man one woman, where women were rendered useless and derogated without husband,and they kept complaining. And for your information it is Only Islam that specifically told us to marry just ONE if we cannot do JUSTICE, but if you can do justice, what stops you from marrying more than one, at least it is better than having a lot of concubines and illegal sexual act. It is natural to go for more than one woman, no be so?

proudkafir:
www.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/1874471.stm

www.theblaze.com/stories/2012/01/18/saudi-journalist-religious-police-made-15-school-girls-burn-to-death-because-they-were-not-wearing-hijabs/

Facts dont lie, see link above on the death of saudi girls who were asked to remain in a burning hostel because they were not wearing the islamic dress called 'abaya' or what i called 'slave cloths'. If those girls were boys they wouldnt have died, am i right? And again, you cant blame the saudi authorities because they must obey allahh at all cost, even if all the girls have to die.

On Aisha again, how was Aisha provoked by saying the truth? Were you there? Aisha, who saw how the lady's body was severely bruised hence felt very emotional such that she had to remark: 'I have never seen women suffer as much as muslim women'. That means that it was not an isolated case, many muslim women were actually suffering. Who are you protecting here, mohammed or the suffering muslim women?

You can quote the full narratives in the hadith so that the whole world can see how kind your prophet was. Remeber, you muslims call mohammed 'mercy to mankind' and 'the best of mankind', which means that he is the perfect example muslims should emulate. How can you describe such a vile character as 'mercy to mankind' and 'the best of mankind'? Does islam change man's view by him calling a white black and a black white?

Mty4real:
On the other hadith Muslim, actually I have just read the mischievous headline posted without getting deep, but after reading fully you could now see what Aisha was deriving at, she is not trying to trivialize the struck on chest that you people hold on to, but trying to emphasize that Angels doesn't visit a house where women are uncovered or stripped, and as a wife you should no what your husband can and cannot do, as such for the fact that you are secretly tracing him means you are suspecting him, in which as a solution it is not to trace him but ask him where he is going before he left,if at all you aren't suspecting him. And moreover in the history, she is still called the favourite woman to the prophet, so is it wrong to correct someone you love most?

proudkafir:
Muslims are never short of excuses, especially when the want to justify the evil of your criminal prophet. Who told you that there is shortage of men and excess women in the 'marriageable' age bracket. In china and India, there are more men than women hence many men find it hard to get a wife.

The demographic composition in the arab world had always been 50:50 between male and female. The people that marry many wives are the rich muslims while the poor ones find it hard to get a wife hence gettin married to widows is common among the muslim arabs. Be logical a bit, if we have 100 men and 100 women living in a community, and 25 men marry 4 wives each (in obedience to allahh\mohammed), that mean 75 men in that community will not have any wife while the rich 25 have 4 wives each. Is that not evil and sexxual greed?

No society can progress scientifically and intellectually where polygamy is the norm. Tell me a single society where polygamy is legal that is developed? None.

Aside from that, the rivalry between kids of different mother and a single father is always bad and deadly. Some of them go killing each other, especially if the father is rich. Why must a sane man create family rivalry and competition is his home? This can only happen in islam. The resultant and cummulative effect of this stupid policy of mohammed are poverty and hunger. Have you asked yourself why muslims are running to europe and america where polygamy is illegal?

Mty4real:
Well.. I think I have made my position very clear on Saudi Arabia's issue, it is wrong and UNISLAMIC to forcefully command ladies to stay inside fire just to get burn, Islam and Saudi Arabia are different things so please NOTE. And again I told you that anything that happened in that stance will just fall under NECESSITY and talking about that every reasonable man will know that you shouldn't be talking about hijab or veil where lives are at stake and where people are struggling to safe themselves from fire, it will be a SIN in the sight of Allah to have waited for the fire to get you crushed after having way to escape. We have a situation in the time of Khalifa Umar where cutting the thief hands were suspended because of starvation. To Aisha again, I don't think because I struck my wife in correcting her has made me merciless, or has made me brutal, and why don't you research more on where Aisha succeeded in praising the prophet beautifully ever ever? Or is it because that will not support your argument?

Demmzy15:
My brother, please don't allow this people to get to you. No matter what you do or say, they're never satisfied, they'll make you slender and back bite other Muslims all in the name of defense of Islam. The person you're talking to is true2god aka true2satan, a flat'headed stiffnecked Yeebhoe boy who when he eventually gets free 10mb begins to pour out old trashy rhetorics, don't mind them and back off.

They'll push you to the extent of saying things you're not meant to say! Salam Alaikum

Mty4real:
You have argued well... But not applicable in this stance, you cannot address this issue by looking at the populous gender regarding birth rate , but rather you look at populous gender regarding death rate, this will show you that women were regarded as leftover and considered populous check France and the likes. And again we outnumbered them at birth just in a very negligible number, which is not much. So who is going to marry those leftovers using your one man one woman approach. And to be sincere, is it not all those countries that practice monogamy were the most indecent in terms of illicit sexual act, to the extent of promulgating gay marriage after been tired with having free illicit sexual act which is not bad having mistress all over in so far as they were not married to them . And then whether rich or poor and you want to get married that is another issue to be discussed elaborately later. And who told you monogamy is not used to violence as much as that of polygamy, and I know that been developed shouldn't be determined by polygamy or monogamy especially the way you are couching it.... To be continued

proudkafir:
The area with the highest male mortality rate is the arab world. A man with one wife have a tendency of living longer than a man with four wives, all things being equal. The pressure and stress a man with 4 will hav will be more than that of a man with a single wife.

You said monogamy encourages indecency, well I dont know where you get your facts. Your prophet was not even satisfied with 4 wives, if he was a decent man he wouldnt have broken his own rule of a man not taking more than 4 wives.

Again, your religion encourages contract marriage, called nikah mut'a. Muta is evil in christianity but ok in islam. I can engage in muta with a woman for one day and dissolve it afterwards. This is a technical prostitution that islam and allahh sanctioned.

The people at the receiving end of this evil practices are the muslim women.

Mty4real:
You are still falling back to what I have corrected you not to do again, I think the purpose of these discussions should end fruitfully and not trying to deceive people with a very low knowledge of the actual fact of what we are talking about, it is an established fact that before the advent of Islam, mostly if not all tribes and Nations have engaged in polygamy, so it is ONLY Islam that came to reduce it to FOUR and even reduced to ONE if you cannot do JUSTICE, so talking about the prophet, he has most of these wives before the prohibition was revealed, and it's Allah that commanded him to keep them as it is before the revelation. The mut'a marriage you are talking about was also banned since the time of prophet, so why bringing the issue in this 21st century just to wake the sleeping dog, I think I will use the advice of my brother that says you are indeed on a mission to pull my legs and not to hear the truth, and Allah have said there will be people like you that will deny the truth no matter how far you have strive to lighten up there heart, I submit on this long overflogged issue and thanks for the discussion, I really appreciate it.

Mty4real:
You are still falling back to what I have corrected you not to do again, I think the purpose of these discussions should end fruitfully and not trying to deceive people with a very low knowledge of the actual fact of what we are talking about, it is an established fact that before the advent of Islam, mostly if not all tribes and Nations have engaged in polygamy, so it is ONLY Islam that came to reduce it to FOUR and even reduced to ONE if you cannot do JUSTICE, so talking about the prophet, he has most of these wives before the prohibition was revealed, and it's Allah that commanded him to keep them as it is before the revelation. The mut'a marriage you are talking about was also banned since the time of prophet, so why bringing the issue in this 21st century just to wake the sleeping dog, I think I will use the advice of my brother that says you are indeed on a mission to pull my legs and not to hear the truth, and Allah have said there will be people like you that will deny the truth no matter how far you have strive to lighten up there heart, I submit on this long overflogged issue and thanks for the discussion, I really appreciate it.

Mty4real:
You are still falling back to what I have corrected you not to do again, I think the purpose of these discussions should end fruitfully and not trying to deceive people with a very low knowledge of the actual fact of what we are talking about, it is an established fact that before the advent of Islam, mostly if not all tribes and Nations have engaged in polygamy, so it is ONLY Islam that came to reduce it to FOUR and even reduced to ONE if you cannot do JUSTICE, so talking about the prophet, he has most of these wives before the prohibition was revealed, and it's Allah that commanded him to keep them as it is before the revelation. The mut'a marriage you are talking about was also banned since the time of prophet, so why bringing the issue in this 21st century just to wake the sleeping dog, I think I will use the advice of my brother that says you are indeed on a mission to pull my legs and not to hear the truth, and Allah have said there will be people like you that will deny the truth no matter how far you have strive to lighten up there heart, I submit on this long overflogged issue and thanks for the discussion, I really appreciate it.

Mty4real:
I think I am now justified by all your comments, and any researcher and fact founder would have spotted all your mistakes and where you have problems in understanding the religion, BUT as I have said what is the essence of all arguments if it's not fruitful, you are not ready to leave your religion and neither do I want to leave mine, so why do you derive pleasure in abusing our prophet, and neither are we allowed to abused yours because it's part of been courteous and respectful to your dear jesus as COMMANDED by the Holy book, why don't we face ourselves in terms of intentions and deeds, and why don't we go back to what we believed in and let us be judged by it. At this juncture, whether you called him all funny names among which you called him PEDOFILE, hahahahahaI found it very funny and idiotic, do u really know who is called a PEDOFILE? Mtseeeew. Well... The deed has been done, he has succeeded in influencing the whole world, and YOU PEOPLE with all your kindness, and MERCY, you have not even succeeded in influencing NAIRALANDERS not to talk of....

Mty4real:
Hahahaha very funny, so WHAT WILL YOU NOW call him when he married his first wife Khadija who was TIMES TEN older than him, or is it that all other wives of his are also children, or don't you know a pedophile is someone who has psychiatric order that will be hunting him uptil his demise, a pedophile will always suffer from such deficiency from time to time

proudkafir:
Please khadijah was not ten times older than mohammed, she was 15 years older than him.

Kahdijah was a very rich woman who assisted mohammed financially (mohammed at a time was also her employee) and also decided to marry mohammed. It will be difficult for mohammed to marry another woman at that time because, financially, khadijah ran the show. It will only be ungrateful for mohammed to go after other women, using his wife's money to do that. I give mohammed kudos for respecting himself while khadijah was alive.

However, mohammed became a changed man immediately khadijah dies. It wasnt on record that mohammed was able to manage khadijah's business after she died. In the early days of the islamic community, after the death of khadijah, the muslim ummah find things very hard and barely feed. It was the generosity of the pagans that sustain the livelihood of the muslim ummah then. Let me not go further on that.

On the issue of a man being a pedofile, it is true that it is a psychiatric disorder. What gives you the impression that mohammed didnt have a psychiatric disorder then, since he was always alone in a cave being supposedly possesed by one 'angel gabriel'? Remember that mohammed was always pressed down whenever this angel gabriel wanted to speak to him (it is in your hadith, i will give you if you dont mind). Mohammed atimes suffered a violent convulsion anytime he wanted to recieve 'revelation' from that fake angel gabriel.

So going by mohammed's own experience with the fake 'angel gabriel', we might conclude that he actually suffered a psychiatric disorder. If not, how can a man of 51 years make a marriage proposal to a girl of 6 years? If another person does that, aside from mohammed, I believed you will agree with me that the man has a psychological problem. However, since you are a devout muslim, you can never say your prophet has a psychiatric problem, but as a non-muslim, I think he had.

Mty4real:
Hahahaha very funny, so WHAT WILL YOU NOW call him when he married his first wife Khadija who was TEN TIMES older than him, Perhaps let me invent a word called 'adultphile' or is it that all other wives of his are also children, or don't you know a pedophile is someone who has psychiatric order that will be hunting him uptil his demise, a pedophile will always suffer from such deficiency from time to time

Mty4real:
So as you laid down in your own words, he was sensible enough to have been employed by her, and he was sensible to have been managing the business properly before marriage, he was sensible to have married a wealthy woman, and he was sensible when he thought it will not be wise of him to marry another woman while she was the one packaging the runs, and so suddenly he changed and was suffering from psychiatric disorder, I even thought you will even give him another phrase like adultphile when he married someone that is 15yrs older than him who is old enough to be..... Fill in the blanks

Mty4real:
I am glad you admit that we have someone called a disobedient wife, but what I will now ask you is to bring any other suitable way to treat a disobedient wife apart from these stages prescribed by the Holy book, at least if you are condemning something, then you bring up the better ones so that we can now discuss it and wage it. Again you should stand corrected where you said there is no way of dealing with men too if they misbehaved, indeed we have several ways in dealing with them, some of it is to seek REDRESS in court when she is MALTREATED or NOT MAINTAINED, OR EVEN TIRED OF THE HUSBAND ON SOME OTHER GROUNDS OTHER than THE ONES MENTIONED. Infact Islam came purposely to save them from evil and unjust men and of course you wouldn't expect the Holy book to be silent on that,just pick a topic and let us discuss. Lastly with regards to the hadith, they were misunderstood as I have said, I will like to treat each hadith on its merit, starting with the woman that comes to the prophet complaining that she was beaten by her husband, yes agreed she was beaten and it is only an unreasonable man that will beat without reason, as such the prophet gave her medication, and that is to be SUBMISSIVE to her husband when it comes to SEX. That means she has been denying him SEX all along before he went berserk. And I did not see any reason why you will persistently deny your legal husband of SEX. With regards that of Aisha, the prophet has tried to caution Aisha by leaving a husbands house WITHOUT PERMISSION WILL be unacceptable, as he is the bread winner and leader of the family, or maybe I should ask if it's good to leave husband house without permission. To be continued.....

Mty4real:
Someone will now agree with me on the defective nature of jesus not getting married, now tell me how can you restrict a man with a woman, this is unrealistic looking at what is obtainable at the moment, some developed countries were now suffering from this selfish law of one man one woman, where women were rendered useless and derogated without husband,and they kept complaining. And for your information it is Only Islam that specifically told us to marry just ONE if we cannot do JUSTICE, but if you can do justice, what stops you from marrying more than one, at least it is better than having a lot of concubines and illegal sexual act. It is natural to go for more than one woman, no be so?

Mty4real:
On the other hadith Muslim, actually I have just read the mischievous headline posted without getting deep, but after reading fully you could now see what Aisha was deriving at, she is not trying to trivialize the struck on chest that you people hold on to, but trying to emphasize that Angels doesn't visit a house where women are uncovered or stripped, and as a wife you should no what your husband can and cannot do, as such for the fact that you are secretly tracing him means you are suspecting him, in which as a solution it is not to trace him but ask him where he is going before he left,if at all you aren't suspecting him. And moreover in the history, she is still called the favourite woman to the prophet, so is it wrong to correct someone you love most?

Mty4real:
Well.. I think I have made my position very clear on Saudi Arabia's issue, it is wrong and UNISLAMIC to forcefully command ladies to stay inside fire just to get burn, Islam and Saudi Arabia are different things so please NOTE. And again I told you that anything that happened in that stance will just fall under NECESSITY and talking about that every reasonable man will know that you shouldn't be talking about hijab or veil where lives are at stake and where people are struggling to safe themselves from fire, it will be a SIN in the sight of Allah to have waited for the fire to get you crushed after having way to escape. We have a situation in the time of Khalifa Umar where cutting the thief hands were suspended because of starvation. To Aisha again, I don't think because I struck my wife in correcting her has made me merciless, or has made me brutal, and why don't you research more on where Aisha succeeded in praising the prophet beautifully ever ever? Or is it because that will not support your argument?

Demmzy15:
My brother, please don't allow this people to get to you. No matter what you do or say, they're never satisfied, they'll make you slender and back bite other Muslims all in the name of defense of Islam. The person you're talking to is true2god aka true2satan, a flat'headed stiffnecked Yeebhoe boy who when he eventually gets free 10mb begins to pour out old trashy rhetorics, don't mind them and back off.

They'll push you to the extent of saying things you're not meant to say! Salam Alaikum