donnffd:
I just want to ask this question following this logic:-

1. You cant give what you dont have.
2. God doesn't have an iota of Evil
3. God created all things in the universe
4. There is Evil in the universe.

So my question is where exactly did evil originate from, if God is devoid of it (and please the devil is not an answer because he too was created by God)?

Please only matured theists are invited to attempt the question, thanks.

cc: shadeyinka, lordnicklaus, doctoralien e.t.c

donnffd:
I just want to ask this question following this logic:-

1. You cant give what you dont have.
2. God doesn't have an iota of Evil
3. God created all things in the universe
4. There is Evil in the universe.


So my question is where exactly did evil originate from, if God is devoid of it (and please the devil is not an answer because he too was created by God)?


Please only matured theists are invited to attempt the question, thanks.

cc: shadeyinka, lordnicklaus, doctoralien e.t.c

DoctorAlien:
GOD did not create the angels robots, who would not have a mind of their own. They had the freewill to choose whether to serve Him or not. GOD desires that His Creatures obey and serve Him out of love for Him as their Maker, and the recognition of His excellence, glory, majesty and wisdom. GOD created them with freewill because He wanted to make His nature of love obvious to His creatures, and also for them to understand(as is the case now) that obedience to Him is 100% for their own good.

Satan could choose to rebel against GOD because he was not a robot. He had freewill. That said, the origin of sin and evil in the heart of this terribly powerful, majestic being who once stood in the presence of GOD Himself, is mysterious and unaccounted for.

DoctorAlien:


Yours is a very intelligent question. The truth is that the origin of sin and evil is mysterious and unaccounted for. It is mysterious because it is hard to understand why a being terribly powerful(next in power only to the GODhead), in the holy and untainted courts of Heaven, would begin to harbour conceit and pride in his heart.

It is pertinent to understand, anyway, that GOD does not force obedience from His Creatures, and that they can choose to worship Him or not.

butterfly88:
What do you mean by "a being next in power to the Godhead please"?

donnffd:
I just want to ask this question following this logic:-

1. You cant give what you dont have.
2. God doesn't have an iota of Evil
3. God created all things in the universe
4. There is Evil in the universe.


So my question is where exactly did evil originate from, if God is devoid of it (and please the devil is not an answer because he too was created by God)?


Please only matured theists are invited to attempt the question, thanks.

cc: shadeyinka, lordnicklaus, doctoralien e.t.c

The forces/behaviors that are the opposite or enemy of good. Evil generally seeks own benefit at the expense of others and is based on general malevolence.
Any particular individual or state which may follow these forces or behaviors.

DoctorAlien:
GOD did not create the angels robots, who would not have a mind of their own. They had the freewill to choose whether to serve Him or not. GOD desires that His Creatures obey and serve Him out of love for Him as their Maker, and the recognition of His excellence, glory, majesty and wisdom. GOD created them with freewill because He wanted to make His nature of love obvious to His creatures, and also for them to understand(as is the case now) that obedience to Him is 100% for their own good.

Satan could choose to rebel against GOD because he was not a robot. He had freewill. That said, the origin of sin and evil in the heart of this terribly powerful, majestic being who once stood in the presence of GOD Himself, is mysterious and unaccounted for.

Lennycool:

But you forget that it was the all knowing God that created Lucifer, knowing fully well he would later cause the downfall of mankind. He knew from the moment he made him what Lucifer would do and still created him

DoctorAlien:


Lucifer was very powerful in Heaven. He was the covering cherub of GOD Himself. He stood in the presence of GOD Himself, and beheld His face. He was terrible in power and might, majestic to behold, and was adorned with wisdom surpassed only by the wisdom of GOD. Indeed, he sealed up the sum(Ezek. 28:12). He was the leader of the angels. They delighted to carry out his will(that was why he was able to deceive some of them). The only privilege which Lucifer was not given was knowledge of the counsels of GOD Himself. This is reserved only for GOD.

Thus, Lucifer was next in power only to the GODhead.

butterfly88:
good,

now: you're trying to push the origin of "evil" to push the origin of sin to Satan the accursed and this is not correct


for it begs the question, does God have infinite knowledge? if yes!, that means therefore that He definitely knows that the creation of Satan will also bring sin(assuming Satan created evil)..now if He knows this prior to the creation of Satan and[b] wants a world free of evil[/b] Why did he go ahead with the creation of Satan?

the only way we can resolve this is either god has no prior knowledge (that is he doesn't know what he is about to make), which is incorrect.

i won't rush unto concluding...lets have your opinion.

DoctorAlien:
"...It is impossible but that offences will come: but woe unto him, through whom they come!" Luke 17:1.

donnffd:
I just want to ask this question following this logic:-

1. You cant give what you dont have.
2. God doesn't have an iota of Evil
3. God created all things in the universe
4. There is Evil in the universe.


So my question is where exactly did evil originate from, if God is devoid of it (and please the devil is not an answer because he too was created by God)?


Please only matured theists are invited to attempt the question, thanks.

cc: shadeyinka, lordnicklaus, doctoralien e.t.c

butterfly88:
... pardon me please,whats the verse trying to explain? @ doctoralien

DoctorAlien:


The gift of freewill will surely be abused, and rebellion against GOD will surely arise, but woe to the person through who these will come.

butterfly88:
ok..so it is from the creation of "freewill" afterall and not the devil

donnffd:
I just want to ask this question following this logic:-

1. You cant give what you dont have.
2. God doesn't have an iota of Evil
3. God created all things in the universe
4. There is Evil in the universe.


So my question is where exactly did evil originate from, if God is devoid of it (and please the devil is not an answer because he too was created by God)?


Please only matured theists are invited to attempt the question, thanks.

cc: shadeyinka, lordnicklaus, doctoralien e.t.c

DoctorAlien:


Remember that you would have been a robot today without a mind of your own, had GOD not given freewill to you.

butterfly88:
I'm only against you attributing the origin of evil to Satan the accursed ...the creation of freewill is a better response..."and maybe that's the best design possible"

Pidggin:


Evil originated from sin of disobedience, from pride and self exhortation

JSoE:


This is the most stupid reply I've seen on this thread.

OK, let's break it down.
The talking snake 'deceived' Adam and the ribwoman(who didn't have a conscience at that time,btw),right?
And deception is evil,right?
And the deception happened before the disobedience, right?

Now this is the definition of deception

Deception : An instance of actions and/or schemes fabricated to mislead and/or delude someone into errantly believing a lie or inaccuracy.
Evil,right?

So how the fvck did evil originate from the disobedience when deception was there first? Or is lying no more a sin in your religion?

You can't tell me the talking snake suddenly became deceptive by itself without a cause.

Or maybe you're referring to lucifer's disobedience. Lucifer didn't create itself. The omniscient god who knew how lucifer will turn out created it. You can't tell me lucifer just decided to disobey and become proud without a cause or someone creating that evil and putting it inside.
Don't tell me you now support the 'something from nothing' theory.

So think again and come back.
Where did evil originate from? You can't always pin everything on man or lucifer. Two weak creatures without foreknowledge of good and evil.

CAPSLOCKED:

JSoE:


This is the most stupid reply I've seen on this thread.

OK, let's break it down.
The talking snake 'deceived' Adam and the ribwoman(who didn't have a conscience at that time,btw),right?
And deception is evil,right?
And the deception happened before the disobedience, right?

Now this is the definition of deception

Deception : An instance of actions and/or schemes fabricated to mislead and/or delude someone into errantly believing a lie or inaccuracy.
Evil,right?

So how the fvck did evil originate from the disobedience when deception was there first? Or is lying no more a sin in your religion?

You can't tell me the talking snake suddenly became deceptive by itself without a cause.

Or maybe you're referring to lucifer's disobedience. Lucifer didn't create itself. The omniscient god who knew how lucifer will turn out created it. You can't tell me lucifer just decided to disobey and become proud without a cause or someone creating that evil and putting it inside.
Don't tell me you now support the 'something from nothing' theory.

So think again and come back.
Where did evil originate from? You can't always pin everything on man or lucifer. Two weak creatures without foreknowledge of good and evil.

shadeyinka:



You have placed your premise down in such a way as to conclude that if there is no iota of Evil in God and God "created evil" then its either God is Evil or He doesn't exist!

But, not so fast my friend!

First, EVIL is NOT a thing.

If Evil is not a thing, then is is not a direct creation. Evil must have been a bi-product of creation!

One could argue that the creator is also responsible for the bi-product His creation caused: like man is responsible for the carbon polutulion vehicles cause.

So before explaining the above, we need to define the term evil!

Dictionary Defn:
adjective
Intending to harm; malevolent.
Morally corrupt., Unpleasant.
synonyms
nefarious, malicious, malevolent
antonyms
good
noun (plural evils)


However, Gods definition of Evil is more Generic:
Evil is going against the WILL of God.

The above definition covers both the dictionary definition and more.

For example "consensual fornication" is evil eben though the dictionary definition does not imply so.

Now that we have set the proper ground of understanding, we answer the question "isn't God responsible howbeit indirectly for evil"?

1. Evil is an inevitable consequence of Free will.
2. Creatures of free will commit evil NOT God
3. For Evil not to Exist, creatures of Free will must not exist.
4. It was Gods desire to have both creatures with
I. No free will e.g. Planets, Atoms, Gravity etc AND
ii. Creatures with Free will e.g. Angels, Man

Objective:
Ultimately to select among the Free Willed Creatures those who will Love and Obey Him by their Free Will.

Only such are useful to God!

Conclusion:
Evil is a biproduct of the creation of free will.
Agents of Free will cause Evil and NOT God

I rest my case!

lordnicklaus:

Good question. The origin of evil is something that has left people perplexed and desiderate for answers. Freewill itself is the very foundation of both good and evil. Religious inclination doesn't determine moral value but freewill does, so one can chose to be good or evil regardless of being religious or not. So, God gave freewill to all but evil was spurned from the idea to be more important and revered and to prove nonchalant to rules and regulations. Evil is but an illusion, a barren wasteland untouched by the rain of goodness. From every perfection, there can be an eruption of evil.

DoctorAlien:

Yours is a very intelligent question. The truth is that the origin of sin and evil is mysterious and unaccounted for. It is mysterious because it is hard to understand why a being terribly powerful(next in power only to the GODhead), in the holy and untainted courts of Heaven, would begin to harbour conceit and pride in his heart.
It is pertinent to understand, anyway, that GOD does not force obedience from His Creatures, and that they can choose to worship Him or not.

Smallville10:
its a good thing u said Evil and not 'Evil Powers'... But let me ask u a simple question... Define Evil

Pidggin:


Evil originated from sin of disobedience, from pride and self exhortation

DoctorAlien:
Kay17,

Lucifer was not ejected from Heaven immediately pride was found in him. GOD, ever loving and merciful, cautioned Lucifer severally. Lucifer was jealous of Christ, and argued that Christ deserved a place in the counsels of GOD no more than he himself does. GOD clearly set out the position of His Son, Christ, as GOD. He called a heavenly council and made it clear that all and sundry are to worship and revere Christ just as they worship and revere GOD. But this only stoked the fire of jealousy in Lucifer's heart. He wanted to be worshipped just like GOD. GOD explained to Satan that the path which he was about to take would only bring discord and ultimately lead him to destruction. But all the warnings fell on deaf ears.

Conceit turned into pride, and pride into self-exaltation, and self-exaltation into full-blown rebellion. Lucifer became Satan(adversary), and was cast out, and his doom sealed.

Thus, Satan cannot say he wasn't aware of the consequences of his action.

donnffd:


Interesting, but it just pushes the question backwards, where did pride come from(if God the source of all things is not proud)?