₦airaland Forum

Trippledots:
Any one with an idea where to get NiFe batteries.both local seller or foreign.....

chris81964:
I will load it soon. I have some of the issues that Sapiro mentioned with mine as well. However they have performed well. We have one of the batteries that has a discharged cell. The specific gravity in that cell indicated that what we have is water relative to the others. We will continue to run equalization till we correct it or ditch it
Update 851 pm. For the first time since I returned to Lagos my batteries are holding above 25 volts at night. They are at 25.44 with my freezer and lights on. Changed my charger settings and the batteries got hot. You could make tea with the electrolyte. All the cells boiled and burbled except one. It got hot but no gas or burbling.
We will do it again tomorrow. Brute force from my AC charger and my charge controller seems to do it. They cool down today and tomorrow we give it another try.

DMerciful:
http://encell.com/fused-iron-batteries/
http://beyondoilsolar.com/product/nickel-iron-battery-encell-usa-series/

Saipro:
I don't really think so. As you are aware, 3 of my 8 batteries were defective ab initio. The one with the worst defects gave up first. From extensive reading and conference with people who've been using solar since the 80s, I would say we're doing everything right. We need better batteries.

I am yet to receive a single complain from any of my US Battery users/clients. Fresh stock for each one. Me thinks:

1. Our Trojans spent a wee too long in the warehouse. We have no idea of how they were maintained or bulk charged (3 of mine came with swollen terminals and buckled plates).
2. No need to reach float everyday so long as you can hit 90% daily. 100% charge twice a week is adequate.
3. Do not keep them under 50% charge for any length of time.

Golden rules:
4. Single string rules! If you must use multiple strings, connect them all to a busbar. More than 3 strings is considered poor practice.
5. For FLA, be mindful of electrolyte levels
6. For FLA as well, check SG at least once a month for the first 6 - 9 months so you get a feel of which batteries might give issues.
7. Routinely check terminals for dirt, corrosion and loose connections. How often is up to you

Finally:
8. Learn your charging voltages for your batteries. Overcharging is nearly as lethal as undercharging.
9. If you wouldn't be using your batteries for a while, find a way to trickle charge them to maintain them in float. Or since Nigeria is smack in the middle of the tropics, bulk charge them every 30 - 60 days.
10. Oh, I almost forgot: if you your batteries are constantly warm to hot, there's a problem. True, you get more kick out of warm batteries. They also die almost twice as fast. Shorts, overcharging, loose connections, etc. Whatever the case, investigate fast, especially if a single battery or two are warmer than the others.
11. I have been told that it's also good practice to occasionally take your batteries down to about 50% and bring them back up soon afterwards. There's supposedly another that of hard sulphation which occurs with frrquent shallow cycles. Do that perhaps every 2 - 6 months. At least once a year. You stand to gain a lot more than you stand to lose. If you routinely discharge 30 - 50% of your capacity, this advice isn't for you.

What else? Let everyone else contribute. I'm sure there are a lot of "green scholars" here.

Our Trojans spent a wee too long in the warehouse. We have no idea of how they were maintained or bulk charged (3 of mine came with swollen terminals and buckled plates).

DMerciful:
Those batteries are being forced to give their all......they are likely to fail sooner than later

chris81964:
The experience I have is similar to the experience many off grid people have. The cure is exactly what I am doing. So if you have a different solution I would like to hear them. My batteries will soon be 10 years old and I am having the same results now as I did at the beginning.

kiekie1:
Not totally maintenance free ! I admire the 80% DOD advantages and I also hope Chinese brands or imitations won't flood the open market on the short run tho ..

DMerciful:
We are talking about 40yrs life span.....nothing beats that!

kiekie1:
When yours arrive , talk from your personal usage experience .. I stated few clear points above and didnt ridicule lifespan of battery as said by its manufacturer , although any lil malicious damage-clause can affect warranty validity in Nigeria !

DMerciful:
I did not order Nickel iron(too expensive) but LiFeO4. Check reviews online and other research.....they are almost incomparable apart from frequent watering which the latest models have addressed by installing auto watering system. Nickel iron batteries like iron Edison are mostly used by power companies!

DMerciful:
Oga Chris.....10yrs old? Twale for you....you must be doing the right thing. Pardon me, I say twale again.

kiekie1:


My dear friend I ain't arguing with you on this as theory aint practical OK !! As per longetivity, like Chris mentioned about his batteries hitting 10yrs , have u seen tubular/flooded hoppecke or IND Trojans die prematurely especially when not abused cos they ain't totally maintenance free ?? When companies in Nigeria brings in "Nickel iron & LifeP" after much experiments & abuse within , doubting Thomases will believe more in the said product k

DMerciful:
http://encell.com/fused-iron-batteries/
http://beyondoilsolar.com/product/nickel-iron-battery-encell-usa-series/

chris81964:
I have had the same experience with my batteries multiple times. It happens the same time every. When I am away and Nepa goes with me. You can't be off grid and not have a generator, you will damage your batteries.
Run an equalization charge twice the first week and then every week for a month. Make sure you fully charge your batteries every day. They will recover. Mine took much longer this time than the last.
I am doing a video on it. You will see it on my YouTube channel next week.

DUNKA:
Oga Chris Goodmorning watched your YouTube videos and needed clarification on the issue if Generator set when offgrid. If one has sufficient panels will one still need a gen set? Abi had large array so why would he still a genset since he is in imploring and sunlight is not a problem? It seems the Trojans are not what they used to be or we have a specific problem with those been supplied. Have you been able to recover the faulty cell you tried rejuvenating? Is the US battery in your bank ever had the same issue that you are experiencing with the Trojans ?

Thanks for your response.

harveyspec:
please if an inverter is rated 1700va, 1190W with a crest factor of 1:5

what does it mean?

cc:
chris81964
DMerciful
bigrovar

harveyspec:
please if an inverter is rated 1700va, 1190W with a crest factor of 1:5

what does it mean?

cc:
chris81964
DMerciful
bigrovar

bigrovar:
1700va and 1190w just means the inverter has a power factor of about 0.7 (The difference between VA and W is represented by power factor. VA is used with AC appliance were sometimes volt and amps go out of phase this is caused by how AC appliance load shifts the phase of the current compared to the phase of the voltage. The closer the power factor of a device is to 1 the more efficient that device is at power consumption. hence 0.9 PF is better than 0.8. You can get the PF of a device by dividing w by va in your case 1190 / 1700.

Crest factor is another term for surge capability of an inverter. 1.5 means the inverter can surge up to 5 times its rated power. In this case your inverter is 1190w (its rated power) but it can surge up to 1190 x 5. Inverter makers often exaggerate their crest factor. even if an inverter can do 5 times its rated power (highly improbable) it often can only do this for about a second which might not be enough to start devices where such power is needed.
Crest factor allows an inverter or generator to start devices which requires 3 to 5 times their running power when starting (usually not more than 3 secords)

bigrovar:
Crest factor is another term for surge capability of an inverter. 1.5 means the inverter can surge up to 5 times its rated power. In this case your inverter is 1190w (its rated power) but it can surge up to 1190 x 5. Inverter makers often exaggerate their crest factor. even if an inverter can do 5 times its rated power (highly improbable) it often can only do this for about a second which might not be enough to start devices where such power is needed.
Crest factor allows an inverter or generator to start devices which requires 3 to 5 times their running power when starting (usually not more than 3 secords)

harveyspec:
please if an inverter is rated 1700va, 1190W with a crest factor of 1:5

what does it mean?

cc:
chris81964
DMerciful
bigrovar

DUNKA:
Oga Chris Goodmorning watched your YouTube videos and needed clarification on the issue if Generator set when offgrid. If one has sufficient panels will one still need a gen set? Abi had large array so why would he still a genset since he is in imploring and sunlight is not a problem? It seems the Trojans are not what they used to be or we have a specific problem with those been supplied. Have you been able to recover the faulty cell you tried rejuvenating? Is the US battery in your bank ever had the same issue that you are experiencing with the Trojans ?

Thanks for your response.

chris81964:
Good day. In the United States where I live they recommend that you have a generator when you are off grid. If you maintain a normal life style there are times in the year where the sun is not sufficient. For me November to February and again during the rainy season. You will break out the generator once every two weeks.
The cell has started to come back. I will or have upload video two and then do video three. The US Battery is different from the Trojan. I got it 18 months ago. It uses much less water and I don't seem to experience the same problems. But then the Trojans where more abused too.

chris81964:
Crest factor of 1.5 is the amount by which it can surge. 1190 x 1.5.

dapsyra:
The Crest factor of a sinusoidal current waveform is 1.414.

An Inverter with crest factor of 1.5 cannot handle 5 times its rated power. It can only handle 1.06 (1.5/1.414) times its rated power for a very short period specified by the manufacturer in the datasheet.

chris81964:
Good day. In the United States where I live they recommend that you have a generator when you are off grid. If you maintain a normal life style there are times in the year where the sun is not sufficient. For me November to February and again during the rainy season. You will break out the generator once every two weeks.
The cell has started to come back. I will or have upload video two and then do video three. The US Battery is different from the Trojan. I got it 18 months ago. It uses much less water and I don't seem to experience the same problems. But then the Trojans where more abused too.

bigrovar:
sorry I meant 5:1 (as stated by OP) and not 1.5. 5:1 means ratio of 5 to 1. some inverter makers use 3:1, 5:1 to represent that surge factor (probably because its more user friendly) despite I doubt any inverter can do 5 times its rated output power.

harveyspec:
Pls what I wrote was 1:5 not 1.5

the inverter spec sheet says it's crest factor is 1:5 (1.7kva, 1190w)

my main concern is whether this inverter can power a fridge of 120w.

the manual says it's not for heavy appliances & fridge was listed as one of such appliances

meanwhile some folks says it can power fridges & even freezers

CC
chris81964
dapsyra

Saipro:
I don't really think so. As you are aware, 3 of my 8 batteries were defective ab initio. The one with the worst defects gave up first. From extensive reading and conference with people who've been using solar since the 80s, I would say we're doing everything right. We need better batteries.

I am yet to receive a single complain from any of my US Battery users/clients. Fresh stock for each one. Me thinks:

1. Our Trojans spent a wee too long in the warehouse. We have no idea of how they were maintained or bulk charged (3 of mine came with swollen terminals and buckled plates).
2. No need to reach float everyday so long as you can hit 90% daily. 100% charge twice a week is adequate.
3. Do not keep them under 50% charge for any length of time.

Golden rules:
4. Single string rules! If you must use multiple strings, connect them all to a busbar. More than 3 strings is considered poor practice.
5. For FLA, be mindful of electrolyte levels
6. For FLA as well, check SG at least once a month for the first 6 - 9 months so you get a feel of which batteries might give issues.
7. Routinely check terminals for dirt, corrosion and loose connections. How often is up to you

Finally:
8. Learn your charging voltages for your batteries. Overcharging is nearly as lethal as undercharging.
9. If you wouldn't be using your batteries for a while, find a way to trickle charge them to maintain them in float. Or since Nigeria is smack in the middle of the tropics, bulk charge them every 30 - 60 days.
10. Oh, I almost forgot: if you your batteries are constantly warm to hot, there's a problem. True, you get more kick out of warm batteries. They also die almost twice as fast. Shorts, overcharging, loose connections, etc. Whatever the case, investigate fast, especially if a single battery or two are warmer than the others.
11. I have been told that it's also good practice to occasionally take your batteries down to about 50% and bring them back up soon afterwards. There's supposedly another that of hard sulphation which occurs with frrquent shallow cycles. Do that perhaps every 2 - 6 months. At least once a year. You stand to gain a lot more than you stand to lose. If you routinely discharge 30 - 50% of your capacity, this advice isn't for you.

What else? Let everyone else contribute. I'm sure there are a lot of "green scholars" here.

dapsyra:
Crest Factor can be stated in decimal (x.y) or ratio (x:y). The minimum permissible crest factor is 1.0 or 1:1 which is the crest factor of DC current. The crest factor for pure AC current is 1.414 or 1.414:1

To determine the surge handling capability of an Inverter, you have to divide the stated Crest factor by 1.414

In your case, the Inverter Crest factor is stated as 5:1, so it can handle surge up to 3.5 (5/1.414) times it's capacity.

The Inverter is rated 1190W, so the maximum surge it can handle is 4,165W (1190x3.5) for a very short time that would be stated in the datasheet.

Your fridge is rated 120W, but the startup surge can be 3 times higher than the rated power. So, we expect a power surge of 360W. This is well within the capability of the Inverter.

My conclusion: Based on the data you provided in this thread, the Inverter can power your fridge comfortably.

harveyspec:
thanks man, your explanation is crystal clear

but it appears my elementary maths is rusty, why is everyone assuming 5:1 is same as 1:5?


I thought 1:5=0.2

5:1=5

Is it that the manual made a mistake or I'm the one getting it all wrong

Again the manual says 1:5

pls does your above explanation still hold?

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