RESULT SPEAKS LOUDER THAN CRITICISMS

I love the reply of this man to Charly Boy after he labelled Pastors as conmen,.

Read:

The fact is many Nigerians are loosing it. They can't think beyond going after pastors.

In what way has pastors prevented Nigeria from owning an Airline

In what way do pastors prevent Nigeria from having industries

Less than 0.0001% of pastors own Jets in Nigeria. But no let us forget the over 70% that earn less than 50k/month and focus on the 0.0001% than own jets.

If you ran your governments the way church leaders are running churches. Nigeria might be a Qatar right now. In all these argument Canaanland has had stable electricity and water supply for its over 15,000 residents since 1999 and is already on the verge of converting waste to electricity. RCCG is producing 25MW of electricity. Yet your useless govt you pay compulsory tax, vat, CIT, Pet Tax has not been able to give you light decades after independence.

Living Faith has more than 16,000 Staff and has never owed any of them salary! Yet your state govt that collects Allocation plus Tax cannot pay full salary.

Living Faith a single Church is schooling 16 thousand of your Citizens in Higher institutions and many more at primary and Secondary levels yet you think you have the capacity to waggle your tongue

I went for Shiloh all through and stayed in the staff quarters yet it was electricity all through, for one second water did not go off inspite of thousands that were present. On a normal day you won't walk 20 meters before you find a segregated bin to dispose your waste.

The entire area was fully covered by different layers of Security with multiple CCTV and IoT enabled barrier gates. And yet your Abuja, capital of the Nation does not have CCTV yet you open your foul mouth to talk down on pastors! Ode

Between the guy that calls himself Area father and Oyedepo who resigned a federal job and started a Church of 3 people and has widened it to over 6,000 churches globally, over 100 schools, 2 hospitals, Over 1000hectares farm for livestock and crop, Another farm in Igbesa and CU. With 15,000 housing Estate, Water factories, Zeolite factory, One Research center, a scholarship fund, Beverage factories, 10 million books, Publishing house, Radio Station etc who has had more impact or who will have better capacity to govern the nation. Mumu

Canaanland host hundreds of thousands of people every week yet no stampede ever. Your govt gathered ppl at stadium for recruitment excersise and before it even began many were dead!

Living Faith already has a master plan till 2032 yet your govt does not have a plan for 2020!

You know Illogicality is the trademark of most Africans. They fail to think beyond their prejudices and sentiments hence Africa has remained on the ground.

COPIED!!!

Today churches are full of corruption and greedy pastors

I wish I could see this guy and engage him in real discussion.

See my brother, the only reason why churches grow and run well us not because they pray so well or the pastors have very fantastic leadership prowess, NO
it is because of the people there; in churches we are oriented or should I say hypnotized to do your work their without looking for personal gains, people run to their churches, contributing to its growth, not cutting corners, most times, cleaning and washing, working in various departments without percuniary benefits, the sole aim of people is just to see the church grow and of course grow it will...
But in the society we live in THESAME people come out and treat it with reckless abandonment, you don't care what becomes of it, you steal from the society, u beat corners to oil your pockets while your primary duty of help building the society is left to suffer; u don't care about it, after all it's the churches u work that will take you to heaven..
That is the real problem we have here; misplace priority , we forget that our children will grow up in the society we abandon and not the churches we adore., our children will become a product of what we make out of our society..
My brother, if we could put just 50% of the passion we put in churches in our society , we will become First World nation in less than a decade.


- The Apostle

These are facts. The christaindom is contributing to human resource development.

Government business is no one's business. More like come chop. While churches are confirmed pastors' business. Which CEO or Chairman carelessly allows his money yielding venture to sink?

No mentions pls ... I'll be in church and won't reply you

TheTrueApostle:
I wish I could see this guy and engage him in real discussion.

See my brother, the only reason why churches grow and run well us not because they pray so well or the pastors have very fantastic leadership prowess, NO
it is because of the people there; in churches we are oriented or should I say hypnotized to do your work their without looking for personal gains, people run to their churches, contributing to its growth, not cutting corners, most times, cleaning and washing, working in various departments without percuniary benefits, the sole aim of people is just to see the church grow and of course grow it will...
But in the society we live in THESAME people come out and treat it with reckless abandonment, you don't care what becomes of it, you steal from the society, u beat corners to oil your pockets while your primary duty of help building the society is left to suffer; u don't care about it, after all it's the churches u work that will take you to heaven..
That is the real problem we have here; misplace priority , we forget that our children will grow up in the society we abandon and not the churches we adore., our children will become a product of what we make out of our society..
My brother, if we could put just 50% of the passion we put in churches in our society , we will become First World nation in less than a decade.


- The Apostle

You are completely wrong on this the church is not immune to all these problems. The families that are in the church make the society

Most projects are handled by individuals outside the church. The church is filled with insincere people that committee's frude.

The church is filled with with more sinners than saints.

In all this leadership and how well resources are manged is determined by the pastor.

Is not a perfect situation as you think. I wish you are involved in church management to understand what I mean.

TheTrueApostle:
I wish I could see this guy and engage him in real discussion.

See my brother, the only reason why churches grow and run well us not because they pray so well or the pastors have very fantastic leadership prowess, NO
it is because of the people there; in churches we are oriented or should I say hypnotized to do your work their without looking for personal gains, people run to their churches, contributing to its growth, not cutting corners, most times, cleaning and washing, working in various departments without percuniary benefits, the sole aim of people is just to see the church grow and of course grow it will...
But in the society we live in THESAME people come out and treat it with reckless abandonment, you don't care what becomes of it, you steal from the society, u beat corners to oil your pockets while your primary duty of help building the society is left to suffer; u don't care about it, after all it's the churches u work that will take you to heaven..
That is the real problem we have here; misplace priority , we forget that our children will grow up in the society we abandon and not the churches we adore., our children will become a product of what we make out of our society..
My brother, if we could put just 50% of the passion we put in churches in our society , we will become First World nation in less than a decade.


- The Apostle

Let see take example of Covenant University. You mean everybody working there goes to winners chapel?

They are other private university that were established before CU. But today they can not be compared.

Leadership and resource management is the key.

agwom:
Today churches are full of corruption and greedy pastors

...compared to your government and your elected leaders?

lol

Let them allowed the accounts to be audited

Politicians are Democrats.
Churches are Dictatorships!

rusep:
Let them allowed the accounts to be audited

Account not audited they are making great exploit.

Politicians that have audited account what have they achieved?

TheTrueApostle:
I wish I could see this guy and engage him in real discussion.

See my brother, the only reason why churches grow and run well us not because they pray so well or the pastors have very fantastic leadership prowess, NO
it is because of the people there; in churches we are oriented or should I say hypnotized to do your work their without looking for personal gains, people run to their churches, contributing to its growth, not cutting corners, most times, cleaning and washing, working in various departments without percuniary benefits, the sole aim of people is just to see the church grow and of course grow it will...
But in the society we live in THESAME people come out and treat it with reckless abandonment, you don't care what becomes of it, you steal from the society, u beat corners to oil your pockets while your primary duty of help building the society is left to suffer; u don't care about it, after all it's the churches u work that will take you to heaven..
That is the real problem we have here; misplace priority , we forget that our children will grow up in the society we abandon and not the churches we adore., our children will become a product of what we make out of our society..
My brother, if we could put just 50% of the passion we put in churches in our society , we will become First World nation in less than a decade.


- The Apostle

Actually I wrote the article so any question?

Statsocial:

Actually I wrote the article so any question?

you wrote thee useless article.

Churches manage 16,000 workers, so what? Talk about when they have to pay millions of workers and they have to generate electricity for same.

Oyedepo said he's not made a profir from all his investments, inclusive of the University- if that were true, doesn't it tell u that they were pumping in free money to sustain the flow?

You talked rubbish with no logical reasoning.

Churches makes millions of free money every month from gullible and non-gullible members, it's a fucking free money!

And did u have a record of the whole pastors in Nigeria that u came about 0.01% or it's just one of your attempt to sound logical?

Area father is just trying to stay relevant,just as he did with the protest when the ovation was high for ipob. Freeze is an idiot and I don't take him serious. But nevertheless, as a Christian, most pastors are thieves and they are gluttons!!!

Jesus didn't teach to ammas wealth, yet pastors even allow their networth to be publicized. This you know what happened when David counted the Israelites? Or when the King, counted and showed off his wealth?

You collect offerings and tithes from the poor, yet the children of the poor cannot attend your school, members are not entitled to massive discounts...

Guy, please.. no lete vex o.

TheTrueApostle:
I wish I could see this guy and engage him in real discussion.

See my brother, the only reason why churches grow and run well us not because they pray so well or the pastors have very fantastic leadership prowess, NO
it is because of the people there; in churches we are oriented or should I say hypnotized to do your work their without looking for personal gains, people run to their churches, contributing to its growth, not cutting corners, most times, cleaning and washing, working in various departments without percuniary benefits, the sole aim of people is just to see the church grow and of course grow it will...
But in the society we live in THESAME people come out and treat it with reckless abandonment, you don't care what becomes of it, you steal from the society, u beat corners to oil your pockets while your primary duty of help building the society is left to suffer; u don't care about it, after all it's the churches u work that will take you to heaven..
That is the real problem we have here; misplace priority , we forget that our children will grow up in the society we abandon and not the churches we adore., our children will become a product of what we make out of our society..
My brother, if we could put just 50% of the passion we put in churches in our society , we will become First World nation in less than a decade.


- The Apostle

you do acknowledge that the churches are growing cos ppl are dedicated to the work of God, why den do u disbelieve that if the model of the church is reproduced in d society, our country will be better? Why do u dis believe dat if our children are taught the word of God in schools, principles such as honesty, diligence, integrity etc, dey will grow up to be responsible citizens? Why do u dis believe dat if the model of the church is reproduced in government we will have a better country?

SLIDEwaxie:
you wrote thee useless article.

Churches manage 16,000 workers, so what? Talk about when they have to pay millions of workers and they have to generate electricity for same.

Oyedepo said he's not made a profir from all his investments, inclusive of the University- if that were true, doesn't it tell u that they were pumping in free money to sustain the flow?

You talked rubbish with no logical reasoning.

Churches makes millions of free money every month from gullible and non-gullible members, it's a fucking free money!

And did u have a record of the whole pastors in Nigeria that u came about 0.01% or it's just one of your attempt to sound logical?

Area father is just trying to stay relevant,just as he did with the protest when the ovation was high for ipob. Freeze is an idiot and I don't take him serious. But nevertheless, as a Christian, most pastors are thieves and they are gluttons!!!

Jesus didn't teach to ammas wealth, yet pastors even allow their networth to be publicized. This you know what happened when David counted the Israelites? Or when the King, counted and showed off his wealth?

You collect offerings and tithes from the poor, yet the children of the poor cannot attend your school, members are not entitled to massive discounts...

Guy, please.. no lete vex o.

Don't be an idiot. You are the one talking trash.
You want to compare what churches make to what govt makes?
Government has access to Crude oil proceeds, Customs fee, CIT, PayE and many other sources of income. The point of the article if you had read without sentiments is that the Church is a better manager of the little it has. The greatness of Churches doesn't lie in Tithes because not all members are even tithe compliant.

Mind you I have been corrected that the Church employees are 25,000 not 16000 as i said earlier said. How many State Governments can boast of such large civil work force? yet they never pay salaries on time.

Even in the wealthiest of Churches Tithe income is always a curve because some may pay this month and not pay for the next. However pastoral salaries never comes in late because the church is kin to savings.

Let me break it down for you, if the Country is managed the way Churches has been managed then Nigeria would have gone very far!

Statsocial:

Don't be an idiot. You are the one talking trash.
You want to compare what churches make to what govt makes?
Government has access to Crude oil proceeds, Customs fee, CIT, PayE and many other sources of income. The point of the article if you had read without sentiments is that the Church is a better manager of the little it has. The greatness of Churches doesn't lie in Tithes because not all members are even tithe compliant.

Mind you I have been corrected that the Church employees are 25,000 not 16000 as i said earlier said. How many State Governments can boast of such large civil work force? yet they never pay salaries on time.

Even in the wealthiest of Churches Tithe income is always a curve because some may pay this month and not pay for the next. However pastoral salaries never comes in late because the church is kin to savings.

Let me break it down for you, if the Country is managed the way Churches has been managed then Nigeria would have gone very far!

25,0000 is actually a large workforce to you, in comparison to State governments? Are u well? Did u realise that the smallest State with a moderate civil workforce is more than 1million and it's Bayelsa!

Are u even normal?

How can u boast of an institution like covenant cities and it's subsidiaries and still claim no profit. You are either a liar or a bad manager!

A school.in ognn state pays 150k for it's teachers and the students pay less than 100k and the almighty covenant University said he's making losses. Even Madonna is not making losses.

Liars, they all are!

SLIDEwaxie:
25,0000 is actually a large workforce to you, in comparison to State governments? Are u well? Did u realise that the smallest State with a moderate civil workforce is more than 1million and it's Bayelsa!

Are u even normal?

How can u boast of an institution like covenant cities and it's subsidiaries and still claim no profit. You are either a liar or a bad manager!

A school.in ognn state pays 150k for it's teachers and the students pay less than 100k and the almighty covenant University said he's making losses. Even Madonna is not making losses.

Liars, they all are!

1 million Kwa. How many people are even living inside Bayelsa. Of u better calm down.
The primary purpose of a church is not to create employment. But even in that they are doing comparatively better than Govt.

You may not understand the difference between "For Profit" and "Not for Profit" but I don't blame you. It is your education.
In case you don't know Harvard University is not for profit. All the money generated in these Not for profit universities are all channeled back into the system even though the owners can choose to make profits if they want to. So "not for profit" is a choice not to make profit by allowing reintegration of funds into the system.

This same problem you highlighted most churches are also facing it because they have bad leader as pastor

So let's commend the pastors that are doing and stop the madness of attacking people who pay tithes.

Why most people dont have passion fir Nigeria is because of our leaders have failed US

TheTrueApostle:
I wish I could see this guy and engage him in real discussion.

See my brother, the only reason why churches grow and run well us not because they pray so well or the pastors have very fantastic leadership prowess, NO
it is because of the people there; in churches we are oriented or should I say hypnotized to do your work their without looking for personal gains, people run to their churches, contributing to its growth, not cutting corners, most times, cleaning and washing, working in various departments without percuniary benefits, the sole aim of people is just to see the church grow and of course grow it will...
But in the society we live in THESAME people come out and treat it with reckless abandonment, you don't care what becomes of it, you steal from the society, u beat corners to oil your pockets while your primary duty of help building the society is left to suffer; u don't care about it, after all it's the churches u work that will take you to heaven..
That is the real problem we have here; misplace priority , we forget that our children will grow up in the society we abandon and not the churches we adore., our children will become a product of what we make out of our society..
My brother, if we could put just 50% of the passion we put in churches in our society , we will become First World nation in less than a decade.


- The Apostle

IMAMS can't manage the Mosque just like the government...

Buhari and other Northern leaders including Fulani Herdsmen and Boko Haram are the products of the IMAMS...

Statsocial:

1 million Kwa. How many people are even living inside Bayelsa. Of u better calm down.
The primary purpose of a church is not to create employment. But even in that they are doing comparatively better than Govt.

You may not understand the difference between "For Profit" and "Not for Profit" but I don't blame you. It is your education.
In case you don't know Harvard University is not for profit. All the money generated in these Not for profit universities are all channeled back into the system even though the owners can choose to make profits if they want to. So "not for profit" is a choice not to make profit by allowing reintegration of funds into the system.

That's an interesting point. In most civilized societies, any managers of non-profits cruising around in private jets are seen as frauds.
You spoke about Harvard. Does their president managing a $40 billion endowment fund cruise around in private jets? Do non-profits like the Red Cross, Doctors Without Borders, UNICEF, Human Rights International etc have their leaders cruising around in private jets? How is it that you don't feel the slightest of discomforts at churches being run like corporations?

Because, kid youself all you want - Pentecostal churches are run like corporations and family businesses. That is why Oyedepo will hand over to his son. So there is absolutely nothing special about how they run their camps, universities and all that. Private corporations pay salaries and facilitate the growth and expansion of their businesses. That is who you should compare your churches to and not the government.

Kemperor:
IMAMS can't manage the Mosque just like the government...

Buhari and other Northern leaders including Fulani Herdsmen and Boko Haram are the products of the IMAMS...

No, Imams and Muslim clerics are not greedy thieves like Pentecostal pastors. They encourage their members to give to the poor and not for the expansion of their Muslim business. They care more about the welfare of their flock rather than expanding their business and centralization is not encouraged in Islam. They promote modesty, simplicity and humility. You won't find them rocking Gucci clothes worth over a million Naira like Fatoyinbo in COZA, or riding private jets like Oyedepo and Adeboye and they don't aspire to such.

Obi1kenobi:


That's an interesting point. In most civilized societies, any managers of non-profits cruising around in private jets are seen as frauds.
You spoke about Harvard. Does their president managing a $40 billion endowment fund cruise around in private jets? Do non-profits like the Red Cross, Doctors Without Borders, UNICEF, Human Rights International etc have their leaders cruising around in private jets? How is it that you don't feel the slightest of discomforts at churches being run like corporations?

Because, kid youself all you want - Pentecostal churches are run like corporations and family businesses. That is why Oyedepo will hand over to his son. So there is absolutely nothing special about how they run their camps, universities and all that. Private corporations pay salaries and facilitate the growth and expansion of their businesses. That is who you should compare your churches to and not the government.

Well in case you don't know Harvard president uses a private jet which belongs to the University. Oyedepo uses a jet which belongs to World Missions Agency and not him. Try and get information before you go on a critic rampagage.

Pastors handing over to their kids is not a new thing in Christiandom. Joel Osteen took over the Lakewood, Texas Church from his father. Mathew Hagee is probably going to take over John Hager ministries, Kenneth W Hagin took over from his father Kenneth E. Hagin. So pastors handing over to their children isn't abnormal.

Obi1kenobi:


No, Imams and Muslim clerics are not greedy thieves like Pentecostal pastors. They encourage their members to give to the poor and not for the expansion of their Muslim business. They care more about the welfare of their flock rather than expanding their business and centralization is not encouraged in Islam. They promote modesty, simplicity and humility. You won't find them rocking Gucci clothes worth over a million Naira like Fatoyinbo in COZA, or riding private jets like Oyedepo and Adeboye and they don't aspire to such.

They most likely wouldn't be able to purchase a Jet even if they wanted to.
Lol your argument reeks of ignorance bruv. Are you seriously comparing who gives more between the Nigerian Church and Islam. Do you know how many orphanages are owned by Churches? Do you know how many homes are actively funded by churches? Do you know how much churches provide as relief disasters? Do you know how many schools have been rehabilitated by churvhes? Do you know how many scholarships that has been provided by the church lol

pafra:



You are completely wrong on this the church is not immune to all these problems. The families that are in the church make the society

Most projects are handled by individuals outside the church. The church is filled with insincere people that committee's frude.

The church is filled with with more sinners than saints.

In all this leadership and how well resources are manged is determined by the pastor.

Is not a perfect situation as you think. I wish you are involved in church management to understand what I mean.

When income is excessive you can perform

Can your church agree to an external audit ?

Let's see how well run they are


If Nigeria had a revenue of 20 trillion a year even a fool would do roads , good school and all that

Statsocial:

Well in case you don't know Harvard president uses a private jet which belongs to the University. Oyedepo uses a jet which belongs to World Missions Agency and not him. Try and get information before you go on a critic rampagage.

Pastors handing over to their kids is not a new thing in Christiandom. Joel Osteen took over the Lakewood, Texas Church from his father. Mathew Hagee is probably going to take over John Hager ministries, Kenneth W Hagin took over from his father Kenneth E. Hagin. So pastors handing over to their children isn't abnormal.

Which private jet does Harvard's president use? What of the other non-profit organizations I named - which private jet do they use? Oyedepo's jet belongs to him. Stop deluding yourself. No one else decides who rides and who doesn't and his son will certainly inherit his holdings.

It's funny you think Joel Osteen, seen as representing much of what is wrong with the modern perversion of the faith somehow proves your point. He's seen by much of the American public as another conman televangelist. No surprise many of these are the heroes of Nigerian Pentecostals. Any church where custodianship is passed on as some kind of birthright within the family is a den of conmen. America of course is the land where pastors are allowed to be con men. The Europeans are less tolerant of profiteering pastors - a major reason the likes of Oyedepo and Ashimolowo have gotten in trouble with the UK authorities before.

With all monies going into one purse and none coming out

Rich pastors, poor congregation

pafra:
RESULT SPEAKS LOUDER THAN CRITICISMS

I love the reply of this man to Charly Boy after he labelled Pastors as conmen,.

Read:

The fact is many Nigerians are loosing it. They can't think beyond going after pastors.

In what way has pastors prevented Nigeria from owning an Airline

In what way do pastors prevent Nigeria from having industries

Less than 0.0001% of pastors own Jets in Nigeria. But no let us forget the over 70% that earn less than 50k/month and focus on the 0.0001% than own jets.

If you ran your governments the way church leaders are running churches. Nigeria might be a Qatar right now. In all these argument Canaanland has had stable electricity and water supply for its over 15,000 residents since 1999 and is already on the verge of converting waste to electricity. RCCG is producing 25MW of electricity. Yet your useless govt you pay compulsory tax, vat, CIT, Pet Tax has not been able to give you light decades after independence.

Living Faith has more than 16,000 Staff and has never owed any of them salary! Yet your state govt that collects Allocation plus Tax cannot pay full salary.

Living Faith a single Church is schooling 16 thousand of your Citizens in Higher institutions and many more at primary and Secondary levels yet you think you have the capacity to waggle your tongue

I went for Shiloh all through and stayed in the staff quarters yet it was electricity all through, for one second water did not go off inspite of thousands that were present. On a normal day you won't walk 20 meters before you find a segregated bin to dispose your waste.

The entire area was fully covered by different layers of Security with multiple CCTV and IoT enabled barrier gates. And yet your Abuja, capital of the Nation does not have CCTV yet you open your foul mouth to talk down on pastors! Ode

Between the guy that calls himself Area father and Oyedepo who resigned a federal job and started a Church of 3 people and has widened it to over 6,000 churches globally, over 100 schools, 2 hospitals, Over 1000hectares farm for livestock and crop, Another farm in Igbesa and CU. With 15,000 housing Estate, Water factories, Zeolite factory, One Research center, a scholarship fund, Beverage factories, 10 million books, Publishing house, Radio Station etc who has had more impact or who will have better capacity to govern the nation. Mumu

Canaanland host hundreds of thousands of people every week yet no stampede ever. Your govt gathered ppl at stadium for recruitment excersise and before it even began many were dead!

Living Faith already has a master plan till 2032 yet your govt does not have a plan for 2020!

You know Illogicality is the trademark of most Africans. They fail to think beyond their prejudices and sentiments hence Africa has remained on the ground.

COPIED!!!

they are better at exploiting the poor you mean to say

Statsocial:

They most likely wouldn't be able to purchase a Jet even if they wanted to.
Lol your argument reeks of ignorance bruv. Are you seriously comparing who gives more between the Nigerian Church and Islam. Do you know how many orphanages are owned by Churches? Do you know how many homes are actively funded by churches? Do you know how much churches provide as relief disasters? Do you know how many schools have been rehabilitated by churvhes? Do you know how many scholarships that has been provided by the church lol

They wouldn't because they do not fleece their flock. It's really that simple. Muslims don't run mosques anything like how Christians - especially Pentecostals - do. They are not one-tenth as aggressive in raising funds. They live a life of remarkable simplicity. On Fridays sometimes, I've observed Muslims gathering for prayers around my office in Isolo. You see everyone from wealthy Lebanese, Indian and Hausa/Fulani factory, depot and warehouse owners praying side-by-side with maiguards and okada riders etc. No hierarchies like churches were politicians, corporate bigwigs and other top benefactors of the church business sit in the front seats. Reminds me of Danjuma's recent birthday celebration in Church (not sure if it was Catholic or Anglican) with 3 Reverends gathering at the front to serenade him with a "Happy Birthday" sing-along.

You must have comprehension problems cause I never said Muslims give more than Christians. I said their Imams do not solicit for money like Pastors. Giving is focused more on individual discretion. So, it is impossible to get rich from a clerical role in Islam, but getting rich off being a Pastor is a feature of modern christianity.

Obi1kenobi:


They wouldn't because they do not fleece their flock. It's really that simple. Muslims don't run mosques anything like how Christians - especially Pentecostals - do. They are not one-tenth as aggressive in raising funds. They live a life of remarkable simplicity. On Fridays sometimes, I've observed Muslims gathering for prayers around my office in Isolo. You see everyone from wealthy Lebanese, Indian and Hausa/Fulani factory, depot and warehouse owners praying side-by-side with maiguards and okada riders etc. No hierarchies like churches were politicians, corporate bigwigs and other top benefactors of the church business sit in the front seats. Reminds me of Danjuma's recent birthday celebration in Church (not sure if it was Catholic or Anglican) with 3 Reverends gathering at the front to serenade him with a "Happy Birthday" sing-along.

You must have comprehension problems cause I never said Muslims give more than Christians. I said their Imams do not solicit for money like Pastors. Giving is focused more on individual discretion. So, it is impossible to get rich from a clerical role in Islam, but getting rich off being a Pastor is a feature of modern christianity.

It is you who has comprehension problems. If the Church gives more than the Mosque then why compare how they solicit funds or how wealthy they both are.

As regards pastors soliciting for funds it is a feature of the Church since its founding days. Apostle Paul once critixized members for expecting him and other apostles to live a poorer life than they do..

I don't know that Giving is compelled in Christiandom either. Everyone gives what he or she can afford. So what is your point?

In churches both the rich and poor also worship together so I don't get what your point is saying rich Muslims and poor Muslims worship together as if churches segregate rich and poor people.

As per pastors being rich in comparison. Yes, we in the church who pay the tithes, offerings are perfectly OK with it.

Living faith church has 156 branches in Ghana alone, RCCG has over 700 branches in UK alone amongst tens of thousands of churches across the globe. So to compare such churches to mosque does not even make any sense to begin with. But don't mistaken the simplicity of that Imam with Humility. The Sultan Of Sokoto I believe lives in more opulence than Pastor Adeboye or Oyedepo....

So you say.....


Meanwhile

Statsocial:

It is you who has comprehension problems. If the Church gives more than the Mosque then why compare how they solicit funds or how wealthy they both are.

As regards pastors soliciting for funds it is a feature of the Church since its founding days. Apostle Paul once critixized members for expecting him and other apostles to live a poorer life than they do..

I don't know that Giving is compelled in Christiandom either. Everyone gives what he or she can afford. So what is your point?

In churches both the rich and poor also worship together so I don't get what your point is saying rich Muslims and poor Muslims worship together as if churches segregate rich and poor people.

This really had nothing to do with my claims. There's nothing you've said that I didn't comprehend. You on the other hand went off on a tangent rambling about who operates more orphanages, showing you had comprehension issues with my own statement. My simple claim was that Muslim clerics do not solicit money anywhere near as much as Christian counterparts do. Read it again and let it percolate this time.

And giving is compelled, especially in many Pentecostal churches. This is one of the fundamentally dishonest arguments a lot of you put up. You simply create strawman distortions that basically imply that as long as no one has a gun pointed at you, that you are not compelled to give. That is a silly and childish argument. I've spent a good amount of my time as a Pentecostal since my conversion in first year of University and I have seen a hell of a lot of schemes devised to manipulate the flock into compliance. Schemes devised to emotionally manipulate (with selective scripture quoting and associated threats of doom) and shame and ostracize.

As per pastors being rich in comparison. Yes, we in the church who pay the tithes, offerings are perfectly OK with it.

Living faith church has 156 branches in Ghana alone, RCCG has over 700 branches in UK alone amongst tens of thousands of churches across the globe. So to compare such churches to mosque does not even make any sense to begin with. But don't mistaken the simplicity of that Imam with Humility. The Sultan Of Sokoto I believe lives in more opulence than Pastor Adeboye or Oyedepo....

That's your personal prerogative. I know many Christians who aren't "okay" with it, but such is their long indoctrination and emotional manipulation and dread of "touching the Lord's anointed", they dare not stand by their convictions. They "leave it for God to judge".

Who was arguing about how many branches Living Faith or Redeemed have? Islam is structured differently which is why profiteering in the manner of modern Pentecostals is abhorrent to them. You actually have Pentecostal churches where branches that don't meet up with certain targets in the repatriation of funds to the headquarters have Pastors demoted, re-assigned or removed: basically operating like bank branches .
What a shame for the salvation message of Christ.

And hell no.......the Sultan of Sokoto doesn't live in more opulence than Adeboye or Oyedepo.