₦airaland Forum

Blue3k:
If they aren't equal so what? Is anyone stopping private sector from building more plants in These places. The mention of Dangote and Sanusi is too shoe that people will wail no matter what. Go look at thread and see for yourself. The generalization is true.

I don't know who the private sector operators will be. The government doesnt even know till they get offers. The story doesn't even have a date or timeline. What's the point losing shirt over an approval. The technical issues aren't impossible to remedy. If Nigeria can pipe gas to Ghana to fuel their power plants then these places can run just as easily. Its really that simple as long as nobody blows up pipelines.

The West African gas pipeline is 678 km and works fine.

Erm.....no. People would not wail no matter what. Again, stop projecting those ridiculous generalizations and focus on the merits of this particular argument, rather than the fallacious conjecture. You keep talking about the private sector, but this would be a joint venture if it comes to fruition with NNPC driving the vision and providing some equity while soliciting partners. I'm pretty damn sure they would find a lot more partners down South than in the North, even from Northern investors themselves who would rather invest their money in the South where these projects should yield more fruit. Regardless of the progress or lack of it which you keep highlighting, this already reveals their sectional agenda. The very intention is what is being judged here. This is pretty blatantly obvious but in some disingenuous attempt to appear the cool head among "wailers", you've decided to be coy with the blatant truth that this government (which I voted for and supported) is the most brazenly sectional, tribalistic government in living memory of this country.

Obi1kenobi:
Erm.....no. People would not wail no matter what. Again, stop projecting those ridiculous generalizations and focus on the merits of this particular argument, rather than the fallacious conjecture. You keep talking about the private sector, but this would be a joint venture if it comes to fruition with NNPC driving the vision and providing some equity while soliciting partners. I'm pretty damn sure they would find a lot more partners down South than in the North, even from Northern investors themselves who would rather invest their money in the South where these projects should yield more fruit. Regardless of the progress or lack of it which you keep highlighting, this already reveals their sectional agenda. The very intention is what is being judged here. This is pretty blatantly obvious but in some disingenuous attempt to appear the cool head among "wailers", you've decided to be coy with the blatant truth that this government (which I voted for and supported) is the most brazenly sectional, tribalistic government in living memory of this country.

You have no counter arguments about pipeline argument. I told you how it can feasibly work give you examples here in west Africa where similar projects work. This would be no different from Que Ibo power plant. No arguments about sectional agengenda and rather investing south. Again your complaints dont revolve around project not working but intentions. Dint lose sleep over a proposal guy.

How many 4,600MW Plants NNPC don establish for Rivers, Delta or Akwaibom where them suck out this funds from ?

USELESS COUNTRY.

Blue3k:
The next big part about resources being issue can be solved with pipeline. If West African pipeline is 678 km and it supplies Ghana with gas to make electricity. If Niger Republic has Natural gas they can import it from there. Nigeria already imports crude from them. The human resources that will be there issue.

If such a pipeline makes economic sense, it shouldn’t require NNPC’s intervention to get built. Look at how American companies lobbied frantically for years to get the Keystone XL pipeline built - they didn’t have to wait for a US-government run agency to “partner” with them to want in on the action.

The real driver here isn’t economics but politics - the object is to derive benefits from oil and gas for the northern states even at the cost of having to bribe the private sector to make economically subpar investments.

gocac:
for you consumption, i am a Rivers man. GEJ should answer that question not me. Because Gej could have done what Buhari is doing today, instead he abandoned ND and decided to build amajiri schools and railway in the north.
Now, Is it Buhari you never vited fir that will remember you? Stop talking nonsense here. Blane goodluck and not fulani cow called bubu.

Stop vomiting lies. Goodluck was never GMD of NNPC and even though I am not a GEJ fan I know GEJ tried with the pushing of PIB. Same Northerners who resisted PIB are the ones trying to build Power plants & pipelines through NNPC.

omohayek:
You say the project is "private drive with a bit of public sector support", but where are the private drivers of which you speak? No for-profit company in their right mind would voluntarily opt to locate such facilities in the north, far away from the raw materials and in a region with far less human capital to draw on. Besides, which private sector players would ever "pair" with a Nigerian parastatal that has never run anything with success in more than 40 years?

These proposals are rubbish from start to finish, and even if they never see the light of day, they are revealing about the sectional, economically nonsensical priorities of Buhari's government. You don't plan to expend scarce resources on economically irrational proposals like these unless you're allowing tribal and regional factors to drive your thinking at the expense of ROI calculations.

I'll repeat: NNPC itself needs to be abolished, and the entire energy sector deregulated and opened up to foreign investment. Only then will we see what investments make most sense and where - and I'm betting that not a single one of any such investments will be located in the north, not even when they're being made by northerners like Dangote.

God bless you for putting it straight to oga Blue3k2.
It would have made sense that the isolated north sends her own raw materials (mostly food stuff ) down south to industries with easy gas supply to run that will process them, then they get exported to the their foreign destination.
When this is fruitful the proceeds of the export can be supplement with oil money to start building pipelines that can transmit gas and even human beings back to the north.
The problem is they want to hold the south down and overtake us with our own resources. Oga Blue3k don't see through their plans and probably think they will leave the south alone after getting what they want, but absolute power corrupts absolutely and they will islamize blue3k2 when they have what they seek. Lol

mikolo80:
bastard you made analogy now you can't follow it.
north has car(oil) that just happen to be in your backyard (Niger delta)
if I park my car in your garage does that make it yours? fool think before you type

omohayek, blue3k2, richeso, obi1kenobi.
Please do you guys understand the bold part ?

omohayek:
If such a pipeline makes economic sense, it shouldn’t require NNPC’s intervention to get built. Look at how American companies lobbied frantically for years to get the Keystone XL pipeline built - they didn’t have to wait for a US-government run agency to “partner” with them to want in on the action.

The real driver here isn’t economics but politics - the object is to derive benefits from oil and gas for the northern states even at the cost of having to bribe the private sector to make economically subpar investments.

They did require multiple governments intervention in case of WAGP. The point about KXL is true. I could bring up other examples of pipelines laid all around world like Russian pipelines to europe being more similar to WAGP than KXL. The investment being supar in power plant is a maybe. Assuming everything goes like WAGP it wont be. The point about political driven true everything with NNPC is. The government bribed private sector in same manner WAGP.

Desyner:
omohayek, blue3k2, richeso, obi1kenobi.
Please do you guys understand the bold part ?

It’s no surprise that many northerners have long had a bizarre entitlement mentality, in spite of how far behind they lag in all indices of development: Nigeria’s very existence since 1914 has always been about using southern economic resources to subsidise northern backwardness. What is unusual in this particular character’s case is that he’s too stupid to even try to hide that bloated sense of entitlement from public view.

Desyner:
God bless you for putting it straight to oga Blue3k2.
It would have made sense that the isolated north sends her own raw materials (mostly food stuff ) down south to industries with easy gas supply to run that will process them, then they get exported to the their foreign destination.
When this is fruitful the proceeds of the export can be supplement with oil money to start building pipelines that can transmit gas and even human beings back to the north.

Everything is a plan to spread Islam. Anyway the most logical thing to do in reality is for them to power themselves with energy resources there via coal or hydro projects. Why would they need to send food down south to process.

Blue3k:
Everything is a plan to spread Islam. Anyway the most logical thing to do in reality is for them to power themselves with energy resources there via coal or hydro projects. Why would they need to send food down south to process.

Nah.....this is the more logical thing to do: use Niger-Delta resources to subsidize their infrastructural projects. Coal and hydroelectric power plants are far more expensive to construct than gas-powered plants. And use NNPC, an autonomous organization with a massive budget to almost rival the FG,which the Northern cartel control in this administration to push the agenda.

Obi1kenobi:
Nah.....this is the more logical thing to do: use Niger-Delta resources to subsidize their infrastructural projects. Coal and hydroelectric power plants are far more expensive to construct than gas-powered plants. And use NNPC, an autonomous organization with a massive budget to almost rival the FG,which the Northern cartel control in this administration to push the agenda.

using Nnpc funds to sponsor projects whether in the north,south,east or west is an economic fraud.
that is why the idea of 4600MW gas plant is madness. Nnpc does not have such powers.
yes it can pursue community social responsibility of sponsoring projects WITHIN its area of operation which covers the social wellbeing of the community of oil and gas exploration such as education, healthcare,road,job opportunities but not to usurp the responsibility power of the state

Obi1kenobi:
Nah.....this is the more logical thing to do: use Niger-Delta resources to subsidize their infrastructural projects. Coal and hydroelectric power plants are far more expensive to construct than gas-powered plants. And use NNPC, an autonomous organization with a massive budget to almost rival the FG,which the Northern cartel control in this administration to push the agenda.

Hydro less expensive but sure if you say so.

baralatie:
using Nnpc funds to sponsor projects whether in the north,south,east or west is an economic fraud.
that is why the idea of 4600MW gas plant is madness. Nnpc does not have such powers.
yes it can pursue community social responsibility of sponsoring projects WITHIN its area of operation which covers the social wellbeing of the community of oil and gas exploration such as education, healthcare,road,job opportunities but not to usurp the responsibility power of the state

so nnpc only provides fuel in Niger delta(nnpc o not nndc) . na wa o

Blue3k:
Hydro less expensive but sure if you say so.

dams not cheap in short run but free fuel in long run

Desyner:
omohayek, blue3k2, richeso, obi1kenobi.
Please do you guys understand the bold part ?

follow his analogy from previous mentions to get it

Desyner:
God bless you for putting it straight to oga Blue3k2.
It would have made sense that the isolated north sends her own raw materials (mostly food stuff ) down south to industries with easy gas supply to run that will process them, then they get exported to the their foreign destination.
When this is fruitful the proceeds of the export can be supplement with oil money to start building pipelines that can transmit gas and even human beings back to the north.
The problem is they want to hold the south down and overtake us with our own resources. Oga Blue3k don't see through their plans and probably think they will leave the south alone after getting what they want, but absolute power corrupts absolutely and they will islamize blue3k2 when they have what they seek. Lol

how is it your resource?
did you put it there ?
are you willing to kill for said resources?
are you willing to die for said resources?

if you answer no to all those questions then it's not yours.
sucks but that's reality not nairaland wishful thinking

omohayek:
It’s no surprise that many northerners have long had a bizarre entitlement mentality,

why is it bizarre
do you not feel entitled to insult ppl on a faceless forum
do you not feel entitled to oil you didn't put there, cannot extract, refuse to process and won't lay your life down for? why then shouldn't Nigerian who found oil in Nigerian borders and is willing to do all the above.

if armed robbercome to you house
tell him he is bizarrely entitled

in spite of how far behind they lag in all indices of development: Nigeria’s very existence since 1914 has always been about using southern economic resources to subsidise northern backwardness. What is unusual in this particular character’s case is that he’s too stupid to even try to hide that bloated sense of entitlement from public view.

and you're so stupid to think low development indices is a point against entitlement
humans are entitled to whatever they can get away with especially when they have guns and knives and a cowardly greedy lazy prey.

they're entitled to the oil
go and beat them with Nairaland insults
let's see how that will change anything in next 50 years

only men are entitled to shit not peons and grammar speakers,men with guns

mikolo80:
dams not cheap in short run but free fuel in long run

The oil and gas not free. The end users have to pay. Nobody has to pay for a river "naturally" flow. As long there's enough water pushing turbines the plant works.

Blue3k:
The oil and gas not free. The end users have to pay. Nobody has to pay for a river "naturally" flow. As long there's enough water pushing turbines the plant works.

yet we pay kainji. it's delicate choice. build for 10 and fuel with 10 for next hundred years (1000 total)or look for 100 (World Bank loan with interest ) to build then be free from fuel cost although water levels are going down.
it's like (I-pass-my-neighbour) Vs solar or wind turbine
one fast and cheap but will chop fuel silently
other expensive and slow to implement but fuel free with 20 year payback period
how many of have that kind of free cash
besides lots of gas being flared in ND

Blue3k:
The oil and gas not free. The end users have to pay. Nobody has to pay for a river "naturally" flow. As long there's enough water pushing turbines the plant works.

I never talk environmental impact o. somebody always pays

mikolo80:
if armed robbercome to you house
tell him he is bizarrely entitled

So you're openly admitting that you're "entitled" to Niger-Delta oil in exactly the same way an armed robber is "entitled"? That the oil is "yours" simply because you have the guns and say so? I didn't know it was possible to be so stupid, but well done to you, sir.

and you're so stupid to think low development indices is a point against entitlement
humans are entitled to whatever they can get away with especially when they have guns and knives and a cowardly greedy lazy prey.

I see you're a subscriber to the old "might makes right" school of moral philosophy. Very well then, since we're dispensing with the pretense that normal ethical considerations apply to you and your ilk from the north, I hope you'll keep your mouth firmly shut should the day ever arise when all those southerners you see as mere "prey" decide to become the hunters, and turn you into the hunted. You seem to think that the fact your people swamped the Nigerian Army through the quota system somehow serves as proof of your innate northern military prowess, but we'll see how well all those antiquated AK-47s and obsolete Mig-21s work for you and your quota-system brothers in 21st century warfare conducted with drones, missiles and satellites ...

omohayek:
So you're openly admitting that you're "entitled" to Niger-Delta oil in exactly the same way an armed robber is "entitled"? That the oil is "yours" simply because you have the guns and say so?

is the oil 'ours' or not
you only get 13%
so I say it's 87% ours

I didn't know it was possible to be so stupid, but well done to you, sir.

you allowed outsiders to take your oil without a fight and when you fought your warriors sold you out for peanuts
you're the stupid ones

I see you're a subscriber to the old "might makes right" school of moral philosophy.

subscription is irrelevant when it's fact
guns rule, everytime

Very well then, since we're dispensing with the pretense that normal ethical considerations apply to you and your ilk from the north,

funny how you think telling the truth as it is makes one from the north

I hope you'll keep your mouth firmly shut should the day ever arise when all those southerners you see as mere "prey" decide to become the hunters, and turn you into the hunted.

and they will be hunting me and I will be looking ba
selling groundnut while they are hunting me
I see how stupid you are

You seem to think that the fact your people swamped the Nigerian Army through the quota system somehow serves as proof of your innate northern military prowess,

political prowess
same coin different sides

but we'll see how well all those antiquated AK-47s and obsolete Mig-21s work for you and your quota-system brothers in 21st century warfare conducted with drones, missiles and satellites ...

how many of these things does south have
don't forget north have more money to buy same plus the headstart they have in Ak'S

and Chinese still fly MiGs dum dum
anything other than raptors and above is moot

Blue3k:
Hydro less expensive but sure if you say so.

No, it isn't. And hell yeah, I said so. It is much cheaper to run than gas powered plants, but initial construction costs for hydro plants are more expensive. Often considerably so. Do your research.

Or to help you, you can use this US EIA report comparing energy sources as a reference:
https://www.eia.gov/outlooks/aeo/assumptions/pdf/table_8.2.pdf

Obi1kenobi:
No, it isn't. And hell yeah, I said so. It is much cheaper to run than gas powered plants, but initial construction costs for hydro plants are more expensive. Often considerably so. Do your research.

Or to help you, you can use this US EIA report comparing energy sources as a reference:
https://www.eia.gov/outlooks/aeo/assumptions/pdf/table_8.2.pdf

Do yours the studies for west Africa show hydro is less expensive. Check west African power pool documents.

http://www.ecowapp.org/sites/default/files/mp_wapp_volume_2.pdf

One finds in red the areas where the marginal cost is the highest. Without surprise, the areas with the most expensive energy are located inside the continent; they do not have gas infrastructures or hydroelectric projects. In this case, the marginal units are regularly diesel units at the interior-continent price. For these areas the marginal cost is higher than 100 USD/MWh.The units with a marginal cost slightly lower than the maximum are tagged in yellow. The marginal units in these areas are regularly less expensive units like coal (Senegal-Dakar and Niger- Salkadamna) or for which the importation from better located areas is regularly sufficient. They have a marginal cost between 90 and 100 USD/MWh. Then there are the areas where the marginal unit is a gas turbine running on natural gas. This case is valid for all the southern part of West Africa (in green on the chart) where the marginal cost is between 80 and 90 USD/MWh. Lastly, the areas where there are such hydroelectric possibilities that these units are often marginal are indicated in blue. For these sites, the marginal cost is lower than 80 USD/MWh.

Blue3k:
Do yours the studies for west Africa show hydro is less expensive. Check west African power pool documents.

http://www.ecowapp.org/sites/default/files/mp_wapp_volume_2.pdf

You're still mistaken. Costs of power generation is very different from costs of plant construction, which is what my initial comment that started this back-and-forth was stating. The very use of MWh there shows where your confusion is from. MW refers to power output or input and is used to express the capacity of a machine. You compare the relative costs of power plants in $/MW. Megawatt-hour (MWh) on the other hand measures energy output/input which is an ongoing cost and is used to refer to production/consumption. What you're presenting is the cost of power generation, not the cost of the power plants. You can read another different link from the first one.
https://www.e-education.psu.edu/eme801/node/530

I have seen no Nigerian links, but I have no reason to believe it would be any different from global standards.

Obi1kenobi:
You're still mistaken. Costs of power generation is very different from costs of plant construction, which is what my initial comment that started this back-and-forth was stating.

I have seen no Nigerian links, but I have no reason to believe it would be any different from global standards.

I see my mistake. I midunderstood. Anyway you hydroelectric construction cost neglects fact hydroelectric plants have longer lifetimes than gas power plants. Then it's way cheaper to cooperate with lower electricity cost. Over life of plant I would say the hydro cheaper long run.

Check link you can see construction cost and various operating and management cost of life of plant.

mikolo80:
why is it bizarre
do you not feel entitled to insult ppl on a faceless forum
do you not feel entitled to oil you didn't put there, cannot extract, refuse to process and won't lay your life down for? why then shouldn't Nigerian who found oil in Nigerian borders and is willing to do all the above.

if armed robbercome to you house
tell him he is bizarrely entitled

and you're so stupid to think low development indices is a point against entitlement
humans are entitled to whatever they can get away with especially when they have guns and knives and a cowardly greedy lazy prey.

they're entitled to the oil
go and beat them with Nairaland insults
let's see how that will change anything in next 50 years

only men are entitled to shit not peons and grammar speakers,men with guns

The reason the northerners are easily brainwashed is people like you who speak good english but use it to concoct rotten logic.

Blue3k:
I see my mistake. I midunderstood. Anyway you hydroelectric construction cost neglects fact hydroelectric plants have longer lifetimes than gas power plants. Then it's way cheaper to cooperate with lower electricity cost. Over life of plant I would say the hydro cheaper long run.

Check link you can see construction cost and various operating and management cost of life of plant.

You are still parading this forum with ignorant post and irrelevant fact beyond your understanding. Look at all your post for the past 2 years and realize the volume of trash you ve created.

Standing5:
[s]You are still parading this forum with ignorant post and irrelevant fact beyond your understanding. Look at all your post for the past 2 years and realize the volume of trash you ve created.[/s]

Lol you talking out your butt go sober up kid. I've dealt with you plenty of times. Thanks for good laugh. The last two times I talked you. You were talking about mining not helping in tax revenue. Then you said implied factormyth website more credible than SPA website.

Desyner:
The reason the northerners are easily brainwashed is people like you who speak good english but use it to concoct rotten logic.

wetin concine logic with fact.
survival of the fittest has existed since Adam and eve

they are survivin
you're lamenting
instead of strategising and fighting back
good luck

mikolo80:
wetin concine logic with fact. survival of the fittest has existed since Adam and eve
they are survivin you're lamenting instead of strategising and fighting back good luck

I see why islam goes after people and not 'God'.