adioolayi:
Their usual way.. Oby like many other experienced technocrats usually resort to the "You have a set. biased mindset of your view" when they shockingly meet a match that can school them

Olukunle won this intellectually and he respectfully drive home his points.. .. picking a position and backing it up with verifiable data...he went as far as even "conceding" to Oby's unverifiable data and use simple arithmetic to finish her based on her own data.
Madam was surprised she could meet someone like that and resorted to defensive mode.

sorry bro, it is either your basic economics theory is bad or you have never had to do real life practical transactions in this scope.

5 years from now coupled with additional education you would be ashamed of this your post

obailala:
I think one point I've gathered from this argument is this; the Chinese give infrastructure and not money, and that already nullifies your argument.

You claim the IMF gives money and monitors what it's used for but the Chinese give without condition?... With all the IMF loans Nigeria and other African countries have received over the decades, how come we still struggle to point out the location of infrastructure these loans were used for?... Whereas on the other hand, the Chinese build infrastructure directly without handing cash over to our kleptomaniac leaders; in Nigeria today we can point out the functional Abuja to Kaduna rail, the Lagos to Ibadan rail, the negotiations for Mambilla are ongoing etc.

After so many decades of enriching klepto leaders who in turn return the stolen funds to western banks, it's amusing that we still have Nigerians who still BELIEVE the IMF actually cares about how the loans they give to Africa are spent.

E go forever dey better for you.

centoke30:

bright master well done. so a former World Bank vice president should banter words with a young chap who doesn't know anything about international loans

Yes, a young chap that knows what he is saying will never be intimidated by your so called former world bank president on the issue of Chinese loans and that from Brentwood.

Realname:


Why attack their tribe that way ?

Too toxic

Mods rule 2

This will denegerste

cc Seun
cc JARUS
cc CHAIRCOVER
cc Lalasticlala
cc Seun
cc Rocktation
cc farano
cc Dominique

Keep deceiving yourself. It's 9.47am and I just read his comment. Truth is, no place for a backward and bitter tribe.

gurnam:


Don’t be a coward, go and call him a bastard on twitter. He is a bastard to you simply because he intellectually engaged your almighty Oby and made her looked ordinary.
I don’t know what is is wrong with some of you Ibos! You tribalized even the mode mundane things

seems you dont know your maths. Read what a fellow nairalander with one head like you pointed out chronique:


So a loan with a 12 years maturity that cumulatively adds up to 43.2% is better than that of a 38 years maturity window and cumulatively adds up to 47.5%? Some of you have no business being in business or discussing anything finance. now is 38years maturity period not better at 47.5% than 12years at 43.2%? You guys just rush to comment without thinking. Oby was making sense, that olakunle was just making noise

Zirah:


Keep deceiving yourself. It's 9.47am and I just read his comment. Truth is, no place for a backward and bitter tribe.

This person is calling the Igbo tribe a backward and bitter tribe

You know nothing

That is all I have to tell you

gurnam:


Yes, a young chap that knows what he is saying will never be intimidated by your so called former world bank president on the issue of Chinese loans and that from Brentwood.

the guy was saying rubbish

This is what you shld pay attention to


'chronique:


So a loan with a 12 years maturity that cumulatively adds up to 43.2% is better than that of a 38 years maturity window and cumulatively adds up to 47.5%? Some of you have no business being in business or discussing anything finance.

[s]

famosh:

Do the daft IPIGs & the dumb PDP sycophants understand what they're talking about?

[/s]
A frustrated skull mining, sufferisticated, demonic broom wielding zombie has just hyperventilated

gurnam:


I don’t do religion junk that some of you igbos are famous for. Take it away from my mention

but you do tribalism junk by calling anybody against buhari igbos and ipob.

SoNature:
I bet that most of you up there commenting had no idea what the guy is talking about.

You were impressed that he was flying figures around and that other commentators praised him

I know there are many senseless youths in this country, but please stop displaying your foolishness if you have no reasonable contribution to make

If u quote me, I won't reply you

many nigerian youths, escpecially d tribal bigots, from twitter to nairaland are ignorant n stewpid at dsame time..they just key into discussions to loathe, not to even learn anyfin,.. Thats how stewpid they are, n u see lots of them here in nairaland, why they get d kind of politicians they have..the guy flying figures has so mesmerised them to boisterity n even compounded their foolishness, oby only saw the gathering of worms n their worms alike..n gave way...d lady wif class cannot go on mixing or bantering neophyte tadpoles in muds..so she kept quiet, or prolly found somethin important doing, since she found it wasnt worth it..knowing wat most nigerian ova sabi youths sound like...on twitter...

SoNature:
I bet that most of you up there commenting had no idea what the guy is talking about.

You were impressed that he was flying figures around and that other commentators praised him

I know there are many senseless youths in this country, but please stop displaying your foolishness if you have no reasonable contribution to make

If u quote me, I won't reply you

Of a truth you're correct.

Most people just appreciate the fact that "Oby was served". Whether she was served correctly or not it's not their business.

Anybody can get facts wrong anywhere, anytime. It does not mean she's stupid or dumb.

The value of this madam is dropping like the naira

datribune:
d guy is right, IMF is bad news.
When d thieving politicians of d then National Party of Nigeria (NPN) ran d nation aground, d IMF knowing that Nigeria was in a very weak position attached slavish conditionalities to their loan which d Buhari/Idiagbon govt rejected. d then economic team led by Dr Onaolapo Soleye devised d ingenuous system of batter 4 oil with Brazil & some other countries which was highly successful & had significant impact in d recovery of d economy.
When Gen Babangida overthrew d Buhari govt he tried to take d IMF loan which met wit stiff resistance frm civil society, Labour, students etc & he had to drop d idea. IBB however took d country down d path of what he described as d Structural Adjustment Program (SAP) which was championed by Chief Olu Falae & which was like taking d IMF loan thru d backdoor & included majorly d devaluation of our currency. d Naira went into a free fall & has never recovered. d IMF is bad news & a tool of neo-colonialism. IBB's error of judgment caused d nation dearly.

The IMF wahala was all over Africa during that period, the Brazil move and Umaru Dikko fiasco was the reason the British made sure they remove Buhari.
Buhari is a serious head ache to their agenda in Nigeria and Africa as a whole.
Nigerians paid big time then and the country is still paying till today.

meccuno:
Olakunle Abiola somoye finished work on oby ezekwesili BETWEEN WORLD BANK/IMF2 AND CHINA LOAN
THREAD---

OBY E-Most annoying of this latest round of RISING SCALE of Public Debt by countries of the continent is that the politicians are behaving EXACTLY like the ones who PILED UP DEBTS in the 80s & 90s.

Oby-Chinese attitude to Indebtedness is the HARDEST in the world. I know, because one had to deal with it in the course of my work @ the World Bank, helping African countries to get the HIPC Debt Cancellation.

It ANNOYS ME TO NO END to see our countries BINGING on Chinese Loans.

Olukunle -“Just sign up for plenty Loans...forget about imperatives of Debt Sustainability.” KAI!!
1/ I will be the first to admit that we should be wary of China, but who else would have partnered with us on infrastructure development like the Chinese? with interest as low as 2-3% asides technological and knowledge transfer we also have targeted fundings for agric.

Oby-You are referring to their Concessionary Loan/Grant which is paltry compared to the predominant Non-Concessionary Loan Book it has built up across Africa.
We need to put the feet of our leaders to the fire to articulate and execute market reforms like China did & grew. KEY POINT.

Olukunle -Please ma can you kindly furnish us with the interest rate on the Non - Concessionary loan to Nigeria so we can compare with what IMF/WorldBank can offer us.

Oby- Wonderful! I should furnish you? �
It is the FG you should ask for its Non-Concessional Loan details with China cos it varies.
What I do know though, is that on average, Chinese loans offer an interest rate of 3.6 percent, a grace period of 4 years & a maturity of 12years. /1
Most of African countries borrow from the World Bank as IDA - International Development Assistance (Concessional Loan) countries at service charge of 0.75 percent, a 0.25 percent front-end fee and 0.25 percent commitment charge. 6 year Grace Period & repayment period of 38years.

Olukunle-/1 I insist Chinese Loans are 2-3% not 3.6% as you said recall 2013 loan for airport terminals. According to you IDA is 1.25% (0.25+0.25+0.75) for a spread of 38 years = 47.5%
Yet IMF’s principal charges/interest alone is 0.84% minus front-end commitment & service charge.
But let’s go by your figures, at 1.25% for a spread of 38 years = 47.5% with brettonwood “Conditionalities” which includes “Retrenchment of civil servants” it’s good enough but for Chinese Loan of 3.6% (your figure) with 12 years maturity total is
3.6% x12= 43.2% contd of/1 ...

Recall on Chinese loan there’re Concessionary and Non Concessionary clauses which doesn’t seek to impose their own “Reformation” but rather ensure - through- Chinese Companies that the purpose of the loan is fulfilled (Train, Bridges & Highways).
Contd 1\...

We joined IMF in 1963 yet asides the mismanagement of the funds given to us by our leaders, Nigeria had to suffer retrenchment of civil servants and foreign exchange between the $ to N started dropping exponentially. The Naira started plummeting after Buhari was ousted in 1985

Oby- I shall not enable this, dear. Too much confusing assumptions in your tweets. The worst of them is you not knowing that there is a difference between Lending by the World Bank - Investment in Development needs & Lending by IMF- Balance of Payment needs. It is enough. Tweet on.

Olukunle- I don’t know as much as you do and I concede that from the get go that is why I still used your figures to do the basic arithmetic to reach a logical conclusion of why Chinese loan may be better than IDAs after all.

OBY - You are wrong on that but hardly matters cos again, that’s not the point of my tweets. You have a set mind on what you wish to tell me and therefore keep engaging in Transactional dialogue. Go back and read my Tweet again & see why yours are unnecessary. Blessings.

Olakunle -Sorry but maybe if you just furnish us with the % on the non concessionary loans from the Chinese perhaps we would see the glaring difference between the 100% concession loans of IDAs.
You know people in the FG, for the sake of learning ask them so you teach your boys here ��

@MrSomoye #AppreciationTweet on the Chinese loan and IMF loan thread.

Mummy didn't answer him but did a separate tweet to sub the young man.

OLUKUNLE ABIOLA SOMOYE WIN MANY WITH HIS EDUCATING TWITTER.

It's funny to see Nigerians applaud this Somoye guy simply because they felt mesmerized by the figures he's throwing. I know Nigerians hate mathematics and figures but at least common sense and basic principle would make the obvious more obvious.

Admittedly, lack of political conditionalities and supervision (if true) of utilization of the loans is a good thing. But that's just about the only good thing about Chinese loans BASED ON THE FIGURES POSTED IN THIS ARGUMENT. The key features of a good loan shows that IDA is a far better option than the Chinese loans.

The primary features of "better" loan lie in the INTEREST RATE and DURATION OF PAYMENT.

1.INTEREST RATE: Chinese 2-3 (or 3.6)%; IDA 1.25%. which is better? IDA of course. If you doubt it, I would ask you a question: if you're taking a loan would you go for a higher interest rate? I bet you won't.

2. Duration of payment: Chinese 12years, IDA 38years. which is better? IDA of course. In your personal loan I'm sure you prefer longer duration for easy payment.


NOW THE ARITHMETIC FIGURES.
He calculated a total Interest rate for Chinese loans for 12years as 43.2% (3.6x12).
Then IDA loan for 38years as 47.5% (1.25x38). If FG can payoff Chinese loans in 12 years, nothing stops them from paying off IDA loan in 12 years (NOBODY SAYS YOU CAN'T OFFSET YOUR LOAN EARLIER). Based on his calculation of "total interest rate", IDA loan for 12 years gives 15% (1.25x12). So by his own calculation, given the same duration of payment, IDA is still by far the "BETTER LOAN".
If this is your personal loan, I'm 100% certain you will prefer a loan that gives you CHEAPER INTEREST RATE and LONGER DURATION. (Even the Chinese if they can, would take IDA loan and lend it to Africa @Chinese rate and make some profit for themselves.....this is how banks make money if you know). I don't see how this appears like rocket science because it's on twitter but I understand Nigerians and basic mathematics are enemies.

NB: His calculated figures are FUNDAMENTALLY FAULTY as Yearly Interest is calculated from Balance for each Year and not from initial capital. So his arithmetically calculated total INTEREST RATE is misleading. Total interest rate of what, original capital? Absurd. But I don't want to delve into that for now unless someone asks for it. I'm sure that's why Madam Oby left him alone with his glorified ignorance well exposed on twitter.

TheUbermensch:


Of a truth you're correct.

Most people just appreciate the fact that "Oby was served". Whether she was served correctly or not it's not their business.

The same impoverished and jobless youths she is trying so hard to liberate from there deceptic and thieving leaders...'slaves that loves their chains'.

deomelo:




No, you have reading comprehension issues.


It's not by accident that Oby didn't challenge his assertions

It all depends on wen it was screenshot.


Meanwhile those loans are extremely dangerous, U will understand this in the future.

Zirah:


Keep deceiving yourself. It's 9.47am and I just read his comment. Truth is, no place for a backward and bitter tribe.

Going by this I think your tribe is the bitter and backward one, you are the first to attack her entire tribe because you think she is wrong.
How backward and senseless!

HardMirror:
seems you dont know your maths. Read what a fellow nairalander with one head like you pointed out chronique:


So a loan with a 12 years maturity that cumulatively adds up to 43.2% is better than that of a 38 years maturity window and cumulatively adds up to 47.5%? Some of you have no business being in business or discussing anything finance. now is 38years maturity period not better at 47.5% than 12years at 43.2%? You guys just rush to comment without thinking. Oby was making sense, that olakunle was just making noise

i think government should start making basic finance a compulsory course for all higher institution students so they can have an idea of some of these things.

studentofTruth:



It's funny to see Nigerians applaud this Somoye guy simply because they felt mesmerized by the figures he's throwing. I know Nigerians hate mathematics and figures but at least common sense and basic principle would make the obvious more obvious.

Admittedly, lack of political conditionalities and supervision (if true) of utilization of the loans is a good thing. But that's just about the only good thing about Chinese loans BASED ON THE FIGURES POSTED IN THIS ARGUMENT. The key features of a good loan shows that IDA is a far better option than the Chinese loans.

The primary features of "better" loan lie in the INTEREST RATE and DURATION OF PAYMENT.

1.INTEREST RATE: Chinese 2-3 (or 3.6)%; IDA 1.25%. which is better? IDA of course. If you doubt it, I would ask you a question: if you're taking a loan would you go for a higher interest rate? I bet you won't.

2. Duration of payment: Chinese 12years, IDA 38years. which is better? IDA of course. In your personal loan I'm sure you prefer longer duration for easy payment.


NOW THE ARITHMETIC FIGURES.
He calculated a total Interest rate for Chinese loans for 12years as 43.2% (3.6x12).
Then IDA loan for 38years as 47.5% (1.25x38). If FG can payoff Chinese loans in 12 years, nothing stops them from paying off IDA loan in 12 years (NOBODY SAYS YOU CAN'T OFFSET YOUR LOAN EARLIER). Based on his calculation of "total interest rate", IDA loan for 12 years gives 15% (1.25x12). So by his own calculation, given the same duration of payment, IDA is still by far the "BETTER LOAN".
If this is your personal loan, I'm 100% certain you will prefer a loan that gives you CHEAPER INTEREST RATE and LONGER DURATION. (Even the Chinese if they can, would take IDA loan and lend it to Africa @Chinese rate and make some profit for themselves.....this is how banks make money if you know). I don't see how this appears like rocket science because it's on twitter but I understand Nigerians and basic mathematics are enemies.

NB: His calculated figures are FUNDAMENTALLY FAULTY as Yearly Interest is calculated from Balance for each Year and not from initial capital. So his arithmetically calculated total INTEREST RATE is misleading. Total interest rate of what, original capital? Absurd. But I don't want to delve into that for now unless someone asks for it. I'm sure that's why Madam Oby left him alone with his glorified ignorance well exposed on twitter.

My brother leave all this long grammar.the west have en giving us loans since independence yet african nations are still backwards.whenever the west involves themselves in africa,disaster happens.but the short period china has involved themselves with africa has yielded more fruits.the west should only help us military wise while china should help us economically.shikena

gurnam:


Yes, a young chap that knows what he is saying will never be intimidated by your so called former world bank president on the issue of Chinese loans and that from Brentwood.

that boy was talking gibberish. take that his assertions to a professor of accountancy like I did and you will understand

It's funny to see Nigerians applaud this Somoye guy simply because they felt mesmerized by the figures he's throwing. I know Nigerians hate mathematics and figures but at least common sense and basic principle would make the obvious more obvious.
Admittedly, lack of political conditionalities and supervision (if true) of utilization of the loans is a good thing. But that's just about the only good thing about Chinese loans BASED ON THE FIGURES POSTED IN THIS ARGUMENT. The key features of a good loan shows that IDA is a far better option than the Chinese loans.
The primary features of "better" loan lie in the INTEREST RATE and DURATION OF PAYMENT.
1.INTEREST RATE: Chinese 2-3 (or 3.6)%; IDA 1.25%. which is better? IDA of course. If you doubt it, I would ask you a question: if you're taking a loan would you go for a higher interest rate? I bet you won't.
2. Duration of payment: Chinese 12years, IDA 38years. which is better? IDA of course. In your personal loan I'm sure you prefer longer duration for easy payment.
NOW THE ARITHMETIC FIGURES.
He calculated a total Interest rate for Chinese loans for 12years as 43.2% (3.6x12).
Then IDA loan for 38years as 47.5% (1.25x38). If FG can payoff Chinese loans in 12 years, nothing stops them from paying off IDA loan in 12 years (NOBODY SAYS YOU CAN'T OFFSET YOUR LOAN EARLIER). Based on his calculation of "total interest rate", IDA loan for 12 years gives 15% (1.25x12). So by his own calculation, given the same duration of payment, IDA is still by far the "BETTER LOAN".
If this is your personal loan, I'm 100% certain you will prefer a loan that gives you CHEAPER INTEREST RATE and LONGER DURATION. (Even the Chinese if they can, would take IDA loan and lend it to Africa @Chinese rate and make some profit for themselves.....this is how banks make money if you know). I don't see how this appears like rocket science because it's on twitter but I understand Nigerians and basic mathematics are enemies.
NB: His calculated figures are FUNDAMENTALLY FAULTY as Yearly Interest is calculated from Balance for each Year and not from initial capital. So his arithmetically calculated total INTEREST RATE is misleading. Total interest rate of what, original capital? Absurd. But I don't want to delve into that for now unless someone asks for it. I'm sure that's why Madam Oby left him alone with his glorified ignorance well exposed on twitter.


Ignorance is a disease. Ignorance you're unaware of is incurable.

senatordave1:

My brother leave all this long grammar.the west have en giving us loans since independence yet african nations are still backwards.whenever the west involves themselves in africa,disaster happens.but the short period china has involved themselves with africa has yielded more fruits.the west should only help us military wise while china should help us economically.shikena

I care not about who help you. Help yourself. This I say both to you as a person and Nigeria as a country.

chronique:


i think government should start making basic finance a compulsory course for all higher institution students so they can have an idea of some of these things.

Totally agree. The level of ignorance is amazing.

7lives:


The IMF wahala was all over Africa during that period, the Brazil move and Umaru Dikko fiasco was the reason the British made sure they remove Buhari.
Buhari is a serious head ache to their agenda in Nigeria and Africa as a whole.
Nigerians paid big time then and the country is still paying till today.

Very correct. I'm glad there ar people who care to know about Nigerian history. They did d same to Murtala Mohammed after whom Buhari/Idiagbon modelled their govt. Those two regimes were a thorn in d flesh of Britain & d colonial powers. Murtala's foreign policy which had Africa & particularly d liberation of countries like Zimbabwe, Angola, S/Africa etc as its centerpiece was a threat to d interests of d colonialists. It could all hav been very different if d foreign powers had not intervened & either d Murtala govt or its offshoot, d Buhari/Idiagbon govt had survived. It could hav been very different because those were serious govts committed to d development of not only Nigeria but Africa as a whole. I agree, Nigeria has never recovered.

centoke30:

that boy was talking gibberish. take that his assertions to a professor of accountancy like I did and you will understand

What exactly did you “professor” say? Let us know, we want to learn from his fountain of knowledge

Sirjamo:
I know that Dr Oby knew that Chinese loans are far better than that of the IMF and World Bank, she was just looking for a way to discredit the Buhari government. Typical Igbo

So when she was campaigning for Buhari she was Yoruba, now she has become Igbo

7lives:


The IMF wahala was all over Africa during that period, the Brazil move and Umaru Dikko fiasco was the reason the British made sure they remove Buhari.
Buhari is a serious head ache to their agenda in Nigeria and Africa as a whole.
Nigerians paid big time then and the country is still paying till today.

The wahala is not with IMF and it's loans. The problem is with your leaders and their utilization of the loans. Its the same loans that banks and some individuals like Dangote are growing their wealth on. IMF don't utilize the loans for you, you do it yourself.

madridguy:
Wonderful contribution.

Thanks Bro

What are they even talking about?

deepwater:


sorry bro, it is either your basic economics theory is bad or you have never had to do real life practical transactions in this scope.

5 years from now coupled with additional education you would be ashamed of this your post

I don't get this your rant... have I claimed to be a major in the subject of discuss I haven't. Two intellectually sound people argued with facts and one seems to have upper hand.. and you are here abusing my position for going with the one that convinced me what the government did was in the right direction I don't get you. If you know more, you can school us too.

madridsta007:


Adeosun that is discrediting Buhari and his anti-corruption agenda, basically giving him the middle finger with a forged “Oluwole” NYSC certificate is Igbo abi?

Don't mind them, when Oby was campaigning for Buhari, she was not Igbo