Discussion on Doctrine between a Christian and a Jehovah's Witness - Christianity Etc (39) - Nairaland
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| Re: Discussion on Doctrine between a Christian and a Jehovah's Witness by Nobody: 6:09pm On Jun 02, 2019*. Modified: 6:27pm On Jun 02, 2019 |
nutarious:You're 100% correct Sir/Ma! That's why we are having the same mindset like Robots manufactured from the same company! Romans 15:5-6, 1Corinthians 1:10, 2Corinthians 13:11 Ephesians 4:3 Philippians 2:2 ![]() So you garit, menh you fucking garit! ![]() |
| Re: Discussion on Doctrine between a Christian and a Jehovah's Witness by Nobody: 6:15pm On Jun 02, 2019 |
Emusan:What a beautiful post you just copied there! ![]() Please try to present that with all sincerity before any neutral and humble Bible reader whose minds have not been deluded with any kind of teaching and see the outcome! Act 26:28 ![]() |
| Re: Discussion on Doctrine between a Christian and a Jehovah's Witness by Nobody: 6:22pm On Jun 02, 2019 |
Emusan:If they're all living in that sense surely they needed no more resurrection{since they've gotten their own resurrection even before Jesus paid the ultimate price} and Jesus' death has only come to open the way for who to be resurrected? ![]() Please who is lying by saying Jesus is the FIRST BORN from the dead! Revelations 1:5 ![]() |
| Re: Discussion on Doctrine between a Christian and a Jehovah's Witness by Barristter07: 7:40pm On Jun 02, 2019 |
Emusan:I Centered on the aspect that proved my position in relation to the subject of discussion , unless you mean he isnt Wonderful counselor [ going by his high knowlege as Wisdom personified ] and Mighty God ? Do you also believe Jesus was an everlasting Father before His birth? You didn't answer this.His position as everlasting Father and Prince of peace are not fulfilled with his birth as human either .In fact while he was on earth, this two roles are yet to be fulfilled in him . But my question remains : Does Shall be Called Reduce the Fact that he is a Mighty God before his birth ? Isaiah was about the MESSIAH not The word that became flesh...I quoted different commentaries to show you that Isaiah was directed to the MESSAIH and not His preexistence just as Luke addressed the Thing Mary will give birth to.Is he not wise enough as Wonderful counselor before his birth ? In his pre existence , Is he a Mighty God ? Which means Isaiah was directed to the person of the Messiah that's even why I said "you may then ask, why using Isaiah as a proof of Jesus deity?"To which you replied : He must be God , which begs the question: Has he always been God or its just when he was given birth to ? John 1:18 " No man has seen God at anytime; the only begotten god who is at the Father's side is the one who has explained him " Not only does this proves he has served as a mighty God before his birth, but he was " begotten " as a son as well . |
| Re: Discussion on Doctrine between a Christian and a Jehovah's Witness by Barristter07: 7:42pm On Jun 02, 2019 |
Maximus69:He probably forgot the subject of discussion was Ressurection . |
| Re: Discussion on Doctrine between a Christian and a Jehovah's Witness by Barristter07: 7:50pm On Jun 02, 2019 |
Emusan:It also refer to his pre existence when it says through the same son, the world was made .. Was he lying that its the Son that was used if he wasn't a son as at then ? |
| Re: Discussion on Doctrine between a Christian and a Jehovah's Witness by Barristter07: 8:00pm On Jun 02, 2019 |
Emusan:The question you should have asked rather than forming myopic opinion is : What did Jesus mean by Dead risen . Ressurection ? " Regarding the RESSURECTION OF THE DEAD, have you not read what was spoken to you by God, who said: I am the God of Abraham and the God of Isaac and the God of Jacob? He is the God, not of the dead, but of the living " Matthew 22:32,33 The Dead hasn't Rise. Comprehende ? By virtue of Gods power to raise the dead, he views his righteous ones as living . |
| Re: Discussion on Doctrine between a Christian and a Jehovah's Witness by Nobody: 8:25pm On Jun 02, 2019*. Modified: 5:38am On Jun 03, 2019 |
Barristter07:They just come up with different fabricated gibberish to defend what has been rendered defenceless! People are alive after Adam brought sin and death upon mankind and Jesus have to come and do what again for the dead? ![]() Please in what sense is Jesus' death of any significance if the righteous are already living? ![]() Abi there are other righteous people somewhere apart from those who live by Godly principles? ![]() Humility is surely a key factor in the process of redeeming mankind. Psalms 37:11, Matthew 5:5, Galatians 5: 23 I just keep wondering how all these stubborn goats could grasp the concept of a single channel that God is using to dispense spiritual food for obedient mankind? Matthew 25: 32 |
| Re: Discussion on Doctrine between a Christian and a Jehovah's Witness by johnw47: 4:25am On Jun 03, 2019 |
deception-lies of the false jw's so called jehovah's witnesses are taught to lie but to then lie about lying in the may 1st, 1957 watchtower, in the article, "use theocratic war strategy" they call their lying "theocratic war strategy" of course you won't find it in the bible evil as they are, just like their daddy, john 8:44 and doesn't it show that they are taught to lie lie begets lie, and boy do they beget, ![]() taking after the devil their god and father of lies |
| Re: Discussion on Doctrine between a Christian and a Jehovah's Witness by Nobody: 6:15am On Jun 03, 2019 |
Which of these six titles perfectly fits this thread? ¤Discusion on Doctrine between two Christians! ¤Discussion on Doctrine between two believers! ¤Discussion on Doctrine between two scholars! ¤Discussion on Doctrine between a ECWA member and one of Jehovah's Witnesses! Discussion on Doctrine between a Christian and a Jehovah's Witness! Discussion on Doctrine between a TRUE Christian and a MISINFORMED religionist! Of course a honesthearted and sincere observer will notice the best title that perfectly fits this thread after thoroughly considering the consistency of *PRESENTATIONS! Act 2:14 *ATTITUDE! Titus 3:2 *FREENESS OF SPEECH! Act 4:13 *RESPECT! Colossians 4:6 *CALMNESS! 1Peter 3:15 *SURETY! Colossians 2:2 from the two debators! (1)Shadeyinka{ECWA} and (2)Maximus{JW} |
| Re: Discussion on Doctrine between a Christian and a Jehovah's Witness by johnw47: 6:25am On Jun 03, 2019 |
Maximus69:lying pharisee false jw nails max the one out of six titles that perfectly fits this thread is: Discussion on Doctrine between a TRUE Christian and a MISINFORMED religionist!(which of course is you max) i know i have hit a sore point with you you love to lie, but you hate being shown up for your lies, but that's the price a false jw liar has to pay johnw47: |
| Re: Discussion on Doctrine between a Christian and a Jehovah's Witness by Nobody: 6:50am On Jun 03, 2019 |
johnw47:OK! The best title should have been ¤Discussion on Doctrine between a TRUE Christian and a MISINFORMED religionist! And going by your own HONEST and SINCERE observation, the misinformed religionist is Maximus{JW} Hmmm, that's noted. Thanks for the contribution Sir, God bless you! ![]() |
| Re: Discussion on Doctrine between a Christian and a Jehovah's Witness by Jozzy4: 11:29am On Jun 03, 2019 |
Emusan:After have told you its about ressurectiom, you still type this thrash That the Dead rise means what ? |
| Re: Discussion on Doctrine between a Christian and a Jehovah's Witness by Jozzy4: 11:36am On Jun 03, 2019 |
Emusan:Big tyme trash , first position yet others are Sons BEFORE him . right ? The world was made through the Son, deal with it @ uncreated word, Lolz , uncreated can be the beginning of creation right? ![]() |
| Re: Discussion on Doctrine between a Christian and a Jehovah's Witness by Jozzy4: 11:39am On Jun 03, 2019 |
Maximus69:Those guys are enemy of Jesus ransom, always rendering it invalid with their human tradition. |
| Re: Discussion on Doctrine between a Christian and a Jehovah's Witness by Nobody: 11:50am On Jun 03, 2019 |
Jozzy4:They publicly declare they know God but deny him even with their tongue! Mark 7:6-7 Jesus died so that we might live, it was after his death that God declared us free of the guilt of Adamic sin, yet some are claiming that people who died and were buried have been living even before Jesus paid the price! ![]() Instead of humbly asking to know what Jesus meant by his statement, they felt those CAREFULLY studying his words to grasp all his parables are evildoers! ![]() |
| Re: Discussion on Doctrine between a Christian and a Jehovah's Witness by Janosky: 6:08pm On Jun 03, 2019 |
nutarious:Acts15:1-12,18-31 the first century Christians were robots, they looked up to the body of apostles and Elders in Jerusalem to make decisions for everyone of them. They ALL had "same line, same thought ,no personal opinions". *** 1 Cor1:10 " Now I urge you brothers through the name of our lord Jesus Christ that you should ALL speak in agreement..... that you may be completely united in the same mind and in the same line of thought" *Phil 2:2 " Make my joy full by being of the same mind and having the same love being completely united, having the one thought in mind" Apostle Paul confirmed you're a LIAR and Pharisee , you're just dey form say you be Christian. But ,You're NOT ! |
| Re: Discussion on Doctrine between a Christian and a Jehovah's Witness by nutarious(f): 10:26pm On Jun 03, 2019 |
Janosky: Janosky:Robot quoting scripts that suits him/her. Once a Robot always a Robot. Is This also applicable to your Robotic Organisation? Acts 13:1-2 Now there were in the church that was at Antioch certain prophets and teachers; as Barnabas, and Simeon that was called Niger, and Lucius of Cyrene, and Manaen, which had been brought up with Herod the tetrarch, and Saul. As they ministered to the Lord, and fasted, the Holy Ghost said, Separate me Barnabas and Saul for the work whereunto I have called them. By their Fruit we shall no them. Romans 8:14, 16-17 For as many as are led by the Spirit of God, they are the sons of God. The Spirit itself beareth witness with our spirit, that we are the children of God: And if children, then heirs; heirs of God, and joint-heirs with Christ; if so be that we suffer with him, that we may be also glorified together. The Devil is the master Programmer, he did a good Job with you guys. John 8:44 Ye are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father ye will do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and abode not in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaketh a lie, he speaketh of his own: for he is a liar, and the father of it. Once a Robot, always a Robot. |
| Re: Discussion on Doctrine between a Christian and a Jehovah's Witness by Janosky: 4:12pm On Jun 04, 2019 |
nutarious:** Acts 13:1,2 is a true description of Jehovah's witnesses According to "nutarious": # "Same line, same thought no personal study, no personal opinion etc A Robot is a coded machine............ Same is Jehovah Witness." Nutarious, why you dey disgrace yourself with your LIES on NL? You quoted Acts13:1,2 where Barnabas, Lucius,Manaen, Simeon and Saul had "same line,same thought" to following the direction from the holy spirit. *-** Nutarious, I challenge you to name one disciple in Acts 13:1,2 who had personal opinions independent of the holy spirit? Every honest hearted person can now see that , according to Nutarious, Jesus disciples were "robots" like Jehovah's witnesses and rightly qualified to be called children of God. Nutarious is a notorious Pharisee notable for falsehood and lie lie. **** JWs bear witness to the truth like Jesus Christ and his disciples. John 18:37. John17:17. |
| Re: Discussion on Doctrine between a Christian and a Jehovah's Witness by Nobody: 6:10pm On Jun 04, 2019 |
The bible vs Jehovah witness In 1870, at the age of eighteen, an ex-Congregationalist by the name of Charles Taze Russell started a Bible class in Pittsburgh. In 1876, the class elected Russell as their Pastor. He founded the "Herald of the Morning" in 1879, which eventually developed into what is known today as "The Watchtower Announcing Jehovah's Kingdom." Today this publication has grown to over seventeen million copies per month in over one hundred languages. In 1884, Russell incorporated the "Zion's Watch Tower Tract Society" at Pittsburgh. Today this organization has branches in over one hundred countries, and it has missionary works in over two hundred and fifty. With over one-half million volunteer workers, the Jehovah's Witnesses have become a serious threat to Bible believers throughout the world. Russell died in 1916, and Judge J.F. Rutherford took over the Society's leadership. It was under Rutherford's leadership that the group took the name "Jehovah's Witnesses," and Society headquarters moved to Brooklyn. Rutherford died in 1942, and Nathan Knorr took control and boosted the membership to over two million. In 1961 the Society published its own "translation" of the scriptures, called "The New World Translation of the Holy Scriptures." Knorr died in 1977, and Frederick Franz took over the leadership of the Watchtower Society. Franz is the current leader of the Jehovah's Witnesses (1991). Rather than bore ourselves with the corrupt history of the Watchtower Bible and Tract Society, we shall get straight to the main issue at hand: What does the Bible say about their DOCTRINES? The true Bible-believer realizes that the primary purpose for the Lord giving us the Scriptures is DOCTRINE (2 Tim. 3:16), and we are supposed to KNOW sound doctrine from false doctrine. Many have departed from the faith and have given themselves over to "doctrines of devils" (1 Tim. 4:1), and it is our Christian duty to check these people and arm ourselves against their false teachings. The main false doctrines taught by the "JW's" (Henceforth used to abbreviate "Jehovah's Witnesses" are as follows: (1) that God is not a Trinity, (2) that Jesus Christ did not physically rise from the dead, (3) that there will be no literal and physical Second Coming of Christ, and (4) that there will be no place of eternal torment for the wicked. These are the major heresies taught by the JW's, and we shall examine each of these in light of God's pure and preserved words. Let us begin with a look at the Trinity.Is God A Trinity? According the Bible, God is a Triune Being. As all humans are a trinity (soul, body, and spirit--1 Ths. 5:23), God is also a Trinity. In Genesis 1:26, God said, "Let us make man in our image. . ." In Genesis 11:7, God said, ". . . .let us go down, and there confound their language. . ." The terms "us" and "our" obviously refer to the Holy Trinity. So the Trinity is found in the very early chapters of the Bible. In the New Testament, we can see all three Members of the Trinity at the Baptism of Jesus in Matthew chapter three. God the Father is speaking from Heaven. God the Son is being baptized, and God the Holy Ghost is descending like a dove. When Jesus gave the Great Commission in Matthew 28:18-20, He said in verse 19, "Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost." 1 John 5:7 tells us that there are THREE that bear record in Heaven: ". . . the Father, the Word, and the Holy Ghost: and these three are one." (The "Word" is Christ according to John 1:1-3, 14, and 1 John 1:1-3.) God is a Trinity. He isn't three Gods, like the JW's accuse us of believing, but He is ONE Triune God. The pagans who worshipped three gods did so because they knew from observing the creation that God must be in some way associated with the number "THREE." They never fully understood the Holy Trinity, but you must admit that they came much closer than the JW's. As a man is a soul, a body, and a spirit, God the Father is the Soul of the Trinity, God the Son is the Body, and God the Holy Ghost is the Spirit. According to Psalm 19:1 and Romans 1:20, God's creation actually declares the Trinity doctrine. One can see PROOF of the Trinity everywhere in the universe. The universe consists of three parts: Time, Space, and Matter. Time consists of three parts: Past, Present, and Future. Space consists of three parts: Length, Width, and Height. Matter consists of three parts: Energy, Motion, and Phenomena. There are three heavens in 2 Cor. 12:2, and on earth there are three forms of life: Man, Plant, and Animal. These forms of life are found in three places: Land, Sea, and Air. God is continually showing us through His creation that He is a Trinity. A perfect example of this is the sun. The sun has three kinds of rays: chemical rays, light rays, and heat rays. Chemical rays cannot be seen or felt, but they can be very powerful. When one receives a sunburn, it is from the sun's chemical rays. This is a type of God the Father. Light rays are sometimes visible to the human eye. This is a type of Jesus Christ, the "light of the world" (John 8:12) and the "Sun of righteousness" (Mal.4:2). Heat rays are a type of the Holy Ghost for they bring comfort to us by warming our bodies, just as the Holy Ghost, the Comforter (John 16:7), brings comfort to us. So one can clearly see that God's word and God's creation both testify to the fact that He is a Trinity. However, some people aren't getting the message. The book, "Let God Be True", (Watchtower Bible & Tract Soc., 1952) says the following on page 92: "The trinity doctrine was not conceived by Jesus or the early Christians." Then on page 93, this book says: "...the plain truth is that this is another of Satan's attempts to keep the God-fearing person from learning the truth of Jehovah and His Son Jesus Christ." On page 102 of the 1946 edition of "Let God Be True," the JW's make a very blasphemous statement concerning the Holy Trinity: "...Sincere persons who want to know the true God and serve Him find it a bit difficult to love and worship a complicated, freakish looking, three-headed God." Such a remark is entirely uncalled for and is a blank misrepresentation of what Christians really believe about the Trinity. The JW's cannot UNDERSTAND the Trinity, so they CONDEMN the Trinity. They fail to realize that it is not our job to tell God WHAT HE IS or to even FULLY UNDERSTAND how He can exist. Our responsibility is to BELIEVE WHAT HE SAYS, AS HE SAYS IT, WHERE HE SAYS IT, WITHOUT CHANGING A SINGLE WORD! The Scriptures already presented in this study clearly show that God is a Trinity. Your responsibility is NOT to attempt reasoning out the eternal decrees of God in your small finite mind. Your responsibility is to BELIEVE WHAT GOD SAYS. Now either you DO, or you DON'T. The JW's DON'T. The JW's believe that Jehovah is God the Father, and that Jesus Christ and the Holy Ghost are not God. They're wrong. The Bible tells us that Jesus Christ and the Holy Ghost are both Deity. Jesus Christ Is Deity As the Second Member of the Trinity, Jesus Christ stands co-existent in Eternity with God the Father and God the Holy Spirit. There are many proofs in the scriptures for the Deity of Christ. |
| Re: Discussion on Doctrine between a Christian and a Jehovah's Witness by Nobody: 6:16pm On Jun 04, 2019 |
We shall now list several of them. (1) In Zechariah 12:10, Jehovah speaks of the future return of Christ and says, ". . . They shall look upon me whom they have pierced, and they shall mourne for him, as one mourneth for his only son . . . ." This is spoken again in Revelation 1:7, which is clearly a reference to Christ Himself, but in Zechariah 12:10 GOD said, ". . . They shall look upon me whom they have pierced . . . ." The One that they pierced was Jesus Christ! So, in Zechariah 12:10, God is saying that He is Jesus Christ. (2) In John 1:1, John 1:14, 1 John 1:1, and in 1 John 5:7, Jesus is called "the Word," and John 1:1 says that "the Word was God." (3) Thomas referred to Jesus as "My Lord and my God" in John 20:28, and Jesus did not see the need to correct him. (4) Isaiah 7:14 gives us the prophecy of the Virgin Birth of Christ and states that His name would be "Immanuel." Matthew 1:23 tells us that this word means "God with us." (5) In Isaiah 9:6, Jesus is called "Wonderful, Counsellor, The mighty God, The everlasting Father, The Prince of Peace." The Bible certainly would not say this about anyone less than God. (6) In John 10:30, Jesus says, "I and my Father are one." Jesus is not a lesser god; He is ONE with the Father. (7) Micah 5:2 tells us that Jesus is "from everlasting." ( In John 8:58, Jesus tells the Pharisees, "Before Abraham was, I am." He claimed to be the "I AM" of Exodus 3:14, which is God Almighty.(9) Jesus allowed others to worship Him (John 9:38; Matt. 14:33; and Luke 24:52), which was forbidden, unless He was God (Rev. 22:9). (10) Jesus forgave sins (Mark 2:5), which only God can do (Mark 2:7). (11) The Lord Jesus Christ is omnipresent (Matt. 18:20; 28:20; II Cor. 13:14; I John 5:7). We know He is God because He is capable of being everywhere at once. (12) Jesus is omniscient (Mark 11:2-6; Matt. 12:40). He is God because He knows all things. (13) The Lord Jesus is also omnipotent (Rev. 19:6; Matt. 28:18). He has all power. (14) According to John 1, 1 John 1, Colossians 1, and Hebrews 1, Jesus Christ is the Creator of Genesis 1! (15) Jesus never sinned! Romans 3:23 says that ALL HAVE SINNED and come short of the glory of God, but Jesus did not sin (2 Cor. 5:21; 1 Peter 3:18). So Jesus had to be God. Now, if you've taken time to check these references, then the Holy Spirit has attempted to show you one great truth: The LORD JESUS CHRIST IS GOD. That much is clear to any honest Bible student. The Jehovah's Witnesses are not honest Bible students. One only has to pick up a copy of their "New World Translation of the Holy Scriptures" to see how dishonest and unfaithful they are with God's word. We shall list a few examples of how the New World Translation ATTACKS the Deity of the Lord Jesus Christ: (1) It changes Zechariah 12:10 to read, ". . . they will certainly look to the one whom they pierced. . . ." (2) John 1:1 in the N.W.T. says that "the Word was a god," instead of "the Word was God." The definite article "the" is replaced with "a," and the capital "G" is replaced with a lower case "g." The last half of 1 John 5:7 is omitted in the N.W.T., because it says that the Father, the Word (which is Christ in John 1:14), and the Holy Ghost "are one." (3) The Virgin Birth is attacked in Isaiah 7:14 of the N.W.T. by translating "maiden," instead of "virgin," even though Matthew 1:23 TOLD THEM that it should read "virgin!" The JW's will attack anyone or anything associated with the Lord Jesus Christ. (4) They change "from everlasting" in Micah 5:2 to read, "time indefinite," which is not the same at all. (5) John 8:58 is where Christ said, "Before Abraham was, I am." This matches God's statement to Moses in Exodus 3:14, meaning that Christ is God. However, the N.W.T. says, "Before Abraham came into existence, I have been." This destroys the valuable cross reference to Exodus 3:14. The JW's believe that Jesus was "a god" before the time of Abraham, but that He was NOT the "I AM" of Exodus 3:14. (6) In John 9:38, Matthew 14:33, and Luke 24:52, the JW's have replaced the word "worshipped" with the words "did obeisance," which is not the same (See Gen. 37:7, 43:28; Exodus 18:7; 2 Sam. 1:2; 2 Chr. 24:17). The matter is clear: the JW's will attack the Lord Jesus Christ every time they have a chance. Their "bible" proves it. Their WRITINGS also prove it. Here are a few blasphemous remarks made by the JW's over the years concerning the Lord Jesus Christ: ". . . he was the first and direct creation of Jehovah God" (The Kingdom is at Hand, p. 46, 47, 49). "If Jesus were God, then during Jesus' death, God was dead in the grave" (Let God Be True, p. 91). ". . . the true Scriptures speak of God's Son, the Word, as 'a god'." He is a "mighty god," but not the Almighty God, who is Jehovah" (The Truth Shall Make You Free, p. 47). "The very fact that he was sent proves he was not equal with God, but was less than God his father" (The Word: Who is He, p. 41). This is how a cult deals with the written word of God. HUMAN REASONING is the final authority of all cults. Rather than to take God at His word BY FAITH, a cultist will always REJECT God's word and attempt to reason things out for himself. All cults will ADD TO, SUBTRACT FROM, OR IGNORE the written revelation of God. For those of us who BELIEVE the scriptures, we are now well aware of the fact that Jesus Christ is God. Those who believe otherwise will have to CHANGE or IGNORE the Bible, because the Bible testifies of none other than the Lord Jesus Christ Himself (John 5:39). The Holy Ghost Is Deity The JW's believe that the Holy Ghost is only "God's active force." They deny the scriptural teaching that the Holy Ghost is a Member of the Holy Trinity: "The Scriptures themselves unite to show that God's holy spirit is not a person but is God's active force by which he accomplishes his purpose and executes his will" (Aid to Bible Understanding, pg. 1543). "The Holy Spirit is the invisible active force of Almighty God that moves his servants to do his will" (Let God Be True, pg. 108). Not only do the JW's deny the DEITY of the Holy Spirit, they even deny that He is a person. So, in this sense, Satan has been exalted ABOVE the Holy Ghost by the JW's! The reason given by the JW's for the personality of Satan is that: ". . . the Bible calls Satan a manslayer, a liar, a father (in a spiritual sense) and a ruler. (John 8:44, 14:30) Only an intelligent person could fit all those descriptions." (See "Awake!", December 8, 1973) We agree, but how can any honest person say that and then DENY the personality of the Holy Ghost? The Holy Ghost ALSO has attributes that only a PERSON can have. For example: (1) Only a person could SPEAK, which the Holy Spirit does (Acts 2:11; 13:2; Rev. 2:7). (2) Only a person could TEACH and COMFORT (Jhn. 16:7, 13). (3) Only a person could have a MIND (Rom. 8:27). (4) Only a person could possess the POWER that the Holy Spirit possesses (Rom. 15:19). (5) Only a person could be INSULTED and GRIEVED (Heb. 10:29; Eph. 4:30). So the Holy Ghost certainly IS a Person, but more than that, He is GOD, the Third Member of the Holy Trinity. There are several scriptural proofs for the Deity of the Holy Ghost: (1) In Acts 5:3 Peter accuses Ananias of lying to the Holy Ghost, and then in verse four Peter tells him that he had lied unto GOD. The Holy Ghost is God. (2) The Holy Ghost says in Acts 13:2, "Separate me Barnabas and Saul for the work whereunto I have called them." GOD is the one who calls men to do His work (Rom. 8:28; Gal. 1:6; 1 Ths. 2:12; 4:7; 2 Ths. 2:13-14); so, the Holy Ghost is God. (3) Only God could perform all the great wonders that the Holy Ghost performs (Psa. 104:30; Jhn. 14:16, 26; 16:8-14; Job 33:4; 1 Cor. 6:11; Eph. 1:13; 4:30). (4) The Holy Ghost is God because blasphemy against Him shall not be forgiven (Mat. 12:31). (5) The Holy Ghost is God because He is ETERNAL (Heb. 9:14). (6) The Holy Ghost is God because He is OMNIPRESENT (Psa. 139:7- .(7) The Holy Ghost is God because He has the power to give life (John 3:6; 6:63). (9) The Scriptures are God's word, and 2 Peter 1:21 says that the Holy Ghost INSPIRED the Scriptures. Therefore the Holy Ghost is God. The Bible clearly reveals to us that the Holy Ghost is a Member of the Holy Trinity. To deny this truth is to openly deny God's word. The Trinity doctrine is a BIBLE doctrine. It is true that Satan has counterfeited the Trinity doctrine for many centuries in many pagan religions, but that doesn't change the truth. God's word declares that He is a Trinity, and it is our responsibility to BELIEVE it. Did Jesus Christ Rise Physically From the Dead? According to the JW's, He did not. The Bible speaks of a literal and physical resurrection, but the Watchtower Society teaches that Jesus only rose from the grave spiritually. Their literature speaks for itself: ". . . So the King Christ Jesus was put to death in the flesh and was resurrected an invisible spirit creature." (Let God Be True, pg. 138) "Therefore the bodies in which Jesus manifested himself to his disciples after his return to life were not the body in which he was nailed to a tree. They were merely materialized for the occasion, resembling on one or two occasions the body in which he died..." (The Kingdom Is At Hand, pg. 259) "Our Lord's human body . . . did not decay or corrupt . . . whether it was dissolved into gasses or whether it is still preserved somewhere . . . no one knows." (Studies In The Scriptures, Vol. 2, pg. 129) According to the words of Jesus Christ Himself, He is NOT merely a spirit being. He is a literal and physical risen Savior. In Luke chapter twenty-four, beginning at verse thirty-six, the disciples see the risen Christ and they supposed they had seen a spirit (vs. 37); but Jesus cleared the matter up for everyone when He said, ". . . Why are ye troubled? and why do thoughts arise in your hearts? Behold my hands and my feet, that it is I myself: handle me, and see; for a spirit hath not flesh and bones, as ye see me have." (Luk. 24:38-39) He then SHOWED them His hands and feet, and they believed. What did they believe? They believed that He was a literal and physical being in a literal and physical body. When Jesus appeared to Thomas He said, ". . . Reach hither thy finger, and behold my hands; and reach hither thy hand, and thrust it into my side: and be not faithless, but believing. " (Jhn. 20:27) The risen Christ had the crucifixion scars in His body to PROVE that He had been physically resurrected from the dead. If Jesus didn't rise physically then He lied in John 2:18-22 when He said that His "body" would rise in three days. He didn't say His spirit would rise. He said that His BODY would rise. When He arose His disciples actually REMEMBERED this prophecy and believed. Too bad the JW's can't do the same. The JW's claim that Jesus appeared in different bodies after His so-called "spiritual resurrection." Their "proof" for this is the fact that the Emmaus disciples didn't recognize Him in His resurrection body, so it couldn't have been the same body. That's nonsense. Luke 24:16 tells us why they didn't recognize Him. It had nothing to do with a spiritual body. The problem was their EYESIGHT: "But their eyes were holden that they should not know him." The bodily resurrection of Christ is a fundamental Bible doctrine. The salvation of a person's soul rests upon this doctrine, because if Jesus didn't physically rise from the dead AS HE SAID HE WOULD, then we're all lost and going to Hell according to 1 Corinthians 15:12-19 (JW's included). Will There Be A Literal and Physical Second Coming? If the Lord Jesus Christ was resurrected literally and physically from the dead, and if He appeared physically to His disciples, then His Second Coming must also be literal and physical. Acts 1:11 tells us that Jesus will return "in like manner as ye have seen him go into heaven." Jesus ascended into Heaven literally, physically, and visibly, so He will return "in like manner." The JW's deny this. They insist that the Second Coming of Christ will be SPIRITUAL, rather than literal and physical: "Christ Jesus comes, not again as a human, but as a glorious spirit person." (Let God Be True, pg. 196) "Since no earthly men have ever seen or can see the Father, they will be unable to see the glorified Son." (Let God Be True, pg. 197) "It is a settled Scriptural truth, therefore, that human eyes will not see him at his second coming, neither will he come in a fleshy body." (The Truth Shall Make You Free, pg. 295) The word of God says otherwise. Paul says in Titus 2:13 that we should be LOOKING for that blessed hope and the glorious APPEARING of the great God and our Savior Jesus Christ. If the JW's are right in saying that we will not be able to see Christ, then why did Paul tell us to be LOOKING for His APPEARING? The New World Translation has very conveniently removed the word "appearing" from Titus 2:13 and replaced it with "manifestation." The same has also been done in 1 Timothy 6:14, 2 Timothy 1:10, and 2 Timothy 4:8. (You can make the Bible teach ANYTHING if you just CHANGE THE WORDS!) Now we know that the Second Coming of Christ will NOT be a spiritual and invisible return. Revelation 1:7 says, "Behold, he cometh with clouds; and every eye shall see him, and they also which pierced him: and all kindreds of the earth shall wail because of him. Even so, Amen. " In Matthew 24:30, Jesus Himself says, "And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory. " Zechariah 14:4 says, "And his feet shall stand in that day upon the mount of Olives, which is before Jerusalem on the east, and the mount of Olives shall cleave in the midst thereof toward the east and toward the west, and there shall be a very great valley; and half of the mountain shall remove toward the north, and half of it toward the south. " The literal and physical feet of Luke 24:39 will literally STAND upon the literal, physical, and very visible mount of Olives. That's perfectly clear to anyone with reading ability. There's nothing spiritual or invisible about the Second Coming of Christ. The "clouds" will be literal (Rev. 1:7), as will the "fire" (2 Ths. 1: , the "saints" (1 Ths. 3:13), the "mountains and rocks" (Rev. 6:16), and, of course, the thousand-year reign (Rev. 20:1-7). A "spiritual" or "invisible" Second Coming is totally foreign to the written revelation of God.Now, it is also noteworthy to point out that the JW's have quite a record when it comes to DATING the Second Coming. Listed below are five separate instances where the JW's have predicted the Second Coming and missed: (1) In 1897, a book titled "The Battle of Armageddon" stated on page seventy-five that Jesus' Second Coming had ALREADY HAPPENED INVISIBLY in the year 1874, and the Watchtower publication re-stated this in the September 15th issue of 1922 and also in the January 1st issue of 1924. (2) On January 15th, 1892, the Watchtower claimed that Armageddon began in 1874 and would end in 1914. This became quite an embarrassment for the JW's because 1914 was the beginning of World War I! (3) The book Millions Now Living Will Never Die claimed that the year 1925 would actually bring about the return of Abraham, Isaac, Jacob and the faithful prophets of old. Page eighty-nine of this book claimed that "the earthly phase of the kingdom shall be recognized." However, when the January 1, 1925, issue of the Watchtower was published, it said, "This may be accomplished. It may not be." (4) The December Watchtower for 1941 claimed that World War II would turn America and England into dictatorships, that the end of Nazi rule would mark the end of demon rule , and that God would rule when the Nazis were defeated. (5) In 1942, the JW's were still talking about Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob returning "any day now!" ( Consolation , May 27, 1942, Pg. 13) So the Watchtower Society will continue right along with it's foolish date setting--keeping it's members in constant fear and confusion. It is true that the Bible gives us many definite signs which indicate the Lord's return is getting very near, but no one knows the day nor the hour (Mat. 24:36). |
| Re: Discussion on Doctrine between a Christian and a Jehovah's Witness by Nobody: 6:17pm On Jun 04, 2019 |
Is Hell A Literal Fiery Place? The JW's have traditionally believed and taught that there is no eternal punishment for the wicked: ". . . the Bible hell is mankind's common grave..." (Let God Be True, pg. 92. Page ninety-eight of this book refers to the doctrine of Hell as a "God defaming doctrine." ) "The doctrine of a burning hell where the wicked are tortured eternally after death cannot be true . . . ." (Let God Be True , pg. 99) We call it to the reader's attention that it was none other than the Lord Jesus Christ who first used the term "hell fire" (Mat. 5:22), and it was Jesus Christ who said in Matthew 25:41, ". . . Depart from me, ye cursed, into everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his angels." When the JW's attack the Hell doctrine they are attacking the very words of Christ. A JW believes that Hell is only the grave that everyone goes to at death. He believes that the saved ones in the graves will be given eternal life on earth after the White Throne Judgment of Revelation 20:11-15, while the unsaved in the graves will be annihilated once and for all in the Lake of Fire. JW's refuse to believe that God will punish the wicked forever in the Lake of Fire. Of course, the Scriptures say something entirely different: (1) There is no FIRE in the grave, but there certainly is fire in the "hell" of the Bible (Luk. 16:23; Deu. 32:22; Mat. 5:22; 18:9; Jas. 3:6). (2) No one PRAYS from the grave, but they certainly do in Hell (Luk. 16:24; Jon. 2:2). (3) Hell was originally made for the Devil and his angels (Mat. 25:41), but the grave was not. (4) A Christian's SOUL does not go to the grave at death (Phi. 1:21-23; 2 Cor. 5:1-10; 1 Ths. 5:10). Only the BODY goes to the grave. An unsaved man's body also goes to the grave at death, but his SOUL goes to a place of TORMENT and FLAMES (Luk. 16:22-23). (5) The grave cannot possibly be Hell because Jesus said it would be better to enter into life (eternal life) without a hand, a foot, or an eye, than to go to Hell (Mat. 18:8-9). How could it be "better" if Hell is only the grave where there is no suffering at all? According to Jesus Christ, Hell is a lot WORSE than losing a hand, a foot, or an eye forever. (6) Annihilation cannot be true because the Bible uses such terms as "shame and everlasting contempt" (Dan. 12:2) and "torment . . . forever" (Rev. 14:11). Shame and torment are sufferings that are experienced by a LIVING BEING, not an annihilated corpse. God is an ETERNAL Being; therefore, an eternal payment is required for sin (Mar. 9:44-48; Isa. 66:22-23). You can have a FAIR TRIAL, or you can have a FREE PARDON. In a fair trial before God, you will be eternally damned to Hell because you are a sinner against a Holy God. God will have no choice but to sentence you to Hell forever. If you are wise you will receive God's FREE PARDON. Jesus Christ has ALREADY paid for your sins, but you must RECEIVE Him as Savior. John 1:12 says, "But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name: " Friend, have you ever turned from your sins and received the Lord Jesus Christ as your Savior? The Bible says, "For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life." (Jhn. 3:16) Many have the idea that our good works can save us and get us into Heaven, but the Bible says this isn't so: "As it is written, There is none righteous, no, not one:" (Rom. 3:10) "For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God;" (Rom. 3:23) "For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: Not of works, lest any man should boast." (Eph. 2:8-9) We have no really "good" works, because we're all SINNERS by nature. We were born into this world as sinners (Psa. 51:5), and this is why Jesus said we must be "born again" (Jhn. 3:3). This new birth is given to us freely, and was made possible when Christ died and shed His blood at Calvary for our sins. By receiving Jesus Christ as your Savior, trusting Him alone to save you, you can be born again. You can have eternal life TODAY by faith in Jesus Christ. Romans 10:13 says, "For whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved." Romans 10:9-10 says, "That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved. For with the heart man believeth unto righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation. " Friend, why not turn from your sins right now and call upon the Lord to save your soul? Receive Jesus Christ as your Savior and serve Him faithfully until He returns. If you've received Christ as your Savior, then we urge you to follow the Lord in baptism, and we also advise you to find a good Bible-believing church and join it. Don't allow such false teachers as the Jehovah's Witnesses to lead you astray! If we can assist you in any way, please contact us. If you need more information about salvation, please write and ask for a copy of Understanding God's Salvation Plan. Copyright © 1991 James L. Melton |
| Re: Discussion on Doctrine between a Christian and a Jehovah's Witness by Nobody: 6:39pm On Jun 04, 2019 |
what does it mean to be born of the spirit? John 3:5-6 Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God. That which is born of the flesh is flesh; and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit. Jesus while talking to nicodemus pass on a spiritual truth about the reality of God's kingdom i.e entering into God's kingdom. one must needs undergo a second birth to be part of it. Jesus further said that which is born of the flesh is flesh and that which is born of the spirit is spirit. Jesus was describing two nature 1. is the earthly nature 2. God's nature. humans are spirits living in the flesh but through the sin of Adam has lost the spiritual nature of God as a result are ruled by sin which leads unto death. but those who are born of the spirit regain the lost nature of God, their spirit man transforms into the image of God. to be spirit in the context of John 3vv6 only mean to carry, bear share of the spirit's nature not to be a spirit laterally. |
| Re: Discussion on Doctrine between a Christian and a Jehovah's Witness by Nobody: 7:21pm On Jun 04, 2019 |
solite3:May God bless you for this lengthy write-up Sir! So now can you go to your neighbours to preach and teach them all of this just as Jehovah's Witnesses are known to be doing globally with burning zeal? ![]() Because they're the ONE and ONLY group that has dedicated their lives for the preaching and teaching work, and it will amount to failure on your part if you and all your folks who believe all that you typed up there can't beat them in the field of selfless evangelism! ![]() |
| Re: Discussion on Doctrine between a Christian and a Jehovah's Witness by nutarious(f): 7:59pm On Jun 04, 2019 |
Maximus69:Robot! Cloned by an Organisation |
| Re: Discussion on Doctrine between a Christian and a Jehovah's Witness by Nobody: 8:53pm On Jun 04, 2019 |
nutarious:That's my REAL name Sir! I am NOW cloned to live my life for someone else{ 2Corinthians 5:15} So if you carefully observe all those living their lives for just one single role model, of course they must act as robots in the face of all those who are still living for themselves! 1Peter 4:4-5 That is why all those who have agreed to live there lives in HARMONY with the role model are GROUPING themselves together as one happy global family of CLONED ROBOTS! 1Corinthians 1:10, Philippians 2:2 Ephesians 4:3 Hence they are ORGANISED as one! Ephesians 4:5 ![]() |
| Re: Discussion on Doctrine between a Christian and a Jehovah's Witness by Nobody: 9:26pm On Jun 04, 2019 |
Maximus69:Jehovah witness organisation is an antichrist organisation 1 John 2:18 Little children, it is the last time: and as ye have heard that antichrist shall come, even now are there many antichrists; whereby we know that it is the last time. 2 John 1:7 For many deceivers are entered into the world, who confess not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh. This is a deceiver and an antichrist. Jehovah witness denies that Jesus is come in the flesh, they believe Jesus is a spirit creature. |
| Re: Discussion on Doctrine between a Christian and a Jehovah's Witness by Nobody: 9:29pm On Jun 04, 2019 |
Maximus69:you are being duped. Jehovah witness organisation is not in the bible, Jesus does not enslave anybody. |
| Re: Discussion on Doctrine between a Christian and a Jehovah's Witness by Nobody: 9:43pm On Jun 04, 2019 |
solite3:Jesus does not enslave anybody! But Paul SLAVED for Jesus! Romans 1:1, Colossians 3:24 James SLAVED for Jesus! Jude 1 So please tell me Sir, who is lying between Paul,Jude and You? ![]() |
| Re: Discussion on Doctrine between a Christian and a Jehovah's Witness by nutarious(f): 10:38pm On Jun 04, 2019 |
Maximus69:Good, at least you agreed you are a Robot. Don't worry about the scripture quoting its part about your cloning, we are used to it. So Robot, this Organisation that cloned you is not even upto 300 years Old. Its just like Muhammad telling us about Jesus after 600years later. @least on the last day, you have no excuse with all the brothers trying their best to Help you. Don't worry quoting me, I don't respond to Robot. |
| Re: Discussion on Doctrine between a Christian and a Jehovah's Witness by Nobody: 4:54am On Jun 05, 2019 |
Maximus69:did they tell you they were enslaved by Jesus? |
| Re: Discussion on Doctrine between a Christian and a Jehovah's Witness by Nobody: 7:05am On Jun 05, 2019 |
To who was this post addressed? ![]() Hope you're not talking to a robot ? ![]() nutarious:@least nobody SEE any of your so called INVISIBLE brothers trying their best to help people know what Jesus commanded in their homes! James 2:18-26 ![]() The ONE and ONLY blissful brotherhood recognised globally are Jehovah's Witnesses or sorry Robots who have lesser flair for material things in order to go out incessantly to HELP their neighbours know what Jesus commanded! Matthew 24:14, 28:19-20 ![]() God bless you Sir! |
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In John 8:58, Jesus tells the Pharisees, "Before Abraham was, I am." He claimed to be the "I AM" of Exodus 3:14, which is God Almighty.