SaintBeehot:
you've stated
Etrusen, I see no reason why even a blind man should ask such question, because it's stated on almost 70% of the post TAO11 has commented on.

AreaFada2:

The minute Ikwerre associate with Benin in any form, both East and West begin to attack them. It's no secret.

samuk:


Over fifty tribes up to Ghana claims Benin ancestry, it's about time for reunification. After over 100 years of the destruction of Benin and forceful claims of her people by Igbo and Yoruba, these people are beginning to fight back and establishing links to their ancestral land.

samuk:


You are still lying all over nairaland, the current Ooni of Ife traces Oduduwa/Ooni lineage to Egypt and the ancient Egyptian God Osiris. You are not from Ife, which indigenous Ife accounts says Oduduwa was Ife/Yoruba man.

samuk:
[s]The fact that Tao lies 100% doesn't make her lies true. Tao is not from Ife and the current Ooni traces Oduduwa (which was a mythical figure) and Ooni lineage to Egyptian God Osiris.[/s]

samuk:
[s]You are still lying all over nairaland, the current Ooni of Ife traces Oduduwa/Ooni lineage to Egypt and the ancient Egyptian God Osiris. You are not from Ife,[/s] which indigenous Ife accounts says Oduduwa was Ife/Yoruba man.

tollyboy5:

I don't know about that but people who know even little about African history knows about Egyptian conquest and mass migration to other Africa path. I don't want to talk about osiris I'll invite some people that are knowledgeable in my next thread.
These ones are just hyping ife for nothing they've overwhelmed their brain with different apologist document written to hype IFE . Yoruba and ijebu has similar ancestors that migrated to southwest but the apologist historians has been bending lies from ages.
Now Oduduwa is from ife but legend have it that he couldn't speak Yoruba.
Im going to deal with this liars in my next thread since I'm also Yoruba. Someone is quoting some scientific stuff to back up ignorance.
you're giving scientist a scientific prove of your ignorance. Stay tuned I'll invite one of my scientist friend to my next thread. We need some people to be humbled.
Even in the research world some prehistoric event are always stated with care, these ones are stating apologist compilation from some ignorant historian. I might not be a very good historian but as a scientist its enough to debunk some unnecessary tales.
She's already shifting the goal post. Even calling me impostor
I've invited them all to my town at epe but they're scared

tollyboy5:
Samuk ive read all the yeye link of evidence. And noticed even the historians don't know where the oduduwa group came from
Even the other settlement has no ancestral root.

Just ask the simple question again and see how they'll post irrelevant data to read unnecessary story.

The context lack basic logic.
Question
1. Where did oduduwa came from?
2. What ancestor ?
3.What people?
Answer
Slflflcclcoco. lcldldlclcxlflclcfclclccclflfl.....
Flflfflfldcdk 1985 fkflfflfkdldhsjsejsjdjsjejdk
Dkdkdkdldfff Mr dkdkdkdk 1834 flffl......

I've wonder how simple question turn to story with no answer.
Abi maybe people were created in the Niger area
Shame on we Africans. The Yoruba history we were thought said oduduwa was from middle-east also.
It shows all recent apologist history has no sensible prove of the group of people oduduwa decended from.
We'll destroy all the historical liars. See someone calling me impostor . see awori is calling impostor.
Awori 4 dat mata I don't have anything to sey. Awori that I know very well won't hesitate to bend history for money.

tollyboy5:
Samuk ive read all the yeye link of evidence. And noticed even the historians don't know where the oduduwa group came from
Even the other settlement has no ancestral root.

Just ask the simple question again and see how they'll post irrelevant data to read unnecessary story.

The context lack basic logic.
Question
1. Where did oduduwa came from?
2. What ancestor ?
3.What people?
Answer
Slflflcclcoco. lcldldlclcxlflclcfclclccclflfl.....
Flflfflfldcdk 1985 fkflfflfkdldhsjsejsjdjsjejdk
Dkdkdkdldfff Mr dkdkdkdk 1834 flffl......

I've wonder how simple question turn to story with no answer.
Abi maybe people were created in the Niger area
Shame on we Africans. The Yoruba history we were thought said oduduwa was from middle-east also.
It shows all recent apologist history has no sensible prove of the group of people oduduwa decended from.
We'll destroy all the historical liars. See someone calling me impostor . see awori is calling impostor.
Awori 4 dat mata I don't have anything to sey. Awori that I know very well won't hesitate to bend history for money.

tollyboy5:

I don't know about that but people who know even little about African history knows about Egyptian conquest and mass migration to other Africa path. I don't want to talk about osiris I'll invite some people that are knowledgeable in my next thread.
These ones are just hyping ife for nothing they've overwhelmed their brain with different apologist document written to hype IFE . Yoruba and ijebu has similar ancestors that migrated to southwest but the apologist historians has been bending lies from ages.
Now Oduduwa is from ife but legend have it that he couldn't speak Yoruba.
Im going to deal with this liars in my next thread since I'm also Yoruba. Someone is quoting some scientific stuff to back up ignorance.
you're giving scientist a scientific prove of your ignorance. Stay tuned I'll invite one of my scientist friend to my next thread. We need some people to be humbled.
Even in the research world some prehistoric event are always stated with care, these ones are stating apologist compilation from some ignorant historian. I might not be a very good historian but as a scientist its enough to debunk some unnecessary tales.
She's already shifting the goal post. Even calling me impostor
I've invited them all to my town at epe but they're scared

TAO11:
@Tollyboy5, did you forget that you’ve already being exposed as an impostor?

Stop claiming to be Ijebu when you couldn’t even translate two basic Ijebu words, and you couldn’t find any member of your alleged Ijebu family who can.

Be proud of your inconsequential ancestors whoever they are, and stop claiming to be Ijebu.

My Ijebu people aren’t scummy as you’ve repeatedly proven yourself to be.

Cheers!

NB: Remember you never miss any opportunity to want to prove to be Ijebu. So, I wonder what changed with those two Ijebu words. LMAO

Cc: Cc: gomojam, talktrue1234, reallest, SaintBeehot, Balogunodua, Gratefulheart1, DenreleDave, Amujale, babtoundey.

TAO11:
@Tollyboy5’s reasoning:
I would accept sky-descent, creation, or even evolution; provided the geographical area in question is the Middle-East.

What my mind is never going to accept is if the same thing is claimed to have happened within Africa.
——————————
@Samuk’s reasoning:
I would accept the statement of the reigning Ooni even if such statement is his personal fancy which he never claimed to be an indigenous IFE narration.

What my mind is never going to accept are contrary peer-reviewed academic and scholarly statements published years before he became king and directly stated to be an indigenous IFE narration.

NB: Moreover, even this statement of his doesn’t mention anywhere in the video that Ooni-ship descended from Osiris/Egypt.

Rather, his statement here, as shown plainly in this video, is the direct opposite of that. To quote is words: “... Ooni ... become [sic] Osiris ...”


Cc: gomojam, talktrue1234, reallest, SaintBeehot, Balogunodua, Gratefulheart1, DenreleDave, Amujale, babtoundey.

samuk:
[s]So the Ooni who is supposed to be the custodian of Yoruba and Ife culture is talking garbage and living in a fantasy world according to Tao.

So it's Ooni personal fantasy or fancy to link Ooni to Egypt according to Tao

Every notable traditional rulers that claims links to the mythical Oduduwa agree that he was a foreigner to Ife, the current Ooni, his immediate predecessor, the current Oba of Benin and his father all agree the mythical Oduduwa was a none native of Ife.

Both literate and illiterate Yoruba were either taught at school or Oral history that Oduduwa was from the middle east.

But Tao wants everyone to burn all history books written since the 1800s saying the mythical Oduduwa was not from Ife and accept her almighty 2010 scholarly work. This is not only desperation but an obsession with lies.

Maybe Tao should go to Ife and teach the Ooni his history.

This imposter that wants to be holier than the Pope and more Ife than the Ooni is not even from Ife.[/s]

Balogunodua:


Now I see how pained you're attacking her people just because she exposed you is a stale one....

Balogunodua:

You kept disturbing us with this never coming up thread of yours why not prove her wrong and stop wailing already...

Balogunodua:
Now I see how pained you're attacking her people just because she exposed you is a stale one....

TAO11:
@Tollyboy5’s reasoning:
I would accept sky-descent, creation, or even evolution; provided the geographical area in question is the Middle-East.

What my mind is never going to accept is if the same thing is claimed to have happened within Africa.
——————————

TAO11:
Samuk

No where in your video did the Ooni claim that Oonis descended from Osiris in Egypt.

His statement, instead, is the direct opposite — he claimed that Osiris of Egypt descended from Ooni.

In other words, he never claimed an Egyptian origin for Oduduwa contrary to what you’re fraudulently desperate to pass to your fellow gullible Binis.
————————

Moreover, the early 1800s story of a foreign roots for Oduduwa did not originate from within Yorubaland.

Rather, it originated for the first time in Hausaland from the stories of Sultan Bello of Sokoto. Your insecurity is so loud retard.

On the other hand, the historical account I cited originates from Ife; was published in a scholarly work much earlier than 2 0 1 0 [even though the year makes zero difference since the older contrary accounts originated from Hausaland rather than from Ife or anywhere in Yorubaland]; and it specifically makes it clear that Oduduwa is a Yoruba man from Ife. — please commit suicide.


Cc: gomojam, talktrue1234, reallest, SaintBeehot, Balogunodua, Gratefulheart1, DenreleDave, Amujale, babtoundey, scholes0

tollyboy5:
••• The fell from sky theory I introduce was to help you land at a particular junction since your whole historical broaha start and end in west Africa. Sarcastically meaning they fell from sky to west Africa. The east Africa has a more stronger research including the middle east, Though some might include legends and myth.

[s]But these legends and myth can't be discarded by scientist since they drop many jaw dropping evidence and mystical tablet and ornaments that'll make us think of an earlier civilisation on this planet.[/s] If you stand by your historians good luck, but we'll stand on more prevailing evidence until we get to the root of man.

You don't know about African history madam. There is no strong evidence of evolution in the African man.

But it doesn't change the east Africa migration to other part of Africa which you seriously go against through selective and bias historical base research.

Yes! That's why after stating some wrong figures and quotes you try getting the science related evidence to prove it.
Bye.

samuk:
So the Ooni claimed that the Egyptian God Osiris came from Ooni and the Ooni become Osiris when they die according to Tao.

Does this now mean Egyptians were from Ife?
Wonderful

No amount of insults can free you from this hole you put yourself

We have been variously told by the Yoruba that Oduduwa was

1. From the Sky
2. From Saudi Arabia
3. From Egypt
4. From Ife
5. From Benin
6. Egyptian God Osiris are now from Ooni

The Yoruba and Tao will not kill someone with their lies and confusions about Oduduwa origin on Nairaland

[s]You are parading yourself as nairaland historian, claiming to know Benin history more than the Benin themselves[/s] but you can't convince us on the correct origin of your mythical Oduduwa.

We are not going to accept a mere 2010 citations on the origin of Oduduwa, the most famous Yoruba figure.

What happened to all your 12th century Yufi, 14th century Ogane, 16th century Coptic and Arabic texts, 1765, 1845 and 1896 history of Yoruba books you qoute and references all over nairaland? Are you saying none of them say nothing about the Origin of Oduduwa or the Hausas wrote all these books.

TAO11:
Now I know you wish you didn’t bungle publicly. But unfortunately for you — you already did. Now I’m set to highlight it for you.

What you actually prayed wished that your source (the reigning Ooni) should have said is Ooni descended from Osiris so you can claim a foreign roots for Oduduwa.

What your source (the reigning Ooni) clearly said instead, from your own video, is Osiris descended from Ooni — the direct opposite.

So, stop deluding tricking you mind into believing that I said it. No, your own video said it — even though it turned out to be a boomerang.

Per your own source with which you sought, only to fail, to support a fallacy; yes!

Well, at no point did I insult you, I only made a statement of historical fact. I said your a slave of the Yoruba-Oba of Benin, and I have first hand report to back it up. Would you like to see it.

Yes, we have been told and by different non-Yoruba sources (except “4” sources) as well as one non-existent source. Let’s analyze:

“1”: This is not a historical account, but rather a mythical narrative intended to glamorize and deify the personality of Oduduwa.

The similitude of this in Benin mythical narrative is that a certain Igodo who is the progenitor of Benin’s first monarchy was supposed to have descended into Benin city from the sky.

However, the historical Benin narrative about him states that he is a real human being who came to rule over ‘Benin’ all the way from Ife.

“2”: & “3”: The Middle-East roots account originated with Sultan Bello of Soloto and has nothing to do with Yoruba indigenous account.

”4:” Yes, this account is an indigenous historical account emanating from Ife itself, and as such the only logically dependable account.

Interestingly (and sadly for you), there is no indigenous historical account which conflicts with it.

“5”: Yes, the Binis at some point for inferiority purposes came up with this, despite that fact that it blatantly contradicts their own earlier, extant and INDIGENOUS account.

In any case, historical scholarship have put the fraudulent Binis in their place by calling this Benin account what it is — an interesting nonsense.

“6”: As I have demonstrated earlier, this has nothing to do with the origin of Ooni (Oduduwa), but rather the opposite — even though you had originally tried to fraudulently pass off the former, only for it to boomerang.

In other words, this is (sadly for you) an entirely opposite point to what you wish to establish.

. Well, every non-Yoruba ethnic group and religion in Nigeria may lay claim to Oduduwa if they please (as it’s seeming to be the case), the traditional historical account of Oduduwa’s kingdom has the final say.

And it holds that Oduduwa is a Yoruba man from Ife — and there is no indigenous historical account which conflicts with with this.

Let’s ponder an important questions on the ancestors and kings’ progenitors of the Binis.

Where do Bini ancestors and the progenitors of Benin kings originate from?:

(A) From the sky via a long chain, according to Benin mythological narrative.

(B) From the youngest son of God [and His wife], according to Omonoba Erediauwa.

(C) From Ife, according to the classical and “official” Bini account.

(D) From Egypt, according to Benin Chief Egharevba’s 1953 publication.

(E) From Sudan, still according to Chief Egharevba’s 1953 publication.

(F) From Europe, according to the Benin 1823 account.

What’s very interesting about these confusing answer choices is that they all claim to be indigenous unlike in the case of the Yorubas where only of them is indigenous.

Only stable minded free born can be convinced with facts. And they have been disillusioned. They are copied below.

Cc: gomojam, talktrue1234, reallest, SaintBeehot, Balogunodua, RuggedSniper, Gratefulheart1, macof, DenreleDave, Amujale, babtoundey, scholes0, Newton85
——————————


Reply to your PS insertion:
Throw tantrums all you want lad, there are no earlier (or later) historical citations of indigenous nature which contradicts this indigenous Ife historical account that Oduduwa is a Yoruba man from Ife.

I should add also that this indigenous historical account which I cited was actually published about two decades earlier than 2010.

Although I am aware that its year of publication have absolutely no effect since there is nothing earlier (or later) of indigenous nature which contradicts it.

Yes, only one of them (the early 1800s account of Sultan Bello of Sokoto) touches on our subject here. And that is the now popular account which ascribes a Middle Eastern root to Oduduwa.

No, the other sources (and ?date) you’ve noted here did not make any such mention — except one which faintly hinted something along that line. I would touch on that.

The general objective of these authors appears not to be about documenting history, but rather to take note of themes of interest to them while they continue with their exploration of these foreign land.

This appears to explain why there is not a single mention of Eweka I, Ewuare I, Ehemihen, et al. in the notes taken by the early European visitors to Benin.

Having said that, the text which I noted to have faintly hinted something along the line of our discourse here is a 1666 French translation of a text on some Coptic traditions.

This 1666 French pamphlet is cited on pages 153-154 of Louis J. Morié’s “Les Civilisations Africaines Histoire de L’ Éthiopie (Nubie Et Abyssinie),” 1904, first published 1897.

Morié’s citation of this 1666 French pamphlet makes mention of different well-known deified Yoruba heroes by name. In fact, it also specifically mentions the country of origin of one of them by name as follows:

“le roi [b]Chango ..., était, d’après les récits mêmes des noirs, un roi de Kousch, d’où son surnom d’Obba-Kouso, roi de Kousch. Né à Ifé ...”

Translation:
“King Shango ..., was, according to the stories of the blacks, a king of Kush, hence his nickname of Oba Koso, king of Kush. Born in Ife[/b] ...”

In the light of the Yoruba traditional account that Shango is strictly patrilineal descended from Oduduwa (Oduduwa’s great-grand son); this Coptic tradition appears then to be the only c.1600 writing hints Oduduwa’s roots to be IFE.

In other words, if this account is anything to go by at all, then it appears that the distant Copts agree with the indigenous account of IFE itself.

Having said that, this account seems in some general way (rather than in specific terms) to bolster the position of the Ooni where it states that this individual of Ife roots (i.e. Shango) once reigned as king in the land of Kush — yes, I know that has nothing to do with the roots of the Ooni, but rather the other war round.

Cheers!

TAO11:


Yes, only one of them (the early 1800s account of Sultan Bello of Sokoto) touches on our subject here. And that is the now popular account which ascribes a Middle Eastern roots to Oduduwa.


The general objective of these authors appears

Having said that, the text which I noted to have faintly hinted something along the line of our discourse here is a 1666 French translation of an old Coptic text.

This French pamphlet is cited on pages 153-154 of Louis J. Morié’s “Les Civilisations Africaines Histoire de L’ Éthiopie (Nubie Et Abyssinie),” 1904, first published 1897.

Morié’s citation of this pamphlet makes mention of different well-known deified Yoruba heroes by name.

In fact, it also specifically mentions the country of origin of one of them by name — as follows:

“le roi Chango ..., était, d’après les récits mêmes des noirs, un roi de Kousch, d’où son surnom d’Obba-Kouso, roi de Kousch. Né à Ifé ...”

Translation:
“King Shango ..., was, according to the very accounts of the blacks themselves, a king of Kush, hence his nickname of Oba Koso, king of Kush. Born in Ife ...”

In the light of the Yoruba traditional account that Shango is strictly patrilineal descended from Oduduwa (Oduduwa’s great-grandson); this Coptic tradition appears then to be the only pre-1800 writing which gives a hint on Oduduwa’s roots.

In other words, if this Coptic account is anything to go by, then it appears then that even the distant Copts agree with the indigenous Ife account that Oduduwa (i.e. Sango’s paternal great-grandfather) is an Ife indigene himself.

Having said that, this Coptic account also seems in some general way (rather than in its specific details) to bolster the reigning Ooni’s statement (which you erroneously brought up) where it states that this individual of Ife roots (i.e. Shango) once ruled as king in the land of Kush.

samuk:


In the light of the Yoruba traditional account that Shango is strictly patrilineal descended from Oduduwa (Oduduwa’s great-grandson); this Coptic tradition appears then to be the only pre-1800 writing which gives a hint on Oduduwa’s roots.

How Does Your above Bolded statement suggests that Oduduwa was originally a native of Ife, How? How?, ............Sango was only linked to Oduduwa, that's all. Not Oduduwa origin.

People have suggested here that history students or historians are not as clever, smart and bright as scientists, you seems to be confirming this with your submissions.

The simple question is, what other sources since the 16th century linked Oduduwa origin to Ife apart from your 2010 reference?

You thought you were dealing with your regular unintelligent students and readers, so you wrote pages of reply without actually answering the question.

You quoted a 1904 French source that linked Sango to Oduduwa, even if these entities were not gods/myths, how does:

1. Sango being the grandson of Oduduwa mean/translates into meaning that Oduduwa was from Ife.

2. How does Sango being born in Ife mean Oduduwa was originally from Ife.

3. Even the Oba of Benin agree that Oranmiyan ( son/grandson of Oduduwa) was born in Ife, how does this mean that Oduduwa was originally from Ife.

You wrote long epistle trying to cite French and Coptic texts but ended up not answering the simple question of any earlier historical sources backing Ife 2010 accounts of the Origin of Oduduwa being from Ife.

There is nowhere in your French and Coptic references that say Oduduwa was a native of Ife.

Is it not a shame that you have to blame the Hausa/Fulani of Sokoto for teaching the middle east origin of Oduduwa to Yoruba people, including your early historians, present historians, earlier and present Obas who still parrot Oduduwa middle east origin.

After telling everyone that you guys are the most sophisticated and educated in Nigeria, yet the history of Yoruba most important figure, Oduduwa was give to you by the Hausas you all refer to as illiterates.

Can you now see why most of you are educated illiterates?

Tao is telling us that Oduduwa middle east origin since 1800s was a lie told and fabricated by the Hausas and the Yoruba only woke up from their slumber in 2010 to make correction, so much for Yoruba acclaimed education and sophistication.

You are in this problem, because you are trying to support your 2010 Oduduwa Ife origin lie, because it was a fabrication based on ego rather than historical accounts.

You just don't wake up one day in 2010 and write some garbage as history and expect clever people to just accept it.

One can only wonder the IQ of those that applaud you.

Haven't been unable to answer the question, the question remains.

You can't be dabbling into Benin history all the time without being able to give a convincing historical account of Oduduwa origin.

Etinosa1234:


Samuel Johnson gave two accounts of Oduduwa as at early 20th century

The account that Oduduwa came from ife is recent revisionism

tollyboy5:

Who's wailing here ejo o! Question labere ?
She's the only one calling for supporters and likers every where.
I'm a scientist I can't wail on folktales . she's the one that need to go continue reading her storybooks.
Alaye calm down. Because I came to check prontpage news doesn't mean I have enough time. Even the person I wanted to mention is always at work.
Lady who her spouse might have taking care December expenses vs me that is trying to put things together .
I'm not replying any of this thread anymore . If I have chance I create the thread. I've said itll be in a month time.
Shalom

Balogunodua:


Lolz...
You are scientist and you don't have time it looks like you don't know the meaning of scientist

samuk:
Is it not a shame that you have to blame the Hausa/Fulani of Sokoto for teaching the middle east origin of Oduduwa to Yoruba people, including your early historians, present historians, earlier and present Obas who still parrot Oduduwa middle east origin.

After telling everyone that you guys are the most sophisticated and educated in Nigeria, yet the history of Yoruba most important figure, Oduduwa was give to you by the Hausas you all refer to as illiterates.

Can you now see why most of you are educated illiterates?

Tao is telling us that Oduduwa middle east origin since 1800s was a lie told and fabricated by the Hausas and the Yoruba only woke up from their slumber in 2010 to make correction, so much for Yoruba acclaimed education and sophistication.

You are in this problem, because you are trying to support your 2010 Oduduwa Ife origin lie, because it was a fabrication based on ego rather than historical accounts.

You just don't wake up one day in 2010 and write some garbage as history and expect clever people to just accept it.

One can only wonder the IQ of those that applaud you.

samuk:
In the light of the Yoruba traditional account that Shango is strictly patrilineal descended from Oduduwa (Oduduwa’s great-grandson); this Coptic tradition appears then to be the only pre-1800 writing which gives a hint on Oduduwa’s roots.

How Does Your above Bolded statement suggests that Oduduwa was originally a native of Ife, How? How?, ............Sango was only linked to Oduduwa, that's all. Not Oduduwa origin.

People have suggested here that history students or historians are not as clever, smart and bright as scientists, you seems to be confirming this with your submissions.

The simple question is, what other sources since the 16th century linked Oduduwa origin to Ife apart from your 2010 reference?

You thought you were dealing with your regular unintelligent students and readers, so you wrote pages of reply without actually answering the question.

You quoted a 1904 French source that linked Sango to Oduduwa, even if these entities were not gods/myths, how does:

1. Sango being the grandson of Oduduwa mean/translates into meaning that Oduduwa was from Ife.

2. How does Sango being born in Ife mean Oduduwa was originally from Ife.

3. Even the Oba of Benin agree that Oranmiyan ( son/grandson of Oduduwa) was born in Ife, how does this mean that Oduduwa was originally from Ife.

You wrote long epistle trying to cite French and Coptic texts but ended up not answering the simple question of any earlier historical sources backing Ife 2010 accounts of the Origin of Oduduwa being from Ife.

There is nowhere in your French and Coptic references that say Oduduwa was a native of Ife.

Haven't been unable to answer the question, the question remains.

You can't be dabbling into Benin history all the time without being able to give a convincing historical account of Oduduwa origin.