I stay in the North East part of Nigeria, and I understand that my question may come as a shock to some Christians. But when you see and witness everyday what we experince here everyday, you would want to think again.
When I say Fire Arms, I refer to a licensed fire Arm, not like those acquired by armed robbers.

The rate at which religious disturbances occur here is alarming, we take cover in Military Cantoments when these events occur. I have many Muslims friends, I eat with them, we play together, however, most of them are Southern Muslims, though I have a few Northern Muslims, I am extra careful with them.

During crisis period, the Northern muslims do not know you as friends, they can kill the very person they ate with the day before. The advise for Fire Arms actually came from the Church council here (all churches here belong to this council)

Like I said earlier, owning Fire Arms might appear strange to my brothers and sisters in the South, here we are seriously considering having one so we can defend ourselves when another crisis occurs, and I assure you, that will be in less than 3 weeks.

What does the Bible say??

jesus did ask his disciples to buy swords, so you are on the right path if you acquire Weapons of Mass Destruction to defend yourself

IDINRETE:

jesus did ask his disciples to buy swords, so you are on the right path if you acquire Weapons of Mass Destruction to defend yourself

That does not make sense dude.  Maybe you are trying to mock the poster but your post there failed. No need to make the thread something it is not. Let us please keep to topic.

@Poster, We are not called to live by fear. I see no reason why one would want to buy fire arms to protect oneself from particular persons unless you have been threatened in some way by these particular persons, in which case, I can not tell you that you are not allowed to defend self. Please stay out of PARANOIA AVENUE and please keep yourself in the Sane zone. if you are threatened, please report to the right authorities, and if you need to, get something to protect yourself with. But the main thing you should keep in mind is that the person you kill ( if you end up having to use your weapon) is a soul that God loves too and came to die to save.

Xvalier:

During crisis period, the Northern muslims do not know you as friends, they can kill the very person they ate with the day before.

There is only one reason why they go to such lengths.

Is this happening in Nigeria?

An eye for an eye leaves everybody blind . . .

pilgrim.1:

There is only one reason why they go to such lengths.

which is?

I must admit your topic threw me off for a second but after reading the post I say GO FOR IT!

There's nuthin in the bible that prohibits a christian from protecting themselves and their families. Especially if you have young children. Infact it is your job and duty to protect them.
If an armed robber came into your house, threatens the life of your wife and children, not only is it biblical but it is at the very least human to protect them. Likewise if a crazed fanatic comes by threatening you or your family by all means PROTECT THEM and URSELF! just make sure do so wisely.
  and are legally licensed to own a gun, and must only use it when the situation absolutely warrants it.

Kobojunkie:

That does not make sense dude.  Maybe you are trying to mock the poster but your post there failed. No need to make the thread something it is not. Let us please keep to topic.

@Poster, We are not called to live by fear. I see no reason why one would want to buy fire arms to protect oneself from particular persons unless you have been threatened in some way by these particular persons, in which case, I can not tell you that you are not allowed to defend self. Please stay out of PARANOIA AVENUE and please keep yourself in the Sane zone. if you are threatened, please report to the right authorities, and if you need to, get something to protect yourself with. But the main thing you should keep in mind is that the person you kill ( if you end up having to use your weapon) is a soul that God loves too and came to die to save.

 
  Killing someone in self defence or in defence of another person is not wrong! Yes Jesus died for them too but there are consequences for the actions they've chosen to do.
Picture this: you see a person/ a stranger/ your wife/ your child being attacked and you go forth to save them and end up killing the attacker - what were you supposed to do? standby idly? go and call for help? while they kill ur wife or child? try to talk to the attacker?
  I agree with you though that the poster should avoid getting paranoid. Also understand that reporting to the "authorities" does very little to change anything in Nigeria.

The rate at which religious disturbances occur here is alarming, we take cover in Military Cantoments when these events occur. I have many Muslims friends, I eat with them, we play together, however, most of them are Southern Muslims, though I have a few Northern Muslims, I am extra careful with them.

During crisis period, the Northern muslims do not know you as friends, they can kill the very person they ate with the day before. The advise for Fire Arms actually came from the Church council here (all churches here belong to this council)

: The fact that you are honest enough to speak the truth about Southern Muslims attitude versus Northern Muslims attitude, should point to you that the reality of 'religious unrest,' in Nigerian North, is truly not religious. Afterall, the common thread is Islam amongst the Muslim populace, of Nigeria, at least. I restrict my comment to Nigeria, alone, since it is your primary concern here. It is a microobservation of what it is in Islam, which people call religious violence. The Macroobservation truth of it is that it more ethnic or racial than true religious underpinnings.

For example the Northern Muslims may even slaughter their own Muslim people, just because he or she is not from the North. So Islam is not in play here, even though they may shout Allahu Akbar at the top of their lungs, while committing any killing or destruction. It is the same in Palestine, too, because what you see is the flag of Palestine, whereas the flag of Islam is not showing.

Finally, I am only responding only because of the fact that the Church Council finds it greatly essential to even think about the need for 'Arms.' There is no difference in the ignorance of the individuals amongst the Muslims of Northern Nigeria, or Southern Nigeria or the whole world, who participate or encourage destructions of lives or properties of people who are innocent and the Church Council, which calls for acquisition of weapons. They are all in the same boat.

Islam requires that one should stand up for Justice, even if it against oneself! Muslims are supposed to restrain from doing any fighting and in particular against innocents. The only way a Muslim should fight is he/she is restricted from entering the Mosque and or practicing Islam. Finally, Muslims are not supposed to fight as a fragmented bodies, but as a singly wholesome community.

So what we have happening now around the whole world and in Nigeria is not Islamic way of prosecuting any war. You want to know about how Muslim fight, refer yourself to the wars under Muhammad (as) and the four (4) kalifahs, in a general sense of it.

JeSoul:

I must admit your topic threw me off for a second but after reading the post I say GO FOR IT!

There's nuthin in the bible that prohibits a christian from protecting themselves and their families. Especially if you have young children. Infact it is your job and duty to protect them.
If an armed robber came into your house, threatens the life of your wife and children, not only is it biblical but it is at the very least human to protect them. Likewise if a crazed fanatic comes by threatening you or your family by all means PROTECT THEM and URSELF! just make sure do so wisely.
and are legally licensed to own a gun, and must only use it when the situation absolutely warrants it.


Killing someone in self defence or in defence of another person is not wrong! Yes Jesus died for them too but there are consequences for the actions they've chosen to do.
Picture this: you see a person/ a stranger/ your wife/ your child being attacked and you go forth to save them and end up killing the attacker - what were you supposed to do? standby idly? go and call for help? while they kill your wife or child? try to talk to the attacker?
I agree with you though that the poster should avoid getting paranoid. Also understand that reporting to the "authorities" does very little to change anything in Nigeria.

My post does not in any way advise the poster that what he is doing is wrong. All I ask is that one make sure to have a clean conscience even in this and to understand that these are also human beings and not animals. Reporting to the authorities is not always for the sake of it. It is more to make sure one's conscience is clear. Make sure you have done all you know to do before you make that ultimate decision to kill another human being. It is for the law to have record and for your own soul to have record of the fact that you did the right thing when and if one has to engage in battle with guilt.

Hi Olabowale,

are you aware that the Northern Muslims treat and regard the Southern muslims as second class muslims. I say this with all objectivity. My Northern Muslim friends tell me they are true Islam followers. I must tell you also, that during the crisis that started as a result of the "Caricature of Mohammed", I know of 2 Yoruba Muslims that were killed along with Christians. I cannot begin to tell you the names they give to Southern Muslims

From the the few words of yours I read, you and I can be best of friends, even though we are of different religion, but again, from your name (and view point) I see you are a Southern Muslim, hence not suprised that you are thinking, rational, and objective.

I hope I can share issues with you from time to time.

Thank you fro your advise also.

Guns wont solve it.
Theoreticaly: It Christians are allowed to carry arms, muslims will also be allowed the same.
now So far, when all these massacre occur, the very weapons available to the muslim hoarde (stones, cudgels, knives, petrol, etc) are available to the christians too; but the level of restraint (or lack of it) shown by the vairous groups determine the scope/result of the horror. Adding guns to the the mix only makes an already difficult-to-manage scenerio impossible-to-manage.
Better education and enlightment will do more to quell this riots than guns would. I read that during the Bauchi riots, some Christians actualy banded together to help prevent a mosque from getting burnt down. Imagine if our muslim brothers show the same gesture to their christian compatriots.

Lets show more Love. That is the greatest power available to humans.

It seemed as though these muslims (i purposely ignored the word fanatics) wouldnt stop their riots in the north until christians started letting them have a taste of their own medicine.

Imagine a muslim walking into the church with a gun in his hand ready to kill the pastor and the congregation decide to bow their heads in prayer instead of bringing that man down with a microphone or speaker aimed at the back of his head.

I however think christians should allow the wisdom of God to guide their hearts at all times so that when situations like these arise, by the spirit they'll do as occacions demands.

@alfa olabowale,
Well said bro,well said

@Xavier:

Hi Olabowale,
are you aware that the Northern Muslims treat and regard the Southern Muslims as second class Muslims. I say this with all objectivity. My Northern Muslim friends tell me they are true Islam followers. I must tell you also, that during the crisis that started as a result of the "Caricature of Muhammad", I know of 2 Yoruba Muslims that were killed along with Christians. I cannot begin to tell you the names they give to Southern Muslims
From the the few words of yours I read, you and I can be best of friends, even though we are of different religion, but again, from your name (and view point) I see you are a Southern Muslim, hence not surprised that you are thinking, rational, and objective.
I hope I can share issues with you from time to time.
Thank you fro your advise also.

: A Makkan or a Medina Muslim, can not claim with 100% certainty that he/she is a better Muslim than anyone who is Muslim, from any other part of the world! Whosoever claims that a Muslim who is not practicing 'Islam,' through the Prism of 'INNOVATION,' is a worse Muslim than him/herself simply based on ethnicity, gender, race, wealth or any of the worldly and class delineations, is an arrogant person and hence is a Hypocrite. That person, the speaker who is speaking arrogantly is a follower of Shaitan, while in the state of believing that he/she is better!

Allah says that God consciousness is the only barometer of classification/quality of human beings with Him. Muhammad (as), said that the Arab is not better than the non Arabs, or the other way around. The White is not better than the non white, or the other way around. The Wealthy is not better than the unprivileged, or the other way around. A man is not better than a woman, or the other way around. The old is not better that the young, or the other way around. The only way one person is better than the other is in their degrees of Piety of God consciousness.So if any group of Muslims discriminate against another group of Muslims, by laying claims to what is only known to The Merciful, then we see tremendous error in that thinking. That been said, as above, I asked God Almighty to bring the light of guidance to the hearts of non Muslims and destroy any and all forms of arrogance from the hearts of any Muslim. Amin.

I do tell my Northern Nigerian Muslim brothers, and I know a good number of them, but most are good in their practice of Islam, but the few who think that Islam begins and ends in Nigeria, within the Northern boundaries, that no one will enter Paradise, from the Islamic perspective, based on Ethnicity alone. If this is so, all Arabs will have to enter Paradise, and so will all Pakistanis. For Pakistan is the only country that is organised on Islam, the reason it separated from Mother Hindu India.

Those Muslims who were killed out of Ignorance acts of anyone, be they Muslims or not, I ask Allah the Only One who truly grant prayers to accept them into His Paradise. Amin. Nigeria has a long way to go in the matters of ethnic relationshipand interaction. One is encouraged by Islam to show tolerance. I am lacking in that department, too. But I will try to follow the set of examples of my righteous predecessors; The Prophet, and his companions and the two generations which followed. How can a Muslim help others to see the beauty of Islam, except that he/she, the Muslim shows good Islamic quality, always.

BIBLICALLY,it is not right for christians to hold guns or other weapons to fight others but it seems moslems are emboldened by the nonchallant of the govt at local,state ,federal levels over incesant killings of christians by them ,it will not be out of place to have guns ready for battle because my people say if you keep playing with small fowl, a time will come when you will be sharing corn with the small fowl. the excesses of the moslems are too grossed for christians to keep quiet.can you imagine how cartoon in Denmark could cause mayhem in Maiduguri.or how useless it was for the moslems in kano to cut the head of GIdeon Akaluka and put on a stick and celebrated along the streets in kano.thank God iam not in kaduna anymore i would have gotten my AK47 for self defence.it is stupid for them to kill people and after they will tell u islam preaches peace.which peace .recently they killed a woman in bauchi because of one silly reason.how can somebody be killed because one leaf of koran is torn and carried by wind to where other people reside.this is nonesense,really someone has to keep AK47 close to him

akpanbaba,
ur argument is quite good but if we have to look at it from other angle we will realized that most of instances of mayhem and religion riots do occur in the northern part of the country. where we have most of these religious fanatics due to lack of western education.
how many time have u heard of religion riot in the western,southern and easteren parts of nigeria or we do not have muslims their?
No, carrying of arms may not be the perfect solution to this poblem. i am not a moslem but i think all religions preach peace including islam but most of these northerners are nonentities, fools who will not see any good things in western education, they are highly myopic. u can see that in the way they live their daily lives .
i had my one year NYSC in the north with what i saw there no one will ever pray to be like them. i mean no easterner,southerner or westerner pray to be an hausa man.
i thiink they need education.
let us continue to pray that the almighty God in His mercy open their eyes to education.

akpanbaba:

[b]BIBLICALLY,it is not right for christians to hold guns [/b]or other weapons to fight others

Can you please show the scripture reference? Christians are charged to be peaceful people and meek towards everyone. But nowhere does the bible tell not to protect ourselves whether it is by means of a gun or cutlass.
However I pretty much agree with most of the stuff you said, and like other posters said the christian just has to be cautious and use sense and the guidance of the holyspirit when "protecting' themselves with the use of a firearm.

@ Xvalier

I stay in the North East part of Nigeria, and I understand that my question may come as a shock to some Christians. But when you see and witness everyday what we experince here everyday, you would want to think again.
When I say Fire Arms, I refer to a licensed fire Arm, not like those acquired by armed robbers.

The rate at which religious disturbances occur here is alarming, we take cover in Military Cantoments when these events occur. I have many Muslims friends, I eat with them, we play together, however, most of them are Southern Muslims, though I have a few Northern Muslims, I am extra careful with them.

During crisis period, the Northern muslims do not know you as friends, they can kill the very person they ate with the day before. The advise for Fire Arms actually came from the Church council here (all churches here belong to this council)

Like I said earlier, owning Fire Arms might appear strange to my brothers and sisters in the South, here we are seriously considering having one so we can defend ourselves when another crisis occurs, and I assure you, that will be in less than 3 weeks.

What does the Bible say?HuhHuhHuhHuhHuhHuh?

Just one question for you. Did any of the disciples seek to protect themselves when faced with danger from their enemies? Did Jesus encourage them in anyway to defend themselves?

I might be wrong but I can't ever recall the righteous having to defend themselves when faced with danger, percieved or otherwise.

K-TON , my brother i don't know whether you have stayed in the north before , if you have stayed in the north for long you would have a different view entirely.As a christian i don't support violence but the question is ;how long will they continue to kill christians just for flimsy reasons.Again how many christians will they kill before theY stop this madness.My cousin was burnt alive in Rigassa village in kaduna.Recently a yoruba woman was killed in Bauchi just for flimsy reason,in kaduna the tongue  of a pastor was cut because he used his tongue to peach,in Malali village a moslem entered the church while the service was on and removed the public address system because according to him the church was disturbing him.
        In 1991,for example over 100 churches were  burnt in kaduna because of what happened in college ofeducation ,kafanchan.I don't want to continue because tears  is rolling.

         It is not about education ,it is about non respect for human lives.check it out ,in all islamic  countries violence is walking on four legs.people who have the fear of GOd and respect for human lives cannot kill aimlessly.why don't we have killings in the south.are all southerners educated?.it is all about respect for lives.people should not be taken as 'nama'.This is why i believe  that christians should adopt the method Nehemiah used when he was building the temple.weapon in one hand while work was going on.
         I believe in prayers  but we should not close our eyes when we pray, because it will be unfortunate to discover that they would have finished the christians before the prayer is over.my brother he who feels knows it.
          Do you know that no recommendation  from investigation panel or tribunal set up to try religious upheavals in this country has  ever seen the light of the day.There is insincerety everywhere.THEY want to kill christians or' arni'. Or are you not aware that they keep on saying that they are greater in number .They have to reduce the population of christians at slightest provocation .PLS HELP ME TO GET AK47 BEFORE I GET MY OWN FROM NIGER DELTA

That does not make sense dude. Maybe you are trying to mock the poster but your post there failed. No need to make the thread something it is not. Let us please keep to topic.

@Poster, We are not called to live by fear. I see no reason why one would want to buy fire arms to protect oneself from particular persons unless you have been threatened in some way by these particular persons, in which case, I can not tell you that you are not allowed to defend self. Please stay out of PARANOIA AVENUE and please keep yourself in the Sane zone. if you are threatened, please report to the right authorities, and if you need to, get something to protect yourself with. But the main thing you should keep in mind is that the person you kill ( if you end up having to use your weapon) is a soul that God loves too and came to die to save.

Kobojunkie,

You are talking as if you don't know Nigeria.

I am sure cases like this would have been reported and nothing had been done about it. If they have done something about it, then cases like this will never happen.

I don't blame anyone who choose to carry firearms, although I don't whole heartedly support it.

K-TON , my brother i don't know whether you have stayed in the north before , if you have stayed in the north for long you would have a different view entirely.As a christian i don't support violence but the question is ;how long will they continue to kill christians just for flimsy reasons.Again how many christians will they kill before theY stop this madness.My cousin was burnt alive in Rigassa village in kaduna.Recently a yoruba woman was killed in Bauchi just for flimsy reason,in kaduna the tongue of a pastor was cut because he used his tongue to peach,in Malali village a moslem entered the church while the service was on and removed the public address system because according to him the church was disturbing him.
In 1991,for example over 100 churches were burnt in kaduna because of what happened in college ofeducation ,kafanchan.I don't want to continue because tears is rolling.

It is not about education ,it is about non respect for human lives.check it out ,in all islamic countries violence is walking on four legs.people who have the fear of GOd and respect for human lives cannot kill aimlessly.why don't we have killings in the south.are all southerners educated?.it is all about respect for lives.people should not be taken as 'nama'.This is why i believe that christians should adopt the method Nehemiah used when he was building the temple.weapon in one hand while work was going on.
I believe in prayers but we should not close our eyes when we pray, because it will be unfortunate to discover that they would have finished the christians before the prayer is over.my brother he who feels knows it.
Do you know that no recommendation from investigation panel or tribunal set up to try religious upheavals in this country has ever seen the light of the day.There is insincerety everywhere.THEY want to kill christians or' arni'. Or are you not aware that they keep on saying that they are greater in number .They have to reduce the population of christians at slightest provocation .PLS HELP ME TO GET AK47 BEFORE I GET MY OWN FROM NIGER DELTA

@Akpanbaba :

I have always maintained that Islamic religion is a satanic religion manufactured from the satanic kingdom.

Anyone who practises this satanic religion is always blood thirsty and have no regard for human life.

Of course, they will never try those killing people for religious reasons because the country itself is controlled by these hausas who happened to be predominately muslims. Have you asked yourself, why would the government of Nigeria, allow Sharia law to be introduced in the Northern part of the country in the first place. That alone is dividing a country that is secular. I look forward to the day when such satanic sharia law will be abolished.

Honestly everything about Islam is continuous evil.

@poster :

All I know is that evil will never triumph over good.