thehomer:

"Sin" shouldn't be heritable. If you think it should be heritable, please tell me why.

but genes are also inherited?

Tell me why?

Disconection from the source of life leads to dead.

Reconnection to the source of life has conditions.

If satan has the power to sustain life pepetually or if satan can create life then we will not be here talking.

The one that has the power to sustain life pepetually is the one Adam separated from.

They condition for reconnection is what we are talking about since our father Adam cause the Disconection.

ifeness:

A spirit who wants to be worshiped. please could you ask him why he hated Esau?

you look for fault were God is but you cant add a day to your life.

The story of Esau was God demonstrating that he can tell the future.

And he likes the type of Jacod that love spiritual things.

ifeness: I have an isreali friend. He claimed their Torah God told them black people are animals and they should be used as slaves.

Are you not already a slave to him?

^^^^
lies

truthislight:

but genes are also inherited?

Tell me why?

Disconection from the source of life leads to dead.

Reconnection to the source of life has conditions.

If satan has the power to sustain life pepetually or if satan can create life then we will not be here talking.

The one that has the power to sustain life pepetually is the one Adam separated from.

They condition for reconnection is what we are talking about since our father Adam cause the Disconection.

Sin isn't like genes. A person's children cannot be sent to prison because the committed a crime.

Sins are supposed to be acts performed and they obviously cannot be inherited. It looks as if you think they should be heritable. Can you please tell us why you think so?

truthislight:

your father does not have a father and your grand father does not have a father etc, etc and i know you know all of them then,

your first father chose satan instead of God.

satan has a right of claim to what Adam handed over to him.

You may not know what you are saying then i understand your situation,

that is why am talking to you.

You cant claim an excuse of not knowing any longer, but that you reject it.

whoever it is you are calling my father is not my father, neither does anyone in my lineage know him, nor can the geneology of my family be traced to him. Whatever he did to your God is not my business, who he chose to serve is not my business either that your God can use that to judge shows how irrational and wicked his sense of justice and fairness is. God help you, tomorrow dome religioud sect murder you on the basis of such believe system that some man that looks like you commited a crime against them and so you must die. What is the difference between those islamist fundamentalist that kill people in northern Nigeria over provocations committed against their religion in far away middle East or europe by some christian you don't know or even seen before. You are qualified for death all because you are a christian, imagine a world like that? Your God is a monster.

thehomer:

Sin isn't like genes. A person's children cannot be sent to prison because the committed a crime.

Sins are supposed to be acts performed and they obviously cannot be inherited. It looks as if you think they should be heritable. Can you please tell us why you think so?

Certain acts performed are sins. But how or why they come to be performed is the issue. Why do we do things that hurt others and or ourselves, tell a lie, give/take a bribe, get drunk, pursue promiscuity like a religion, steal other people's property etc etc?

Yes, the acts are wrong, but why are they done at all? It is that "why" that is inherited. It's practically hardwired into our corrupted genes. Because we are humans born of Adam, we sin. Period.

The issue of Grace is that we're helpless about our condition. We can't go back to the Garden and undo Adam's deed or unchoose his choice. Once he chose, we were bound by it since we were part of him then. But God took on this problem we were helpless to solve.

In Christ, He took on the principle (the why) of sin and destroyed it. The message of the Gospel to every man is that all men are free and need no longer labor under the load of sin. If any man believes it to be true, his action will be to rise up out of his slavery to sin.

If any man does not, he will either continue a fruitless struggle or he will start making excuses for his sin.

God's Judgment then is on this wise:

¤ Was freedom procured for you?

¤ Were you told of it?

¤ Did you take hold of it?

These answers need not wait till the Judgment Day to be known. One's practical life on earth today bears witness to them.

truthislight:

you look for fault were God is but you cant add a day to your life.

The story of Esau was God demonstrating that he can tell the future.

And he likes the type of Jacod that love spiritual things.

Its all about the God delusion. Its really eaten deep......the only reason a man will pay the church 10% of his income every month. That is more powerful than JUJU.

thehomer:

Sin isn't like genes. A person's children cannot be sent to prison because the committed a crime.

Sins are supposed to be acts performed and they obviously cannot be inherited. It looks as if you think they should be heritable. Can you please tell us why you think so?

so, parental characteristics Cannot be pass unto the children by the parent?

So children cannot pay for a debt that their father incured?

How honest and true are this statment?

ifeness:

Its all about the God delusion. Its really eaten deep......the only reason a man will pay the church 10% of his income every month. That is more powerful than JUJU.

if you know the bible well you will come to know the truth about tith.

Stay on the topic

truthislight:

if you know the bible well you will come to know the truth about tith.

Stay on the topic

I have no business knowing the bible well. I have read it and it is full of the primitive man's encounters with Extra terrestrial e.g Moses,Abraham,Elijah, Ezekiel,Paul etc. You wanna live by the biblical codes? Perhaps i should welcome you to planet earth again.

Over the years the church have been relying on science. You watch TV,you use electricity,Mobile phone and even the internet. Yet you all claim it is Satan's kingdom. Why don't you Christians live in the mud houses,just the same Jesus lived during his time. If God cares about Christians,why haven't he inspired any christian to invent something as little as table lamp?

Believe it or not your Bible gods were extra terrestrials. They came and they are gone. You wont move forward if you dont stop living on the primitive book.

äßdłœøÿęgęñ'§‰¢¿¡` œ§…"•°‰*|»æł

@ifeness, this alien message was found at Nag Hammadi, do you know what it means?

Ihedinobi:

Certain acts performed are sins. But how or why they come to be performed is the issue. Why do we do things that hurt others and or ourselves, tell a lie, give/take a bribe, get drunk, pursue promiscuity like a religion, steal other people's property etc etc?

Yes, the acts are wrong, but why are they done at all? It is that "why" that is inherited. It's practically hardwired into our corrupted genes. Because we are humans born of Adam, we sin. Period.

So what if there was no Adam. Does this negate the idea you're pushing?
You claim that why they perform the acts is the issue. I make a counter claim that God made humans in such a way that they perform these actions.

Ihedinobi:
The issue of Grace is that we're helpless about our condition. We can't go back to the Garden and undo Adam's deed or unchoose his choice. Once he chose, we were bound by it since we were part of him then. But God took on this problem we were helpless to solve.

God could have prevented it by not putting the tree there in the first place couldn't he? God could have prevented this apple thing from being transmissible couldn't he?

Ihedinobi:
In Christ, He took on the principle (the why) of sin and destroyed it. The message of the Gospel to every man is that all men are free and need no longer labor under the load of sin. If any man believes it to be true, his action will be to rise up out of his slavery to sin.

No he didn't. Christians sin just as much as everyone else so obviously this grace doesn't help prevent it. If you're claiming that though they sin this grace somehow covers them, then this grace thingy is pointless and amounts to a deliberate injustice.

Ihedinobi:
If any man does not, he will either continue a fruitless struggle or he will start making excuses for his sin.

God's Judgment then is on this wise:

¤ Was freedom procured for you?

Freedom? I wasn't chained in the first place.

Ihedinobi:
¤ Were you told of it?

Due to my answer above, this question is moot.

Ihedinobi:
¤ Did you take hold of it?

Not applicable.

Ihedinobi:
These answers need not wait till the Judgment Day to be known. One's practical life on earth today bears witness to them.

Yet the Christian lives don't bear witness to them. This makes me conclude that this grace isn't even there.

truthislight:

so, parental characteristics Cannot be pass unto the children by the parent?

I didn't say that.

truthislight:
So children cannot pay for a debt that their father incured?

I didn't say that either.

truthislight:
How honest and true are this statment?

You are simply confusing issues. Can a son or grandson serve jail time for a father or grandfather's murder?

truthislight:

if you knew the bible well you will come to know the truth about tith.

Stay on the topic

My friend if you use your brain very well you will come to understand that most of what you have in that bible is all inconsistent fairytale that can not be proven. None of them happened anywhere.
I have continued to ask Christians this same question; if God is all knowing, all seeing and is every where kind of supernatural entity, who created Man in his own image, what is the rationale for sending his only "begotten Son" to die for sins committed by entities he created? Not even just to die but to further suffer humiliation and eventually violent murder by these same entities his father is angry with and want him, Jesus to save from his uncontrollable anger.
Is it to feed his oversized murderous ego or to appease himself?
What kind of loving father appeases himself by asking his only son to die just so he, his father can be pleased?
Does it mean the all loving God is not magnanimous enough to resolve his grouse with his creations without having to force his only begotten son to let himself to be killed by his creations?
Is he such an ego maniac whose decisions are entirely based on the flow and tide of his emotions.
Can you honestly call say such actions are driven by love? EGO?
what kind of Loving God allows entities he created to suffer in an eternal burning furnace and the ones that make it to his heaven are zombies with no self will, they are condemned to eternal life of slavery. Boosting God's oversized ego through false praises they don't mean and fearful worship they are bound to do in heaven.
In heaven, their life is nothing short of enternal slavery, they must not feel or be imperfect lest they will be considered not fit for heaven or to be in the "loving Presence" of an insecure and paranoid God.
You can't have sex, smoke weed, feel Hot or even have a three-some with some beautiful angels, making mistakes is not even to be considered else you will be shown hell. What exactly will one be doing in such a place? Reminds me of that movie, Equillibrium.
only a kid will believe all that fairy BS in the bible written by pius church fraudstars.

thehomer:

So what if there was no Adam. Does this negate the idea you're pushing?
You claim that why they perform the acts is the issue. I make a counter claim that God made humans in such a way that they perform these actions.

Why do you make this counter-claim?

God could have prevented it by not putting the tree there in the first place couldn't he? God could have prevented this apple thing from being transmissible couldn't he?

I'm going to answer these as questions not arguments.

Yes and No.

The reason for "Yes" is that He could have prevented it by not creating at all.

The reason for "No" is that God being God could not but create. He must create. It is simply being true to His Nature to create. And when He does create, He creates intelligent beings that have the option to defy Him. He must in order to be true to His Nature.

No he didn't. Christians sin just as much as everyone else so obviously this grace doesn't help prevent it. If you're claiming that though they sin this grace somehow covers them, then this grace thingy is pointless and amounts to a deliberate injustice.

Well, if you see a Christian that sins, tell him he's no Christian.

Freedom? I wasn't chained in the first place.

Ok

Due to my answer above, this question is moot.

Ok

Not applicable.

Ok

Yet the Christian lives don't bear witness to them. This makes me conclude that this grace isn't even there.

Given your answers to those three questions, this last comment is curious. You seem to mean by it that you are cognizant of a bondage to sin. That you recognize a need to be free. That you have heard a message of freedom. That you have looked for attendant evidence and found none.

Being a Christian myself, I think you just made an excuse to remain in sin. That is well and good. There is no gun to your head demanding that you accept your salvation and walk free. You may stay where you are, though I pray that you don't, but then those answers you gave to my three questions have ceased to count. And like I said, there wasn't need to wait for the day of the Summing of all things for the answers. The hope I have is that before that day, your answers will change. But if they do not, God's conclusions based on them will be exceedingly righteous.

Ihedinobi:

Why do you make this counter-claim?

To show that God deliberately made people this way rather than people becoming this way because of some fruit.

Ihedinobi:
I'm going to answer these as questions not arguments.

Yes and No.

The reason for "Yes" is that He could have prevented it by not creating at all.

The reason for "No" is that God being God could not but create. He must create. It is simply being true to His Nature to create. And when He does create, He creates intelligent beings that have the option to defy Him. He must in order to be true to His Nature.

Your response is a false dichotomy. e.g in response to your "yes", he could have created the earth without the fruit. With regards to your "no" response, he also could have created stones to sing his praises all day as Jesus said.

Ihedinobi:
Well, if you see a Christian that sins, tell him he's no Christian.

Then one can safely say that there are no Christians on earth.

Ihedinobi:
Ok



Ok



Ok



Given your answers to those three questions, this last comment is curious. You seem to mean by it that you are cognizant of a bondage to sin. That you recognize a need to be free. That you have heard a message of freedom. That you have looked for attendant evidence and found none.

No, what I've clearly said is that I do not see any bondage to sin. I've said time and again that a cage with the door open is not bondage.

Ihedinobi:
Being a Christian myself, I think you just made an excuse to remain in sin. That is well and good. There is no gun to your head demanding that you accept your salvation and walk free. You may stay where you are, though I pray that you don't, but then those answers you gave to my three questions have ceased to count. And like I said, there wasn't need to wait for the day of the Summing of all things for the answers. The hope I have is that before that day, your answers will change. But if they do not, God's conclusions based on them will be exceedingly righteous.

Actually your God introduced a gun into the equation. The equation is now obey me or burn in hell. That is as coercive holding a gun to someone's head and demanding their money otherwise they will be shot.

I would conclude by pointing out that your God, the God of the Bible is actually not good by any measure of what it means to be good.

rhymz: My friend if you use your brain very well you will come to understand that most of what you have in that bible is all inconsistent fairytale that can not be proven. None of them happened anywhere.
I have continued to ask Christians this same question; if God is all knowing, all seeing and is every where kind of supernatural entity, who created Man in his own image, what is the rationale for sending his only "begotten Son" to die for sins committed by entities he created? Not even just to die but to further suffer humiliation and eventually violent murder by these same entities his father is angry with and want him, Jesus to save from his uncontrollable anger.
Is it to feed his oversized murderous ego or to appease himself?
What kind of loving father appeases himself by asking his only son to die just so he, his father can be pleased?
Does it mean the all loving God is not magnanimous enough to resolve his grouse with his creations without having to force his only begotten son to let himself to be killed by his creations?
Is he such an ego maniac whose decisions are entirely based on the flow and tide of his emotions.
Can you honestly call say such actions are driven by love? EGO?
what kind of Loving God allows entities he created to suffer in an eternal burning furnace and the ones that make it to his heaven are zombies with no self will, they are condemned to eternal life of slavery. Boosting God's oversized ego through false praises they don't mean and fearful worship they are bound to do in heaven.
In heaven, their life is nothing short of enternal slavery, they must not feel or be imperfect lest they will be considered not fit for heaven or to be in the "loving Presence" of an insecure and paranoid God.
You can't have sex, smoke weed, feel Hot or even have a three-some with some beautiful angels, making mistakes is not even to be considered else you will be shown hell. What exactly will one be doing in such a place? Reminds me of that movie, Equillibrium.
only a kid will believe all that fairy BS in the bible written by pius church fraudstars.

i couldn't say it better! You hit the nail on it's head.

ifeness:

I have no business knowing the bible well. I have read it and it is full of the primitive man's encounters with Extra terrestrial e.g Moses,Abraham,Elijah, Ezekiel,Paul etc. You wanna live by the biblical codes? Perhaps i should welcome you to planet earth again.

Over the years the church have been relying on science. You watch TV,you use electricity,Mobile phone and even the internet. Yet you all claim it is Satan's kingdom. Why don't you Christians live in the mud houses,just the same Jesus lived during his time. If God cares about Christians,why haven't he inspired any christian to invent something as little as table lamp?

Believe it or not your Bible gods were extra terrestrials. They came and they are gone. You wont move forward if you dont stop living on the primitive book.

what are cement and bricks made of?

Too low .......

Try harder.

I already said I wouldn't engage atheists I've engaged before on such matters as this. The argument always degenerates into gross illogicality. So, the instant I sense a circling back to cleared arguments, I'm out and you can have fun all by yourself.

thehomer:

To show that God deliberately made people this way rather than people becoming this way because of some fruit.

Ok. Proceed to show how this is so.

Your response is a false dichotomy. e.g in response to your "yes", he could have created the earth without the fruit. With regards to your "no" response, he also could have created stones to sing his praises all day as Jesus said.

This response is not tenable as it does not take correct account of God's Nature and it misrepresents Jesus's words.

Then one can safely say that there are no Christians on earth.

No, they cannot. Unless you can show to me evidence that everyone who goes by the name Christian contradicts the name by persisting in sin.

No, what I've clearly said is that I do not see any bondage to sin. I've said time and again that a cage with the door open is not bondage.

And I've agreed to that before. And went on from it to say that that is why God's Judgment is righteous.

Actually your God introduced a gun into the equation. The equation is now obey me or burn in hell. That is as coercive holding a gun to someone's head and demanding their money otherwise they will be shot.

This is your opinion. You assume that hell exists to coerce people into serving God. Can you prove this?

I would conclude by pointing out that your God, the God of the Bible is actually not good by any measure of what it means to be good.

Let's not get into this. The very foundations of this argument are absurd to say the least.

thehomer:

I didn't say that.



I didn't say that either.



You are simply confusing issues. Can a son or grandson serve jail time for a father or grandfather's murder?

your question is on the punishment. = error
, wrong premise.

the issue is on the crime/sin/debt the parent owe.

For punishment to be mated out it means that the offender has been cought judged and sentence or he is sentence in absentia

Adam died for his sins = GENESIS 3:19

but the dept of the parent resulted in bankruptcy/death the children cant escape this consequence of their fathers stupidity.

But a wealthy benefactor has come to the rescue and needs an undertaking from the children that they will not repeat their fathers blunders

the undertaken is on individual basis.

Any that refuses can not benefit from the provision/facilities provided by the benefactor.

rhymz: My friend if you use your brain very well you will come to understand that most of what you have in that bible is all inconsistent fairytale that can not be proven. None of them happened anywhere.
I have continued to ask Christians this same question; if God is all knowing, all seeing and is every where kind of supernatural entity, who created Man in his own image, what is the rationale for sending his only "begotten Son" to die for sins committed by entities he created? Not even just to die but to further suffer humiliation and eventually violent murder by these same entities his father is angry with and want him, Jesus to save from his uncontrollable anger.
Is it to feed his oversized murderous ego or to appease himself?
What kind of loving father appeases himself by asking his only son to die just so he, his father can be pleased?
Does it mean the all loving God is not magnanimous enough to resolve his grouse with his creations without having to force his only begotten son to let himself to be killed by his creations?
Is he such an ego maniac whose decisions are entirely based on the flow and tide of his emotions.
Can you honestly call say such actions are driven by love? EGO?
what kind of Loving God allows entities he created to suffer in an eternal burning furnace and the ones that make it to his heaven are zombies with no self will, they are condemned to eternal life of slavery. Boosting God's oversized ego through false praises they don't mean and fearful worship they are bound to do in heaven.
In heaven, their life is nothing short of enternal slavery, they must not feel or be imperfect lest they will be considered not fit for heaven or to be in the "loving Presence" of an insecure and paranoid God.
You can't have sex, smoke weed, feel Hot or even have a three-some with some beautiful angels, making mistakes is not even to be considered else you will be shown hell. What exactly will one be doing in such a place? Reminds me of that movie, Equillibrium.
only a kid will believe all that fairy BS in the bible written by pius church fraudstars.

evidence base on false informations.

When you argue base on reality/what the bible teaches then i can address your worries.

rhymz: My friend if you use your brain very well you will come to understand that most of what you have in that bible is all inconsistent fairytale that can not be proven. None of them happened anywhere.
I have continued to ask Christians this same question; if God is all knowing, all seeing and is every where kind of supernatural entity, who created Man in his own image, what is the rationale for sending his only "begotten Son" to die for sins committed by entities he created? Not even just to die but to further suffer humiliation and eventually violent murder by these same entities his father is angry with and want him, Jesus to save from his uncontrollable anger.
Is it to feed his oversized murderous ego or to appease himself?
What kind of loving father appeases himself by asking his only son to die just so he, his father can be pleased?
Does it mean the all loving God is not magnanimous enough to resolve his grouse with his creations without having to force his only begotten son to let himself to be killed by his creations?
Is he such an ego maniac whose decisions are entirely based on the flow and tide of his emotions.
Can you honestly call say such actions are driven by love? EGO?
what kind of Loving God allows entities he created to suffer in an eternal burning furnace and the ones that make it to his heaven are zombies with no self will, they are condemned to eternal life of slavery. Boosting God's oversized ego through false praises they don't mean and fearful worship they are bound to do in heaven.
In heaven, their life is nothing short of enternal slavery, they must not feel or be imperfect lest they will be considered not fit for heaven or to be in the "loving Presence" of an insecure and paranoid God.
You can't have sex, smoke weed, feel Hot or even have a three-some with some beautiful angels, making mistakes is not even to be considered else you will be shown hell. What exactly will one be doing in such a place? Reminds me of that movie, Equillibrium.
only a kid will believe all that fairy BS in the bible written by pius church fraudstars.

bring this in bits,
so that i can address them one at a time.

Ihedinobi: I already said I wouldn't engage atheists I've engaged before on such matters as this. The argument always degenerates into gross illogicality. So, the instant I sense a circling back to cleared arguments, I'm out and you can have fun all by yourself.

And I've encountered Christians over and over again who make such claims and refuse to back them up. If you're going to claim that an argument is grossly illogical, then the least you could do is to demonstrate how it is illogical rather than simply running away.

Ihedinobi:
Ok. Proceed to show how this is so.

I will through our interactions here. What was Eve's first sin? Was it eating the apple or listening to the serpent (who by the way told the truth) and deciding to eat the apple?

Ihedinobi:
This response is not tenable as it does not take correct account of God's Nature and it misrepresents Jesus's words.

How exactly is God's nature unaccounted for and what is the correct representation of Jesus' words?

Ihedinobi:
No, they cannot. Unless you can show to me evidence that everyone who goes by the name Christian contradicts the name by persisting in sin.

Okay. Do you think it is feasible for someone to live on this earth without committing at least one sin a week? In fact, I would point out that belonging to the wrong denomination is also a sin against God.

Ihedinobi:
And I've agreed to that before. And went on from it to say that that is why God's Judgment is righteous.

You didn't agree with me. You said I recognized the bondage of sin while I said I didn't recognize this bondage. Merely asserting that God's judgement is righteous doesn't make it so you know. If you like, we can examine his judgement to see if it is indeed righteous.

Ihedinobi:
This is your opinion. You assume that hell exists to coerce people into serving God. Can you prove this?

Sure. Hell serves two purposes. To punish people and to serve as a deterrent for going against God. Just think of other punishments in other situations e.g corporal punishment in schools. What purpose does it serve? The same two: punishment and deterrent. The punishment is the pain and the deterrent is letting people know that they will be whipped for performing certain actions.

Ihedinobi:
Let's not get into this. The very foundations of this argument are absurd to say the least.

No they're not absurd. I will say that the foundations for claiming God's justice simply serve to corrupt the meaning of justice.

truthislight:

your question is on the punishment. = error
, wrong premise.

the issue is on the crime/sin/debt the parent owe.

For punishment to be mated out it means that the offender has been cought judged and sentence or he is sentence in absentia

Adam died for his sins = GENESIS 3:19

but the dept of the parent resulted in bankruptcy/death the children cant escape this consequence of their fathers stupidity.

But a wealthy benefactor has come to the rescue and needs an undertaking from the children that they will not repeat their fathers blunders

the undertaken is on individual basis.

Any that refuses can not benefit from the provision/facilities provided by the benefactor.

You're simply making some irrelevant introductions here. Can you simply answer this question? Can a son or grandson serve jail time for a father or grandfather's murder? You can answer with a yes or no with your explanations.

truthislight:

evidence base on false informations.

When you argue base on reality/what the bible teaches then i can address your worries.

My friend stop pretending like you know anything about what you are blabbing about. Go and do your research on the origins of the bible and see how foolish your boasful confidence is. Can you in all honesty tell anyone that there is a concrete evidence of Jesus christ ever existing? Thorough Research has been done towards unravelling the historicity of Jesus christ, instead more evidence continue to show that he never existed. All the accounts in the gospels are contradictory and have been found to be similar stories credited to god-men myths like zeus. Krishna. buddha, Horus and other pre-christian pagan gods. All of the canonical gospels do not have any known authors, all assumptions. Go ahead and check instead boasting in ignorance.

thehomer:

And I've encountered Christians over and over again who make such claims and refuse to back them up. If you're going to claim that an argument is grossly illogical, then the least you could do is to demonstrate how it is illogical rather than simply running away.



I will through our interactions here. What was Eve's first sin? Was it eating the apple or listening to the serpent (who by the way told the truth) and deciding to eat the apple?



How exactly is God's nature unaccounted for and what is the correct representation of Jesus' words?



Okay. Do you think it is feasible for someone to live on this earth without committing at least one sin a week? In fact, I would point out that belonging to the wrong denomination is also a sin against God.



You didn't agree with me. You said I recognized the bondage of sin while I said I didn't recognize this bondage. Merely asserting that God's judgement is righteous doesn't make it so you know. If you like, we can examine his judgement to see if it is indeed righteous.



Sure. Hell serves two purposes. To punish people and to serve as a deterrent for going against God. Just think of other punishments in other situations e.g corporal punishment in schools. What purpose does it serve? The same two: punishment and deterrent. The punishment is the pain and the deterrent is letting people know that they will be whipped for performing certain actions.



No they're not absurd. I will say that the foundations for claiming God's justice simply serve to corrupt the meaning of justice.

guy stop!

What was the truth that satan told eve?

This whole argument is rot if what you just said is the truth

thehomer:

You're simply making some irrelevant introductions here. Can you simply answer this question? Can a son or grandson serve jail time for a father or grandfather's murder? You can answer with a yes or no with your explanations.

what ?

Read my post again slowly.

That was properly addressed.

Or is it they are irrelevant to you as an atheist?

truthislight:

guy stop!

What was the truth that satan told eve?

This whole argument is rot if what you just said is the truth

Read your Bible and see what Satan told Eve. He told her that she wouldn't die but would become wise and she didn't die.

truthislight:

what ?

Read my post again slowly.

That was properly addressed.

Or is it they are irrelevant to you as an theist?

I couldn't parse your answer through the irrelevant introductions you were making. Why don't you plainly answer the question I asked?

rhymz: My friend stop pretending like you know anything about what you are blabbing about. Go and do your research on the origins of the bible and see how foolish your boasful confidence is. Can you in all honesty tell anyone that there is a concrete evidence of Jesus christ ever existing? Thorough Research has been done towards unravelling the historicity of Jesus christ, instead more evidence continue to show that he never existed. All the accounts in the gospels are contradictory and have been found to be similar stories credited to god-men myths like zeus. Krishna. buddha, Horus and other pre-christian pagan gods. All of the canonical gospels do not have any known authors, all assumptions. Go ahead and check instead boasting in ignorance.

I have confirmed all those,

pls, stay on the topic.

Most if not all of what you are saying have been addressed befor....

I just dont like going in circles.

thehomer:

And I've encountered Christians over and over again who make such claims and refuse to back them up. If you're going to claim that an argument is grossly illogical, then the least you could do is to demonstrate how it is illogical rather than simply running away.

Let me explain something to you, sir. There are too many of my Father's children yet to be found and brought home for me to waste time over those who declare that they care nothing for my Father and spit on His offer of all His House to them. I will "run away" when you start wasting my time.

I will through our interactions here. What was Eve's first sin? Was it eating the apple or listening to the serpent (who by the way told the truth) and deciding to eat the apple?

The bolded is your answer. Evidence of the original sin is that it is still very much a part of our constitution. That thought that the serpent was right was the sin. Because it was the reason behind which our parents took the fruit (which was not defined as an apple or any other plant, by the way). And it is the reason behind which we disobey God whenever we do.

How exactly is God's nature unaccounted for and what is the correct representation of Jesus' words?

Your statement implied that God's Nature would allow Him to create without allowing that which He created the choice to go against Him. That is false. God CANNOT create without allowing that which He creates a choice to defy Him. That is His Nature.

Jesus said that if the people crying out "Blessed is the King who comes in the name of the Lord! Peace in heaven and glory in the highest!" were silent, "the very stones would cry out" (Luke 19:40). Would you say that your representation of that was correct?

Okay. Do you think it is feasible for someone to live on this earth without committing at least one sin a week? In fact, I would point out that belonging to the wrong denomination is also a sin against God.

Sure, you could even join diluminati (don't worry if you don't know her) in saying that wet dreams are a sin too.

In any case, you may declare as much as you want that no man is morally pure but unless you can show me that you have examined all Christians and found none who is free of sin, I cannot accept your protestations.

You didn't agree with me. You said I recognized the bondage of sin while I said I didn't recognize this bondage. Merely asserting that God's judgement is righteous doesn't make it so you know. If you like, we can examine his judgement to see if it is indeed righteous.

Check through the thread. I believe you'll find a response that I made to a comment resembling the one you made that an open cage is no bondage. That's the one I mean. I'm sorry it's a near-impossibility to dig it up on my phone.

No sir, I will not examine God's Righteousness with you.

Sure. Hell serves two purposes. To punish people and to serve as a deterrent for going against God. Just think of other punishments in other situations e.g corporal punishment in schools. What purpose does it serve? The same two: punishment and deterrent. The punishment is the pain and the deterrent is letting people know that they will be whipped for performing certain actions.

I'm aware of societal practices. God is quite above them. Hell does represent punishment, but God does not punish as man does. I'm not willing to deal with that until we have sorted the present issues out.

As for deterrents, I know nobody who is a Christian according to the Bible's definition of the term that became one to escape hell. Whether contemporary or in the Bible.

No they're not absurd. I will say that the foundations for claiming God's justice simply serve to corrupt the meaning of justice.

No need to fight over this. I have only said that I won't address it.

Ihedinobi:

Let me explain something to you, sir. There are too many of my Father's children yet to be found and brought home for me to waste time over those who declare that they care nothing for my Father and spit on His offer of all His House to them. I will "run away" when you start wasting my time.

Meh you're just looking for any excuse to avoid critically examining the claims you present.

Ihedinobi:
The bolded is your answer. Evidence of the original sin is that it is still very much a part of our constitution. That thought that the serpent was right was the sin. Because it was the reason behind which our parents took the fruit (which was not defined as an apple or any other plant, by the way). And it is the reason behind which we disobey God whenever we do.

But the serpent was in fact right. After she ate the fruit, she didn't die did she? So the disobedience was the crime and not simply eating the fruit. Now why did God create people with the nature of being disobedient?

Ihedinobi:
Your statement implied that God's Nature would allow Him to create without allowing that which He created the choice to go against Him. That is false. God CANNOT create without allowing that which He creates a choice to defy Him. That is His Nature.

Do plants, bacteria and the malaria parasite have choices to go against him? Who are you to say that God cannot create a world without beings that have their own minds? How do you know that it is his nature?

Ihedinobi:
Jesus said that if the people crying out "Blessed is the King who comes in the name of the Lord! Peace in heaven and glory in the highest!" were silent, "the very stones would cry out" (Luke 19:40). Would you say that your representation of that was correct?

Well the stones won't cry out in pain so what will they cry out? Isn't it what the people weren't saying that they would say?

Ihedinobi:
Sure, you could even join diluminati (don't worry if you don't know her) in saying that wet dreams are a sin too.

In any case, you may declare as much as you want that no man is morally pure but unless you can show me that you have examined all Christians and found none who is free of sin, I cannot accept your protestations.

That's just it. I don't have to examine all to show you that, I can simply use rational reasons and reasonable generalizations to show it. That is the nature of some scientific demonstrations and philosophical arguments.

Ihedinobi:
Check through the thread. I believe you'll find a response that I made to a comment resembling the one you made that an open cage is no bondage. That's the one I mean. I'm sorry it's a near-impossibility to dig it up on my phone.

I've checked and I didn't find such a response.

Ihedinobi:
No sir, I will not examine God's Righteousness with you.

I wonder why.

Ihedinobi:
I'm aware of societal practices. God is quite above them. Hell does represent punishment, but God does not punish as man does. I'm not willing to deal with that until we have sorted the present issues out.

As for deterrents, I know nobody who is a Christian according to the Bible's definition of the term that became one to escape hell. Whether contemporary or in the Bible.

Sure you don't but I do. Have you heard of Pascal's Wager? That is the premise of the entire argument and I know people who have been swayed by it.

Ihedinobi:
No need to fight over this. I have only said that I won't address it.

Who's fighting?