not to lie, at times I wonder if we have a country ? Imagine some ideeiot coming from cameroun or niger with no border all the way to kaduna, jos even Ogun to go kill farmers.

Fulanis are not the problem here it is this silly bororos

they always hostile to their host. there still enough gazing land in the north

alj harem:
not to lie, at times I wonder if we have a country ? Imagine some ideeiot coming from cameroun or niger with no border all the way to kaduna, jos even Ogun to go kill farmers.

Fulanis are not the problem here it is this silly bororos

Chameleon you don carry come.. lol

Wetin the topic say?
Did it say bororos or Fulani?
E be like say u just chop mad cow today!

The federal government should enlighten us, northerners/southerners, young and old, about the most commonly accepted cause of desertification?

OVERGRAZING!

Despite abundant scientific knowledge out there and all over the World and scientific community, why should anybody still be normadically grazing animals in 2012
Next, someone will tell it's their tradition, culture, or whatever. I say change it and get on aboard 2012. If people graze in their own lands, they will rotate and map plots of land for different seasons, like it's done all over the civilized world.

bashr8: why cant the fulanis buy lands for grazing afterall they make billions from sales of cows and nigerians buy them its not as if we get them for free, its buisness and not an act of patriotism. live stock farmers dont go about asking govt to give them land around the country for poutry or fish farming so why cow.

Your question clearly indicates that you are ignorant of our history and are looking for a naive and simplistic solution for a very complex problem.

Farmer-nomad conflict is second only to Boko Haram among dangers threatening Nigeria. Violence has erupted between nomads and farmers in Nasarawa, Taraba, Benue, Plateau and Adamawa states recently not to talk of similar conflicts in the SW, SE, and SS. I'd suggest you first read up and try to understand the root cause of these conflicts before suggesting dumb solutions.

Maybe your brother Akanbi_Edu can assist you with the education.

naijaking1:
Next, someone will tell it's their tradition, culture, or whatever. I say change it and get on aboard 2012. If people graze in their own lands, they will rotate and map plots of land for different seasons, like it's done all over the civilized world.

You know better than the post above. Stop pretending that the kind of social reengineering required for what you are suggesting has ever been done successfully anywhere in the world

ndu_chucks:

Your question clearly indicates that you are ignorant of our history and are looking for a naive and simplistic solution for a very complex problem.

Farmer-nomad conflict is second only to Boko Haram among dangers threatening Nigeria. Violence has erupted between nomads and farmers in Nasarawa, Taraba, Benue, Plateau and Adamawa states recently not to talk of similar conflicts in the SW, SE, and SS. I'd suggest you first read up and try to understand the root cause of these conflicts before suggesting dumb solutions.

Maybe your brother Akanbi_Edu can assist you with the education.

Mallam, do we stick our heads in the ground because it's "history"?
Sahara desert has been encroaching the north for many years now, and you can't figure out a scientific response instead of an appeal to so-called history?

We shouldn't even be talking about nomadic farming at this age . . . .

ndu_chucks:
You know better than the post above. Stop pretending that the kind of social reengineering required for what you are suggesting has ever been done successfully anywhere in the world

You know better than to argue what you don't know, instead of looking it up.

ndu_chucks:

Your question clearly indicates that you are ignorant of our history and are looking for a naive and simplistic solution for a very complex problem.

Farmer-nomad conflict is second only to Boko Haram among dangers threatening Nigeria. Violence has erupted between nomads and farmers in Nasarawa, Taraba, Benue, Plateau and Adamawa states recently not to talk of similar conflicts in the SW, SE, and SS. I'd suggest you first read up and try to understand the root cause of these conflicts before suggesting dumb solutions.

Maybe your brother Akanbi_Edu can assist you with the education.

You need to stop this line of reasoning.

Cattle farmers sell cattle for profit.

Why should society provide free land for cattle rearers?

Why are cattle farmers in the US and Europe not asking for free land?

If you want to raise cattle, then buy land for grazing and sort out your own logistics?

The problem here is that Fulani businessmen should be running this types of ventures but will not because they have their eyes on oil wells and contracts leaving the business to nomadic, illiterate, and irrational herdsmen who go around trespassing and destroying properties belonging to others.

Katsumoto:

You need to stop this line of reasoning.

Cattle farmers sell cattle for profit.

Why should society provide free land for cattle rearers?

Why are cattle farmers in the US and Europe not asking for free land?

If you want to raise cattle, then buy land for grazing and sort out your own logistics?

The problem here is that Fulani businessmen should be running this types of ventures but will not because they have their eyes on oil wells and contracts leaving the business to nomadic, illiterate, and irrational herdsmen who go around trespassing and destroying properties belonging to others.

Don't be surprised that I agree with your post in as much as we are talking about the settled Fulani. The Fulani were probably all nomads in times past, but some clans later settled in towns and villages (settled Fulani), while others continued nomadism (nomadic Fulani). The two groups are otherwise similar in all respects. However, while the settled Fulani see cattle-rearing as a hobby and businesses, the "nomadic Fulani" considers it a way of life.

The distiction is very important. You people calling for the destruction of the way of life of people who have been living in Nigeria since at least the 1500s are quite insensitive. We can find solutions to the problem but we must be sensitive to the way of live of the millions of herdsmen in question. I'm afraid until a reasonable and comprehensive solution is found, you people better learn how to fend off daggers and vicious sticks.

@ndu chuks

You know me and you are cool and all that, but please don't bring your bullllsh.it Hausa Fulani agenda to this sceintific topic. The link below is a purely academic work without regards to Nigerian politics. In the US, every 5th grader knows that overgrazing caused deserts, pure and simple

http://www4.uwsp.edu/geo/faculty/ritter/geog101/textbook/biogeography/desertification.html

Desertification
Desertification is the expansion of dry lands due to poor agricultural practices (e.g. overgrazing, degradation of soil fertility and structure), improper soil moisture management, salinization and erosion, forest removal, and climate change.
BE.43 Desertification in Africa
Courtesy FAO

Two common misconceptions prevail about desertification, that it spreads from a desert core and drought is responsible. Desertification spreads outward from any where excessive abuse of the land occurs and far from any climatic desert. Droughts do increase the possibility of desertification if the carrying capacity of non-irrigated land is exceeded. Well-managed land can recover from the effects of drought. Combining drought with land abuse sets the stage for desertification.

Cause of DesertificationDesertification comes about by a complex interaction between the natural environment and human activities. The cause may vary from region to region on account of economic conditions, population pressure, agricultural practices, and politics. Human activities that destroys surface vegetation, degrades soil structure and fertility, impedes water infiltration, and causes soil drying promotes desertification. This is especially true for the fragile transition zone between arid and semiarid land where human activity has stretched the ecosystem to its limit causing expansion of deserts.

Population growth and its demand on agricultural resources has promoted the desertification process. Over cultivation, for example, causes declining soil fertility leading to falling crop yields. Over use leads to crusting of exposed topsoil by rain and sun that increases runoff, water erosion and gullying. Soil drying promotes wind erosion and encroachment of sand dunes on arable land.

Overgrazing has several effects. It:

•Causes a decline in pasture vegetation and palatable grass species.
•Replaces perennials with short-lived annual species that do not hold soil against erosion.
•Compacts soil under trampling hoofs.
•Destabilizes dunes when crest vegetation is eaten.
Forest cutting for fuel wood has deforested large tracks of land in Africa and Asia encouraging desertification.






The guys in Wisconsin who did this study clearly don't think like you!

ndu_chucks:

Don't be surprised that I agree with your post in as much as we are talking about the settled Fulani. The Fulani were probably all nomads in times past, but some clans later settled in towns and villages (settled Fulani), while others continued nomadism (nomadic Fulani). The two groups are otherwise similar in all respects. However, while the settled Fulani see cattle-rearing as a hobby and businesses, the "nomadic Fulani" considers it a way of life.

The distiction is very important. You people calling for the destruction of the way of life of people who have been living in Nigeria since at least the 1500s are quite insensitive. We can find solutions to the problem but we must be sensitive to the way of live of the millions of herdsmen in question. I'm afraid until a reasonable and comprehensive solution is found, you people better learn how to fend off daggers and vicious sticks.

One person's right to live in a certain way MUST not and SHOULD not infringe upon the rights and properties of others.

If a group of Fulanis wants to live like nomads from Sokoto to River, then let them buy properties along their chosen trail.

Fulani's were not the only group living in present day Nigeria in the 16th century.

You can make light of the situation with regards to daggers and Fulani may well continue to maim and kill all over Nigeria but don't be surprised when others respond with a viciousness never before seen in Nigeria.

Mallam ndu chucks

So, you want us to help support Fulanis harm our own environment?
"It's been their culture since 1500 BC" you say? That's why the government must intervane, force them, jail them, or shoot them at sight if they refuse to give up their dangerous tradition. Every tribe gave up some ancient and unscietific tradition, why not your Fulani people.

There is almost no time to plead or educate them at this time, time is of the essence, especially given that all the funds made available for reforestation are stolen by the same people.
Theoritically, Lagos and Port Harcourt could become deserts within a few 100 years if we continue fooling around with these wandering Fulani grazers, instead of forcibly preventing them from killing all of us.

I can only laugh at the topic. Land rights ko, right lands ni. They for ask me to quit my house so they can turn it into a cattle ranch. These fulani will soon get what they deserve in Nigeria.

One thing is certain, the normads are not going to buy no land from anyone. Its best to accept this reality and come of with creative ways to solve the problem. Since no one has a way of reengineering the way of life of these nomads anytime soon, I've suggested the creation of federal reserve zones where these nomads can live with minimal negative impact on the rest of us. May I suggest that the rest of you suggest other possible solutions and lets see what we end up with.

@naijaking1, I don't think you can blame the Fulanis for decertification which is caused by population growth and its demand on agricultural resources which promote the desertification process. You cannot blame them for over cultivation either, for obvious reasons.

You cannot simply wish 15million nomads away, you've got to find proper solutions to the problems you are creating for them and those you believe they are causing for you.

ndu_chucks:

Your question clearly indicates that you are ignorant of our history and are looking for a naive and simplistic solution for a very complex problem.

Farmer-nomad conflict is second only to Boko Haram among dangers threatening Nigeria. Violence has erupted between nomads and farmers in Nasarawa, Taraba, Benue, Plateau and Adamawa states recently not to talk of similar conflicts in the SW, SE, and SS. I'd suggest you first read up and try to understand the root cause of these conflicts before suggesting dumb solutions.

Maybe your brother Akanbi_Edu can assist you with the education.




You know better than the post above. Stop pretending that the kind of social reengineering required for what you are suggesting has ever been done successfully anywhere in the world

north west alone is bigger than SE and SS put together, why dont you dedicate one or 2 states there , buy massive lands and graze in it, imagine the beroms waking up tomorrow to discover that federal govt gave fulanis their land in plateau for free to graze. besides the same way they want federal govt to give them land why dont they just buy the land, what do you do with all the billions you make from cattle trade? you dont build houses, you dont send your children to school , your not that materialistic like the south so pls do you cook and eat the money?

ndu_chucks:

Don't be surprised that I agree with your post in as much as we are talking about the settled Fulani. The Fulani were probably all nomads in times past, but some clans later settled in towns and villages (settled Fulani), while others continued nomadism (nomadic Fulani). The two groups are otherwise similar in all respects. However, while the settled Fulani see cattle-rearing as a hobby and businesses, the "nomadic Fulani" considers it a way of life.

The distiction is very important. You people calling for the destruction of the way of life of people who have been living in Nigeria since at least the 1500s are quite insensitive. We can find solutions to the problem but we must be sensitive to the way of live of the millions of herdsmen in question. I'm afraid until a reasonable and comprehensive solution is found, you people better learn how to fend off daggers and vicious sticks.

The solution is a simple one.......land use acts! Since you are making ancestral way of life the core pointer in your defense, it is at par to counter the push with ownership of native lands. Feferal govt is a tenant on native lands and thereby is unqualified to redistribute that land without the conswnt of natives. This will take us back to seeking redress in the constitution and particularly on the land act statutes. Fulani can make demands to have right of way to native lands, just as much that natives of tjat land has the right to deny and shut them out.

If however, the Federal governmrnt intervene to over-ride natives and award zones for Fulani to graze on thrir land, then it will be a discriminatoty practice without equally awarding rights of way to natives in traditionally fulani habitats. We know this is impractical. The end result is Fulani will have autonomy on land use throughout regions of Nigeria..

ndu_chucks: One thing is certain, the normads are not going to buy no land from anyone. Its best to accept this reality and come of with creative ways to solve the problem. Since no one has a way of reengineering the way of life of these nomads anytime soon, I've suggested the creation of federal reserve zones where these nomads can live with minimal negative impact on the rest of us. May I suggest that the rest of you suggest other possible solutions and lets see what we end up with.

@naijaking1, I don't think you can blame the Fulanis for decertification which is caused by population growth and its demand on agricultural resources has promoted the desertification process. You cannot blame them for over cultivation either, for obvious reasons.

You cannot simply wish 15million nomads away, you've got to find proper solutions to the problems you are creating for them and those you believe they are causing for you.

Oh! Now you increased their number from 12 mil to 15 mil. Bunch of 7th century liars.
Those people who are knifing and stabbing innocent property owners will soon feel the loss of all patience by those they harass. And by the way, the fulani coming out to ask for this silly right indicates they are already feeling the heat of their fights with land owners. It is a matter of time and the normadic life will be squeezed outta them for good.

ndu_chucks:

Don't be surprised that I agree with your post in as much as we are talking about the settled Fulani. The Fulani were probably all nomads in times past, but some clans later settled in towns and villages (settled Fulani), while others continued nomadism (nomadic Fulani). The two groups are otherwise similar in all respects. However, while the settled Fulani see cattle-rearing as a hobby and businesses, the "nomadic Fulani" considers it a way of life.

The distiction is very important. You people calling for the destruction of the way of life of people who have been living in Nigeria since at least the 1500s are quite insensitive. We can find solutions to the problem but we must be sensitive to the way of live of the millions of herdsmen in question. I'm afraid until a reasonable and comprehensive solution is found, you people better learn how to fend off daggers and vicious sticks.

i have nothign against the culture or way of life but its wrong to venture into someones property and no culture permits that, buy the lands yourselves, you dont even need to venture south theres a enough land in the north , i used to think the north was all desert till i saw pictures the other of northern states ,its actually as green as the south and with such a large land mass there will be less issues of land disputes unlike the south so whats the problem ?

bashr8: i have nothign against the culture or way of life but its wrong to venture into someones property and no culture permits that, buy the lands yourselves, you dont even need to venture south theres a enough land in the north , i used to think the north was all desert till i saw pictures the other of northern states ,its actually as green as the south and with such a large land mass there will be less issues of land disputes unlike the south so whats the problem ?

Lol. All the good lands, like those you see in the photos you mentioned, have been taken over by the northern military and political elites. There no longer is any free good land in the North. All that is left is eroded, flooded or desertified land. That is why the normads venture south steadily.

Dudu_Negro:

The solution is a simple one.......land use acts! Since you are making ancestral way of life the core pointer in your defense, it is at par to counter the push with ownership of native lands. Feferal govt is a tenant on native lands and thereby is unqualified to redistribute that land without the conswnt of natives. This will take us back to seeking redress in the constitution and particularly on the land act statutes. Fulani can make demands to have right of way to native lands, just as much that natives of tjat land has the right to deny and shut them out.

If however, the Federal governmrnt intervene to over-ride natives and award zones for Fulani to graze on thrir land, then it will be a discriminatoty practice without equally awarding rights of way to natives in traditionally fulani habitats. We know this is impractical. The end result is Fulani will have autonomy on land use throughout regions of Nigeria..

How do you define native land and natives for that matter? Just so you know, tha land area along the paths which herdsman take to travel from North to South, East to West, have been considered their own land for centuries. If the herdsmen had had a different lifestyle, they would have possibly been natives of areas in every region in Nigeria according to conventional definition of natives. In their minds, you people are the ones encroaching on their generational properties. We cannot dismiss this reality, but consider it in proffering a lasting solution. These people are Nigerians as well.


Bashr8 & FSU, with due respect, Egbe ndi Israeli piafuka gi isi. mumus

asha 80:

what is wrong in grazing lands in the north?

pls help me to ask them. The northern part of 9ja can accomodate them as for south am against it.

ndu_chucks:

How do you define native land and natives for that matter? Just so you know, tha land area along the paths which herdsman take to travel from North to South, East to West, have been considered their own land for centuries. If the herdsmen had had a different lifestyle, they would have possibly been natives of areas in every region in Nigeria according to conventional definition of natives. In their minds, you people are the ones encroaching on their generational properties. We cannot dismiss this reality, but consider it in proffering a lasting solution. These people are Nigerians as well.


Bashr8 & FSU, with due respect, Egbe ndi Israeli piafuka gi isi. mumus

so if nigeria divides will it also be their own lands ? from your logic fulanis own every part of nigeria.

naijaking1: Mallam ndu chucks

So, you want us to help support Fulanis harm our own environment?
"It's been their culture since 1500 BC" you say? That's why the government must intervane, force them, jail them, or shoot them at sight if they refuse to give up their dangerous tradition. Every tribe gave up some ancient and unscietific tradition, why not your Fulani people.

There is almost no time to plead or educate them at this time, time is of the essence, especially given that all the funds made available for reforestation are stolen by the same people.
Theoritically, Lagos and Port Harcourt could become deserts within a few 100 years if we continue fooling around with these wandering Fulani grazers, instead of forcibly preventing them from killing all of us.

lol, I missed this hilarious post.

nwanne m, you live in the USA, ko? Why didn't the US government kill off the red Indians who refuse to give up their way of life, but instead set aside designated areas for them within the US called Indian Reservations?

You make the lovely Fulani grazers into some murderers while your people continue to worship your government officials who have directly and indirectly murdered thousands of you. Which kind double standard bethis?

Wait, till a smart southern businessman goes to buy a 1000 hecter land in some God forsaken desert land in the north, fences it, irrigates it, and plants grazing grass as they do in Texas, then you'll see some lazy local politician wake up from his sleep and ask him to go back to Igboland the day cattle grazing begins on the land.

naijaking1: Wait, till a smart southern businessman goes to buy a 1000 hecter land in some God forsaken desert land in the north, fences it, irrigates it, and plants grazing grass as they do in Texas, then you'll see some lazy local politician wake up from his sleep and ask him to go back to Igboland the day cattle grazing begins on the land.

i know some igbo men already providing such services with mostly with the northern trailer drivers , they buy large space of land ,provide security , mini lodges and even mini bank and charge them for services , hmmmmmmm there will always be buisness opportunities in naija. i think one of the northern elites wanted to do something like dat cant remember how it ended.

ndu_chucks:


lol, I missed this hilarious post.

nwanne m, you live in the USA, ko? Why didn't the US government kill off the red Indians who refuse to give up their way of life, but instead set aside designated areas for them within the US called Indian Reservations?

You make the lovely Fulani grazers into some murderers while your people continue to worship your government officials who have directly and indirectly murdered thousands of you. Which kind double standard bethis?

I tell you what the double standard is. It's when Nigerian Fulanis think and act as they're entitled to everything in Nigeria, even grazing cattle in my home town by force. Who is the red Indian here Obviously other non-Fulanis from Plateau to Nassarawa, to Benue, to Imo, to Ogun are the Indians. Otherwise, there is no way any Nigerian Fulani would have such a sense of ownership over other Nigerians as to speak about grazing right in all 36 states.
Note, Isaid Nigeria Fulanis, The Ghananian Fulanis are much more respectful, hardworking, and honest. Since after Othman Dan Fodio killed many northern kings, the Fulanis have always had a pervated sense of entittlement in Nigeria.
It's like the Igbos asking fom free stockfish(Okporoko)from the federal government, because afterall, it part of their culture. Don't mind that all the nutritional value of okporoko had been removed by factories in Norway.

Fulani can designate as much fulani land for grazing as they want. If you venture towards other people's land, you are looking for trouble and trouble you would get. Even if FG designate people's land to them, it would not fly with others. What they are asking for is an act of war. And 12 million fulani herdsmen? Common men you are not talking to babies.

ndu_chucks:


lol, I missed this hilarious post.

nwanne m, you live in the USA, ko? Why didn't the US government kill off the red Indians who refuse to give up their way of life, but instead set aside designated areas for them within the US called Indian Reservations?

You make the lovely Fulani grazers into some murderers while your people continue to worship your government officials who have directly and indirectly murdered thousands of you. Which kind double standard bethis?

Red Indians are indigenous to the US; are Fulani indigenous to all parts of Nigeria? Red Indians were herded into reservations to 'compensate' them for stealing their lands. Who stole land from the Fulani? Your analogy is way off-point.

Try something else

ndu_chucks:

How do you define native land and natives for that matter? Just so you know, tha land area along the paths which herdsman take to travel from North to South, East to West, have been considered their own land for centuries. If the herdsmen had had a different lifestyle, they would have possibly been natives of areas in every region in Nigeria according to conventional definition of natives. In their minds, you people are the ones encroaching on their generational properties. We cannot dismiss this reality, but consider it in proffering a lasting solution. These people are Nigerians as well.


Bashr8 & FSU, with due respect, Egbe ndi Israeli piafuka gi isi. mumus

What sort of 'my father is the president of the united states' lie is this?

First, only a thief and scoundrel would think that a travelling path belongs to him.

Second, before the arrival of the British, the Eastern part of the country hadn't seen the Fulani. The West had but only so far as they were Muslim scholars, horse traders, or warriors.

Any talk of Fulani herdsmen travelling from Sokoto all the way to Lagos is just a big fat fccuking lie.

Katsumoto:

What sort of 'my father is the president of the united states' lie is this?

First, only a thief and scoundrel would think that a travelling path belongs to him.

Second, before the arrival of the British, the Eastern part of the country hadn't seen the Fulani. The West had but only so far as they were Muslim scholars, horse traders, or warriors.

Any talk of Fulani herdsmen travelling from Sokoto all the way to Lagos is just a big fat fccuking lie.

Mallam has been known to spin out of control with many improper analogies at times.
While Ghananian Fulanis are working their tails off here in NYC for example, their Nigerian brothers are plotting how to over-run the country with the help of their cattle.

Malam _chucks, the quesion again.

bashr8:
why cant the fulanis buy lands for grazing afterall they make billions from sales of cows and nigerians buy them its not as if we get them for free, its buisness and not an act of patriotism. live stock farmers dont go about asking govt to give them land around the country for poutry or fish farming so why cow.[/size]

____ Fulanis are in cattle as a business concern, not charity. They sell cows to other Nigerians like them.

____ Farmers in Nigeria are equally in business, sell farm produce to other Nigerians.

Now, Fulanis' business is affecting other business (farming) in every part of the country.

Why should land be given, free, to the Fulani? considering The nomads are into business and not some charity? More so, the nomadic fulani is more often than not taking care of the cattle on behalf of the "big men".