ldpele: keep moving from church to church,dnt keep ua Bottom one place,mayb u might end up opening ua own n u ll tell us here how mch tithe n offering u av giving to the poor

How does being in Christ Embassy for many years equal moving from church to church? You just commented on something you know nothing about.

Why should I tell you about how much tithe and offering I'm giving to the poor and what does that have to do with my explanation of the process behind the "bestselling" label that's put on Rhapsodies?

The poor quality of the content of your statement is matched only by the poor quality of the style it's written in.

ldpele: wasnt xpectn a palm tree to see any meaningful thing in that statement

Stop wasting your bandwidth, just read the thread and go

lanre_front:

Your assertions, or is it ideas are completely untrue; the bulk of the pentecostal church's wealth, like Redeem, Winners, MFM, and so many others comes from tithes of members.

Please stop spewing nonsense.

So Reedeem empire or Winnerd Empire was built from sales of books. Pleae say something else.

my guy your logic is very poor, do u work in any of the above churches? Show us proof( not hearsay) that they use the tithes to fuel their wealth? If not ,then you are the big liar, assumption is the lowest form of intelligence.

Claus:

My only other comment would be to say that this is not the true commercial reflection of the sales of the books. I was in Christ Embassy for many years. Most Rhapsodies are bought by members as a form of partnership with the intention of giving them out for free to the public. There are still hundreds of Rhapsodies from as far back as 2004 that our local church (at the time) stored in our garage coz they hadn't been given out.

Most committed adult members would buy 10-50 Rhapsodies each per month at £2 per Rhapsody. They take some away to distribute (free) individually and sometimes leave some for the church to distribute (free) corporately. This is the unknown process behind it being a "bestseller".

God bless you bro. I've personally never been inside a Christ Embassy church (and I don't intend to) but I was once in the pastorate of another local church, and a friend who pastored at CEC told me the above, this was why I said it confidently earlier on in the thread. I'm glad to get a witness that I was not lied to.

Another thing I was told is that CEC members are instructed not to attend other churches lest their hearts be poisoned by adulterated word. That made me sad but I guess that's discussion for another day.

InesQor:

God bless you bro. I've personally never been inside a Christ Embassy church (and I don't intend to) but I was once in the pastorate of another local church, and a friend who pastored at CEC told me the above, this was why I said it confidently earlier on in the thread. I'm glad to get a witness that I was not lied to.

Another thing I was told is that CEC members are instructed not to attend other churches lest their hearts be poisoned by adulterated word. That made me sad but I guess that's discussion for another day.

My eyes have seen CEC student members who could not even eat yet they contributed to that rhapsody business, each time someone walks up to me on the street to give me a "free" copy and of course collect my address i just give him the hand like sssssh and go away.

PapaBrowne:

How much do tithes and offerings contribute to a church really. Its very meagre. Pastor Ayo has just one church no branches per say and its based in Warri. It has maybe like maximum of 20,000 members. Half that population would be children. Another half would be jobless stay at home moms with no salary whatsoever. Add that to the numerous graduates without jobs. You might end up with 5000 tithe paying members.

In a country with GDP of $2500 per annum, a 10% tithe would equate to $250. Multiply that by 5,000 tithe paying members and you end up with a maximum of $1.25 Million in a year. Now can this figure you a freaking jet. Na it would take you at least 10 years of doing nothing else to buy a jet.

Truth is these guys get more money from books,gifts and speaking engagements than they will ever get from church offerings and tithes. I have seen small time pastors who recieve brand new car gifts from members. My friends father is a pastor of a 1000 member church. One of his members built him a house. So I dont see why its impossible for church members to buy a jet for their leader.

I believe though that the church is no doing enough in terms of charity. Much of what we have as hospitals and schools are remnants from the missionaries of yesteryear. If today's church does the same, the story would be absolutely different.

from ur analysis of the probanle economic situation of the church u presented, where did they get the money to buy him a jet of over forty million dollars not naira, haba, from one single church.

PapaBrowne:

They already do all that. Its just that we like talking without researching. The Church in question(Pastor Ayo's) has a Micro-finance bank and it helps lots of entrepreneurs with loans for businesses. I am not a fan of extravagance, and neither do I like the excesses of many churches but common sense would tell you that people wopuld not keep going to these churches in numbers if they are being fleeced without benefit.
When you go through a church you see lots of big cars, chubby looking fellows and well dress folks. You hardly see poverty, I can tell you that for sure.

Cut this out. We all know it's a campaign plane for jonathan's 2015 bid . You will soon here , Jesus endorses Jonathan. And why not of jonathan gives you a jet?

I am surprised that this garrulous Ayo, who cannot shut his mouth is now speechless!

Jobless pple......S̶̲̥̅hε̲̣̣̣̥γ̲̣̣̥ church Ŋa̶̲̥̅ federal govt wey go dey settle pple?.......u all beta pray 4 D̶̲̥̅̊ nigerian govt A̶̲̥̅̊η∂ stop bugging D̶̲̥̅̊ man of ĠƠ̴̴̴̴̴̴͡D̶̲̥̅̊. Per say aw much did any of u contributed b4 dey purchased D̶̲̥̅̊ jet?...itz beta u start hustling nw instead of talking nonsense after all were 4 bible ĠƠ̴̴̴̴̴̴͡D̶̲̥̅̊ talk say make pastors no enjoy D̶̲̥̅̊ gud tinz of life?

How many Jets can the Pope boast off? What of the ArchBishop of Canterbury. My friend one thing is for sure, Nigerian pastors have style. If your pastor don't have a jet in this day and age then whats he doing wrong {some might say right} that is preventing him from getting one?



SEE STYLE

pipmaster77: All of you have raised your points and express your opinion. I do not like to comment on church matter because before you even know what you are doing, you have start to offend God. Churches/Pastors are majorly meant to help members or people spiritually and this spiritual help will then translate to physical help in the life of members or people. These members or people have obligation to bless/give the pastor or spiritual leader physical blessings. Matthew 10 vs 5 - 10.

Can you imagine almost of the financial blessings or breakthrough that we read in the bible happening today. Many people and even government would have prosecute the pastor or priest. Read the case of Elijah and the widow of Zarephath in 1 Kings 17 vs 7 - 24. It looks good when reading it in the bible but what will you say if a man of God ask you to prepare him the last food in your house or give him your savings?

Do you remember the case of Moses in the bible when he violated the laws he personally received from God and delivered to his followers. He married a foreign woman and Miriam and Aron accused him, God was angry with them and leprous covered Miriam and it's the same Moses who prayed for her cure. See Number 12 vs 1-16.

I do not support excessive both in the church and in government but government can easily be judge because there is a constitution that stipulate what and what but come to church and pastors, there is no such constitution. God is the one that called them and they did not called themselves and it's the same God who can justly judge them not us. We may complain about them at times because we feel they are not doing much but often we are wrong because what most of them are doing is more than what our government is doing but some are not publishing it because if they start doing it, we will still be the same person to blame them for glorifying themselves.

God allow them to do most of the things we complain about. When God call them, we were not there and also when He speak to them and tell them what to do we were not also there and if a man of God says God told him to do something, a wise man must not argue with him but only judge the statement by the result or leave it for time to judge. When we are sleeping these men of God are awake praying for the growth of their church (members and the nation at large), when we go to party and club to enjoy or celebrate with love ones these men of God are on mountains waiting on the Lord.

One of the problem we have is this. You and I know what some amount of money can do for us and for others and where we can enjoy the money or what we can use the money to achieve and that's why we keep fighting men of God but we have forgotten that most of them if not all use these things (Private jet, Houses and Cars) for the Gospel. Have they ever fly the jet to hotel to sleep with a woman or to Dubai for holiday like you and I will do if we have it. Many of them fast more that half of the days in a years and yet they have money to eat whatever they want to eat. Fellow Nigerians let us leave them alone and let God judge them. They are not forcing any member to buy them asset, they only preach and at times tell you their need for the Gospel or avenue for you to secure financial blessing but finally decision lies with you. Someone said in the comments that he and his brother were ashamed and because of it bought the pastor's book. In the first instance, who asked you to see the pastor? Is it the pastor? or you chose to because you believe him or you want him to solve your problem. Have you not see it in the bible where God says you should not appear before him empty handed or have you ever find it in the whole bible where God told Israelite to find out how priests are eating the offerings or what they do with them. God ask them to bring offering to him and priests are the representatives of God and God is the one to judge priests not the people or else their offerings will not be called offerings but savings. For those of you that goes to herbalist or Alfa, have you ever challenge or question them on how they use your offering.

To go to church and give tithe or offering is a commandment of God but you can choose to obey it or ignore it. Every church is not meant for everybody and if you have been going from church to church stop it and ask God for the one to go. There are poor people around you when you decided to take your girlfriend to fast food join or your children to see a movie why not give the same money to the one that is hungry in your neighborhood. There are people that can not afford their children's school fees but you chose to buy that car or build that your first house why not consider them too. There are people who can not afford money for their hospital bill and begging on media everyday for support but you chose to boarded flight to your destination because our roads are not good or you want to save time. You wear good clothes while others do not have any to where why don't you buy more fairly use (OK) clothes and give some to them. This list can go on and on. You might think you do not have enough of good things of this life and therefore you think some big men are living excessive lives but I tell you today someone in your neighborhood is saying you have more than enough to help them but you chose not to because they have seen you eating fried chicken and maintaining cable TV and I pass my neighbor generator in that you one room apartment.

Let's pray for men of God instead of castigating them or try and start a church and see how easy it is. Motivational speakers studied bible and other books and go to speak but because Pastor is not add to his/her name no one question how he/she spend the proceed. If you are a Christian everything you do suppose to be in the name of God even that your very job but have you question how you spend your salary or have you try to question why should a bank MD be paying million of Naira as salary every month when all his/her expenses are paid for by the same bank.

To grow a church is more difficult than to grow any business. If you think it is a lie, go out today and preach to someone and make sure the person accept your Gospel and follow you to church and the person become committed member then you will reduce or completely stop blaming pastor for their life style. They are not voted for but ordained by God and it's only God that can truly and justly just them. If God favors you today and people begin to buy you assets, will you reject them? So why do you want men of God to reject gifts? Or not use good things of life because they are pastors? The school you went to or you are now, is there different school fee for pastors' children? These men of God are children, husbands/wives, fathers/mothers and friends of other people and they must perform their responsibility as human being.

I do not want to full this place with words but if you think you want to know more about bible teaching concerning men of God, you can send mail to olaleye.matthew@gmail.com

Bro. Olaleye Matthew Olaniyi

I'm sorry to say this, but whoever you are, you do not read your Bible!!!!! Go and read about the early church in Acts of Apostles Chapter 2 vs 44 - 47, Chapter 4 vs 32 - 37 and then come back with your understanding of church. If the church is not about charity, then it has no business existing in the first place.

To some of you who say they profit from books, I will ask: Did Jesus sell his message? Are Pastors supposed to sell salvation? Don't get me wrong, if they sell at cost price, then they are ok and I want to assume that they do. So, there should be no profiting from sale of tapes and books.

One big question I have been asking all supporters of "these men of God" is "Would Jesus buy a jet or accept it as a gift in a country where about 61% of the people live in abject poverty (stats from Natural Bureau of staristics, 2010)?". Jesus rode to Jerusalem on a borrowed donkey (recall people already own horses and chariots in those days).

STYLE

why cant you guys just liv all these MOG alone and face your life? he just xplain it to you that he gives no damm,how long will it take us discusin issues of PRIVATE JET

geez*:
It will cost a minimum of $300,000 to fly a privately owned bombardier jet from Lagos-London (aircraft parking fees, fueling, landing, takeoff etc)

Can't these and the cost of acquiring the jet be used to better the lot of even some of his impoverished church members?

If I owned a church, I would use the money generated to fund entrepreneurial schools and finance the students' businesses afterwards and also give to charity

There are damn too many people in need in the Niger Delta

thats not right. how much will it cost to maintain a dreamliner? Even the passenger numbers when full won't cover cost?

floriana: Adeboye's law of sowing and reaping:

1. Sow N1,000 reap N10,000
2. Sow Toyota Camry 2006 reap Camry 2012
3. Sow your entire salary, reap the position of MD in your workplace
4. Sow your lifesavings, reap central bank of Nigeria
5. Sow 500KVA Mikano generator, reap NEPA
6. Sow private jet, reap jumbo jet + International. airport to serve as plane park
7. Sow your first son, reap. Dangote
8. Sow your wife, reap Dame Patience Jonathan
9 sow your flat backside, reap Beyonce + Kim Kadarshian backsides
10. Sow an estate, reap, Lagos state.

Pastor Adeboye is not ur mate. Watch what u say. U may think u are catching fun or u re making people laugh by saying all these, but watch it. That is all i have to say to u.

PapaBrowne:

They already do all that. Its just that we like talking without researching. The Church in question(Pastor Ayo's) has a Micro-finance bank and it helps lots of entrepreneurs with loans for businesses. I am not a fan of extravagance, and neither do I like the excesses of many churches but common sense would tell you that people wopuld not keep going to these churches in numbers if they are being fleeced without benefit.

Then why did I hoard of others stop if it was benefiting me. We opened my eyes. Open yours my brother

When you go through a church you see lots of big cars, chubby looking fellows and well dress folks. You hardly see poverty, I can tell you that for sure.

So to you that's your definition of prosperity abi. You are void of reasoning my friend. Define vanity? Big cars, chubby looking fellows and well dressed folks. This is not christianity. Your example is the reason why people will go to any length to be like you've just defined. Nigeria is just worsening with the introduction of this bullshit in churches

PapaBrowne:

They already do all that. Its just that we like talking without researching. The Church in question(Pastor Ayo's) has a Micro-finance bank and it helps lots of entrepreneurs with loans for businesses. I am not a fan of extravagance, and neither do I like the excesses of many churches but common sense would tell you that people wopuld not keep going to these churches in numbers if they are being fleeced without benefit.

Then why did I and a hoard of others stop if it was benefiting me. We opened my eyes. Open yours my brother

When you go through a church you see lots of big cars, chubby looking fellows and well dress folks. You hardly see poverty, I can tell you that for sure.

So to you that's your definition of prosperity abi. You are void of reasoning my friend. Define vanity? Big cars, chubby looking fellows and well dressed folks. This is not christianity. Your example is the reason why people will go to any length to be like you've just defined. Nigeria is just worsening with the introduction of this bullshit concept in churches.
Poverty makes churches preach prosperity. When evryone is ok nko? They will start preaching how to keep ur prosperity or How to find more prosperity from GOd