I'm curious.

No childish fighting and immature abusing on this thread please.

If you say the Bible says so, give sensibly polite responses only, with scriptural backing either implicitly or explicitly. If you think otherwise, kindly also state your reasons politely.

Adeboye's law of sowing and reaping:

1. Sow N1,000 reap N10,000
2. Sow Toyota Camry 2006 reap Camry 2012
3. Sow your entire salary, reap the position of MD in your workplace
4. Sow your lifesavings, reap central bank of Nigeria
5. Sow 500KVA Mikano generator, reap NEPA
6. Sow private jet, reap jumbo jets + International airport to serve as plane-park
7. Sow your first son, reap Dangote
8. Sow your wife, reap Dame Patience Jonathan
9 sow your flat backside, reap Beyonce + Kim Kadarshian backsides
10. Sow an estate, reap, Lagos state.

floriana: Adeboye's law of sowing and reaping:

1. Sow N1,000 reap N10,000
2. Sow Toyota Camry 2006 reap Camry 2012
3. Sow your entire salary, reap the position of MD in your workplace
4. Sow your lifesavings, reap central bank of Nigeria
5. Sow 500KVA Mikano generator, reap NEPA
6. Sow private jet, reap jumbo jets + International airport to serve as plane-park
7. Sow your first son, reap Dangote
8. Sow your wife, reap Dame Patience Jonathan
9 sow your flat backside, reap Beyonce + Kim Kadarshian backsides
10. Sow an estate, reap, Lagos state.

Appears you're on the wrong thread.

Nice thread InesQor, subscribing....lets discuss this with all honesty & scriptural backings! Brb

InesQor: I'm curious.

No childish fighting and immature abusing on this thread please.

If you say the Bible says so, give sensibly polite responses only, with scriptural backing either implicitly or explicitly. If you think otherwise, kindly also state your reasons politely.

Already sounding funny, describing a pastor as misbehaving is very wrong

seriallink: Nice thread InesQor, subscribing....lets discuss this with all honesty & scriptural backings! Brb

Thanks! Will be expecting your response.

Azibalua:
Already sounding funny, describing a pastor as misbehaving is very wrong

I don't get you, are you trying to say that pastors are above misdemeanours, infractions, and even crimes against a church or society or state or nation?

Maybe I should have started by asking if a pastor is able to misbehave. Kindly shed light on that.

(Edited to add: words in red)

Azibalua:


Already sounding funny, describing a pastor as misbehaving is very wrong

Are you saying there are no false prophets/pastors/MOGs?

Scriptures says:

2Corinthians 11:13-15 For such are false apostles, deceitful workers, transforming themselves into the apostles of Christ. 14 And no marvel; for Satan himself is transformed into an angel of light.15 Therefore [it is] no great thing if his ministers also be transformed as the ministers of righteousness; whose end shall be according to their works.

Matthew 7:15-16 Beware of false prophets, which come to you in sheep's clothing, but inwardly they are ravening wolves.16 Ye shall know them by their fruits. Do men gather grapes of thorns, or figs of thistles?

Matthew 24:4-5 And Jesus answered and said unto them, Take heed that no man deceive you. 5 For many shall come in my name, saying, I am Christ; and shall deceive many.

1Timothy 4:1-2 Now the Spirit speaketh expressly, that in the latter times some shall depart from the faith, giving heed to seducing spirits, and doctrines of devils; 2 Speaking lies in hypocrisy; having their conscience seared with a hot iron;

2Peter 2:1 But there were false prophets also among the people, even as there shall be false teachers among you, who privily shall bring in damnable heresies, even denying the Lord that bought them, and bring upon themselves swift destruction.

Subscribing to this wonderful thread in the mighty name of Jesus, Amen. Again, thank you seriallink and thank you InesQor for this wonderful thread. The truth is, Jesus dealt with the false religious people in his days who had turned the place of worship then into a den of thieves which can mean or be interpreted as the "misbehaving pastors" of our days. Jesus is NOT physically here now to deal with such misconduct but Christ had put the true believers in charge on earth and true believers have right to deal with them the false ones, chase them out of business and expose them.

Take a look at this scripture as one of my favourites to exposing "false christian" because my brother Joagbaje once said a christian cannot be called false and I showed him this scripture,

New Living Translation (©2007)
Even that question came up only because of some so-called Christians there--false ones, really--who were secretly brought in. They sneaked in to spy on us and take away the freedom we have in Christ Jesus. They wanted to enslave us and force us to follow their Jewish regulations. - Galatians 2:4

New International Version (©1984)
And no wonder, for Satan himself masquerades as an angel of light. It is not surprising, then, if his servants masquerade as servants of righteousness. Their end will be what their actions deserve. - II Corinthians 11:14-15

Oh my goodness! The beauty of scripture comes out so alive when you do a word study along side your study. As of masquerading in the natural, kindly do some word study on "masquerading" and see for yourself. Glory to God!

seriallink:

Are you saying there are no false prophets/pastors/MOGs?

Scriptures says:

2Corinthians 11:13-15 For such are false apostles, deceitful workers, transforming themselves into the apostles of Christ. 14 And no marvel; for Satan himself is transformed into an angel of light.15 Therefore [it is] no great thing if his ministers also be transformed as the ministers of righteousness; whose end shall be according to their works.

Matthew 7:15-16 Beware of false prophets, which come to you in sheep's clothing, but inwardly they are ravening wolves.16 Ye shall know them by their fruits. Do men gather grapes of thorns, or figs of thistles?

Matthew 24:4-5 And Jesus answered and said unto them, Take heed that no man deceive you. 5 For many shall come in my name, saying, I am Christ; and shall deceive many.

1Timothy 4:1-2 Now the Spirit speaketh expressly, that in the latter times some shall depart from the faith, giving heed to seducing spirits, and doctrines of devils; 2 Speaking lies in hypocrisy; having their conscience seared with a hot iron;

2Peter 2:1 But there were false prophets also among the people, even as there shall be false teachers among you, who privily shall bring in damnable heresies, even denying the Lord that bought them, and bring upon themselves swift destruction.

Thanks bro. God bless you!

you have to define what you mean by "misbehaving" first.

to me, misbehaving implies doing [or espousing] something that is in direct contradiction to God's word, while to others, misbehaving means the pastor or minister preached something they disagree with, or would prefer to argue about.

so, what type of misbehaving are we referring to here.

Goshen360: Subscribing to this wonderful thread in the mighty name of Jesus, Amen. Again, thank you seriallink and thank you InesQor for this wonderful thread. The truth is, Jesus dealt with the false religious people in his days who had turned the place of worship then into a den of thieves which can "misbehaving pastors" of our days. Jesus is NOT physically here now to deal with such misconduct but Christ had put the true believers in charge on earth and true believers have right to deal with them the false ones, chase them out of business and expose them.

Take a look at this scripture as one of my favourites to exposing "false christian" because my brother Joagbaje once said a christian cannot be called false and I showed him this scripture,

New Living Translation (©2007)
Even that question came up only because of some so-called Christians there--false ones, really--who were secretly brought in. They sneaked in to spy on us and take away the freedom we have in Christ Jesus. They wanted to enslave us and force us to follow their Jewish regulations. - Galatians 2:4

New International Version (©1984)
And no wonder, for Satan himself masquerades as an angel of light. It is not surprising, then, if his servants masquerade as servants of righteousness. Their end will be what their actions deserve. - II Corinthians 11:14-15

Oh my goodness! The beauty of scripture comes out so alive when you do a word study along side your study. As of masquerading in the natural, kindly do some word study on "masquerading" and see for yourself. Glory to God!

GBAM left right and centre!!! Thanks for your contribution! God bless.

Any takers to defend against the above, comparing scriptures with scriptures? Azibalua? Maybe Joagbaje (seeing he was mentioned above)?

tpia1: you have to define what you mean by "misbehaving" first.

to me, misbehaving implies doing [or espousing] something that is in direct contradiction to God's word, while to others, misbehaving means the pastor or minister preached something they disagree with, or would prefer to argue about.

so, what type of misbehaving are we referring to here.

Misbehaviour would mean acting contrary to Christian values (first thing you said). e.g. 1 Thessalonians 5:22 "Flee all appearances of evil", which would be good behaviour.

But this first example may also include the second thing you mentioned e.g. preaching something scripturally disagreeable or untruthful or twisting the word for personal gain or plainly wicked. e.g. Colossians 3:9 “Lie not one to another.” and Ephesians 4:25 “..Speak every man truth with his neighbour.” and Zechariah 8:19 “…Love the truth and peace.”

Rather than allow such people continue spreading falsehood, Titus 1:11 says, "They must be silenced because they are ruining whole families by teaching what they shouldn’t teach. This is the shameful way they make money." (GWV)

Now let me move over to the other camp. Let us assume that the pastors in consideration are not misbehaving. This would mean that they are of good behaviour right? Then shouldn't they follow the scripture below?

But in your hearts set apart Christ as Lord. Always be prepared to give an answer to everyone who asks you to give the reason for the hope that you have. But do this with gentleness and respect, keeping a clear conscience, so that those who speak maliciously against your good behavior in Christ may be ashamed of their slander. 1 Peter 3:15-16

The scripture above teaches that when your good behaviour in Christ is spoken of maliciously, you should be ready to answer to scrutiny, and to do it with gentleness and respect. SO if they were actually of good behaviour, why can't we "judge" i.e. question them?

^
My brother, "judge not and touch not my anointed" is a false teaching from the pit of hell. Those who don't want to answer to scriptural scrutiny always have skeleton in their wardrobe. Every Christian, irrespective of being a pastor or not is suppose to be transparent in his/her deal(ings).

King James 2000 Bible (©2003)
Do you not know that the saints shall judge the world? and if the world shall be judged by you, are you unworthy to judge the smallest matters? - I Corinthians 6:2

As we (Christians) are to judge or shall judge the world, we are judge among ourselves. When Jesus said,

New Living Translation (©2007)
"Do not judge others, and you will not be judged. For you will be treated as you treat others. The standard you use in judging is the standard by which you will be judged. "And why worry about a speck in your friend's eye when you have a log in your own? How can you think of saying to your friend, 'Let me help you get rid of that speck in your eye,' when you can't see past the log in your own eye? Hypocrite! First get rid of the log in your own eye; then you will see well enough to deal with the speck in your friend's eye. - Matthew 7:1-5

Our Lord is talking about hypocritical judgment in context whereby someone who steals condemn or judge another thief. When you judge other, make sure you are not doing the same thing you are judging the person on. The scripture is crystal clear on believers judging ourselves and ANY MoG is NOT excluded when he/she misbehaves because a pastor is first a Christian before being a pastor. Need I say more? Judge among yourselves......

^
^
^
Besides, the above was fully developed in the Epistle. Romans 2:21-25.....Read for yourself, am tired of quoting scriptures for now.

Goshen360: ^
My brother, "judge not and touch not my anointed" is a false teaching from the pit of hell. Those who don't want to answer to scriptural scrutiny always have skeleton in their wardrobe. Every Christian, irrespective of being a pastor or not is suppose to be transparent in his/her deal(ings).

King James 2000 Bible (©2003)
Do you not know that the saints shall judge the world? and if the world shall be judged by you, are you unworthy to judge the smallest matters? - I Corinthians 6:2

As we (Christians) are to judge or shall judge the world, we are judge among ourselves. When Jesus said,

New Living Translation (©2007)
"Do not judge others, and you will not be judged. For you will be treated as you treat others. The standard you use in judging is the standard by which you will be judged. "And why worry about a speck in your friend's eye when you have a log in your own? How can you think of saying to your friend, 'Let me help you get rid of that speck in your eye,' when you can't see past the log in your own eye? Hypocrite! First get rid of the log in your own eye; then you will see well enough to deal with the speck in your friend's eye. - Matthew 7:1-5

Our Lord is talking about hypocritical judgment in context whereby someone who steals condemn or judge another thief. When you judge other, make sure you are not doing the same thing you are judging the person on. The scripture is crystal clear on believers judging ourselves and ANY MoG is NOT excluded when he/she misbehaves because a pastor is first a Christian before being a pastor. Need I say more? Judge among yourselves......

@Goshen360

Aha! I was still coming to that!! Thanks a lot for valuable contribution.

Meanwhile we're still waiting for contrary responses. Let's hope we get them.

Goshen360: ^
^
^
Besides, the above was fully developed in the Epistle. Romans 2:21-25.....Read for yourself, am tired of quoting scriptures for now.

And a key verse in that scripture you just mentioned is

Rom 2:24 For, as it is written, The name of God is maligned and blasphemed among the Gentiles because of you! [The words to this effect are from your own Scriptures.] [Isa. 52:5; Ezek. 36:20.]

InesQor: I'm curious.

No childish fighting and immature abusing on this thread please.

If you say the Bible says so, give sensibly polite responses only, with scriptural backing either implicitly or explicitly. If you think otherwise, kindly also state your reasons politely.

@InesQor,
My dear InesQor, i will like to know how you know a pastor that is misbehaving?

ogoamaka99:
@InesQor,
My dear InesQor, i will like to know how you know a pastor that is misbehaving?

Hello Ogoamaka, I already answered this while replying tpia1 in Posts 11 and 12. Particularly post 11 (repeated below)

InesQor:

Misbehaviour would mean acting contrary to Christian values (first thing you said). e.g. 1 Thessalonians 5:22 "Flee all appearances of evil", which would be good behaviour.

But this first example may also include the second thing you mentioned e.g. preaching something scripturally disagreeable or untruthful or twisting the word for personal gain or plainly wicked. e.g. Colossians 3:9 “Lie not one to another.” and Ephesians 4:25 “..Speak every man truth with his neighbour.” and Zechariah 8:19 “…Love the truth and peace.”

Rather than allow such people continue spreading falsehood, Titus 1:11 says, "They must be silenced because they are ruining whole families by teaching what they shouldn’t teach. This is the shameful way they make money." (GWV)

InesQor: @Goshen360

Meanwhile we're still waiting for contrary responses. Let's hope we get them.

I hope you don't wait till Christ returns. They will pretend as though they didn't see this thread and overlook it. The basis of scriptural ground for Christians to expose and judge the misbehaving conduct is too strong for anyone to conceal such misconduct.

Infact, that scripture in Romans 2:21-25 talks about "THOSE WHO ROB THE TEMPLE". A temple defined in the NT could be a place of worship or could be a believer because we are the temple of God, 1 Corinthians 3:16. Alas, you think these temple robbers mentioned in Romans 2:21-25 will carry AK47 or AK fourty hundred when they rob the temple . Should we then condole this acts of robbery by professing and false Christians Again, judge among yourselves you Christians.....

We identify false teachers by verifying their teachings whether they are scriptural or not! The passage below says it all. We have to always verify what we are taught with all honesty from the scripture, that way we'll not go astray or mislead others!

Acts 17:11 Now the Berean Jews were of more noble character than those in Thessalonica, for they received the message with great eagerness and examined the Scriptures every day to see if what Paul said was true.

The passage below also supports rebuking misleading teachers who twist scriptures for the sake of their dishonest gain. As you can see in v10 & 11, Circumcision, just like tithe and other OT laws which are not supposed to be preached, but are forced on people by misleading teachers for their dishonest gain! The scripture clearly says we should rebuke them sharply so that they will be sound in their faiths:

Titus 1:10-16 10 For there are many rebellious people, full of meaningless talk and deception, especially those of the circumcision group.

11 They must be silenced, because they are disrupting whole households by teaching things they ought not to teach and that for the sake of dishonest gain.

12 One of Crete’s own prophets has said it: “Cretans are always liars, evil brutes, lazy gluttons.”

13 This saying is true. Therefore rebuke them sharply, so that they will be sound in the faith

14 and will pay no attention to Jewish myths or to the merely human commands of those who reject the truth.

15 To the pure, all things are pure, but to those who are corrupted and do not believe, nothing is pure. In fact, both their minds and consciences are corrupted.

16 They claim to know God, but by their actions they deny him. They are detestable, disobedient and unfit for doing anything good.

12 One of Crete’s own prophets has said it: “Cretans are always liars, evil brutes, lazy gluttons.”

13 This saying is true. Therefore rebuke them sharply, so that they will be sound in the faith

and what is your understanding of this verse?

tpia1:

and what is your understanding of this verse?

The part you quoted means liars should be rebuked sharply so that they will be sound in the faith.

Although of course that is the Epimenides paradox, quoted by Paul.

Epimenides, a Cretan himself, said "All Cretans are always liars", and Paul said the Cretan is right.

Is Epimenides lying by saying All Cretans are always liars (including himself), or is he telling the truth by saying they are always liars (a paradox, since he is Cretan).

This is a philosophical digression from the topic; I think my response above should rather suffice.

seriallink: We identify false teachers by verifying their teachings whether they are scriptural or not! The passage below says it all. We have to always verify what we are taught with all honesty from the scripture, that way we'll not go astray or mislead others!

Acts 17:11 Now the Berean Jews were of more noble character than those in Thessalonica, for they received the message with great eagerness and examined the Scriptures every day to see if what Paul said was true.

The passage below also supports rebuking misleading teachers who twist scriptures for the sake of their dishonest gain. As you can see in v11, Circumcision, just like tithe and other OT laws which are not supposed to be preached, but are forced on people by misleading teachers for their dishonest gain! The scripture clearly says we should rebuke them sharply so that they will be sound in their faiths:

Titus 1:10-16 10 For there are many rebellious people, full of meaningless talk and deception, especially those of the circumcision group.

11 They must be silenced, because they are disrupting whole households by teaching things they ought not to teach and that for the sake of dishonest gain.

12 One of Crete’s own prophets has said it: “Cretans are always liars, evil brutes, lazy gluttons.”

13 This saying is true. Therefore rebuke them sharply, so that they will be sound in the faith

14 and will pay no attention to Jewish myths or to the merely human commands of those who reject the truth.

15 To the pure, all things are pure, but to those who are corrupted and do not believe, nothing is pure. In fact, both their minds and consciences are corrupted.

16 They claim to know God, but by their actions they deny him. They are detestable, disobedient and unfit for doing anything good.

Amen bro...Glory to God.

@ tpia,
I don't understand when misBEHAVING which is basically related to BEHAVIOUR and CONDUCTS parallels with act of preaching. The title of the OP is clear enough for you to contribute what the scripture says. Stop going in circles asking irrelevant kweshions please.

@seriallink and Goshen360:

Thanks again for your responses.

Even if there are no responses again on either side of the discussion, no wahala.

I'm starting to think the matter has been well thrashed.

Goshen360:

Amen bro...Glory to God.

@ tpia,
I don't understand when misBEHAVING which is basically related to BEHAVIOUR and CONDUCTS parallels with act of preaching. The title of the OP is clear enough for you to contribute what the scripture says. Stop going in circles asking irrelevant kweshions please.

stop thinking you know it all.

you tend to get very upset when you're not the one controlling a discussion.

why is that?

do you have ego problems?

people are contributing, and you want only your own voice to be heard, on a public forum.

does that sound workable, to you?

another thread can be opened to discuss this topic, if you and your group have issues with free speech.

Each bible verse quoted by seriallink and I have presented one or more misconducts and misbehaviours act(s) of some Christians, let's see how any true Christian will come out open and tell us that such misconducts and misbehaviours should be condoled by biblical teachings. Jesus did not soften the truth and we will not until His kingdom hit the earth.

which misconduct did you present?

i dont read long stories- can you summarise plz.

@InesQor,
My dear InesQor,my candid advise to you is to be careful how you judge the action of a pastor. What you call misbehavior may be GOD,S direct instruction. Take for instance what happened in Isaiah 20:2 At the same time spake the Lord by Isaiah the son of Amoz, saying, Go and loose the sackcloth from off thy loins, and put off thy shoe from thy foot. And he did so, walking naked and barefoot.
Isaiah 20:3 And the Lord said, Like as my servant Isaiah hath walked naked and barefoot three years for a sign and wonder upon Egypt and upon Ethiopia;
From the above action of prophet Isaiah, it it is done in today's world wont we accuse Isaiah of misbehavior?

tpia1:

stop thinking you know it all.

you tend to get very upset when you're not the one controlling a discussion.

why is that?

do you have ego problems?

people are contributing, and you want only your own voice to be heard, on a public forum.

does that sound workable, to you?

another thread can be opened to discuss this topic, if you and your group have issues with free speech.

And stop introducing sentiments now.....Am I the only talking here on this thread The thread is open to all including you. All you have to do is present a stronger argument against the title of the thread. You have not been able to do that and all you say is that am controlling a thread. Who and who am I controlling and when did I become the omniscience Have I ever acted like I know it all Stop being sentimental and emotional, okay. I confronted you because you are trying to act like you don't understand what misBEHAVIOUR means. Straighten up

tpia1: which misconduct did you present?

i dont read long stories- can you summarise plz.

Sorry for the long posts oooo. Okay here are summaries:

P1: Teaching lies to the congregation (and/or for the sake of increasing wealth) is considered a misbehaviour, and ought to be rebuked. (Titus 1:10-16)
P2: People of good behaviour in Christ ought to be ready to defend their belief with courtesy and respect (1 Pet 3:15-16)
P3: We ought to examine the scriptures carefully to see if what we were taught is true (like the Berean Christians) (Acts 17:11)
P4: We will judge the world so for now we are not unworthy to judge even the smallest matters (1 Cor 6:2)
P5: There are false Christians (and false Christian teachers) [Gal 2:4, 2Cor 11:13-15, Matt 7:15-16, Matt 24:4-5, 2 Pet 2:1, 1 Tim 4:1-2], and even Satan can disguise as an angel of light [2 Cor 11:14-15]

@tpia1
Nobody asked you not to express yourself freely ooo. Just that in threads I personally create I always beg people to be civil. Else the whole thing may descend into a free-for-all and we'll lose the point.