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What Causes Overheating And How Can It Be Totally Prevented - Car Talk - Nairaland

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What Causes Overheating And How Can It Be Totally Prevented by redcliff: 10:30am On Nov 23, 2012
hello Good people on car talk section, i was just thinking out loud. I have noticed that when individuals import a "tokunbo" car especially volkswagen, they are always advised to take away the thermostat to prevent overheating but subsequent opinions have begged to differ. I keep asking myself, did the engineers who made the thermostat not know that those vehicles would be imported to hotter parts of the world cos it seems that our road side mechanics seem to be claiming to be smarter than the white man? why i am saying so is this..

I got a VW MK3 and i was asked to take away the thermostat and i refused following the advice Mr Siena gave me and on another occasion when i went to fix the fog light on the car and the rewire saw the thermostat and told me i needed to take it off also and i refused and i was just trying to be inquisitive about why i should take it away and he said i should not worry. That translated to me that he meant "you go still comot am, no worry, when overheating catch you for road nobody go tell you". What i deduced is that after a period of time, the car would definitely start overheating and i would be forced to remove it. I am asking experts in the house, what can one do to prevent overheating of the engine while still using your thermostat here in Nigeria?
Re: What Causes Overheating And How Can It Be Totally Prevented by kenmaro: 10:52am On Nov 23, 2012
Always make sure there is the recommended good quality coolant in your coolant box. Check your radiator cap cover for the OEM coolant specification.
Re: What Causes Overheating And How Can It Be Totally Prevented by Nobody: 11:24am On Nov 23, 2012
To prevent overheating is simple:

* Don't run plain water in your cooling system, always run a 50/50 coolant / water mix.
* Make sure your fan thermo switch is in good shape (the fan comes on and off automatically).
* Make sure your mechanical fan is in good shape - no broken blades, and the viscous clutch is working.
* Make sure your thermostat is replaced once a year. If it gets stuck in the closed position, coolant will boil.
* Make sure your radiator is clean. A clogged matrix will not cool properly (mud, debris etc muct be steamed off periodically).
* Make sure the correct grade of spark plugs are used. Just because others fit, doesn't make them right, and detonation will cook your engine.
* Too low an octane rating will make your engine run hotter, due to retaarded timing.
* Driving technique - holding the lower gears for prolonged periods (over revving) will make your engine run hotter.
* Binding brakes - if your brakes are binding, your engine will work harder, and run hotter (excessive engine load).
* Incorrect radiator fitment - fitting an radiator from a differnt car is not advisable. A radiator from a Toyota Corolla 1.6 will not cool a Camry 3,0 V6.
* Service your vehicle at the correct interval, and fix any defects found. Don't wait till something breaks, before you fix, just because an engine runs with defects doesn't mean it's right.

In all my years of driving, and with all the vehicles I've owned, overheating has never been an issue.

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Re: What Causes Overheating And How Can It Be Totally Prevented by redcliff: 11:53am On Nov 23, 2012
Siena: To prevent overheating is simple:

* Don't run plain water in your cooling system, always run a 50/50 coolant / water mix.
* Make sure your fan thermo switch is in good shape (the fan comes on and off automatically).
* Make sure your mechanical fan is in good shape - no broken blades, and the viscous clutch is working.
* Make sure your thermostat is replaced once a year. If it gets stuck in the closed position, coolant will boil.
* Make sure your radiator is clean. A clogged matrix will not cool properly (mud, debris etc muct be steamed off periodically).
* Make sure the correct grade of spark plugs are used. Just because others fit, doesn't make them right, and detonation will cook your engine.
* Too low an octane rating will make your engine run hotter, due to retaarded timing.
* Driving technique - holding the lower gears for prolonged periods (over revving) will make your engine run hotter.
* Binding brakes - if your brakes are binding, your engine will work harder, and run hotter (excessive engine load).
* Incorrect radiator fitment - fitting an radiator from a different car is not advisable. A radiator from a Toyota Corolla 1.6 will not cool a Camry 3,0 V6.
* Service your vehicle at the correct interval, and fix any defects found. Don't wait till something breaks, before you fix, just because an engine runs with defects doesn't mean it's right.

In all my years of driving, and with all the vehicles I've owned, overheating has never been an issue.

Siena , you are the boss. another question is this, i noticed something which you mentioned, "making sure the radiator is clean. I think this is a major reason for overheating of a vehicle. You know here in Nigeria, details are not always taken on specific issues. An example is that if you would want to flush your radiator, The road side mechanics might think water is actually okay, to do so or steam washing the radiator with detergent and hot-water. But technically, there are radiator flushes which should be applied to flush out rust particles and sediments from the radiator.
My pain is that most of these things your car would need are not in the car-care shops in Nigeria. If they are, they are so scarce that its difficult to see them not to talk of purchasing them.

My final take is that we would make do with what we have.

Another question is this, how do i know i have a bad thermostat?
Re: What Causes Overheating And How Can It Be Totally Prevented by Nobody: 12:08pm On Nov 23, 2012
When I say clogged radiator, I'm referring to the exterior. If it's all caked in mud, the cooling efficiency will drop. So washing from the outside with a hose, to blast the dirt away is recommended.

Thermostats can fail in two ways. Sticking open, or closed.

If it sticks open, your temperature will be about normal in traffic, though a constant speed (highway) will see the needle drop to the cold sector. It will also take longer for the engine to warm up.

If it sticks closed, the engine will simply boil. The radiator upper hose will be red hot, whereas the lower one will be cold or just lukewarm. Thermostats are cheap, so best replaced annually. You can test it by placing it in boiling water, to see if the vlave opens. But with acces to the housing in some engines so poor, it would make more sense to simply fit a new one once it's removed.
Re: What Causes Overheating And How Can It Be Totally Prevented by Kslib(m): 4:43pm On Nov 23, 2012
Ques: what causes overheating??
Ans: HEAT
Ques: how can it be reduced??
Ans: reduce anything that has to do with heat
Ques: how can it be avoided??
Ans: avoid anything with heat

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Re: What Causes Overheating And How Can It Be Totally Prevented by kingingkinging: 5:04pm On Nov 23, 2012
THANK YOU FOR THIS QUESTION OP. ALSO THE ANSWERS ARE REALLY SATISFACTORY, HOWEVER, I WANT TO KNOW IF WASHING AT THE CAR WASH WITHOUT REMOVING THE RADIATOR OUT FROM THE ENGINE WILL SERVE THE MAIN PURPOSE OR MUST IT BE REMOVED FOR BETTER AND CLEANER WASHING?
Re: What Causes Overheating And How Can It Be Totally Prevented by Serendipity: 5:31pm On Nov 23, 2012
*Lack of enough water in the radiator.
*Failure to put the engine off while the motor is immobile or while in traffic jam. This is because the fan turns at a slow pace whereupon the water that cool the engine is circulated hot.
*Fan belt failure.
*Some engines are also prone to overheating.

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Re: What Causes Overheating And How Can It Be Totally Prevented by Serendipity: 5:31pm On Nov 23, 2012
*Lack of enough water in the radiator.
*Failure to put the engine off while the motor is immobile or while in traffic jam. This is because the fan turns at a slow pace whereupon the water that cool the engine is circulated hot.
*Fan belt failure.
*Some engines are also prone to overheating.

Just my two pennyworth.
Re: What Causes Overheating And How Can It Be Totally Prevented by isarumah(m): 5:45pm On Nov 23, 2012
@siena, please oga, I posted on audi and vw issue thread, but you did not respond. The issue is, I bought tiks audi 80 tiger face with 1.8 engine and electric carb. It works fine, but consumes around 15litres/100km(combined drives). Is it normal for the car? If yes, why? If no, what are the possible problems and solution. Respect sir!

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Re: What Causes Overheating And How Can It Be Totally Prevented by StepG: 5:57pm On Nov 23, 2012
Avoid excessive use of AC. Avoid running on higher torque for long(esp in go slows),100KM/h or 60m/h is most efficient speed on high ways with good engine response for any car on this earth. a higher or lower speed than that can elevate your car temperature. Wash your car regurlarly and Avoid dusty roads that can cause clogging on d radiator cell peripherals.ensure your fan blades are always working. Always put water below the maximum level of your radiator reservoir. Ensure your tyres are rightly pressured. Avoid frequent sudden firing esp.during starting or overtaking.Best of luck.
Re: What Causes Overheating And How Can It Be Totally Prevented by Nobody: 6:52pm On Nov 23, 2012
Serendipity: *Failure to put the engine off while the motor is immobile or while in traffic jam. This is because the fan turns at a slow pace whereupon the water that cool the engine is circulated hot.

Not true. Engines can run at idle for 24 hours, without overheating. The fan actually comes on while the car is stationary, and whilst doing a constant speed, the fan won't be triggered. A mechanical fan will also do the job while the car is stationary.

An engine that boils if the car is stationary has underlying issues that need sorting out.

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Re: What Causes Overheating And How Can It Be Totally Prevented by Nobody: 7:29pm On Nov 23, 2012
ajoguegbe: How the tablet prevents overheating
Dyno-tab® Cooler Coolant:
Replenishes critical cooling system additives
Keeps engines running cooler, up to 20 degrees F

The best way to keep an engine at its optimum temperature is to look after it. All that needs to be done has been posted by various contributors to this thread.

And if this keeps an engine running 20 degrees F cooler, then please clarify. Cooler than what temperature?
Re: What Causes Overheating And How Can It Be Totally Prevented by geemeshin(m): 7:44pm On Nov 23, 2012
A good knowledge...
Re: What Causes Overheating And How Can It Be Totally Prevented by FindOut(m): 7:47pm On Nov 23, 2012
isarumah: @siena, please oga, I posted on audi and vw issue thread, but you did not respond. The issue is, I bought tiks audi 80 tiger face with 1.8 engine and electric carb. It works fine, but consumes around 15litres/100km(combined drives). Is it normal for the car? If yes, why? If no, what are the possible problems and solution. Respect sir!

i remember seeing your complaint on another thread i think & Siena asked you what Audi tiger face was?

& by now, you should know the drill na. What engine type is in your car? At the very least, is it an i4 or V6?
*edit: OK, you did specify. Seen.*

@Siena, Audi 'Tiger face' is the Audi 80 facelift. Lol
Re: What Causes Overheating And How Can It Be Totally Prevented by DECOtech(m): 8:00pm On Nov 23, 2012
How about increasing the size of your radiator to contain more water?
Re: What Causes Overheating And How Can It Be Totally Prevented by Serendipity: 8:30pm On Nov 23, 2012
Siena:

Not true. Engines can run at idle for 24 hours, without overheating. The fan actually comes on while the car is stationary, and whilst doing a constant speed, the fan won't be triggered. A mechanical fan will also do the job while the car is stationary.

An engine that boils if the car is stationary has underlying issues that need sorting out.
If you are savvy mechanically, you won't argue with the fact a car that is stationary has great chances of being overheated. This is manifest on our roads especially in cities that are traffic jam prone.
Your riposte as to stationary and mechanical... is cryptic and obscurantist.
Re: What Causes Overheating And How Can It Be Totally Prevented by Nobody: 8:33pm On Nov 23, 2012
DECOtech: How about increasing the size of your radiator to contain more water?

You could. But then your water pump is designed to flow a specific volume. If you have flow issues, you'll have overheating issues.
Re: What Causes Overheating And How Can It Be Totally Prevented by segun2012: 9:07pm On Nov 23, 2012
Siena:

You could. But then your water pump is designed to flow a specific volume. If you have flow issues, you'll have overheating issues.
how much can i buy a bigger radiator and where can i get it
Re: What Causes Overheating And How Can It Be Totally Prevented by senator2k9(m): 9:09pm On Nov 23, 2012
Nobody seems to have imppressed me with their answers on this thread. Those thermostat was installed on those vehicles coz they were built in Very cold regions where the fan does not work especially during snow n it turns on automatically wen the weather becomes hotter! But in Nigeria here where d weather is very hot, the thermostat is as good as useless coz the engine fan must Continue running to cool down the engine and in that case the thermostat just decorates d engine in Nigeria, and anyday the thermostat mallfunctions n refuses to start the engine fan automatically that's wen u get serious over heating, to be on a safer side, dats y d mechanics advice that the thermostats be removed frm the engine !!
Re: What Causes Overheating And How Can It Be Totally Prevented by Nobody: 9:50pm On Nov 23, 2012
senator2k9: Nobody seems to have imppressed me with their answers on this thread. Those thermostat was installed on those vehicles coz they were built in Very cold regions where the fan does not work especially during snow n it turns on automatically wen the weather becomes hotter! But in Nigeria here where d weather is very hot, the thermostat is as good as useless coz the engine fan must Continue running to cool down the engine and in that case the thermostat just decorates d engine in Nigeria, and anyday the thermostat mallfunctions n refuses to start the engine fan automatically that's wen u get serious over heating, to be on a safer side, dats y d mechanics advice that the thermostats be removed frm the engine !!

Cars built for regions hotter than Nigeria still run thermostats. If you truly feel that thermostats are for "decorating the engines", then I truly feel sorry for you. Those Nigerian roadside mechanics must love you, I can just see them rubbing their hands together, when they see you coming.
Re: What Causes Overheating And How Can It Be Totally Prevented by Nobody: 9:52pm On Nov 23, 2012
segun-2011:
how much can i buy a bigger radiator and where can i get it

Bro, I don't think you read my inital response properly.

Are you going to upgrade your water pump as well? And if yes, how do you intend to do that?

And lastly, is your engine currently overheating?
Re: What Causes Overheating And How Can It Be Totally Prevented by Nobody: 9:56pm On Nov 23, 2012
senator2k9: Nobody seems to have imppressed me with their answers on this thread. Those thermostat was installed on those vehicles coz they were built in Very cold regions where the fan does not work especially during snow n it turns on automatically wen the weather becomes hotter! But in Nigeria here where d weather is very hot, the thermostat is as good as useless coz the engine fan must Continue running to cool down the engine and in that case the thermostat just decorates d engine in Nigeria, and anyday the thermostat mallfunctions n refuses to start the engine fan automatically that's wen u get serious over heating, to be on a safer side, dats y d mechanics advice that the thermostats be removed frm the engine !!

And just so you know, the thermostat doesn't "start the fan", that's the job of the thermo switch. You're confusing two different components. The thermostat is a temperature-sensitive valve, that controls flow, and is entirely mechanical. The thermo switch is a temperature-sensitive switch, that controls the positive circuit of the electric fan (if fitted) and is entirely electrical.
Re: What Causes Overheating And How Can It Be Totally Prevented by Emperoh(m): 10:02pm On Nov 23, 2012
senator2k9: Nobody seems to have imppressed me with their answers on this thread. Those thermostat was installed on those vehicles coz they were built in Very cold regions where the fan does not work especially during snow n it turns on automatically wen the weather becomes hotter! But in Nigeria here where d weather is very hot, the thermostat is as good as useless coz the engine fan must Continue running to cool down the engine and in that case the thermostat just decorates d engine in Nigeria, and anyday the thermostat mallfunctions n refuses to start the engine fan automatically that's wen u get serious over heating, to be on a safer side, dats y d mechanics advice that the thermostats be removed frm the engine !!

My people suffer for lack of knowledge. . . . wink

I will take the liberty to expatiate more on this thermostat issue since i can't understand how a road side artisan
is better that an engineer who have assembled car for both cold and hot regions. The same cars we use here is what is also
used in North America and middle East will very harsh hot weathers.

But here's my take; A lot of components are added to the automobile engine to help in starting the vehicle on a very cold day and also to allow it
run efficiently when the weather and engine is cold. One of such components is the thermostat. Technically, when the engine is cold, the oil has more thickness
and almost congeals. This will require the engine to overcome more resistance in order to rotate. This invariably affects fuel consumption.

So as to combat this issue, manufacturers install devices that ensures the cooling system of the vehicle is not operational if the temperature
of the engine is too low. Therefore, except your 'rewire' has tampered with your fan's connection or thermostat, you will observe that your fan does not
rotate with it. But as soon as the car heats up, the fan automatically starts spinning.

Also, when the engine is cold, the thermostat ensures that coolant is not circulating through the engine but as the engine heats up, thermostat opens up
and allows coolant to circulate through the engine.

But once these cars come to Nigeria, some local 'quacks' suddenly take on the responsibility of 'tropicalizing' these vehicles. In the course of doing these, they consider unnecessary, the overall efficiency of the the vehicle (throttle response, starting ability, idling characteristics etc). in most cases, your fuel consumption increases.

Now, as regards the thermostat, by passing the thermostatic cooling system by wiring the cooling fan directly to the ignition system or removing the cooland thermostat is a terrible idea; in fact, atrocious.

Thermostats have ratings indicating the temperatures at which they will operate. It is therefore best to buy thermostats or thermostatic switches for the appropriate environment. These temperatures are marked on the body of the thermostat or the switches. For instance, a friend bought a golf MKIII from Austria and the normal over heating issue started. On checking, the coolant fan switch, designed for cold regions has 102 degrees written on the switch. This indicates that the environmental temperature where the car will be used must be low. This is to allow the engine to heat up to just under 100 degrees before the cooling system fan comes on. What happens on importing this car here is that while working under load, the car starts over heating and before the time the cooling system is about to start working, coolant is boiling over.

A local mechanic will remove the thermostat and fling it across and go ahead to by pass all by passables. But replacing the thermostat switch with one written 82 degrees on the body sent this problem to the grave.

Removing the thermostat is a bad idea. Aside the effects of over cooling leading to high exhaust emission, poor cold starting ability and increased fuel consumption, the thermal shock created by the missing thermostat can shorten the life of an engine. The mechanics as a result of lack of knowledge, reason that vehicles are supposed to operate at the lowest possible engine temperature whereas vehicles are designed to operate at an optimum coolant temperature of just below the boiling point of the coolant for efficiency reasons.

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Re: What Causes Overheating And How Can It Be Totally Prevented by Nobody: 10:39pm On Nov 23, 2012
Emperoh:

My people suffer for lack of knowledge. . . . wink

I will take the liberty to expatiate more on this thermostat issue since i can't understand how a road side artisan
is better that an engineer who have assembled car for both cold and hot regions. The same cars we use here is what is also
used in North America and middle East will very harsh hot weathers.

But here's my take; A lot of components are added to the automobile engine to help in starting the vehicle on a very cold day and also to allow it
run efficiently when the weather and engine is cold. One of such components is the thermostat. Technically, when the engine is cold, the oil has more thickness
and almost congeals. This will require the engine to overcome more resistance in order to rotate. This invariably affects fuel consumption.

So as to combat this issue, manufacturers install devices that ensures the cooling system of the vehicle is not operational if the temperature
of the engine is too low. Therefore, except your 'rewire' has tampered with your fan's connection or thermostat, you will observe that your fan does not
rotate with it. But as soon as the car heats up, the fan automatically starts spinning.

Also, when the engine is cold, the thermostat ensures that coolant is not circulating through the engine but as the engine heats up, thermostat opens up
and allows coolant to circulate through the engine.

But once these cars come to Nigeria, some local 'quacks' suddenly take on the responsibility of 'tropicalizing' these vehicles. In the course of doing these, they consider unnecessary, the overall efficiency of the the vehicle (throttle response, starting ability, idling characteristics etc). in most cases, your fuel consumption increases.

Now, as regards the thermostat, by passing the thermostatic cooling system by wiring the cooling fan directly to the ignition system or removing the cooland thermostat is a terrible idea; in fact, atrocious.

Thermostats have ratings indicating the temperatures at which they will operate. It is therefore best to buy thermostats or thermostatic switches for the appropriate environment. These temperatures are marked on the body of the thermostat or the switches. For instance, a friend bought a golf MKIII from Austria and the normal over heating issue started. On checking, the coolant fan switch, designed for cold regions has 102 degrees written on the switch. This indicates that the environmental temperature where the car will be used must be low. This is to allow the engine to heat up to just under 100 degrees before the cooling system fan comes on. What happens on importing this car here is that while working under load, the car starts over heating and before the time the cooling system is about to start working, coolant is boiling over.

A local mechanic will remove the thermostat and fling it across and go ahead to by pass all by passables. But replacing the thermostat switch with one written 82 degrees on the body sent this problem to the grave.

Removing the thermostat is a bad idea. Aside the effects of over cooling leading to high exhaust emission, poor cold starting ability and increased fuel consumption, the thermal shock created by the missing thermostat can shorten the life of an engine. The mechanics as a result of lack of knowledge, reason that vehicles are supposed to operate at the lowest possible engine temperature whereas vehicles are designed to operate at an optimum coolant temperature of just below the boiling point of the coolant for efficiency reasons.

This says it all. It's so annoying when all some mechanic wants to do is remove your thermostat. Some years back, I had this E34 BMW that had overheating issues. My mech "fix" the problem by welding the fan clutch such that it spins at engine speed, in addition to throwing away the thermostat. Of course, this led to loud fan noise from the engine bay, low temp of the engine and overall diminished performance of the car.
A little research showed a malfunction of the viscuous fan clutch to be main culprit of the overheating. I had the clutch replaced and and viola, problem solved. I propmtly reinstalled the thermostat and car ran like a dream till I sold it.
People forget that the cylinder of internal combustion engine is a furnace, that needs to keep burning. Making the surrounding area (engine block) too cool leads to increase fuel consumption and low temp hard starting. An engine must attain temperature of 85-100C to work optimally.
Re: What Causes Overheating And How Can It Be Totally Prevented by redcliff: 11:00pm On Nov 23, 2012
speakiing of coolants, the one in my car is blue in colour and the one i bought is green. most times, its not always easy to see the same colour of coolant that was in the engine the period you bought it in car-care shops especially Nigeria. Is it advisable to do a total radiator flush or topup if need be? i understand its advisable to do a radiator flush after 5yrs or 150,000km. how true is this people?
Re: What Causes Overheating And How Can It Be Totally Prevented by senator2k9(m): 11:41pm On Nov 23, 2012
Siena:

And just so you know, the thermostat doesn't "start the fan", that's the job of the thermo switch. You're confusing two different components. The thermostat is a temperature-sensitive valve, that controls flow, and is entirely mechanical. The thermo switch is a temperature-sensitive switch, that controls the positive circuit of the electric fan (if fitted) and is entirely electrical.
is the thermoswitch not in the thermostat? Its just like u r saying humans can't eat on their own, that's d function of the mouth !!
Re: What Causes Overheating And How Can It Be Totally Prevented by Nobody: 12:07am On Nov 24, 2012
senator2k9: is the thermoswitch not in the thermostat? Its just like u r saying humans can't eat on their own, that's d function of the mouth !!

The thermo switch is nothing to do with the thermostat. They are totally separate components.

*Sighs in despair*
Re: What Causes Overheating And How Can It Be Totally Prevented by eyenCalabar(m): 3:08am On Nov 24, 2012
Nice thread to follow. Thanks.

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