Very good post Jakumo.

Jakumo: May I offer heartfelt and sincere condolences to retired General Muhammadu Buhari on the loss of his eldest daughter to that common yet so far incurable ailment, sickle cell anemia.

The greatest sorrow that can befall any human being is to bury their own offspring, and General Buhari, for whatever his human failings may be, did not deserve to experience the deep anguish of a tragedy like this.

In sober reflection of the toll taken by sickle-cell anemia on black populations in general, I must seize this opportunity to thankfully acknowledge yet again the legislation adopted by the Lagos State government, under the intrepid leadership of Governor Raji Fashola SAN, which explicitly outlaws the beating or corporal punishment of children or young adults at home, in schools, and in workplaces throughout Lagos State.

This message of thanks to Governor Fashola is relevant to the passing of Buhari's daughter because that banning of corporal punishment in Lagos State means that all sickle-cell afflicted children who live there are now safe from a little-known side-effect of beating and other manners of pain infliction. That risk factor is specifically that sickle-cell sufferers, can, and have in the past, dropped stone dead while being flogged, as a result of shock to the system that is greatly exacerbated by their medical condition.

The passing of Buhari's daughter reminds us that sickle cell anemia can be a fatal disease even for victims with the means to seek expert medical management of the condition, yet, it is pertinent to consider that with this new Lagos State prohibition on physical violence against children at home and in the classroom, the rate of "unexplained" deaths among sickle-cell sufferers, during or after classroom floggings, will dramatically fall, throughout Lagos State.

With apologies from the slight deviation from the subject of this thread, I offer prayers for the repose of the departed, along with condolences to the Buhari family on the passing of their daughter. May her soul rest in peace.

Jakumo: May I offer heartfelt and sincere condolences to retired General Muhammadu Buhari on the loss of his eldest daughter to that common yet so far incurable ailment, sickle cell anemia.

The greatest sorrow that can befall any human being is to bury their own offspring, and General Buhari, for whatever his human failings may be, did not deserve to experience the deep anguish of a tragedy like this.

In sober reflection of the toll taken by sickle-cell anemia on black populations in general, I must seize this opportunity to thankfully acknowledge yet again the legislation adopted by the Lagos State government, under the intrepid leadership of Governor Raji Fashola SAN, which explicitly outlaws the beating or corporal punishment of children or young adults at home, in schools, and in workplaces throughout Lagos State.

This message of thanks to Governor Fashola is relevant to the passing of Buhari's daughter because that banning of corporal punishment in Lagos State means that all sickle-cell afflicted children who live there are now safe from a little-known side-effect of beating and other manners of pain infliction. That risk factor is specifically that sickle-cell sufferers, can, and have in the past, dropped stone dead while being flogged, as a result of shock to the system that is greatly exacerbated by their medical condition.

The passing of Buhari's daughter reminds us that sickle cell anemia can be a fatal disease even for victims with the means to seek expert medical management of the condition, yet, it is pertinent to consider that with this new Lagos State prohibition on physical violence against children at home and in the classroom, the rate of "unexplained" deaths among sickle-cell sufferers, during or after classroom floggings, will dramatically fall, throughout Lagos State.

With apologies from the slight deviation from the subject of this thread, I offer prayers for the repose of the departed, along with condolences to the Buhari family on the passing of their daughter. May her soul rest in peace.

Jakumo, I am afraid to say that Fashola banning corporal punishment in schools is absolute rubbish.

If we need to protect kids with side effects, while it is pragmatic, it makes more sense to selectively do so than apply a blanket protection.

Sickle-cell kids can always bring in medical certificate that ensures they are exempted from corporal punishment if it is so detrimental to their health.

It would be disaster if we have the discipline of kids like the ones I am seeing in the UK.

Bespoke approaches are always superior in quality to mass approaches.

Sagamite the medical danger posed by beatings to sickle-cell afflicted children is extreme and ever-present, but even "healthy" children stand the risk of lower-limb paralysis from errant impacts to the sciatic nerve located in the back, permanent blindness from "accidental" cane impacts to the eye, and yes, death from the trauma of beatings that OFTEN get out of control, in classroom or workplace settings where such legalized assault and battery is condoned. A nine-year old Nigerian girl was beaten to death by her classroom teacher in Nigeria, less than one month ago, and the assailant is now rightly facing criminal charges.

The psychological damage caused by beatings can be just as insidious, since corporal punishment teaches children that violence is legitimate means of exerting authority over subordinates - a state of affairs that does NOT occur anywhere in civil society or the workplace. Governor Raji Fashola has demonstrated his commitment to the fundamental human rights of ALL his constituents, regardless of age, by ensuring with this bold legislation that violent acts can no longer be committed against ANY person in Lagos State, under the color of law, and that transgressors will be prosecuted for assault and battery at the very least.


Once again I do apologize deviating from the topic here, but a little elaboration on this subject seemed in order.

Jakumo: Sagamite the medical danger posed by beatings to sickle-cell afflicted children is extreme and ever-present, but even "healthy" children stand the risk of lower-limb paralysis from errant impacts to the sciatic nerve located in the back, permanent blindness from "accidental" cane impacts to the eye, and yes, death from the trauma of beatings that OFTEN get out of control, in classroom or workplace settings where such legalized assault and battery is condoned. A nine-year old Nigerian girl was beaten to death by her classroom teacher in Nigeria, less than one month ago, and the assailant is now rightly facing criminal charges.

That only tells me that corporal punishment needs to be more controlled, measured and selectively applied.

Giving example of a 9 year old girl moves my heart, thank you, but it does not change my position. It is not much different from school kids stabbing teachers to death in the UK, but I am sure that is not as heart moving because it is not a child that died.

I am happy the teacher is facing charges because we don't need lunatics like that in a classroom.

Jakumo:
The psychological damage caused by beatings can be just as insidious, since corporal punishment teaches children that violence is legitimate means of exerting authority over subordinates - a state of affairs that does NOT occur anywhere in civil society or the workplace. Governor Raji Fashola has demonstrated his commitment to the fundamental human rights of ALL his constituents, regardless of age, by ensuring with this bold legislation that violent acts can no longer be committed against ANY person in Lagos State, under the color of law, and that transgressors will be prosecuted for assault and battery at the very least.


Apologies for the deviation from the topic here, but a little elaboration on this subject seemed in order.

Honestly, the point about corporal punishment damages children and teaches kids that violence is a legitimate means of exerting authority is rubbish.

As they say, correlation is not causation.

UK kids are not smacked but they sure are violent.

Japan, South Korea, Singapore, Botswana etc apply corporal punishment at home and in schools and they are civilised society and non-violent people. Nor do their kids habitually need personal psychaitrists.

I am sure corporal punishment does not infringe on a child fundamental human rights. Kids are not adults hence different laws can and do apply to them.

And if for some quirky reason it does infringe, contrary to my knowledge, then the fundamental human rights assertions is full of horseshit and need to be changed.

Sagamite, it is worthy of note that no single school in Lagos State has been reported closed due to the inability of school authorities to discipline their charges without resorting to violence. On the contrary, the lifting of that climate of fear, that pervades anywhere that institutionalized violence is meted out, is bound to positively improve academic performance throughout Lagos State, and all other states that follow this noble path of zero tolerance for violence against children.

I have agreed with many of the argumentative stands you have taken in the past, so I suppose it is about time we found a point of disagreement.

Jakumo: Sagamite, it is worthy of note that no single school in Lagos State has been reported closed due to the inability of school authorities to discipline their charges without resorting to violence.

It takes time.

You surely do not expect kids that are being smacked by teachers yesterday to build the foolhardiness and guts to confront those teachers today because some remote man that sits in an office 10km away in Ikeja said it is wrong. Who would protect them from the repercussions IN NIGERIA? Fashola? The Police?

Dem go still beat dem till im yansh red like oyinbo pepper.

I can guarantee you corporal punishment is still rife in every part of Lagos state that is why you have not heard anything.

That is like telling a Nigerian that the UN has declared that arbitrary assault without trial by state security forces is an infringement on his human right, and the mugu carry im head the next morning go insult a group of MOPOL, thinking he has human rights. Na Ban Kim Moon go come save am?

Wait till the ban is enshrined and enforced by the authorities and new batch of kids that have never been corporally punished, and who can recite their rights, get into schools and then you will see the full effects of your advocacy.

Jakumo:
On the contrary, the lifting of that climate of fear, that pervades anywhere that institutionalized violence is meted out, is bound to positively improve academic performance throughout Lagos State, and all other states that follow this noble path of zero tolerance for violence against children.

I have agreed with many of the argumentative stands you have taken in the past, so I suppose it is about time we found a point of disagreement.

Improve performance? I say with all due respect, TOSH!

It is unlikely to improve performance. It might improve innovativeness but definitely not performance.

Why?

1) You will INEVITABLY have more unruly kids.

2) I can GUARANTEE Lagos state or Nigeria does not have the means to train teachers to apply alternative methods of discipline to control the kids.

The whole "cifulised" way of raising kids (i.e. no corporal punihsment) is more EXPENSIVE, more TIDIOUS and more TIME CONSUMING.

Nigeria and Lagos state do not have such means, skills or access to such funds.

The UK spends, at least, 3 times (if not up to 6) on education per student than Singapore but yet Singaporean kids perform better in school. The UK government spends at least £100m annually on truancy initiaves (that is more than the entire annual education budget of Lagos State), not even including spend on other discipline initiatives. I even read once of them spending £5bn over 6 years on truancy in the middle 2000s. We should not even factor in what they spend on the policing and the community damage these unruly u-18 kids impose on society.

That is not optimal or improved performance when you spend more and get less.

The UK government, under Cameron, is looking at how to reverse the indiscipline that has crept up in their society and schools and you are advocating we adopt the mistake they are trying to correct.

r.i.p

It is ineffective policing, incompetent authority, poverty, poor education and lack of a reliable justice system that causes violence, not smacking.

That is what violent societies have in common, and what countries like Singapore, Japan and Botswana that smack and are not violent have in common with non-violent society.

If you live in a society where you know you cannot report grievances to authorities and they would act on it, where the police force is underfunded, corrupt and would even commit crimes on you, where the justice system is unreliable in terms of fairness and swiftness, where those with more power can decide to assault you without any consequence if your are poorer, where large amounts of people are uneducated or refined, THEN YOU WILL HAVE A VIOLENT SOCIETY.

Those are what causes violence in society, not corporal punishment of kids. Correlation is not causation.

The West, Japan, Singapore and Botswana have reliable policing, authority, justice system, good education and low poverty. Hence why their societies are not violent.

The African countries don't have these and are violent.

Not: smacking = violent societies.

Lets start doing our research and analysis to attribute more apt cause-and-effect and root-cause-analysis to issues.

May we not have a society where our son speaks to us like Chris Huhne's son all because we are easily impressionable with funky philosophies and are eager to copy it for the special privilege of being called "civilised", "liberal" and "progressive".

www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/news/politics/4779253/Chris-Huhnes-son-in-bitter-series-of-texts.html

Don't say Sagamite did not warn you.

You will likely end up with unruly kids. Many policy-makers in the UK know the root of the problem and are hinting it (i.e. lack of respect among young people), but they don't have the guts to do what is required to reverse it because the solution is not politically FUNKY.

Continue copying laws based on funkinisation and see the results you will get.

These are only the ones reported for beating their parents. Don't even think of many that are not reported because their parents are too embarrassed, they don't do it frequently enough for their parents to bother or the parents are too scared of them. Talkless of adding millions more that the parents have just given up trying to control them because they know this would happen.

Lets not even talk about the cost of these prosecutions and punitive judgements. Waste of money all because of being funky.

[size=18pt]The children who beat up their own mums and dads: More than 50 kids under 13 have been prosecuted for attacking their parents in London alone[/size]

- Over 800 children between 14 and 17 prosecuted for domestic violence
- Alison Saunders, who will soon become Director of Public Prosecutions, warns the violence epidemic has spread beyond deprived families
- Blames rise in attacks on a lack of respect among young people

Britain's incoming chief prosecutor today warned of an epidemic of children attacking their parents, as it emerged that more than 100 children aged 13 or younger were prosecuted for domestic violence last year.

Alison Saunders stressed that domestic violence does not just involve partners fighting each other, but can see teenagers lashing out against their mothers and fathers.

In 2012-13, more than 2,100 teenagers between the ages of 14 and 17 were prosecuted for domestic abuse, underlining the scale of the largely hidden problem.

An 11-year-old boy in London was this year convicted of assault by beating after a court heard that he had punched his mother and thrown a drawer at her while fighting about a phone bill.

A boy of 13 was convicted when his mother refused to give him money to spend on drugs and he threatened her with a knife.

Over the past three years, a total of 8,395 children have been prosecuted for domestic abuse, which includes violence against parents, siblings and girlfriends or boyfriends, according to the Crown Prosecution Service.

Ms Saunders, who is currently London's chief crown prosecutor but will start work as the new Director of Public Prosecutions next month, blamed the extraordinary amount of abuse carried out by young people on their lack of respect for authority.

She also said that despite the impression of such incidents as being hallmarks of deprivation, they are in fact prevalent in all classes of society.

'One thing about domestic violence is that it is not just in dysfunctional families or just the ones on benefits, it goes across everyone,' she told the Evening Standard.

'Some of those we see are from really badly dysfunctional families, but you also have middle-class and upper-class people involved.

'There is a lack of respect and a lack of regard for authority. When I was growing up the thought of striking a parent was beyond the pale.

'Is that peers, is that TV, is that the general environment in the house? You are not born to commit domestic violence. It's really about nurturing.'

Ms Saunders added that children who are violent towards their family could be encouraged to commit domestic abuse as adults.

'If you are starting off hitting your mum then there is not a lot between that and hitting your girlfriend, wife, partner when you are older,' she said.

This year the Home Office ruled that cases involving 16- and 17-year-olds could be included in domestic violence statistics amidst fears that such cases had previously been wrongly ignored.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2443827/Over-50-children-aged-13-prosecuted-attacking-parents-London.html

Haba, Sagamite, you never leave this matter till now. If you no take time I go vex say make dem flog you like primary-six truant this morning o.

Oya, check ya friend from Edo who miss road, come begin dey live for London, and then go mistake think say na normal thing for inside UK, to beat small pikin like how dem dey do for that him bush village inside Nigeria.

Dem don arrest am now, carry am gbudu-ghudu wey him leg no reach ground, throway am for cell, GBAM !

I sure say this Edo man go don dey cry for inside jail by now, dey beg, dey narrate, say na train him dey train that small boy when this craze-man take flog kill am. Foolish man don forget say na the same one-two-jail dem for jail am if to say na for Fashola Lagos he try that kind assault against small pikin. Fashola for President of Nigeria ! No shaking.

Look him bonga-head, as e dey wo-woh like baboon yansh. Useless man. And him wahala just dey start o. Wait make he enter cell finish, and Cell Prime Minister dem begin dey ask am say wettin he do. If dem mistake go know him offence, dem go kukuma kill am the same day, send am STRAIGHT, go for where devil dey wait near fire, to divide work give am.

http://uk.news.yahoo.com/boy-3-murdered-wet-bed-181413499.html

Anyway, na for inside Her Majesty cell this monkey-banana go rotten and die now. Amen.

Jakumo: Haba, Sagamite, you never leave this matter till now. If you no take time I go vex say make dem flog you like primary-six truant this morning o.

Oya, check ya friend from Edo who miss road, come begin dey live for London, and then go mistake think say na normal thing for inside UK, to beat small pikin like how dem dey do for that him bush village inside Nigeria.

Dem don arrest am now, carry am gbudu-ghudu wey him leg no reach ground, throway am for cell, GBAM !

I sure say this Edo man go don dey cry for inside jail by now, dey beg, dey narrate, say na train him dey train that small boy when this craze-man take flog kill am. Foolish man don forget say na the same one-two-jail dem for jail am if to say na for Fashola Lagos he try that kind assault against small pikin. Fashola for President of Nigeria ! No shaking.

Look him bonga-head, as e dey wo-woh like baboon yansh. Useless man. And him wahala just dey start o. Wait make he enter cell finish, and Cell Prime Minister dem begin dey ask am say wettin he do. If dem mistake go know him offence, dem go kukuma kill am the same day, send am STRAIGHT, go for where devil dey wait near fire, to divide work give am.

http://uk.news.yahoo.com/boy-3-murdered-wet-bed-181413499.html

Anyway, na for inside Her Majesty cell this monkey-banana go rotten and die now. Amen.

Off course he should be in jail. Where else do you think he should be?

Buckingham Palace getting an OBE?

I have said it before, if you overdo a smacking then you should be punished. What I have said is that because of few fucktards like this is not justification to apply a blanket ban as the outcome would be worse for society. In Nigeria, that is disaster waiting to happen.

A law banning smacking would not stop most wicked fucktards like this still being wicked, but it sure would stop the majority responsible parents being able to control their kids. This person is in a nation that bans smacking and he still demonstrated his retardation despite the law.

If they kill am for jail, I would be so happy I would throw a bbq. We all know I have no pity for fucktards.

overdrive: Too bad d good always die young r.I.p my dear

I reject it in Jesus name, amen!