that explains the defending of the floppy ears

LOL.
No Mr Nwando doesn't have the ears.
I want Obama to win.
Can you imagine me seeing Obama on the evening news and Obama when the lights go out?

My very own obama live and direct.

Ibime:

My guy, you dey talk like say Mr Average know all this thing wey you dey talk. You fit talk from now till tomorrow - I already sabi wetin you dey talk. I be President for Investment Club. The fact is, most people have no clue how to invest - or even who to give their money to - some people no want hear am sef - all the investment talk puts them off.

The fact is that we are talking about running a country here, not running a society of highly educated people - and you have to come up with a better solution than what you are suggesting.

Its because we have a pension system here,its as if we can't do without it.People can be compulsorily required to invest their money.What is most important for me is that any money a particular person receives in his old age comes from money he has saved or invested during his working life not from a central Govt pot.

You reap what you sow eventually.

The key point you are both missing is that with demographic changes,the current pension system is unsustainable.Its that simple.Unless you want society to be equally poor,its better that most of society reaps the benefits of welfare reforms.

This is the problem with 'do-gooding' leftists.They would rather everyone be poorer than some left behind.However,with compulsory measures to ensure savings and investment by the "clueless,"even that worst case scenario can be averted.

I remember it was lax government regulation that allowed the con in the first place

there is a reason we have the Securities Exchange Commission in the United States. you could invest in government bonds or CD's if u are too scared to invest in the stock exchange. Social security is approaching bankruptcy, alternatives have to be found.

bawomolo:

there is a reason we have the Securities Exchange Commission in the United States. you could invest in government bonds or CD's if u are too scared to invest in the stock exchange. Social security is approaching bankruptcy, alternatives have to be found.

Exactly! and some CD's especially from online banks pay up to 5% and above.
a safe alternative for the weak at heart

someone mentioned something about having people invest for you if you don't know how.
That's the worst thing anyone can do.
If you don't understand it,don't invest.

@Bawomolo

The point is these institutions were meant to be as safe as US treasury bills, the safest piece of investments in the world.

Accidents happen especially under capitalism and sometimes in places where you least expect it.

You build a house for example, and insure it in the event of a natural disaster. Disaster hits and then you discover that
the Insurance company does not have enough assets to cover your liabilities. What recourse?


Of course, the burgeoning welfare state is of grave concern. France for example has social liabilities now exceeding 60%
of GDP or American debt that is nearing ten trillion dollars.

But rather take care of the short term priorities than start thinking of long term liabilities
cause as one eminent Economist said. . . . . .

In the Long Run we are all dead


Anyway. . . .

nwando:

My very own obama live and direct.

Which one does it for you? The ear, the middle name, or the teeth?

Michelle has been known to hurt girls who look at Barrack that way.

4 Play:

Its because we have a pension system here,its as if we can't do without it.People can be compulsorily required to invest their money.What is most important for me is that any money a particular person receives in his old age comes from money he has saved or invested during his working life not from a central Govt pot.

You reap what you sow eventually.

The key point you are both missing is that with demographic changes,the current pension system is unsustainable.Its that simple.Unless you want society to be equally poor,its better that most of society reaps the benefits of welfare reforms.

This is the problem with 'do-gooding' leftists.They would rather everyone be poorer than some left behind.However,with compulsory measures to ensure savings and investment by the "clueless,"even that worst case scenario can be averted.

Well thank God you aren't in Government. Every civilised government in the world is doing the opposite of what you are saying - so either they are stupid - or you are. Cancel that - no need for insult.

Governments know better than to leave people starving - because a hungry man is an angry man, so you better hide behind your electric fences when they get angry. Actually, that is already happening in Naija now. The rich neglected the poor and now the poor are killing them like fowls - either by armed robbers, potholed roads or ineffective bootlegged drugs. Go figure!

Do-gooding leftist? - yes, thank God I am. Jesus was also. I'm in good company. Rather 'do-good' than 'do-bad'.

Do you not think the people running these Pension funds are professionals? Can they not do a better job than 95% of ordinary people?

Ibime:

Well thank God you aren't in Government. Every civilised government in the world is doing the opposite of what you are saying - so either they are stupid - or you are.

Governments know better than to leave people starving - because a hungry man is an angry man, so you better hide behind your electric fences when they get angry. Actually, that is already happening in Naija now. The rich neglected the poor and now the poor are killing them like fowls - either by armed robbers, potholed roads or ineffective bootlegged drugs. Go figure!

Do-gooding leftist? - yes, thank God I am. Jesus was also. I'm in good company. Rather 'do-good' than 'do-bad'.

Do you not think the people running these Pension funds are professionals? Can they not do a better job than 95% of ordinary people?

OH MY GOSH!!! LMAO!!! Jesus was also a do-gooding leftist?? the same jesus that watched a widow give all she had and praised her for doing that was a do-gooding leftist?? It is almost good to claim jesus is on your side in any argument , LMAO!!!

Kobojunkie:

OH MY GOSH!!! LMAO!!! Jesus was also a do-gooding leftist?? the same jesus that watched a widow give all she had and praised her for doing that was a do-gooding leftist?? It is almost good to claim jesus is on your side in any argument , LMAO!!!

No - Jesus was a 'do-bading' rightist.

What do you think?

Go and read the book of acts and see how the first Church lived together, ate together and contributed together. Ananias and his wife were even killed for lying about his income - just like you probably do on your tax form. Jesus lived with his disciples and shared his 5 loves of bread and fishes the same way. Remember what he said to the rich young man whom he asked to sell all his possesions and follow him? Wealth is not how much you own, it is a state of mind - grredy or giving. And BTW, Jesus praised the woman because of her giving spirit - not because he wanted the Church to have the money.

They have eyes but they do not see.

Ibime:

No - Jesus was a 'do-bading' rightist.

What do you think?

I am not the one claiming JESUS ON MY SIDE IN A POLITICAL DEBATE HERE, you are,  What next?? God give you Visions that you are right and your opponents are hell bound?? Education at work!!!LMAO!!!

Kobojunkie:

I am not the one claiming JESUS ON MY SIDE IN A POLITICAL DEBATE HERE, you are, What next?? God give you Visions that you are right and your opponents are hell bound?? Education at work!!!LMAO!!!

O-boy grow up! Shebi, you were campaigning for Shagari in 1982 when I wasn't even born. Please act your age.

Ibime:

O-boy grow up! Shebi, you were campaigning for Shagari in 1982 when I wasn't even born. Please act your age.

But I am acting my age,  Exactly the reason why I have continued to ignore your childish jabs even now. Problem is I doubt you even see how ridiculously childish you come off from your own posts. For you not to see how childish claiming Jesus on your side in a debate is,  I have to say ,  I am sorry I can not help you ,  LMAO!!! Don't hold it against me for laughing at your own posts cause if you knew how ridiculous that move was, you would not have done that ,  LMAO!!!

PS. Notice how you have over and over transfered issues you have with my posts on other threads(without giving solid reasons) to this one?? Are you sure you are ok

Nobody is claiming Jesus in any debate - just stating facts. Jesus cared for all men, especially the poor - so I don't know what you are laughing about.

I am sure you have heard the seven beautitudes. The fact is that if Jesus was here, you would probably call him a left wing do-gooder as well.

I am not claiming Christian or anything - just telling you.

Ibime:

Nobody is claiming Jesus in any debate - just stating facts. Jesus cared for all men - so I don't know what you are laughing about.

I am sure you have heard the seven beautitudes. The fact is that if Jesus was here, you would probably call him a left wing do-gooder as well.

Sure,  Fact, Jesus cared for all men but NO,  Jesus Never claimed that Providing Welfare is the way to Go ,  Sorry !!! I know what you were doing.  LMAO!!!! Like I explained to you earlier, the same Jesus said their will always be poor when Judas talked of selling the expensive perfume to feed the poor, instead of the lady using it to wash Jesus' feet. Did you miss that part. Do not even claim that Jesus is NOW PRO Welfare state just cause you can not stand being DEBATED in here!!!!LMAO!!!

Hehehe - you are the one speculating whether Jesus is pro-Welfare state or not, not me.

But Jesus did say give to Ceaser what is Ceasers and Give to God what is God's - and love your neighbour as yourself.

Ibime:

Well thank God you aren't in Government. Every civilised government in the world is doing the opposite of what you are saying - so either they are stupid - or you are. Cancel that - no need for insult.

Governments know better than to leave people starving - because a hungry man is an angry man, so you better hide behind your electric fences when they get angry. Actually, that is already happening in Naija now. The rich neglected the poor and now the poor are killing them like fowls - either by armed robbers, potholed roads or ineffective bootlegged drugs. Go figure!

Do-gooding leftist? - yes, thank God I am. Jesus was also. I'm in good company. Rather 'do-good' than 'do-bad'.

Do you not think the people running these Pension funds are professionals? Can they not do a better job than 95% of ordinary people?  

Ibime:

Hehehe - you are the one speculating whether Jesus is pro-Welfare state or not, not me.

Are you sure about that ? LMAO!!!

Ibime:

But Jesus did say give to Ceaser what is Ceasers and Give to God what is God's - and love your neighbour as yourself.

Sure, give to Caesar what is Caesars, not give to Danjuma what belongs to Abubakar, LMAO!!!!! Love your neighbour as yourself does not purport you create a welfare system. The same Bible you get all this from is the same that says if a man does not work, let him not eat. Please enough of the trying to bring God to your side of the debate ooo, LMAO!!

Look - you can LMAO all you want. When I say Jesus was a 'do-good' leftist, you are the one reading literal meaning into it. If I say Ghandhi was a 'do-good' leftist, you wouldn't complain, although Ghandhi never described himself as a leftist. You guys are the one using the label 'leftist'. I wouldn't even describe myself as a 'leftist' so why woud I describe Jesus as such. If I am leftist then Britain must be a leftist country because I like their social systems. Anyway, I don tire for you.

Ibime:

Look - you can LMAO all you want. When I say Jesus was a 'do-good' leftist, you are the one reading literal meaning into it. If I say Ghandhi was a 'do-good' leftist, you wouldn't complain, although Ghandhi never described himself as a leftist. You guys are the one using the label 'leftist'. I wouldn't even describe myself as a 'leftist' so why woud I describe Jesus as such. If I am leftist then Britain must be a leftist country because I like their social systems. Anyway, I don tire for you. 

You really have convinced yourself that I was born yesterdayLMAO!!! children of nowadays!!! continue,  I can go on and on with you on this all night. I mean it does not take a genius to figure out your debating style. This is not the first time you have done this today,  tryed to wiggle around your own posts with twists and turns in directions that only leave you in even worse state in the end. Quit already LMAO!!!

Ibime:


Do-gooding leftist? - yes, thank God I am. Jesus was also. I'm in good company. Rather 'do-good' than 'do-bad'.

He- you must think this is literal and debating society or something. Firstly, your breadth of knowledge is too shallow - you should leave it to Bamowolo - at least he backs up his arguments with facts - you just spew rhetoric. Secondly, I am not so interested in convincing you of anything - discussion sharpens the mind - I also pick up things from debate. Thirdly, you just wanna LMAO! as if that validates your point. Fourthly, it is late and I got to tap soccer tomorrow so I got to go.

Ibime:

He- you must think this is literal and debating society or something. Firstly, your breadth of knowledge is too shallow - you should leave it to Bamowolo - at least he backs up his arguments with facts - you just spew rhetoric. Secondly, I am not so interested in convincing you of anything - discussion sharpens the mind - I also pick up things from debate. Thirdly, you just want to LMAO! as if that validates your point. Fourthly, it is late and I got to tap soccer tomorrow so I got to go.

1) How did you access this ?? Cause I ignored you as soon as you started throwing insults like a child?? I am sorry but I do not debate children in here. I have better things to do with my time, like spend it on more productive things.

2) All the points made by your opponent are available to majority. I sat back waiting for your masters in applied math and minor in economics to kick in, even when it came to understanding that societies that have implemented the universal health care plan for which you advocate, also enjoy the "benefit" of higher tax brackets compared to those without; The situation in China and not to forget, you earlier post on how cuba's literacy level makes the country a better candidate for capitalism than other countries with lower literacy levels. I am still shocked that someone with your claimed level of education would make such a claim( which is where I think most of these insults from you started).

3) The very fact that you even carried insults over from other threads into this shows me that you are not worth my time when it comes to debates. I prefer debating points with people who are able to get out of their comfort zones and realize that they do not necessarily have it all figured out; others have an opinion and right to share it as well, and that playing the GOD IS ON MY SIDE CARD is the lamest move you can ever make in debates such as the one that has been going on all day on this thread.

Kobo can be quite obnoxious at times, I swear.

Some poltical thread has been turned into some Jesus war. Thanks to you.

D-reloaded:

Kobo can be quite obnoxious at times, I swear.

Some poltical thread has been turned into some Jesus war. Thanks to you.

I will ask first if you are stupid. Did you read before jumping to this conclusion?? Where in this did I start the jesus war you claimed?? The dude pointed out that Jesus is on his side of the argument and I tried to make him seee he is not right, are you sure I am the obnoxious one here

You can ask whatever you wish but you're the obnoxious jackass in this thread. If he wants to side with Jesus, so what? Out of all that is written, that is what was bothering you? Why? Why do you bloody care? What does that have to do everything else that was said Stick to the topic or carry go jare.

and you're constantly "LMAO!! OH MY GOD! You actually think yada yada yada LMAO!!!"

Like an obnoxious autistic child. Better calm down. shio.

D-reloaded:

You can ask whatever you wish but you're the obnoxious jackass in this thread. If he wants to side with Jesus, so what? Out of all that is written, that is what was bothering you? Why? Why do you bloody care? What does that have to do everything else that was said Stick to the topic or carry go jare.

and you're constantly "LMAO!! OH MY GOD! You actually think yada yada yada LMAO!!!"

Like an obnoxious autistic child. Better calm down. shio.

Insulting me is not going to help your case, if your bothered to Read the debate and actually understand how jesus came in to the whole you would understand but then again, I accept, I may be asking for too much.

I did read it, after all he was respoinding to 4Play's comment and I think you blew it up and kept dragging it out for no reason.

@D-reloaded,

I did read it, after all he was respoinding to 4Play's comment and I think you blew it up and kept dragging it out for no reason.

And what have you done by this statement, brought an end to it? I was beginning to believe that there is hope for nairaland in the politics section.

This is the second thread I have been involved with in the past few days where people with opposing views have discussed intelligently without resorting to insults. But you guys have spoilt that. Everyone has a right to respond to any postings on this forum even if it wasn't addressed to them. What part of PUBLIC forum isn't public?

Please let's try and keep to the topic. Calling someone obnoxious isn't related to this toic is it?

@Ibime,

Just want to address some of your concerns.

Well thank God you aren't in Government. Every civilised government in the world is doing the opposite of what you are saying - so either they are stupid - or you are. Cancel that - no need for insult.

In my opinion, the govt is indeed stupid. Welfare isn't the job of govt, it is governance, law, order and justice. Won't you think it strange if the judiciary suddenly gets itself involved in welfare? This is just as ludicous as the Excecutive or Legislative arm of govt doing the same. Because it's common now doesn't make it right.

Governments know better than to leave people starving - because a hungry man is an angry man, so you better hide behind your electric fences when they get angry.

The Govt role in food security should not be extended to providing food for the lazy man. The Jesus you mentioned said "he that does not work should not eat."

Actually, that is already happening in Naija now. The rich neglected the poor and now the poor are killing them like fowls - either by armed robbers, potholed roads or ineffective bootlegged drugs. Go figure!

The rich are not responsible for the poor. A man is responsible for his family, and not every privates and harry out there. If my money has to go to the poor, it must be out of my own volition and goodness of heart, not forced upon me by a govt. That armed robbers are roaming aour streets and killing people shows a failure of the govt, not the rich.

Do-gooding leftist? - yes, thank God I am. Jesus was also. I'm in good company. Rather 'do-good' than 'do-bad'.

that is a very bold statement you made. Jesus may have done good, but He never indulged people who are lazy. Jesus was a hard worker and encouraged hardwork. Besides, Jesus did not ask Ceasar to provide for the people, He did that out of the goodness of His heart. If jesus met peopkle's needs through His own reaources, why do we expect the govt to now be the one doing it? Welfare should be left in the hands of the private sector who can administer their own hard earned money better.

Do you not think the people running these Pension funds are professionals? Can they not do a better job than 95% of ordinary people?

No one can handle my money better than I do. I sweated for it, and know its value better than them. I mentioned just one of the tenants I have had who abused this welfare scheme. That could never happen if it was administered by the private sector.

By the way, the Bible is very clear in the Book of Romans what the govt's role should be. It is primarily to provide justice and fairness in the society. Welfare is not one of them. The Disciples in Acts were very specific that provisions were for old women and widows. The function is performed by the Church and not the State. However, the Church is only to be burdened when there is no other family member that can take care of the needs of the widow or elderly woman.

Tayo-D:

@D-reloaded,
And what have you done by this statement, brought an end to it? I was beginning to believe that there is hope for nairaland in the politics section.

This is the second thread I have been involved with in the past few days where people with opposing views have discussed intelligently without resorting to insults. But you guys have spoilt that. Everyone has a right to respond to any postings on this forum even if it wasn't addressed to them. What part of PUBLIC forum isn't public?

Please let's try and keep to the topic. Calling someone obnoxious isn't related to this toic is it?

@Ibime,

Just want to address some of your concerns.

[b]Well thank God you aren't in Government. Every civilised government in the world is doing the opposite of what you are saying - so either they are stupid - or you are. Cancel that - no need for insult.[/b]In my opinion, the govt is indeed stupid. Welfare isn't the job of govt, it is governance, law, order and justice. Won't you think it strange if the judiciary suddenly gets itself involved in welfare? This is just as ludicous as the Excecutive or Legislative arm of govt doing the same. Because it's common now doesn't make it right.
The Govt role in food security should not be extended to providing food for the lazy man. The Jesus you mentioned said "he that does not work should not eat."
The rich are not responsible for the poor. A man is responsible for his family, and not every privates and harry out there. If my money has to go to the poor, it must be out of my own volition and goodness of heart, not forced upon me by a govt. That armed robbers are roaming aour streets and killing people shows a failure of the govt, not the rich.
that is a very bold statement you made. Jesus may have done good, but He never indulged people who are lazy. Jesus was a hard worker and encouraged hardwork. Besides, Jesus did not ask Ceasar to provide for the people, He did that out of the goodness of His heart. If jesus met peopkle's needs through His own reaources, why do we expect the govt to now be the one doing it? Welfare should be left in the hands of the private sector who can administer their own hard earned money better.

No one can handle my money better than I do. I sweated for it, and know its value better than them. I mentioned just one of the tenants I have had who abused this welfare scheme. That could never happen if it was administered by the private sector.

By the way, the Bible is very clear in the Book of Romans what the govt's role should be. It is primarily to provide justice and fairness in the society. Welfare is not one of them. The Disciples in Acts were very specific that provisions were for old women and widows. The function is performed by the Church and not the State. However, the Church is only to be burdened when there is no other family member that can take care of the needs of the widow or elderly woman.

glad you see it too!