ooman: Hey enilove, you got your second to the last bible reference wrong. Its not Acts 14v16-17 that contains what you quoted, its JOHN 14v16-17. Correct that. Calm down there is no pressure.

When you do, I will delete this post so dont quote it.

Peace out

ManirBK: EARLY CHRISTIANS PROSTRATION
AND PRAYER MATS: CHRISTIANS
PRAYING LIKE MUSLIMS.

Early Chistians Prayed Like Muslims
and Jesus...
Speaking of the 7th century,
Diarmaid McCulloch tells the
Christians were praying like
Muslims before the coming of
Islam:
…the characteristic prostration of
Muslim prayer was then normal in
the Christian Middle East, where it
still survives in some traditional
Christian communities. Prayer
mats, still one of the most familiar
features of the mosque today,
were extensively used by the
Christian monks as far apart as
Syria and Northumbria or Ireland
before the coming of Islam. [A
History of Christianity, Diarmaid
McCulloch, Penguin Group, 2009,
p258]
Why would early Christians pray
like Muslims?
Could it have anything to do with
Prophet Jesus (p) worshipping
God in the manner in which
Muslims pray? In fact, even
Christian sources point to this:
Going a little farther, he fell with
his face to the ground and
prayed, “My Father, if it is possible,
may this cup be taken from me.
Yet not as I will, but as you
will.” [Matthew 26: 39, NIV]
Going a little farther, he fell to the
ground and prayed that if
possible the hour might pass
from him. “Abba,[a] Father,” he
said, “everything is possible for
you. Take this cup from me. Yet
not what I will, but what you
will.” [Mark 14:35-36, NIV]
Also see: Luke 22:39-46
Apart from the glaring theological
problem which Trinitarians
encounter from such passages
(i.e. that of Jesus worshipping
God!) we can clearly see that Jesus
appears to pray in the manner of
the Muslims according to Christian
sources. Thus, from these
passages we can understand the
usage of prayer mats within
Christian communities prior to the
coming of Islam.
Note: The word Father (Abba) is
simply a Jewish term for God. It is
not to be taken literally, Professor
Geza Vermes writes: Jesus prayed
there in the solitude, invoking God
as ‘Abba’, ‘Father’ or My Father’.
The word is given in Aramaic in
Mark and in Greek in Matthew and
Luke. Abba is a familiar but also
respectful expression. It is not the
equivalent of ‘Daddy’, as some
New Testament scholars have
unwisely ventured to propose.
[‘Jesus’ Nativity-Passion-
Resurrection, Geza Vermes,
Penguin books, 2008, p. 208]

andromida: This is the bible verse i know which speaks of mohammed.

Ezekiel 8:15-16 Then said he unto me, Hast thou seen this, O son of man? turn thee yet again, and thou shalt see greater abominations than these.

And he brought me into the inner court of the Lord's house, and, behold, at the door of the temple of the Lord, between the porch and the altar, were about five and twenty men, with their backs toward the temple of the Lord, and their faces toward the east; and they worshipped the sun toward the east.

Apparently in the OT it is an abomination to turn your backs toward the temple of the lord and face the east and guess who said its just right to face the east and back the temple of God.

Secondly it is obvious that before the arrival of mohammed on the scene this practice had been in place and it is abominable to God. Why is it abominable to God and why did mohammed make it legit?

submitter: Prophecy Servant of God
` ` ` ` ` ` ` `
word Atmak not necessarily means ‘whom I uphold’ but is infact a name

the writing of Atmak is אתמך
the writing of Ahmad is אחמד

Isaiah 42:1
God says
“Behold, 'My Servant' (pronounced as Abd-ee), ‘whom I uphold’ (pronounced as Atmak);

God mentioning about the coming of His servant
Behold My Servant Ahmad (Isaiah 42:1) - so who is this Ahmad as in God'servant?

He is none other than
Abd-Allah Ahmad (Servant of God, Ahmad) - Prophet Muhammad s.a.w

cleanvessel:

Isaiah 42:1
BEHOLD my servant, whom I uphold; mine elect in whom my soul delighteth; I have put my spirit upon him: he shall bring forth judgement to the Gentiles.

Where did you see your Ahmad here?

Was Muhammad sent to excute judgement or to give warning?

So Muhammad is no more the Comforter, Holy Ghost but a servant of God?

When will you people stop deceiving yourselves? You are seriously searching the bible to get legitimacy for your prophet - Muhammad. Stop searching it is not there.

Matthew 12:
17. That it might be fulfilled which was spoken by Isaias the prophet, saying

18. Behold my servant, whom I have chosen; my beloved, in whom my soul is well pleased: I will put my spirit upon him, and he shall shew judgement to the Gentiles.

Reading from verse 15 will tell you the prophecy is talking about Jesus, not Muhammad. Muhammad has no record in the bible.

submitter: This is not deceiving one selves at all. It is proved by reading ongoing verses in chapter 42 foretelling about this man, servant of God.

have the events mention in passage 42 happened?

verse 11 & 12 mention specifically about arabia (desert), place inhabit by Kedar, inhabitants in areas of Sela. As of today indeed you can see, the inhabitants of arabia glorify and praise God.

You see inhabitants in these lands reciting Allahu Akbar (God is Greatest) , Alhamdulillah (Praise Almighty God) hundreds of times daily.

17- They shall be turned back, they shall be greatly ashamed, that trust in graven images, that they say to the molten images, Ye are our gods.

11- Let the wilderness and the cities thereof lift up their voice, the villages that Kedar doth inhabit: let the inhabitants of Sela sing, let them shout from the top of the mountains.

12- Let them give glory unto the Lord, and declare his praise in the islands.

Praise Almighty Allah as priests and bible scholars around the world are embracing Islam. They are aiding in helping to spread the message on real purpose of life. To worship Almighty God prior to the coming Judgement Day.

cleanvessel:

Isaiah 42:1
BEHOLD my servant, whom I uphold; mine elect in whom my soul delighteth; I have put my spirit upon him: he shall bring forth judgement to the Gentiles.

Where did you see your Ahmad here?

Was Muhammad sent to excute judgement or to give warning?

So Muhammad is no more the Comforter, Holy Ghost but a servant of God?

When will you people stop deceiving yourselves? You are seriously searching the bible to get legitimacy for your prophet - Muhammad. Stop searching it is not there.

Matthew 12:
17. That it might be fulfilled which was spoken by Isaias the prophet, saying

18. Behold my servant, whom I have chosen; my beloved, in whom my soul is well pleased: I will put my spirit upon him, and he shall shew judgement to the Gentiles.

Reading from verse 15 will tell you the prophecy is talking about Jesus, not Muhammad. Muhammad has no record in the bible.

RoyPCain: @cleanvessel: Is Jesus God or Servant of God? If Jesus was God he can not be servant of God, in the same way that neither of the other 2 in the Trinity can not be servant. If Jesus was servant He can not be God, unless both the 2 in Trinity can be servants. You can not have master and servant in the same body on the same job. you can not CEO of major organization and you are the janitor at the same time. You can not put on a suit at a board meeting and at the same time put on apron and cleaning gloves hosing down the toilets. One position is a farce if the other is remotely plausible or probable.




it seems to me that the servant spoken by Isaiah must be someone who spoke to gentiles, someone who took the message of guidance to them and not restricted it to the non gentiles, the nations of the children of Israel. Did Jesus spread his message to the gentiles or was it strictly for the children of Israel? if he didn't invite the gentiles, then he can never the one spoken about by Isiah. read the qualification, again to catch the true quality of the one expected after the verse was revealed to Isiah.

did you ask if Muhammad executed judgment on the gentiles? the answer is yes. The arabs in Makka are gentiles, or are the children of Israel?

Muhammad [SA] is known as the Beloved of God [Abibullah; research it and dont let your anger and hatred cloud your mind].

RoyPCain: @cleanvessel: you would have been better off it you put the minimum effort because you would have found that God says in the Quran that they will never have truly believed until they make you the Judge.



But no, by your Lord, they can have no Faith, until they make you (O Muhammad SAW) judge IN ALL DISPUTES between them, and find in themselves NO RESISTANCE against your decisions, and accept (them) with full submission. S. 4:65

RoyPCain: @cleanvessel; If a man is Loved by my Lord, none is Loved more than Muhammad [SA], the warner, the prophet, the messenger, the judge [what else would you want to add, even if it is not true?]. when you asked and you were served, instead of accepting reality, you just have to move the goal post. typical.


with the accusation you leveled that God provided all the desires of Muhammad [sa], you did not notice that compared to anyone in human history, his Lord has not loved anyone born of a woman more than him, even though he was no more than a slave, servant and human messenger. it seems to me that the verse of Isiah fits this servant [SA] than anyone else in human history because after the verse was revealed to Isiah, Muhammaad was the only judge instead o anyone judging him, and as a servant of God, God supported him by ruhu amin [ruhu qudud, Gabriel] that appeared to humanity.

we know where he was a judge and the groups he judged were both jews and gentiles in madina. God raised his esteem to the highest in the presence of children of israel and his authority was not limited to them, but included the gentiles; arabs. when you are living in fantasy and making stories instead of seeking the mercy of God directly, the reality is with us in Islam in the person of the holy prophet [sa]. we do not have to exaggerate or diminish but state the true quality of people God appointed.

RoyPCain: @cleanvessel; If a man is Loved by my Lord, none is Loved more than Muhammad [SA], the warner, the prophet, the messenger, the judge [what else would you want to add, even if it is not true?]. when you asked and you were served, instead of accepting reality, you just have to move the goal post. typical.


with the accusation you leveled that God provided all the desires of Muhammad [sa], you did not notice that compared to anyone in human history, his Lord has not loved anyone born of a woman more than him, even though he was no more than a slave, servant and human messenger. it seems to me that the verse of Isiah fits this servant [SA] than anyone else in human history because after the verse was revealed to Isiah, Muhammaad was the only judge instead o anyone judging him, and as a servant of God, God supported him by ruhu amin [ruhu qudud, Gabriel] that appeared to humanity.

we know where he was a judge and the groups he judged were both jews and gentiles in madina. God raised his esteem to the highest in the presence of children of israel and his authority was not limited to them, but included the gentiles; arabs. when you are living in fantasy and making stories instead of seeking the mercy of God directly, the reality is with us in Islam in the person of the holy prophet [sa]. we do not have to exaggerate or diminish but state the true quality of people God appointed.

submitter: The prophecy said Servant of God will war in bringing judgement, to correct the wrongs. He will also liberate Arabia from worshiping molten images. Wilderness (desert), villages and cities will glorify God. This is what happen today. Whole of Arabia worshiping God daily.

And we continue reading verses 18-25; Children of Israel will still be deaf and blind as they neglect the message brought by the 'Servant of God'.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
This cannot be a coincidence. If we look at the writing of אתמך (Atmc) אחמד (Ahmad). Not to mentioned אתמך (Atmc) is used only once. Scribes copying error or indeed an intended error? And the word before אתמך (Atmc), is עבדי (Abedi~My Servant). It is indeed indicating Ahmad Abedallah (Ahmad 'Servant of God').

Children of Israel had been foretold by the coming of Ahmad.

the good thing about this whoe thing is tht Muhammad clearly says that all he heard was from an 'angel' and not from God directly. hmmm.

So she took a veil (to screen herself) from them; then We sent to her Our spirit, and there appeared to her a well-made man. (Quran 19:17)

Say: The Holy spirit has revealed it from your Lord with the truth, that it may establish those who believe and as a guidance and good news for those who submit. (Quran 16:102)