There is a worrying trend in the pattern of the violent attacks on the Christian peoples of the Plateau and recently on Christian villages in Southern Kaduna. The nocturnal marauders pillaging Christian villages in North Central Nigeria have a complete disregard for the sanctity of life. There are increasing accounts of the deliberate targeting of women and children by the heavily armed, well-organized, Fulani militia suspected to be behind these dastardly attacks...

For details: http://qreatifdave..com/2013/04/are-christians-in-north-central-nigeria.html

QreatifDave: There is a worrying trend in the pattern of the violent attacks on the Christian peoples of the Plateau and recently on Christian villages in Southern Kaduna. The nocturnal marauders pillaging Christian villages in North Central Nigeria have a complete disregard for the sanctity of life. There are increasing accounts of the deliberate targeting of women and children by the heavily armed, well-organized, Fulani militia suspected to be behind these dastardly attacks...

For details: http://qreatifdave..com/2013/04/are-christians-in-north-central-nigeria.html

What if they are facing Genocide how does that bother you ,are they complaining about it .why take panadol for another man's headache

Yes they are and i can't lie that i am not bothered about it anytime i think about it. They face the risk of domination from a people who believe they are not good enough to have the gift of life and thus Genocide.

I don't know where you're from Sibrah, Kettykin(?), but that's the exact sentiments ordinary Germans, Polish, Chechs, etc had about the Jews just before WW II. See what happened afterwards. Even ordinary Germans were affected. Of course Polish & Chechs were the worse for it. An injury to one is an injury to all. The man die in him who keeps silent in the face of injustice and oppression. Today it's northern Christians, tomorrow its your own people & the rest of the world won't care less. What comes around, goes around.

kettykin:

What if they are facing Genocide how does that bother you ,are they complaining about it .why take panadol for another man's headache

Unbelievably foolish.

kettykin:

What if they are facing Genocide how does that bother you ,are they complaining about it .why take panadol for another man's headache

Sopona lo ma pa e.

QreatifDave: I don't know where you're from Sibrah, Kettykin(?), but that's the exact sentiments ordinary Germans, Polish, Chechs, etc had about the Jews just before WW II. See what happened afterwards. Even ordinary Germans were affected. Of course Polish & Chechs were the worse for it. An injury to one is an injury to all. The man die in him who keeps silent in the face of injustice and oppression. Today it's northern Christians, tomorrow its your own people & the rest of the world won't care less. What comes around, goes around.

If the Middle belt leaders like Gowon , TY Danjuma, Domkat Bali, Useni,Unongo Gana e.t.c are not complaining or even reacting whom would you expect to react in their place .
The middle belt leaders who often go about with a false sense of pride talking about how and why the struck and how the fought to stop Biafra from seceding and how they will use the last drop of their blood to stop the disintegration of Nigeria can not spare a drop of sweat to stop the killing of innocent people in their Domain , then whom do you want to step out stop it.

if you have a good knowledge of history you would realize that this same scenario played out before the civil war , there were Riots in the North Central and western region, Tiv riots and a state of Emergency in the South West with Yoruba leader Awolowo in prison but all that changed when Nzeogwu foolishly and naively led a coup , igbos became scape goats and were now on the receiving end with their people killed by even Tivs who some few months were rioting against Northern Domination and Awolowo who was even jailed by the North turned around and became an exterminator in chief of igbos .

The same predatory circumstances are playing out today and the Northern Minorities are at the receiving end.
Jerry Gana once boasted some few days ago that the North will still fight if need be for Nigeria's unity . what is stopping the North from fighting to liberate it self or the Middle beltans fighting to Liberate them selves whom are they waiting for to come and be their scape goats

Ile-Ife:


Sopona lo ma pa e.

make your contributions rather than make incoherent statements

Vado:

Unbelievably foolish.

at least a foolish person makes mistakes learns from it and becomes wise but a lunatic is finished for life

You may be making a point there. So-called Middle Belt leaders may be guilty of complacency with respect to the possible genocide of their people going on right under their fat noses.. You also seem to know some history. With the benefit of hindsight, don't you think it will be foolish to allow history to repeat itself? Shouldn't we learn from what happened to the Igbos and do every possible to avert a repeat on other people in Nigeria? What's the point of knowing history if we refuse to learn from it?

Middle Belter/North Centrals are Slaves of Hausa/Fulani, they have accepted to be Slave. Each and every one of them even the one unborn is a Slave to Hausa/Fulani.

QreatifDave: You may be making a point there. So-called Middle Belt leaders may be guilty of complacency with respect to the possible genocide of their people going on right under their fat noses.. You also seem to know some history. With the benefit of hindsight, don't you think it will be foolish to allow history to repeat itself? Shouldn't we learn from what happened to the Igbos and do every possible to avert a repeat on other people in Nigeria? What's the point of knowing history if we refuse to learn from it?

Your points are noted and have even been deliberated here on NL, the question is how can the Minorities in the North be saved from the impending genocide , the middle belters populate the military and para military institutions , they hold strategic positions in the senate and other arms of the government like the ministry of internal affairs they have a large body of veteran soldiers who fought to re unite the country .

The senate president the 3rd most influential politician who is a middle beltan is more after donating millions of naira worth of gift to a rich artist and pushing death penalty for oil thieves where as he could have be in the fore front of preparing and passing bills that could help in containing the crises

QreatifDave: I don't know where you're from Sibrah, Kettykin(?), but that's the exact sentiments ordinary Germans, Polish, Chechs, etc had about the Jews just before WW II. See what happened afterwards. Even ordinary Germans were affected. Of course Polish & Chechs were the worse for it. An injury to one is an injury to all. The man die in him who keeps silent in the face of injustice and oppression. Today it's northern Christians, tomorrow its your own people & the rest of the world won't care less. What comes around, goes around.

Do you not think it is an act of idiocy to talk of threat of genocide on the Christians of northern region of Nigeria who had partook in perpetrating genocide on fellow Christians in 1966?

Wiily Willy! This is called negative stereotyping. Have you even been anywhere outside of your home state? Have you been to states in Central Nigeria? Do you've friends who're from that region? I doubt. If my suspicion is correct, then, as is always the case with stereotyping, your position is ill informed.

Dede1, Middle Beltan people didn't commit genocide against any people in 1966. The Nigerian Army fought a civil war with the defunct Biafran army. The Christian people of North Central Nigeria who fought on the Nigerian side, weren't fighting for the Middle Belt against fellow Biafran Christians; they fought for Nigerian. And NO, sir, it is not idiotic to advocate for the rights of a people oppressed. On the contrary, it is the right thing to do if you're a man/woman of good conscience.

You make your bed, you lay on it.

The Middlebelters already made their choice 47 years ago.

If they can fight, let them fight.
If they can't fight, let them perish.

I'm sorry I had to say it this way, and I apologize if you find my opinion insensitive.

But that's just how it goes.

QreatifDave: Dede1, Middle Beltan people didn't commit genocide against any people in 1966. The Nigerian Army fought a civil war with the defunct Biafran army. The Christian people of North Central Nigeria who fought on the Nigerian side, weren't fighting for the Middle Belt against fellow Biafran Christians; they fought for Nigerian. And NO, sir, it is not idiotic to advocate for the rights of a people oppressed. On the contrary, it is the right thing to do if you're a man/woman of good conscience.

you are very wrong on this i never intended opening up old wounds but the truth will be told no matter whose ox is gored , a few links below will prove to you the kind of genocide Northern Minorites perpetrated against igbos
Igbos were killed by even Idomas and Tivs , it was that bad

http://www.biafragenocide.org/index.php?id=51

Many Igbos who managed to escape from the far north were massacred in the thousands

by Idomas and Tivs as they passed through the Middle Belt on their flight to Igboland. The Igbos met similar fate in the hands of the Yorubas in Western Region. In the second waves of massacres during the civil war, the Binis and other non-Igbo military officers of Mid-West origin led the murderous attacks on Ika Ibos (Blood On The Niger, E. Okocha).

No Idoma or Tiv soldier or politician was killed in the Nzeogwu led coup

Ejiné, I'll have you know that you're gravely mistaken. The Middlebeltan are the buffer between you & the horde of islamists in the 'far North'. If Northern Christians sink, it opens the gates to the south. Do you know how the northern islamists will relish pillaging your land, ravaging your women, and plundering your barns? We gave you the presidency in 2011! Without the votes of Northern Christians, Jonathan would never ever have won the presidency, rigged or free & fair. I'll have you know that if Northern Christians perish, the next frontier for the jihadist is the south. God help you!

Interesting discussion, let it go on. But it is worth saying here that we need to properly define the problem of Nigeria and fight it in unity.The igbo guys on this forum should learn from history, forgive the middlebeltans and work together with them in unity to defeat their common enemy. When we keep struggling in isolation we allnare going to lose out.

QreatifDave: Ejiné, I'll have you know that you're gravely mistaken. The Middlebeltan are the buffer between you & the horde of islamists in the 'far North'. If Northern Christians sink, it opens the gates to the south. Do you know how the northern islamists will relish pillaging your land, ravaging your women, and plundering your barns? We gave you the presidency in 2011! Without the votes of Northern Christians, Jonathan would never ever have won the presidency, rigged or free & fair. I'll have you know that if Northern Christians perish, the next frontier for the jihadist is the south. God help you!

I think it is the other way round the Middle belt it was that saved the north , Igbos would have colonized the whole country after the first coup but for Aguiyi Ironsi who foolishly trusted and enthrusted the Christian Middle belt with 2 very important positions the Chief of Army staff to Gowon and ADC to the Head of state to TY danjuma, these 2 erros is what has demoted igbos from 1st class to 6th class citizens in Nigeria.

If the Middle belt was a buffer to the East and Niger delta how come we have muslims in the Middle belt areas of Nassarawa , igalla land and in the South South Areas of Auchi and none in the east even though these areas have proximity with the east. were there Jihadist selective or possibly the eastwas not attractive to them.

QreatifDave: Dede1, Middle Beltan people didn't commit genocide against any people in 1966. The Nigerian Army fought a civil war with the defunct Biafran army. The Christian people of North Central Nigeria who fought on the Nigerian side, weren't fighting for the Middle Belt against fellow Biafran Christians; they fought for Nigerian. And NO, sir, it is not idiotic to advocate for the rights of a people oppressed. On the contrary, it is the right thing to do if you're a man/woman of good conscience.

In your previous post, you talked about not allowing history to repeat itself. It is not surprise to me you did not even know yesteryear’s history of Nigeria. Do you realize that genocide is not a war? Believe me you are not capable of discussing the issue of genocide.

Most of the Nigerian soldiers and civilians who engaged in genocidal endeavor against Ndigbo and other easterners were mainly Christians from the so-called Middle Belt. Names such as Captain Domkat Bali, Lt Nwdikon Pam, Lt Buka Dimka, Lt Nathan Nuhu, Lt John Onoja, Lt William Walbe etc readily come to mind.

kettykin:


I think it is the other way round the Middle belt it was that saved the north , Igbos would have colonized the whole country after the first coup but for Aguiyi Ironsi who foolishly trusted and enthrusted the Christian Middle belt with 2 very important positions the Chief of Army staff to Gowon and ADC to the Head of state to TY danjuma, these 2 erros is what has demoted igbos from 1st class to 6th class citizens in Nigeria.

If the Middle belt was a buffer to the East and Niger delta how come we have muslims in the Middle belt areas of Nassarawa , igalla land and in the South South Areas of Auchi and none in the east even though these areas have proximity with the east. were there Jihadist selective or possibly the eastwas not attractive to them.

. Wow. Gowon was not chief of Army Staff in Ironsi's government. When the coup took place, he just returned from military training abroad. There were officers more senior than him. Eg. Col Pam & Brigadier Maimalari. Why should he be COA? Danjuma was not Ironsi's ADC, LtSani Bello was. You got that wrong. This discussion is about drawing attention of the public to the possibility of genocide against Christians in some North Central States. I think we've gotten your attention, otherwise you won't be in this discussion.

Dede1:


In your previous post, you talked about not allowing history to repeat itself. It is not surprise to me you did not even know yesteryear’s history of Nigeria. Do you realize that genocide is not a war? Believe me you are not capable of discussing the issue of genocide.

I've heard it said that if a man is losing an argument, he resorts to insults. I suppose you're an expert on genocide, sir?

QreatifDave: Dede1, Middle Beltan people didn't commit genocide against any people in 1966. The Nigerian Army fought a civil war with the defunct Biafran army. The Christian people of North Central Nigeria who fought on the Nigerian side, weren't fighting for the Middle Belt against fellow Biafran Christians; they fought for Nigerian. And NO, sir, it is not idiotic to advocate for the rights of a people oppressed. On the contrary, it is the right thing to do if you're a man/woman of good conscience.

Major C. Anuforo, may his soul rest in peace, solemnly swore to kill Lt Col James Pam because Pam led the Nigerian soldiers that annihilated the Tiv, Idoma and Igala people during 1964 riot on the orders of Sarduana of Sokoto. When 2nd Racce under the command of Maj Anuforo was sent to finish what Pam started, he refused to arrest any Tiv, Idoma or Igala fellow but arrest every Fulani and Hausa Muslims sent by NPC and Bello to cause trouble in Middle Belt. Due to face to face altercation with Bello over the arrest of NPC supporters instead of UMBC under J S Tarka, Bello sought for his removal as 2nd Racce commander.

It was not surprise that JS Tarka, a Tiv and leader of UMBC, was contracted by Mobile Corporation to come to USA and campaign against Biafrans in front of American public that seemed to have developed soft spot for Biafrans.

Dede1: Most the Nigerian soldiers and civilians who engaged in genocidal endeavor against Ndigbo and other easterners were mainly Christians from the so-called Middle Belt. Names such as Captain Domkat Baily, Lt Nwdikon Pam, Lt Buka Dimka, Lt Nathan Nuhu, Lt John Onoja, Lt William Walbe etc readily come to mind.

These soldiers you listed were not fighting against Igbos. They were fighting for Nigeria - against Biafra. Make that distinction, sir.

sammyzacks: Interesting discussion, let it go on. But it is worth saying here that we need to properly define the problem of Nigeria and fight it in unity.The igbo guys on this forum should learn from history, forgive the middlebeltans and work together with them in unity to defeat their common enemy. When we keep struggling in isolation we allnare going to lose out.

Do you mind telling us who the common enemy is?

QreatifDave: These soldiers you listed were not fighting against Igbos. They were fighting for Nigeria - against Biafra. Make that distinction, sir.

Again, I think we are talking about genocide, thus, the unprovoked and wanton killing of soldiers and civilians of eastern region origins in northern and western regions of Nigeria by soldiers and civilians from northern region of Nigeria. There was genocide before the war. I am not talking about war. The so-called Christian Middle Belt people chose to fight the war on the Nigeria side and became enemies of Ndigbo and Biafrans. Such endeavor is now a historical fact.

QreatifDave: . Wow. Gowon was not chief of Army Staff in Ironsi's government. When the coup took place, he just returned from military training abroad. There were officers more senior than him. Eg. Col Pam & Brigadier Maimalari. Why should he be COA? Danjuma was not Ironsi's ADC, LtSani Bello was. You got that wrong. This discussion is about drawing attention of the public to the possibility of genocide against Christians in some North Central States. I think we've gotten your attention, otherwise you won't be in this discussion.

Gowon was the Nigerian army chief of Staff under Ironsi's governemnt. Lt Col James Pam and Brigadier Maimalari were Adjutant-General and Brigade Commander respectively under Tafawa Balewa government.

Dede1:

Again, I think we are talking about genocide, thus, the unprovoked and wanton killing of soldiers and civilians of eastern region origins in northern and western regions of Nigeria by soldiers and civilians from northern region of Nigeria. There was genocide before the war. I am not talking about war. The so-called Christian Middle Belt people chose to fight the war on the Nigeria side and became enemies of Ndigbo and Biafrans. Such endeavor t is now a historical fact.

We are not discussing the unfortunate events of the past that truly cost Igbos. It is regrettable. Our major concern here is that history does not repeat itself on other people, in this case, Christians in North Central Nigeria, or for that matter, any other people in Nigeria. Just because your father died, doesn't make it right for you to wish everybody else's father dead, does it?

QreatifDave: . Wow. Gowon was not chief of Army Staff in Ironsi's government. When the coup took place, he just returned from military training abroad. There were officers more senior than him. Eg. Col Pam & Brigadier Maimalari. Why should he be COA? Danjuma was not Ironsi's ADC, LtSani Bello was. You got that wrong. This discussion is about drawing attention of the public to the possibility of genocide against Christians in some North Central States. I think we've gotten your attention, otherwise you won't be in this discussion.

I don't think your arguements can go any further. Pls, go refresh your brain with the history of "yester years"

Gamji007:
I don't think your arguements can go any further. Pls, go refresh your brain with the history of "yester years"

Let's not miss the point. We're not discussing history. The point is clear in the story. Maybe you should read it, sir. qreatifdave..com/2013/04/are-christians-in-north-central-nigeria.html?m=1