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Practising Your Faith Or Not? - Religion - Nairaland

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Poll: are you practising your faith?

yes: 78% (11 votes)
no: 21% (3 votes)
This poll has ended

Are We Saved By Faith Or By Water Baptism? / Did She Loose Faith Or She Was Just A Church-goer? / Justified—by Faith Or Works? (2) (3) (4)

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Practising Your Faith Or Not? by Gwaine(m): 11:04pm On Jun 04, 2006
I've been watching with some interest how some peeps who claim
Christianity as their religion seem to confuse me the more. Jesus said that
people will give an account on judgement day for every idle word that they
speak (Matt. 12:36), and yet it amazes me to read responses from some
of these folks and see some very downtown lines in them: "F_ _ K",
"SH_T", etc. Am I to think that vocabs no longer matter to religious folks
anymore, and nobody cares a hoot about that verse above?

Interestingly, I wonder that serious atheists (or those who claim no
religious beliefs) rarely, if ever, use such out of place words. I'm
not a religious police, but is it that religious people often forget that
they are to be examples to the rest of some of us still trying to find
faith or belief? I don't think I really need religion to learn to use
such lingo, but I certainly appreciate the fact that Jesus example was
consistent with what He taught - He didn't use such, and that makes me
wonder how people claiming to follow Him just simply go ahead and use
them anyway.

Am I missing something?
Re: Practising Your Faith Or Not? by hotangel2(f): 2:32am On Jun 05, 2006
You are most certainly not missing anything.

Im a 'christian' too, but i use more curse words than a normal 'christian' should use. Now im not one bit proud of that, and i know that it's something i shouldn't do, in order to be a 'good example' to non-christians.

Thing is though, when i use those words, i don't mean any harm. It's like a way of life to some people, they just use those words to express their feelings i guess.

Infact, truth is, i can't even defend myself cos i know it's wrong. of course i can start defending myself now, but it's all not gonna worth it, cos the truth is, being christian or not, CUrse words are BAD.

Im asking God to help me though, and im sure he will. smiley smiley
Re: Practising Your Faith Or Not? by Gwaine(m): 4:37am On Jun 05, 2006
Thank you for being so honest, and may God really help and bless you. I'm relieved to know someone shares my concerns, and though I've used it a couple of times until recently when a guest minister shared what holiness means to the Lord. God bless you again and again.
Re: Practising Your Faith Or Not? by Skidoc(m): 11:10am On Jun 05, 2006
You are most def. right. The so-called atheists here don't even use curse words while the Christians & Muslims go all ****! I think it bothers more on culture, principles and courtesy than 'religion'.
Re: Practising Your Faith Or Not? by Gwaine(m): 11:28am On Jun 05, 2006
Hmmm. I think there's more we can do as believers.
We can impact our culture more positively than allow
the culture to impact us, don't you agree?

However, you've a keen sense of observation - the cultural
principles have so impacted the lives of many believers on
both sides (Christianity and Islam) that it's difficult these
days to clearly distinguish believers from 'unbels'.
Re: Practising Your Faith Or Not? by otokx(m): 3:10pm On Jun 05, 2006
We nigerians have taken so much to the garbage of the western culture. As christians, its a terrible thing when we use the f, d and s words which are gutter languages. We ought to be different in the way we speak, dress and generally conduct ourselves.
Re: Practising Your Faith Or Not? by KAG: 6:17pm On Jun 05, 2006
This atheist uses "curse" words sometimes, and has no real problem with the use of them.
Re: Practising Your Faith Or Not? by Gwaine(m): 9:35pm On Jun 07, 2006
Lol, KAG.

At least, I know another atheist on Nairaland who rarely uses
them - nferyn (please someone correct me if I'm wrong). I'm
still going through the various posts, but as yet haven't come
across the admin's use of them, even though he strongly sets
his disagreements about issues (again, I stand to be corrected).

In anycase, I don't use them; at least, not anymore. You can't
guess how many curse words were flung about yesterday in ma
office! Perhaps, if I was counting, might have been close to
666/6.
Re: Practising Your Faith Or Not? by syrup(f): 11:33pm On Jun 14, 2006
I think there's more than just the language people use when it comes to practising one's faith. Some people can be very 'moralistic' in the the way they speak and yet fail to practise the essence of their faith. Add gossip, 'white/innocent lies', cheating husbands, etc to the list. And you wonder how many people that make a profession to faith are actually practising it.

I know it's not easy to maintain a life of clear righteousness in today's compromisive world. But how far should one be willing to go with the compromises, if at all? Or maybe another interesting thread would be titled: "Would You Ever Compromise Your Faith?" Not that I advocate a compromise, but when the issues begin to surface, we'll then know how many of us fill the list.
Re: Practising Your Faith Or Not? by Gwaine(m): 12:27pm On Jun 18, 2006
That's quite a broad one, and good input. Initially, I was concerned
about the use of certain uncouth language among those professing
faith in God and wondered if there wasn't any qualms to it.

However, it is true that there are many issues involved in the real
essence of what it means to practise one's faith. Alas! how often is
the wonder that compromise is rife among believers today, and only
by God's grace do we see and deal with them.

I would not like to be in a situation to compromise my faith; but if I
so happen to be, I pray grace to stand for what I believe than give
in to what is inimical to my relationship with the Lord.
Re: Practising Your Faith Or Not? by ToyM28(f): 12:40pm On Jun 18, 2006
Gwaine u certainly right nd like hot-angel i cant deny i use it sometimes nd i'm in d wrong. But what she doesnt do is waht m gona do: which is defend why i use it soemtimes.

I know its wrong and dat has been settled, but sometimes one cant help it, especially wen around u ppl are see cursing and being insultive. Wen ppl pick fights wiv me (m not talkng on behalf on anybody eslse), i feel dat the only words dey understand is the curse words. Becuase those are the only things, that expresses anger and infuraition very clearly. And once that is established, ppl tend 2 leave u alone.

I want my light to shine, but sometimes i cant help it (nd i know dats an excuse), but come rain come sun, i'll feel sorry for using dose kind of terms, but unless i have God personally tell me what oda language 2 use 2 show my anger on internet sites, m sorry aldo i might not be proud of using it, i'll alwayz sucumb 2 using it.
Re: Practising Your Faith Or Not? by Gwaine(m): 1:11pm On Jun 18, 2006
ToyM28:

Gwaine u certainly right nd like hot-angel i can't deny i use it sometimes nd i'm in d wrong. But what she doesnt do is waht m gona do: which is defend why i use it soemtimes.

Believe me, I'm touched by your sincerity. cheesy

It wasn't easy for me either. God help your walk as I pray
He does mine. And thanks for your input.
Re: Practising Your Faith Or Not? by ToyM28(f): 1:26pm On Jun 18, 2006
lol. tnk u oh. I need the prayers.
Re: Practising Your Faith Or Not? by Coco29(f): 2:04pm On Jun 18, 2006
hot-angel:

You are most certainly not missing anything.

I'm a 'christian' too, but i use more curse words than a normal 'christian' should use. Now im not one bit proud of that, and i know that it's something i shouldn't do, in order to be a 'good example' to non-christians.

Thing is though, when i use those words, i don't mean any harm. It's like a way of life to some people, they just use those words to express their feelings i guess.

Infact, truth is, i can't even defend myself because i know it's wrong. of course i can start defending myself now, but it's all not going to worth it, because the truth is, being christian or not, CUrse words are BAD.

I'm asking God to help me though, and im sure he will. smiley smiley


i need to clarify this, because maybe i am wrong and my dad the preacher is wrong also, i thought being a Christian meant following the ten commandment , i know my religion is Pentecostal but i am not a Christean because i still have sex am not married, i still lie, i still do thinks that i feel is dishonest and not pleasing to god, and i do not go to church because i do not want to be a hypocrite, those people who go to church only on sundays, i pray to god in my own quite time and ash him to guide me back to his path, so when we say "i am a Christean" do we mean that we have a religion or are we a practicing Christean.
Re: Practising Your Faith Or Not? by Gwaine(m): 2:50pm On Jun 18, 2006
Interesting and thought-provoking. I'm one of those persuaded that
to be "Christian" is to have a living relationship with Jesus Christ by
faith which helps us daily experience God's love in righteousness. I'll
break this down:

This relationship is not based on some rigid code like the Mosaic Law
or the Ten Commandments; however, the righteousness in them is
evident in the Christian life. If the Law said not to bear false witness,
my Christian exprience delights in telling the truth - by the help of the
Spirit of God.

I suggest that the difference between a religious life and a relationship
with Jesus Christ is this: religious observance may be of benefit to some,
but it is a lifeless formality. On the other hand, in a relationship with Christ,
we discover a living vitality planted in our hearts to always long to be
pleasing to God by the help of His Spirit.

I've been there before - wondering how I could ever get out of that
cycle of religious life. I sang the songs and praises but they were drab;
I tried to participate in 'church' things, but it was all dry. I'll never forget
the day that a simple prayer delivered me from the most painful sin in
my life (I'm so ashamed to say it here); but since that day, I've known
the reality of His presence and power.

Just seek Him and be sensitive to what He ministers to your heart -
perhaps something to give up or a word to obey: the results are dramatic
and your life will be enriched.

God bless you much.
Re: Practising Your Faith Or Not? by Coco29(f): 3:03pm On Jun 18, 2006
you have touch a part of me that only my father has been able to do, i grew in the church i sang in church i was a (devoted Christean) one bad experience in the church and i was broken unable to allow god to heal the pain, which i know he can do. thanx
Re: Practising Your Faith Or Not? by Gwaine(m): 4:43pm On Jun 18, 2006
You're an inspiration, and I'm confident that you'll find the healing
your heart longs for from God - He's loving way beyond anything
I can say. You're in my prayers from today.
Re: Practising Your Faith Or Not? by Drusilla(f): 9:30am On Jun 19, 2006
Gwaine,

I do not know about this.

I tend to be against the common thing that Christians do: Make up sins and then accuse people of violating them.

I am not saying your doing that because I know you are following the time honored traditions of cultural or nominal christians.

When Paul says I considered it DUNG? Isn't he saying I considered it SHYTE?

In the exact same way that we mean it, when we say: that ain't worth jack shyte?

This idea that one has to be following some old hypocritical Victorian code of ethics to be considered Christian or not sinning, just seems very fishy to me.
Re: Practising Your Faith Or Not? by Gwaine(m): 10:15am On Jun 19, 2006
@Drusilla,

I'd have loved to see more examples than the not-so quaint "new hypocritical
Victorian code" of SHYTE. You see, I'd asked if I was not missing something to
observe that Christians banter some expressions that would make unbels or
non-believers raise their brows. At least, someone earlier told me that they
use curse words and have no problem with doing so, and I didn't think that
he/she was necessarily consigned to a "new hypocritical Victorian code".

Ok, was just teasing. But seriously, when we look deep in our consciences
and wonder about the transforming power and work of the Holy Spirit in our
lives, then some would agree that language reveals one's true identity.

I don't think that my entry is set to "make up sins and then accuse people of
violating them
." My concern was that many of us as believers don't seem to
care these days about these things. Being "Christian" does not rest on what
expressions we use - good or bad; rather it is a personal relationship that
is evidenced in every aspect of our lives - and that includes not only what
we say, but how we say them, Victorian hypocrisy or not.

Fear not - I was there and used them so well that they earned me some
despicable appellation, to the extent that I got the sack twice and had to
move on to other jobs. It wasn't anyone who "made up" my sins - it was
rather the fellowship of God's Spirit in my heart that gave me a change of
attitude, and that's why I don't see the need to use them anymore. Good
though, if you find them well suited to your witness - and in that, peace
to you.
Re: Practising Your Faith Or Not? by Drusilla(f): 3:55am On Jun 20, 2006
Gwaine,

I live in a world, where the bible writes about the poor and helping the poor in over 1000+ verses.

It writes about cussing -- ZERO TIMES.

Yet every other Christian will run up to me and claim, cussing means your not a true Christian! But issues concerning the poor?

Not a peep.

This is what I mean about 'hypocritical'.

People do better when they know better.

So I am not saying you are doing that, at least not purposely, but I frequently meet Christians who do not know what the bible says nor means, instead their on some white glove hunt to prove that 'suburban values' are the same as 'godly values'.

I am simply pointing out they are not the same.
Re: Practising Your Faith Or Not? by Drusilla(f): 3:59am On Jun 20, 2006
Gwaine,

Please do not take that personal. It is not meant to indicate in any way that you are a hypocrite.

I, as an American, am used to people confusing the 'suburban god' with the True God of the Bible.
Re: Practising Your Faith Or Not? by Gwaine(m): 4:42am On Jun 20, 2006
Drusilla,

No, I'm not taking it personal, and hope that my earlier reply didn't
sound as though it meant that.

You're right - some people evaluate others' Christianity on a few out
of context premises, such as just the expressions they hear of them.

One may be 'morally' civil in diction and yet not even blink at the plight
of the less privileged around them. Coincidentally, what you'd pointed
out happened to be the very thing I was reading about in the Scriptures
this morning in my quiet time: Luke 10:28-37, about the priest and Levite
who were (probably) sanctimonious as not to offer help to the man who
fell among thieves.

Indeed, there's much more about this topic about practicing one's faith
than just the mere focus on cuss words - and I very much appreciate
that you and syrup have helped to broaden the scope of what this
entails. Please forgive me if my reply earlier raised any concerns out of
context, and thanks for your input.
Re: Practising Your Faith Or Not? by Drusilla(f): 8:54am On Jun 20, 2006
Gwaine,

If you start in Genesis.

Eve wanting an item, she could not have.

Move along to Saul, (whose name means sheol--hell) and the thing we find there, is that he has kept all the items, that God told him not to keep. Samuel tells him God has taken the kingdom from him for disobedience.

Move along to the verses that all Christians acknowledge as being about the devil in Ezeikiel, God tells satan, it is because of the abundance of your trade and merchandising that you have sinned and led the whole world in sin.

Move along to Habbukuk and you find there that the evil people have taken people, lands and other material goods, to set their nest on high (keep their people safe).

Move along to Jesus Christ, you will find that He only mentions one other god versus the True God of the Bible: The god of mammon. The god of money. He never mentions a god of drinking, in fact he drinks, he never mentions a god of false religious symbolism, in fact he is accused many times of not looking pious enough.

Move along to Paul who warns us against going after riches. James who says that God sent the gospel to the poor and the rich were the ones who dog us in this world. Peter who says that false prophets preach to get rich, using christian people as merchandise.

Then go to the end of the bible and in the book of revelations chapter 18, the LovePeddler of Babylon is all about the money and merchandise and trade, selling souls and men. She has led the whole world astray.

And do not miss that God is coming to destroy the LovePeddler of Babylon.

The bible is clear in it's focus.

But what do we find in Christian churches today?

1. Prosperity gospel is main preaching. So the god of mammon is definitely being preached.

2. Christians giving blood sacrifices to the god of mammon, everytime a baby is killed in an abortion, 33,000 people die EVERY DAY from starvation, even though the money spent on Icecream cones bought on the street in America, would pay to feed every person for a year and the money that Americans spend on christmas presents for their pets would be enough to give adequate health care to all the people in the world. Gleefully talking about not helping welfare mothers and children eat, as the right thing to do. Etc, etc.

3. Christians joyfully supporting the war in Iraq, even though only the most dense person in the world, does not understand that this war was for economic reasons (oil and cash).

4. Ever see the christians who run around church screaming --money cometh, in their churches? So the god of mammon is fully lodged in these churches. Christians will run up to you and say things like: I ain't letting nobody interrupt my prosperity walk.

5. Sex sells and Christians are being sold sex just as much as the non-believer, in this world. Christians and non-believers focus on sex -- christians either on homosexuals or on teenagers getting pregnant(abortions).

Yet what does the bible say?

Jer 22:16  He judged the cause of the poor and needy; then it was well with him: was not this to know me? saith the LORD.

When someone cares about the poor and needy that is a sign that they love the Lord.

Pro 29:7  The righteous knows the plea of the poor; the wicked cares not to know it.

Christians should be focused on the 33,000 children who die everyday from starvation that they can prevent.

Pro 31:9  Open your mouth, judge righteously, and plead the cause of the poor and needy.

We Christians need to be pleading for the poor and needy, not for the fat and greedy.

Pro 31:20  She stretches out her hand to the poor; yea, she reaches forth her hands to the needy.

A good woman is in the caring for the poor business.


The bible is absolutely clear.

I do not think I need to tell you why it would be in the interests of what is called 'Western Christian Civilization' to keep people focused on getting themselves rich, sex, cussing, and personal sins and making sure that people never focus on the trade and merchandise sins that the bible is more focused on.

The bible is just used as prop to justify their economic violence.

What did Jesus do, when he saw religion being used to make money? He got a whip and chased the money changers out of temple.

Economic sins were the cause of Jesus getting violent in the bible.

Sexual sins by the adulteress in the bible? Jesus just forgave her.

A lot of us have purposely been taught WRONG FOCUS by those who benefit from this policy.
Re: Practising Your Faith Or Not? by Gwaine(m): 9:33am On Jun 20, 2006
@Drusilla,

Thanks once again for sharing, and perhaps there's more to the list than you've
taken time to share. Good effort though, and let me share a few things with you:

I'm not usually one to be drawn into other people's concerns where they use the
name and Word of God for their personal purposes. Certainly, I've worried myself
sick with these issues earlier, and if only you knew me before now, I'm even more
guilty than anyone else in this thread of using cuss words to the extent that I got
the sack twice from my former places of employment! Then I learnt to calm down
and be just what God asks me to be - His loving and trusting child - and to help
share the Gospel graciously while praying sincerely and deeply for others.
Admittedly, it's not easy to do that, but I enjoy the help of His Spirit.

Yes, in many quarters in Christendom, we hear and see these things; and believe
me there'll be worse than those listed in your reply. How do I know this? Jesus said
so prophetically as He warned the disciples about the nature of religious confession
in the end-times. What then am I to do in times like these? On the one hand, I could
present myself to God to pursue what pleases Him according to His Word; and on
the other hand, I'll leave Him to be the Judge over these issues. Sad reality that it's
the order of our day to see and hear about these unfortunate experiences, but I'll
guarantee you that God isn't taken by surprise in these matters, as we can see for
instance in Acts 20:28-32, part of which I'll quote here:

For I know this, that after my departing shall grievous wolves enter in among you, not
sparing the flock. Also of your own selves shall men arise, speaking perverse things, to
draw away disciples after them
. [verses 29-30].

I don't know if this would help, but while we cannot ignore these matters or be
passive about them, a verse that has often helped me is I Cor. 4:5 -

"Therefore judge nothing before the time, until the Lord come, who both will bring to
light the hidden things of darkness, and will make manifest the counsels of the hearts:
and then shall every man have praise of God
."

Thank you again, Drusilla. I know how these things affect us sometimes, but I'm
quite confident that as many of us seeking to enjoy His truth will find grace to do
so until Jesus comes.
Re: Practising Your Faith Or Not? by Drusilla(f): 10:48am On Jun 20, 2006
Gwaine,

The "suburban god" is one of the most popular gods.

However there is one god that is pretty close to that one, --- "the hug god".

This is a god that came to love you and desparately needs you to love Him.

You must spend all your time just loving him and not worrying about anything else.

This "hug god" has the same effect as the "suburban god" in that it makes people apathetic and complacent about whatever is going on in the world.


Jesus orders us:
(Mat 5:16) Let your light so shine before men that they may see your good works and glorify your Father who is in Heaven.

We were created for good works.

(Eph 2:10) For we are His workmanship, created in Christ Jesus to good works, which God has before ordained that we should walk in them.

Jesus gave himself so that would become a people zealous for good works.

(Tit 2:14) who gave Himself for us that He might redeem us from all iniquity and purify to Himself a special people, zealous of good works.

We must be careful to maintain, good works.

(Tit 3:cool Faithful is the Word, and as to these things, I desire that you strongly affirm that those believing God might be careful to maintain good works. These things are good and profitable to men.

Fruitfulness is part of good works.

(Tit 3:14) And let ours also learn to maintain good works for necessary uses, so that they may not be unfruitful.

We should be provoking one another to good works.

(Heb 10:24) and let us consider one another to provoke to love and to good works,

Our good works lead unbelievers to Glorify God.

(1Pe 2:12) having your conduct honest among the nations, in that which they speak against you as evildoers, they may glorify God in a day of His visitation, seeing your good works.

We are judged by our treatment of others.

Mat 25:31-46 But when the Son of Man comes in His glory, and all the holy angels with Him, then He shall sit on the throne of His glory. (32) And all nations shall be gathered before Him. And He shall separate them from one another, as a shepherd divides the sheep from the goats. (33) And indeed He shall set the sheep on His right hand, but the goats off the left. (34) Then the King shall say to those on His right hand, Come, blessed of My Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world. (35) For I was hungry, and you gave me food; I was thirsty, and you gave Me drink; I was a stranger, and you took Me in; (36) I was naked, and you clothed Me; I was sick, and you visited Me; I was in prison, and you came to Me. (37) Then the righteous shall answer Him, saying, Lord, when did we see You hungry, and fed You? Or thirsty, and gave You drink? (38) When did we see You a stranger, and took You in? Or naked, and clothed You? (39) Or when did we see You sick, or in prison, and came to You? (40) And the King shall answer and say to them, Truly I say to you, Inasmuch as you did it to one of the least of these My brothers, you have done it to Me. (41) Then He also shall say to those on the left hand, Depart from Me, you cursed, into everlasting fire prepared for the Devil and his angels. (42) For I was hungry, and you gave Me no food; I was thirsty, and you gave Me no drink; (43) I was a stranger and you did not take Me in; I was naked, and you did not clothe Me; I was sick, and in prison, and you did not visit me. (44) Then they will also answer Him, saying, Lord, when did we see You hungry, or thirsty, or a stranger, or naked, or sick, or in prison, and did not minister to You? (45) Then He shall answer them, saying, Truly I say to you, Inasmuch as you did not do it to one of the least of these, you did not do it to Me. (46) And these shall go away into everlasting punishment, but the righteous into everlasting life.

I can appreciate someone talking about loving God and praying for others.

Let us look clearly at what the writer of Hebrews says:

Heb 5:13-14 For every one that useth milk is unskilful in the word of righteousness: for he is a babe. But strong meat belongeth to them that are of full age, even those who by reason of use have their senses exercised to discern both good and evil.

Heb 6:1-3 Therefore leaving the principles of the doctrine of Christ, let us go on unto perfection; not laying again the foundation of repentance from dead works, and of faith toward God, Of the doctrine of baptisms, and of laying on of hands, and of resurrection of the dead, and of eternal judgment. And this will we do, if God permit.

In my opinion far too many Christians are running around stuck at the milk stage, trying to convince people that they have faith towards God, that they know Jesus died for their sins, and worrying about going to hell (eternal judgement).

But clearly the bible refers to those things as the early and easy things of the Christian walk.

Jesus saved you. Christians can stop worrying about what God has done. That's finished.

You found that truth.

Christians need to get on with the business of doing 'good works', which if you want to remind yourself by going back to the above list: is the reason Jesus saved you.
Re: Practising Your Faith Or Not? by Drusilla(f): 11:02am On Jun 20, 2006
Gwaine,

And again, I am not saying you personally have "the hug god" as I was not saying that you have "the suburban god".

I am just saying that we must not use our personal relationship with God as an excuse not to actually obey God and do good works in this world.
Re: Practising Your Faith Or Not? by Gwaine(m): 11:16am On Jun 20, 2006
Drusilla,

I'm sure your passion is admirable. The mammon god, the suburban god, the
hug god. . . and what else?

The fact is that I'm not running around worrying how to stay away from hell
because I know that's settled. You can also be sure that I'm not in any way
courting a passive spirit about the issues that daily confront us as believers
nor do I see complacency as a viable option.

In as much as I can help it, I submit myself to God daily before even doing a
single thing - the refreshing moments with Him in the mornings compares to
nothing else I've ever known in my rascally days.

Even so, I agree with all you've said so far; and I don't think leaving matters
of divine judgement to God as Judge alone should amount to complacency.

Actually, I enjoy the blessings of those who challenge me to good works, and
I trust that they can bear witness that I'm doing the same - and doing so in
creative ways as I continue to seek God's direction in any particular situation
that will bear more fruit for His glory.

For me, it's not just a matter of doing good works, but also how we do those
works as well. Jesus said for us to both take heed what we hear (Mark 4:24),
and also to take heed how we hear (Luke 8:18).

I've enjoyed your inputs and continue to be indebted to you for some of the
challenges you consistently offer me - and God bless you more.
Re: Practising Your Faith Or Not? by Gwaine(m): 11:18am On Jun 20, 2006
Oh well, your second post - I alread clicked on posting the one above.

I understand that you're not ascribing my walk with any of those 'gods'
and you're absolutely correct that we should not hide under any excuses
as reason for disobedience.

God bless again.
Re: Practising Your Faith Or Not? by Drusilla(f): 1:19pm On Jun 20, 2006
Gwaine,

Thank you for being gracious. Now please indulge me one last time.  This last post will be more directly related to what you are speaking about.

Christian Children must all be mild, meek and obedient.

Why mild? Of all the epithats that could be applied to Christ this seems one of the least appropiate. For what does mild conjure up to our minds? Surely a picture of someone who wouldn't so 'bo' the proverbial goose; someone who would let sleeping dogs lie and avoid trouble wherever possible; someone of a placid temperament who is almost a stranger of red-blooded humanity; someone who is a bit of a nonentity, both uninspired and uninspiring.

This word mild is apparently deliberately used to describe a man who did not hesitate to challenge and expose the hypocrisies of the religious people of His day: a man who had such a personality that He walked unscathed through a murderous crowd; a man so far from being a non-entity that He was regarded by the authorities as a public danger; a man who could be moved to violent anger by shameles exploitation or by smug complacent orthodoxy; a man of such courage He deliberately walked to what He knew would mean death, despite the earnest pleas of well meaning friends! Mild! What a word to use for a personaility whose challenge and strange attractiveness nineteen centuries have by no means been exhausted.

Jesus Christ might well be called meek in the sense of being selfless and humble and utterly devoted to what He considered right, whatever the personal cost; but mild never! Yet it is this fatal combination of "meek and mild" which has often been so often, and is even now, applied to Him. We can hardly be surprised if children feel fairly soon that they have outgrown their "tender shepard" and find their heroes elsewhere. But if the impression of a soft and sentimental Jesus has been made (supported, alas, by all too often sugary hymns and pretty religious pictures), the harm is not when the adolescent rejects the soft and childish conception. There will probaly linger in the back of his mind an idea that Christ and the Christian religion is a soft and sentimental thing which has nothing to do with a workaday world.

For there is no doubt that this particular "inadequate god" the soft and mild and sentimental, still exists in many adult minds. Indeed the very word "Jesus" conjures up to many people a certain embarrassing sweet tenderness (which incidentally could easily be put in it's proper place by an intelligent adult reading of the gospels). The appeal of the sickly sweet figure, or those whose methods are founded on such a concept, is rightly regarded by normal people as below the belt.

But in fact there is no connection between what has been rudely called the "creeping Jesus" method and the life and character of the real Christ. It would seem that the mild and meek conception of the deity could readily be seen through, yet experience shows that it is operating beneath the conscious level of many Christian minds, particularily those whose childhood has been coloured by a sentimental attitude toward "the lord Jesus".

Such people find their actions, and even their thoughts, inhibited by a false consideration of what is "loving". They can neither use their critical facilities nor speak plain truth nor meet their fellows naturally for fear they sin against the meek and mild god. To non-christians they thus appear unreal or as hypoctires, while the love they attempt to exhibit toward others is all too often a pathetic travesty of the real thing.

There is a further offshoot of the worship of this false god which must be mentioned. It is the sentimental Christian idea of saintliness. We hear or read of someone who was a real saint: he never saw any harm in anyone and never spoke a word against anyone in his life. If this is really Christian saintliness then Jesus Christ was no saint. It is true that He taught men not to sit in judgement upon one another, but he never suggested they turn a blind eye to evil or pretend other people were faultless. He himself indulged no roseate visions of human nature: He himself knew what was in man as St. John tersely puts it.

[b]Nor can we imagine Him either using or advocating the invariable use of loving words. [/b]To speak the truth was obviously to Him more important than to make His hearers comfortable: through, equally obviously, His genuine love for men gave Him tact, wisdom and sympathy. He was love in action but He was not mild and meek.

(from the book, "Your God is too small"wink
Re: Practising Your Faith Or Not? by Gwaine(m): 5:18pm On Jun 20, 2006
@Drusilla,

The exercise has been worth it and many thanks yet again.

One thing though, which is that many people see the Lord Jesus from
various/varying perspectives. It wouldn't be much of a problem unless
the inference to be drawn is that He was afterall not what the Bible
declares of Him.

This naturally reminds me of the pivotal question He asked His disciples:
"Whom do men say that I am?" In answering that question today, some
may be persuaded that He was something other than He was and is as
we read of Him in God's Word. For me, I'd always play it safe by aligning
my thoughts with what appears in Scripture than appeal to anything less.

"Critical thinking" is good and serves the needs of those who appeal more
to it than a dependence upon the Spirit of God, without Whom it is utterly
impossible to understand His ways or the inspired Word. When I rather
choose to depend on the Spirit, my conclusion is that Christ is indeed no
less as the Bible declares of Him - He is both meek and lowly in heart.

The challenges are well noted, and I trust you'll find grace and blessings
from Him in all spheres of life.
Re: Practising Your Faith Or Not? by Drusilla(f): 6:44pm On Jun 20, 2006
Gwaine,

When you think of a 'meek and lowly in heart' person do they have these actions:

1. Take whips and turn over tables.

2. Confront preachers and tell them the prostitutes will be in heaven before you.

3. Preach about others going to hell more than any other issue.

4. When called by the government tells the government they think they are slick and to wait.

5. Give such concrete arguments that the people shut their mouth.

6. See a horrible death of someone, and then use that death to tell others, your going to die just like that, if you do not repent.


The point is the authors point. As the author repeatedly says: Our ideas____ of what "meek and mild" mean tend to distort the picture of Jesus Christ.
Re: Practising Your Faith Or Not? by Gwaine(m): 8:25pm On Jun 20, 2006
Drusilla:

The point is the authors point. As the author repeatedly says: Our ideas____ of what "meek and mild" mean tend to distort the picture of Jesus Christ.

Precisely, Drusilla. The author's point fits aptly into what I stated earlier:

"Critical thinking" is good and serves the needs of those who appeal more
to it than a dependence upon the Spirit of God
. . ."

As far as "our ideas" are concerned, Jesus could be anything but 'meek[i]
and lowly in heart[/i]' - and that's because some fail to understand that a
person of such disposition does not necessarily have to be thought of as
cowardly in situations that call for boldness. Take the case of the 6th point:
it's either we read it as that He "tells" people they're 'going to die just like
that
', or rather that He was sounding a "warning" to them. And such a
disposition could well be applied to all the preceding points 1-5.

Meekness does not translate into cowardice. Maybe I'm failing to see the
picture clearly, but while agreeing that our ideas at any level tend often to
confuse issues, blur the lines and distort things in a general way, in our
world of today when people tend to hide behind the "politically correct/incorrect"
smokescreen, it's well to see Jesus for Who He really is.

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