Joshthefirst: please can you give some examples of these exceptions we haven't dealt with in our previous statements?

What other exceptions are there?

Say I secretly steal money from someone, and he asks me if I have seen it, and I say no, is that not wrongdoing?

Or I take meat from my mothers pot, and deny it, is that lie not wrong?

What other exceptions are there?

I once read about a very rich woman who died and wiled all her properties to a cat. Lets say her child lies to her he has been diagnosed with cancer (even fabricated a med report) and needs some of the money for treatment. If that exactly is the only way to prevent the woman from foolishly wiling all properties to a cat, that is not a wrong doing. Irrespective of what selfish reasons he had for collecting the money.

The two examples you cited are not exceptions. I clearly told you there are always exceptions to lying for selfish reasons thereby ruling out an absolute.

MonsieurCoder:

Telling lies for selfish reasons is wrong and empathy is enough to tell me that. The point has been made. Another dumb question from you and i unfollow this thread. Stop trying to make people religion is the only to be moral, it is a big told for selfish reasons.

good.
First, I am not trying to make people think religion is the only way to be moral. That would be deceitful. Remember, I am against religious hypocrisy.

Now, what brings about empathy in this case? What makes lieing wrong? Have you ever lied before? For selfish reasons?
Have you ever disregarded empathy and conscience at all?

Joshthefirst: good.
First, I am not trying to make people think religion is the only way to be moral. That would be deceitful. Remember, I am against religious hypocrisy.

Now, what brings about empathy in this case? What makes lieing wrong? Have you ever lied before? For selfish reasons?
Have you ever disregarded empathy and conscience at all?

1. human emotions
2. Empathy
3. Yes.
4. No. Atleast none that would harm my fellow man.
5. Can't remember ever doing so.

MonsieurCoder:

1. human emotions
2. Empathy
3. Yes.
4. No. Atleast none that would harm my fellow man.
5. Can't remember ever doing so.

Okay. You've lied. I have too.

Now, do you realize lieing is disregarding empathy and breaching conscience?

Joshthefirst:

Okay. You've lied. I have too.

Now, do you realize lieing is disregarding empathy and breaching conscience?

No, not when the lies is necessary and it doesn't harm my fellow man

MonsieurCoder:

No, not when the lies is necessary and it doesn't harm my fellow man

are you talking about physical harm? Have you ever told unnecessary lies?

I remember taking something prohibited from the fridge when I was little, and lieing that I did not. That did not cause physical harm, but it was a breach of empathy and conscience.

MonsieurCoder:

No, not when the lies is necessary and it doesn't harm my fellow man

Bro, he is trying to box you into admitting lying is absolutely wrong after which he can throw in his omni skydaddy.

Lol, i know ure wiser anyway.

Joshthefirst: are you talking about physical harm? Have you ever told unnecessary lies?

I remember taking something prohibited from the fridge when I was little, and lieing that I did not. That did not cause physical harm, but it was a breach of empathy and conscience.

Harm, any type of harm. Unnecessary is relative. I would never tell a lie that would hurt my fellow man. You took something prohibited because you were a naughty little brat and not because you lacked empathy. Atleast, you admitted you knew it was wrong. Whether or not you disregard empathy is totally up to you.

rationalmind:

Bro, he is trying to box you into admitting lying is absolutely wrong after which he can throw in his omni skydaddy.

Lol, i know ure wiser anyway.

I can never admit lying is absolutely wrong. NEVER. I can lie a million times to save a life. I would kill a million times in self defense. a billion times self.

MonsieurCoder:

Harm, any type of harm. Unnecessary is relative. I would never tell a lie that would hurt my fellow man. You took something prohibited because you were a naughty little brat and not because you lacked empathy. Atleast, you admitted you knew it was wrong. Whether or not you disregard empathy is totally up to you.

smh.

So you have never done something wrong like lying?

rationalmind:

Bro, he is trying to box you into admitting lying is absolutely wrong after which he can throw in his omni skydaddy.

Lol, i know ure wiser anyway.

close, but not entirely correct.

MonsieurCoder:

I can never admit lying is absolutely wrong. NEVER. I can lie a million times to save a life. I would kill a million times in self defense. a billion times self.

have you ever lied? As in, not to save a life, I mean lieing now. You understand.

Joshthefirst: have you ever lied? As in, not to save a life, I mean lieing now. You understand.

Now this is the last time i would answer this same question. I have a lied millions of times and i would lie trillions more. So far is it necessary at that point and it doesn't hurt my fellow man. I am not telling lies to take what doesn't belong to me. I would lie!

MonsieurCoder:

Now this is the last time i would answer this same question. I have a lied millions of times and i would lie trillions more. So far is it necessary at that point and it doesn't hurt my fellow man. I am not telling lies to take what doesn't belong to me. I would lie!

since you were born, you've never told a lie to take what does not belong to you? Or for your selfish interests?

Wow! Congrats abeg. I no easy.

^^^
But if you have actually lied to take what does not belong to you, or for your selfish interests, it means as you have admitted that you have done wrong.

Joshthefirst: ^^^
But if you have actually lied to take what does not belong to you, or for your selfish interests, it means as you have admitted that you have done wrong.

Assuming i have, and so?

MonsieurCoder:

Assuming i have, and so?

so we'll go on to the next phase of this question and answer session.

Do you agree that for something to be wrong, it means a law is broken?

Joshthefirst: so we'll go on to the next phase of this question and answer session.

Do you agree that for something to be wrong, it means a law is broken?

No. wrong is relative. Fornication is wrong according to christians, not to me. Contraceptives is wrong to some christians, Not to me.

MonsieurCoder:

No. wrong is relative. Fornication is wrong according to christians, not to me. Contraceptives is wrong to some christians, Not to me.

did we not just conclude that a lie with the intent of selfish is always wrong? How is that relative?


Do you want me to break the news for you? To give you the end of this matter?

Joshthefirst: did we not just conclude that a lie with the intent of selfish is always wrong? How is that relative?


Do you want me to break the news for you? To give you the end of this matter?

Please break the news. Wrong is relative. Empathy is enough to tell me what is wrong. Empathy is something we all possess, atheist, muslims, chrsitians, judaist, satanist or buddhist. Whether or not you disregard empathy is up to you. Belief in a super natural being does not equate morality. Morality is Morality, belief is belief. If you are telling me you need a 3000 year old book to tell me what is wrong then you are telling lies, and you know how your god burns people for no reason

MonsieurCoder:

Please break the news. Wrong is relative. Empathy is enough to tell me what is wrong. Empathy is something we all possess, atheist, muslims, chrsitians, judaist, satanist or buddhist. Whether or not you disregard empathy is up to you. Belief in a super natural being does not equate morality. Morality is Morality, belief is belief. If you are telling me you need a 3000 year old book to tell me what is wrong then you are telling lies, and you know how your god burns people for no reason

maybe your atheistic indoctrination does not allow you to see through this honest process we've undergone.

So here's the truth. Everyone has empathy and a conscience, that's why everyone has sinned. Wrong is not relative. Lieing with selfish deceit is always wrong. How do we know? Fundamental natural laws are written in our minds, the very fact of empathy confirms this, and the prescence of empathy and conscience- these natural processes- imply a supreme law giver. Yeah, you might have sensed this.

But here's the bummer; the very fact that you try to hide behind the "wrong is relative" concept shows that you do not want to be responsible for wrongdoing. Or will you now tell me empathy is relative too? After you have just alluded its universality by saying we all possess it?

Wrong is wrong. Lieing for selfish deceit is wrong. The very fact that our empathy and conscience tells us that this basic natural thing is wrong shows that we have a basic natural law written in our minds. And that can only imply an absolute lawgiver: God.

We have all broken these laws of our minds, disregarding empathy and violating conscience, and that's why this absolute lawgiver will judge all...


And you know where that leads to too.

Goodnight mehn

Absolute law giver my assshole

MonsieurCoder: Absolute law giver my assshole

you can give epileptic comebacks wheen you've recovered from the shock.

You have already implied everything I wrote in the question and answer session.

Joshthefirst: you can give epileptic comebacks wheen you've recovered from the shock.

You have already implied everything I wrote in the question and answer session.

story story

My point has been made, you don't need religion to be do the right thing.

Any other thing na super story

MonsieurCoder:

story story

My point has been made, you don't need religion to be do the right thing.

Any other thing na super story

lol. You should realize that you didn't make any true point, and you're the one who kept bringing up religion. I didn't.

Joshthefirst: lol. You should realize that you didn't make any true point, and you're the one who kept bringing up religion. I didn't.

I made my point. You tried to make atheist look bad. Once again, you failed.

Empathy Empathy Empathy

MonsieurCoder:

I made my point. You tried to make atheist look bad. Once again, you failed.

Empathy Empathy Empathy

Goodnight dude.