EzioAuditore:
I'm a Muslim so I don't know if you'll find this helpful. Even though our destinies have already been written, we are responsible for our destinies. For instance, you have the free will to decide whether to decide whether to steal that watch or not, and it is these single self made decisions that influence our destiny. I hope you find this of help, a person of any faith losing his belief in God is not something I like to see.

frank317:


"Even though our destinies have already been written, we are still responsible for our destinies" ... What kind of statement is this? Is this what they teach you in Islamic school?
Yet you try to explain the ridiculous statement by talking about freewill.
Let me ask you... If I decide to steal or not... Am I not going to make an already written decision?
The fact is that.. What you call decision and free will has already been written down and u must follow it even against ur will. You are just created to think its ur will, but like u said, ur will has already been written therefore its not really ur will. U are just living a laid down script

EzioAuditore:


Ooh you twirly dumb f*ck! I should have just left you in your pit of ignorance! Just as you made the decision to exhibit your lack of comprehension and nativity you will atone for all of your actions! Do you know your destiny? Have you seen what was written down for you? Have you tried doing something and an Angel comes down and says that's not what you're supposed to do because you're going to hell or heaven? God already knows what you're going to do, it's been written, but you don't know what that is. Here you have a choice, and even though God knows what it's going to be you still had the free will to make a choice here and that's what you chose, because that's who you are, no one forced you, on earth you had the decision to do it or not do it, no one influenced you. I never should have expected your tiny tiny ninny mind to understand! Honestly if you can't understand how this works then it's a surprise you're still alive, because only an assorted bellend thinks this way.

Pr0ton:


I think Frank317's post is too complex for your brain to absorb, but I'm gonna help you now, dummy.

If truely we have a choice to choose good or bad, does God still not know what you'll choose?

...


smh, tiny minds! 1st question, do you know which choice you're supposed to make according to your destiny?



































I'm giving you time to absorb the question...



Remember, He's Omniscient - He knows all that yesterday, today and tomorrow hold...





Ok.. If He does... Then we are playing the role He already foreknew, written destiny.



If He doesn't... He's not Omscient then, and He's different from the type of God the Bible writer paints Him, e.g

Psalm 139:4
New Living Translation
You know what I am going to say even before I say it, LORD.

Or a "better" translation
International Standard Version
Even before I have formed a word with my tongue, you, LORD, know it completely!

So, if the guy eventually stole the watch, God shouldn't be surprize.

Again, Isa 46:10

New Living Translation
Only I can tell you the future before it even happens. Everything I plan will come to pass, for I do whatever I wish.

EzioAuditore:


Ooh you twirly dumb f*ck! I should have just left you in your pit of ignorance! Just as you made the decision to exhibit your lack of comprehension and nativity you will atone for all of your actions! Do you know your destiny? Have you seen what was written down for you? Have you tried doing something and an Angel comes down and says that's not what you're supposed to do because you're going to hell or heaven? God already knows what you're going to do, it's been written, but you don't know what that is. Here you have a choice, and even though God knows what it's going to be you still had the free will to make a choice here and that's what you chose, because that's who you are, no one forced you, on earth you had the decision to do it or not do it, no one influenced you. I never should have expected your tiny tiny ninny mind to understand! Honestly if you can't understand how this works then it's a surprise you're still alive, because only an assorted bellend thinks this way.

frank317:


oh wise one, the issue is never about us knowing the future. It is, as you said, about God knowing the future. If God knows i will eat Garri, do i have the free will to eat rice? or MUST i " freely " choose garri?

aoyih:
I have been nurturing this thought for so long a time and wish to share it with you my NL family...

Let me start from here:

(1) Shebi God is the all knowing and all knowledgeable God?

(2) Shebi God in his might sees and knows the end from the beginning?

(3) Shebi it was written in the bible that before you were born, I knew you?

All this shows that our life's script has long been written even before we were fertilized in our mother's womb.
If this be the case, it thus mean that everybody's destiny has long been written and can only be reverted by he (God) alone.
If we are only acting the script that has been designed and written from above, why then are we been punished for doing perfectly well in our roles?

Judas was destined to betray Jesus which was a role he ought to play to make his script go in accordance to his destiny...if he obeyed and played the role as directed by God himself, why was he then punished?

Peter was destined to deny Jesus and it came to pass to fulfill his destiny here on earth...

If we are playing our individual roles as already written from above; whether good or bad, long as it goes in concordance with the will of God I don't see any reason why we should be punished by the same God who destined it to be so.

To end it all, I wish to know if it is fair to be punished by God for obeying and playing the role that he has already written for you as your destiny


Please, no insult... just meaningful comments!

EzioAuditore:


Think of your written destiny as someone who goes to the future and garners informations about every your step in life. Then he comes back to the past, he knows everything what you're going to do, but he is not interfering is he? because in the end the decisions we make, good or bad are influenced by the sort of people we are. If you don't get this I don't know what you will.

An2elect2:


men will be punished because sin started from man.
God cannot be said to be the initiator of sin since He cannot sin against himself.

So it is fair and very right for God to punish men!

frank317:



pls wise one... care to explain further.

the issue here is not his interference, why are you bringing interference up? We are still on his knowledge of the future just as you stated.

so i will ask my question again, this time do try to break it down to my understanding by answering my question clearly.


If God knows (this has nothing to do with interference) I will eat garri, do i have the free will to eat rice? or MUST I "freely" eat garri.

the fact is that, with knowledge of the future, Your God does not need interference to manipulate us... he will just relax and allow us FREELY do what he already knows or do u think we can FREELY do otherwise?

simplex2:


Lol...God created a perfect angel that sinned.

He created a perfect man...that sinned also.

Does God know the definition of perfect?

simplex2:


Lol...God created a perfect angel that sinned.

He created a perfect man...that sinned also.

Does God know the definition of perfect?

An2elect2:


God created exactly what He wanted. He never termed angels or man as perfect beings but Himself and all He has done.

When God finished creation He looked at what He had done and saw that they were good. Good because He made them.

Man was good but not perfect and his fall proved that.

EzioAuditore:


That is why we Muslims believe satan was a jinn who was raised to the rank of angels. Jinny like humans have free will while people do not. Angels on the other hand are perfect. .

simplex2:

Ezek 28:14 - 15

Thou art the anointed cherub that covereth; and I have set thee so: thou wast upon the holy mountain of God; thou hast walked up and down in the midst of the stones of fire."
"[b]Thou wast perfect in thy ways from the day that thou wast created[\b], till iniquity was found in thee."

EzioAuditore:


The point is you had the choice to eat rice or Garri but you chose garri. You don't know what God knows do you? The choice of garri is something you arrived at on your own. Because that is the person you are , the person who given those specific circumstances will choose garri!

An2elect2:


at embolden. It didn't say Lucifer was created perfect, it says he had being doing things perfectly well, just the way God wanted them to be until INIQUITY WAS FOUND IN HIM. Iniquity CANNOT be found in a perfect being!

frank317:



ya, the above is cool and easy going until u came to tell me a loving God/creator knows every choice i am gonna make. he knows the bad choice i am gonna make and he knows the good choice i am gonna make and he is going to punish me for making the bad choice he already knows i am gonna make yet there is no way i can freely make a different choice other than the bad choice he already know i am gonna make... this is where i left thinking about what i know or dont know and now trying too hard to understand why my creator should know what i dont know and punish me for making the choice already knows i will make.

this means if God knows i am going to make a bad choice, there is no way i can freely make a good choice because it will go contrary to what he knows i will do

pls what exactly is the function of this his ability to know my future?

simplex2:


Thats why I believe the spiderman will one day invade Nigeria and kill-off all the bad guys. He is real since I watch him live on TV and read loads of comic books about him. However, you need a lot of faith for you to believe in my spiderman, for without faith, no man can accept he is real.

EzioAuditore:


I suppose you're an atheist then? Lol! Frighin dweeb!

simplex2:


Nope. Try again.

EzioAuditore:


Now that you know this, why don't you try to make sure every decision you make is a good one? Know that by doing so, it means it has been written that you will ask these questions and ultimately dedicate your life to doing good, or you may choose to rebel...

frank317:


Lol... Does it matter? According to ur theory, any choice I make, weather good or bad is the right one since I am freely playing the script the creator know I will and must make?

EzioAuditore:


It's the right one, but in this world you get to decide what your right one is. Will it be the good choices or the bad one? That's why I said i
Even though our destiny has been written, we are responsible for our destiny, we are responsible for those choices that make up our destiny.

frank317:



Nah... I will pass. Forunately, my tiny moronic mind cannot make sense of what u are saying. I am not responsible for any destiny that has already been written by the creator. If it makes sense to u, then I wish u all the best in trying to control and already written destiny that you cannot change.

EzioAuditore:
smh, tiny minds! 1st question, do you know which choice you're supposed to make according to your destiny?

EzioAuditore:


I have decided to agree to disagree with you. Apparently this is how it was written that this discussion will end. Peace!

Pr0ton:


Re-frame your question please. I don't get it.

frank317:


Nice.. Obviously your God knew I would believe in this crap that you are preaching. Who knows, perhaps tthos knowledge of his has already motivated him to build a big hot hell for me.... So do I have a choice? I don't think so