absoluteSuccess:
. . . . . . ..

are you open to discussing this bloodline thing?

And are you prexios?

absoluteSuccess:
Ilorin is not the beginning and the end Yoruba history, hear the son of Uthman Dan Fodio to Clapperton before your sweet joy 'Ilorin emergency': "Yarba is an extensive province containing rivers, forests, sands and mountains, as also a great many wonderful and extraordinary things. In it the bird called babage (parrot) is found. By the side of this province there is an anchorage for the Christians, who used to go there and purchase slaves. These slaves were exported from our country and sold to the people of Yarba, who resold them to the Christians" Sultan Bello, 1823. Francis, I already agree with any twist you choose to make out of this.

Historical facts are historical facts. He'll either ignore this post and move on to other stuff, or come back and try desperately to find faults and loopholes in the words of Muhammad Bello son of the Shehu Usman Dan Fodio. He'll never agree that you have been right and he has been wrong.

Because some people keep looking at history from an ethnically-arrogant perspective, that's why this issue has been dragged out longer than it should. Everyone feels the need to claim superiority to all their neighbours. But history has always been a game of 'you fall for me, I fall for you.'

We think alike, the people were painting themselves as almighty at the expense of Yoruba: brutality is the weapon of weaklings. They forgot that Yoruba of old were both wise and brutal, but as we embrace religion and academics, 'the wise Yoruba' barths and brutality gave way to civility and sanctity of life, and Yoruba is enviable to have always earn displeasure from all her neighbours anytime, just for being civil. If Yoruba is coward, how does that stop you from prosecuting your war of attrition? A warmonger that complain about the coward is a fool. You receive beating and cry over it forever and blame the cowards for your scars? @Tpia, in affirmative.

^i just saw your post where you discussed the bloodline issue.

macof:


Made wat up? Lmao I can assure you Yorubas were an ethnicgroup of power. And only the eastern Yorubas were conquered by Bini, the warring and trading groups were found much westernly

Pls mention it

Bro, perhaps your area was conquered by Bini, just saying. Not everybody can relate with that.


In addition, the western Yorubas are the easy going ones. If you are looking for the warring groups, check easternly.

bigfrancis21:


The article mentioned Ilorin all through engaging in the sale of slaves, and not Oyo empire as you previously claimed. Mind you, the Ilorin empire at the peak of its slave trade activities was already a fulani emirate, after the Yorubas had been overthrown by the Fulanis and the Fulanis took over power till today. The ilorin slave trade is about Fulanis selling Yorubas in their own land and not Yorubas selling Hausas/Fulanis. Thus, the Ilorin slave trade can be effectively said to be a Fulani slave trade of sorts, selling Yorubas into slave trade, as well as captives from the North. I see no other Yoruba empire achieving such feat as the fulani-led empire of Ilorin. Not even Oyo empire.

Ilorin was a slave trading depot, various slaves passed through there.

And, if you're not admiring slavery in this post, then what else could you be doing?

Wulfruna:


Historical facts are historical facts. He'll either ignore this post and move on to other stuff, or come back and try desperately to find faults and loopholes in the words of Muhammad Bello son of the Shehu Usman Dan Fodio. He'll never agree that you have been right and he has been wrong.

Because some people keep looking at history from an ethnically-arrogant perspective, that's why this issue has been dragged out longer than it should. Everyone feels the need to claim superiority to all their neighbours. But history has always been a game of 'you fall for me, I fall for you.'

He is Fulani( I think), he can't see it from a non-ethnic viewpoint. If he did, it would challenge his beliefs.


Besides, he's possibly more familiar with the Adamawa side which is towards the Cameroon border, so perhaps he's more cognizant with the politics of that region ( ie Cameroon area).

absoluteSuccess:
Ilorin is not the beginning and the end Yoruba history, hear the son of Uthman Dan Fodio to Clapperton before your sweet joy 'Ilorin emergency': "Yarba is an extensive province containing rivers, forests, sands and mountains, as also a great many wonderful and extraordinary things. In it the bird called babage (parrot) is found. By the side of this province there is an anchorage for the Christians, who used to go there and purchase slaves. These slaves were exported from our country and sold to the people of Yarba, who resold them to the Christians" Sultan Bello, 1823. Francis, I already agree with any twist you choose to make out of this.

People of Yarba <> Fulani. Again reading all passages posted here, it sounds like your "evidence" is working against you. It seems to state that the Yoruba people were subjugated by the Fulani. The Christians being referred to, were they even Yoruba...... Yoruba have only been Christians for less than 120 years.

I don't think anyone in their right mind are going to take these "Yoruba Claims" of dominance seriously.

Fulaman198:


People of Yarba <> Fulani. Again reading all passages posted here, it sounds like your "evidence" is working against you. It seems to state that the Yoruba people were subjugated by the Fulani. The Christians being referred to, were they even Yoruba...... Yoruba have only been Christians for less than 120 years.

This is amazing! How on God's green earth did you derive the bolded statement from the words of the Sultan? Flipping amazing!

And what does Yarba <> Fulani mean? If it means 'Yarba are same as Fulani' then that is even a more amazing derivation, my God!

The Christians by the way refer to the Europeans who used to show up on the coast to purchase slaves from the Yoruba.

No one is claiming dominance here. It is because you've chosen to look at this whole discussion as 'claims of dominance' that you are having problems grasping historical facts.

tpiadotcom:


Bro, perhaps your area was conquered by Bini, just saying. Not everybody can relate with that.


In addition, the western Yorubas are the easy going ones. If you are looking for the warring groups, check easternly.

nope my area was under oyo instead but some areas of East Yorubaland were under Bini notably Owo and Akure
What warring groups in the east can be compared to Egba, Owu and Oyo?

Fulaman198:


People of Yarba <> Fulani. Again reading all passages posted here, it sounds like your "evidence" is working against you. It seems to state that the Yoruba people were subjugated by the Fulani. The Christians being referred to, were they even Yoruba...... Yoruba have only been Christians for less than 120 years.

Pls stop embarrassing urself
nobody is claiming yoruba dominance, open ur eyes

macof:
nope my area was under oyo instead but some areas of East Yorubaland were under Bini notably Owo and Akure

,


yes, the safer usual mentions which are randomly parroted on nairaland.

You for say the entire southwest, nay the whole world, was under Bini?

btw, where is this area of yours which you place under Oyo while assigning other people's area to Bini? And how do you correlate your Oyo claim with your nairaland Bini grabs?

What warring groups in the east can be compared to Egba, Owu and Oyo?

seriously, you sound like you browse google and nairaland and obtain your info from there.

Wulfruna:


Historical facts are historical facts. He'll either ignore this post and move on to other stuff, or come back and try desperately to find faults and loopholes in the words of Muhammad Bello son of the Shehu Usman Dan Fodio. He'll never agree that you have been right and he has been wrong.

Because some people keep looking at history from an ethnically-arrogant perspective, that's why this issue has been dragged out longer than it should. Everyone feels the need to claim superiority to all their neighbours. But history has always been a game of 'you fall for me, I fall for you.'

Still feeling sore from our last debate, huh?

Oh yea I remember, you are the lady who couldn't make a point but jump around with no solid statement to hold on to after I punctured your so-called claim and provided back-up evidence. Yea, you should feel sore because you felt you were right until I proved you wrong yet you kept dragging the debate, repeating your sore old points over and over again, after initially shifting stances.

I consider you lucky because I got so busy that day and the next that I didn't get the chance to reply your last worn-out post.

.

bigfrancis21:


Still feeling sore from our last debate, huh?

Oh yea I remember, you are the lady who couldn't make a point but jump around with no solid statement to hold on to after I punctured your so-called claim and provided back-up evidence. Yea, you should feel sore because you felt you were right until I proved you wrong yet you kept dragging the debate, repeating your sore old points over and over again, after initially shifting stances.

I consider you lucky because I got so busy that day and the next that I didn't get the chance to reply your last worn-out post.

The same debate you ran away from? LOL.

The same way you have shied away from pushing on with your claims that Mandingoes are in Congo and are nearer to Igboland than Yorubaland. (Use Google next time, that was a pretty big slip-up).

Please, address Sultan Muhammadu Bello's words to Clapperton cited here by absoluteSuccess, and don't try to shift attention to a discussion we had on another thread.

(By the way, anytime you wanna get back on that thread, I'll be there to school your ignorant arse.)

Oh, just in case I didn't make it clear before. I'm not Yoruba. I do not belong to any of the major ethnicities. I am a historian, or more correctly a student of history. Facts are all I care about.

macof:

smh this is poor thinking. Fulaman certainly you are better than this
So some eastern yoruba kingdoms were under Edo means Edo owns Yorubas
I guess wit this logic British own africans

Are you this dumb? When a slave master has a slave, he OWNS that slave. Certain Yorubas were slaves to the Binis, and thus Binis owned those Yorubas. What's wrong with his statement in the first place? Or you just feel that you are obliged to reply every post irrespective of the thrash you're spewing?

Wulfruna:


The same debate you ran away from? LOL.

The same way you have shied away from pushing on with your claims that Mandingoes are in Congo and are nearer to Igboland than Yorubaland. (Use Google next time, that was a pretty big slip-up).

Please, address Sultan Muhammadu Bello's words to Clapperton cited here by absoluteSuccess, and don't try to shift attention to a discussion we had on another thread.

(By the way, anytime you wanna get back on that thread, I'll be there to school your ignorant arse.)

Oh, just in case I didn't make it clear before. I'm not Yoruba. I do not belong to any of the major ethnicities. I am a historian, or more correctly a student of history. Facts are all I care about.

I ignored you because you had activated into default repeat mode, repeating your sore old points over and over again, after claiming initially that they were not migrants but later shifted stance to 'oh well they are migrants only if...'. If I remember clearly, I never shifted my stance throughout the debate and provided facts and evidence to back up my initial point which you clearly misunderstood initially. Clearly seeing that you had no point, you sharply entered default repeat mode - my favourite phone media player mode, which repeats songs all over and over again until I change it.

Many times I have such short time to type that I type quickly and barely have time to return to that thread.

Oh well, Mandingoes are in Sierra Leone, as well as Fulas and it still unlikely that these fulas were proceeds of the yoruba slave trade. My point still stands. Keep running around in circles as usual.

I don't even care what your ethnicity is, I definitely knew you are from Niger Delta from the get-go.

Oh well, Fulaman198, your thread has been sorely derailed from its original intent. Sorry.

bigfrancis21:


I ignored you because you had activated into default repeat mode, repeating your sore old points over and over again, after claiming initially that they were not migrants but later shifted stance to 'oh well they are migrants only if...'. If I remember clearly, I never shifted my stance throughout the debate and provided facts and evidence to back up my initial point which you clearly misunderstood initially. Clearly seeing that you had no point, you sharply entered default repeat mode - favourite phone media player mode, which repeats songs all over and over again until I change it.

Many times I have such short time to type that I type quickly and barely have time to return to that thread.

Oh well, Mandingoes are in Sierra Leone, as well as Fulas and it still unlikely that these fulas were proceeds of the yoruba slave trade. My point still stands. Keep running around in circles as usual.

I don't even care what your ethnicity is, I definitely knew you are from Niger Delta from the get-go.

My request is simple. Reply to absoluteSuccess's citation of Sultan Bello's words.

tpiadotcom:



Ilorin was a slave trading depot, various slaves passed through there.

And, if you're not admiring slavery in this post, then what else could you be doing?

Did I ever say Ilorin was not a slave trade depot? Are you this clueless??

Wulfruna:


My request is simple. Reply to absoluteSuccess's citation of Sultan Bello's words.

Exactly. Relishing the posts gently.

absoluteSuccess:
Ilorin is not the beginning and the end Yoruba history, hear the son of Uthman Dan Fodio to Clapperton before your sweet joy 'Ilorin emergency': "Yarba is an extensive province containing rivers, forests, sands and mountains, as also a great many wonderful and extraordinary things. In it the bird called babage (parrot) is found. By the side of this province there is an anchorage for the Christians, who used to go there and purchase slaves. These slaves were exported from our country and sold to the people of Yarba, who resold them to the Christians" Sultan Bello, 1823. Francis, I already agree with any twist you choose to make out of this.

First of all, where exactly does 'yarba' refer to? Can you prove that 'yarba' in question refers to 'Ilorin' in particular?

Second, I'm aware that the name, 'yoruba' you fondly refer to yourselves today comes from the fulani language, particularly in reference to oyo (yarba - yarib.a - yoruba) as the fulani-hausa jihad expanded and pushed the oyo further down south. Weaklings, huh. Pushed further down south from an original area. I haven't read Bello's book in full but I could say that he was referring to a yoruba sub-group, maybe oyo, definitely not Ilorin.

Third, from his statement, his people SOLD (not 'were captured by the yorubas') slaves to Yarba people, who resold them to the Christians (I strongly feel he was referring to the white slave traders here). With no visible evidence so far, YOU CANNOT prove that the Yarba in question was in reference to Ilorin.

Fourth, from the statement above, it is clear that the slaves merely exchanged hands and the Yarba slave trade was not as a result of ruthless raids into northern lands by the Yorubas to capture slaves for sale as in the case of the ruthless Arochukwu slave traders who scouted Igboland for slaves and were feared all over Igboland, thus earning them the name 'Aro Oke Igbo' - Aro great Igbo, compared to what you would have us believe here. Mind you, I am only mentioning the Aro in this case to mirror their audacity and daring spirit. If that is the case, Yarba anchorage was merely a point of exchange for sale of slaves owing to its nearness to the sea. I bet Yorubas of yore would swear unto their ancestors never to be able to dare invade Hausa/Fulani lands.

Fulaman198:
Fulani slaves in Yorubaland? I laugh in Fulfulde. It was the other way around. Yorubas never had slaves. Probably the Edos (who owned you guys btw) did. I'm not too sure, but definitely Fulanis were never Maccube of Yoruba. Maybe in your wildest dreams that happened my Yoruba friends. But nice try though.

Lol Mustapha

Fulaman198:
Besides, I think HalimaSadiya is my new gf please don't beat me up Halima Fulani princess.

<3 <3

tpiadotcom:



are you open to discussing this bloodline thing?

And are you prexios?

There is not much to it @tpia, you know Yoruba is patrilineal, tracing lineage through the father: as such, a son of a slave is a slave, so a male slave in Yoruba can sire children but they will still be inherited like property in their next generation. But the danger is if that slave finds his ways to position of power. At this the Yoruba anchor a saying: b'eru ba joba, eniyan koni ku'kan.

absoluteSuccess:
There is not much to it @tpia, you know Yoruba is patrilineal, tracing lineage through the father: as such, a son of a slave is a slave, so a male slave in Yoruba can sire children but they will still be inherited like property in their next generation. But the danger is if that slave finds his ways to position of power. At this the Yoruba anchor a saying: b'eru ba joba, eniyan koni ku'kan.

Still waiting on your reply to my post.

bigfrancis21:


Still waiting on your reply to my post.

You don't have to wait, google is your friend. Moreso by the time you finish Sultan Bello's book, more answer will be in the offing to you. I enjoy the 'Aro Oke Igbo' terror aspect a great deal, hm what can I say, we learn something new everyday.

absoluteSuccess:
You don't have to wait, google is your friend. Moreso by the time you finish Sultan Bello's book, more answer will be in the offing to you. I enjoy the 'Aro Oke Igbo' terror aspect a great deal, hm what can I say, we learn something new everyday.

Wonderful 'reply', sister. You never cease to amaze me. Oh well, at least you just took home some boldness lessons. What can I say.

absoluteSuccess:
You don't have to wait, google is your friend. Moreso by the time you finish Sultan Bello's book, more answer will be in the offing to you. I enjoy the 'Aro Oke Igbo' terror aspect a great deal, hm what can I say, we learn something new everyday.

oke sef na Yoruba word, in this context.

bigfrancis21:
Oh well, Fulaman198, your thread has been sorely derailed from its original intent. Sorry.

No worries never though it would be my Yoruba friends to do it though (no offence to the Yorubas). Thought it would be AAs but the AAs on this site seem to be the most civil bunch out of all of us.

absoluteSuccess:
There is not much to it @tpia, you know Yoruba is patrilineal, tracing lineage through the father: as such, a son of a slave is a slave, so a male slave in Yoruba can sire children but they will still be inherited like property in their next generation. But the danger is if that slave finds his ways to position of power. At this the Yoruba anchor a saying: b'eru ba joba, eniyan koni ku'kan.

true, the kids will have the status of the father.


i guess the slave owner would try to transfer the slave during his lifetime, rather than risk him becoming his master.


The proverb sounds like the bible one.