Aura2:


Is that how you reason? you decide what you should be asked?
You want a name for a portfolio you believe do not exist? ?

This is what you get when lazy, dumb and ignorant folks like you - who find "reading" so difficult - get.

Did you even care to find out what led or brought in that title?

mcino:
If this discussion is something to rely on, I think the guy called Kaboninc is a genius. I respect his analysis. But it doesn't worth it.

Thank you!

Someone said it was a sermon but you even called it genius! That's great!

Rad1cal:



Old enough to know when mr ITK in you is reduced to naught.



Yeye

That is the beauty of common sense, it draws no parallels with logic, what do you think will happen when you lack it?

kaboninc:


This is what you get when lazy, dumb and ignorant folks like you - who find "reading" so difficult - get.

Did you even care to find out what led or brought in that title?

Personally, I have never heard that someone cordinated our Economy under Obasanjo.
When that guy wrote that it was Soludo, I became curious, the statement of soludo he quoted butressing that fact, I just Googled it and Soludo really said it.

It was contained in one of those Soludo's election letters.

It is wrong for you to claim that co ordinating the economy started with Jonathan.

Although the other guy misplaced the actors, from what I understand in his evidence, Obasanjo co ordinated the economy with soludo present each time decisions are being made.

Tell me in all sincerity, an economic decision by Obasanjo with soludo present, who do you sincerely believe is the brain behind the ideas?

I will ignore your insolence for now.

jpphilips:



That is the beauty of common sense, it draws no parallels with logic, what do you think will happen when you lack it?

You asked people to criticize your idea, he has given you his own contribution, no need for the insults.

Aura2:


Personally, I have never heard that someone cordinated our Economy under Obasanjo.
When that guy wrote that it was Soludo, I became curious, the statement of soludo he quoted butressing that fact, I just Googled it and Soludo really said it.

It was contained in one of those Soludo's election letters.

It is wrong for you to claim that co ordinating the economy started with Jonathan.

Although the other guy misplaced the actors, from what I understand in his evidence, Obasanjo co ordinated the economy with soludo present each time decisions are being made.

Am almost convinced that you're not the alter-ego of jpphilips and so I'll be civil with you...at least for now.

Back to your question,

You're wrong to think that I claimed that co-ordinating the economy started with Jonathan. I said the use of the title. Please read properly before commenting. You're also not concerned about the meaning of what he's trying to portray but what Soludo actually said? SMH 4 YOU!


Thank God you even admitted that you never heard that "someone co-ordinated our economy under Obasanjo". The truth remains that either the president "runs" or "co-ordinates" his government himself of he delegates it to someone else. In Obasanjo's time, he did it himself and Soludo was just an "adviser". Soludo only chaired the drafting committee (as he said) of the NEEDs programme not the economy

Secondly, the title "Co-ordinator of the Economy" or "Co-ordinating Minister of the economy" as used in this thread was first used by Jonathan himself when inaugurating his cabinet. That was in 2011 and when did Soludo use the title in his piece?

Lastly, Soludo being present in Obasanjo's bedroom doesn't mean he "co-ordinated" the economy. There are other brains in that government and Soludo is just not the best.

Tell me in all sincerity, an economic decision by Obasanjo with soludo present, who do you sincerely believe is the brain behind the ideas?
I will ignore your insolence for now.

Soludo made you believe that he was the brain behind the "glory" of the Nigerian economy in his piece abi? Let's not dig further. Let's just remain within this thread. We'll meet to discuss that.

Aura2:

Although the other guy misplaced the actors,

So...

Someone who claims to be so informed, knowledgeable with a high level of understand does not know the names of "key actors" in both present and past governments, their portfolios, their responsibilities, their implementations, their policies and action presents an idea...I mean how do you expect such a person to be taken seriously?

Jpphilips is such a person and you have to go through this thread to spot major goofs by him. Not trying to spite anyone but what's the hurt in trying to be honourable by admitting to a fault of your idea and accepting criticism?

jpphilips:



That is the beauty of common sense, it draws no parallels with logic, what do you think will happen when you lack it?

Shattap dia foool. Painment galore evident in you.



Bwahahahahaha

kaboninc:


Am almost convinced that you're not the alter-ego of jpphilips and so I'll be civil with you...at least for now.

Back to your question,

You're wrong to think that I claimed that co-ordinating the economy started with Jonathan. I said the use of the title. Please read properly before commenting. You're also not concerned about the meaning of what he's trying to portray but what Soludo actually said? SMH 4 YOU!


Thank God you even admitted that you never heard that "someone co-ordinated our economy under Obasanjo". The truth remains that either the president "runs" or "co-ordinates" his government himself of he delegates it to someone else. In Obasanjo's time, he did it himself and Soludo was just an "adviser". Soludo only chaired the drafting committee (as he said) of the NEEDs programme not the economy

Secondly, the title "Co-ordinator of the Economy" or "Co-ordinating Minister of the economy" as used in this thread was first used by Jonathan himself when inaugurating his cabinet. That was in 2011 and when did Soludo use the title in his piece?

Lastly, Soludo being present in Obasanjo's bedroom doesn't mean he "co-ordinated" the economy. There are other brains in that government and Soludo is just not the best.



Soludo made you believe that he was the brain behind the "glory" of the Nigerian economy in his piece abi? Let's not dig further. Let's just remain within this thread. We'll meet to discuss that.

I get your point, but you didn't answer me directly.
That guy misplaced the actors no doubt because his evidence did not directly place Soludo at the center of his claim,

over to you;

Do you agree that Obasanjo was his own co ordinating Minister for the economy according to Soludo?

Aura2:


I get your point, but you didn't answer me directly.
That guy misplaced the actors no doubt because his evidence did not directly place Soludo at the center of his claim,

over to you;

Do you agree that Obasanjo was his own co ordinating Minister for the economy according to Soludo?

What's your point?

Did you read my reply to you? Or you forgot this paragraph:

Thank God you even admitted that you never
heard that "someone co-ordinated our economy
under Obasanjo". The truth remains that either
the president "runs" or "co-ordinates" his
government himself of he delegates it to someone
else. In Obasanjo's time, he did it himself and
Soludo was just an "adviser". Soludo only chaired
the drafting committee (as he said) of the NEEDs
programme not the economy

What again is your point?

kaboninc:


What's your point?

Did you read my reply to you? Or you forgot this paragraph:




What again is your point?

Sorry it was an oversight, since you agree that Obasanjo did it himself, why did you tell us that the "toga" co ordinating Minister for the economy started with Jonathan?

Aura2:


Sorry it was an oversight, since you agree that Obasanjo did it himself, why did you tell us that the "toga" co ordinating Minister for the economy started with Jonathan?

Please re-read that reply.

If you ask any unnecessary question, I'll ignore you. Hope you don't have difficulty reading or understanding.

kaboninc:


I wonder if am speaking to a sane fellow. This is your own statement:


I even thought that you have brains sef.

Why I kept on hammering on the subject of Russian Government's interference in the devaluation of the currency was because I thought you were of average inteligence. Alas, you are not. You kept bringing up "govt banks stopped issuing LOC's for importers, but rather the LOCs were routed through private banks" as indicated up there shows how shallow you are.

For the record, the Russian Government "owned banks" DID NOT issue any LOC in 1998 for any importers except, of course, it was you! Only the government banks you own issue LOC. I hope you even know what an LOC is.

Secondly, the fall of crude oil prices was not the major reason rather it contributed. The spoils of war was the major cost that led to Russian economy crises. Stop deceiving people here.



Rubbish! Remember this:


You see the bold word, and how your statement is an affirmative statement?

So you've turned into a liar now abi or your memory is too short that you forget things so quickly right?



Shssssss!!!! Don't let people hear this from you......
Dam.n!!
You just hate to learn. Why is it so if I may ask? Soludo at no time CO-ORDINATED our economy.

You don't even know the relationship between a drop in crude prices and an economic meltdown! As per if we paid exchange rate differentials, I told you to go read up your books especially on elementary economics. When you do, consider this hint: consider the length of time the price of crude was down and the landing cost of PMS within that time. Also consider to price sold at the retail stations. When you do, you come over.




I laugh at you. Why because you reasoning is shallow. Not deep and may never be deep! It is a fact.
A Special Purpose Vehicle (Neconde) was set up to acquire a stake in a project. In assessing the capabilities, technicalities and soundness of the SPV, do you dwell on the SPV as an entity, as you are currently doing with Neconde? Or the parties that formed the SPV?

As an analogy, what is the pedigree of Ikeja Electricity Distribution Company? or Transmission Company of Nigeria, of Seplat Energy (as at 2011)?

Again, you are not any were close to average intelligence.



Brother, I wish you could tell us how bad the DSO model is for gas in Nigeria.

Hint: For the fact other countries practice a particular policy doesn't mean it can work in ours!

You finally arrived at the point I knew this debate would end. Stop wasting your time with people living in caves. I have followed this argument and I waited for you to come to this conclusion. Have a nice Sunday.

kaboninc:


Please re-read that reply.

If you ask any unnecessary question, I'll ignore you. Hope you don't have difficulty reading or understanding.

You knew that OBJ co ordinated his economy with the help of Soludo as an Economic adviser (in your words)

But you told us that it started with Jonathan, at this point, I see no difference between the folly of jp and yours, what you need to learn here is that picking irrelevant holes while ignoring the substance of an argument, is a waste of effort.

If you still have time, I have another relevant question to ask below

@kaboninc

is it possible in Nigeria for the CBN (though independent) to devalue the nation's currency without the knowledge of the Co ordinating Minister of the economy?

Aura2:



You knew that OBJ co ordinated his economy with the help of Soludo as an Economic adviser (in your words)

But you told us that it started with Jonathan, at this point, I see no difference between the folly of jp and yours, what you need to learn here is that picking irrelevant holes while ignoring the substance of an argument, is a waste of effort.

If you still have time, I have another relevant question to ask below

You know you should shut up.

Are you the alter-ego of jpphilips?

Are you blind that you missed this:

Secondly, the title "Co-ordinator of the Economy" or "Co-ordinating Minister of the economy" as used in this thread was first used by Jonathan himself when inaugurating his cabinet. That was in 2011 and when did Soludo use the title in his piece?

Did you see the bold word? TITLE?

I did not tell you that IT started with Jonathan but that the title was first used by Jonathan. Are you having problems understanding? Don't you know the difference?

Or you came here to defend your alternate, jpphilips or you're him?

I did not know that Obasanjo co-ordinated the economy "with" Soludo. Maybe in your head, he did. But you should know something and always know something - Soludo was an "adviser" and his responsibility at that time when he was an adviser was restricted to "advisory".

Please stop disturbing me about this trivial issue a JSS 3 students would attempt.

Aura2:
@kaboninc

is it possible in Nigeria for the CBN (though independent) to devalue the nation's currency without the knowledge of the Co ordinating Minister of the economy?

Another dumb question from you. Go read up my various replies to your alternate, jpphilips.

atlwireles:


You finally arrived at the point I knew this debate would end. Stop wasting your time with people living in caves. I have followed this argument and I waited for you to come to this conclusion. Have a nice Sunday.

Wow!!

Thanks.

Happy Sunday to you too.

Aura2:
@kaboninc

is it possible in Nigeria for the CBN (though independent) to devalue the nation's currency without the knowledge of the Co ordinating Minister of the economy?

the real question is can the co ordinating minister of the economy issue instructions to the CBN not to devalue the naira or vice versa!

baralatie:

the real question is can the co ordinating minister of the economy issue instructions to the CBN not to devalue the naira or vice versa!

Are you privy to any move by the Finance minister to avert the demands of the oil dealers?

Aura2:



Are you privy to any move by the Finance minister to avert the demands of the oil dealers?

hahahaha!!!
let us balance the issue of payments with a simple example.
1.an importer of behalf of Nnpc imports 1000000 litres of petrol let say $0.5 per litre in the month of 1st January,2014($500000).
for the past six(6) months,dollar=naira exchange has been stable with a max difference of #1($1= 100).
after 3 months,CBN had pressure on the naira due to factors beyond its control and devalues the naira by 30%.
if you are the minister what will you do?

baralatie:

hahahaha!!!
let us balance the issue of payments with a simple example.
1.an importer of behalf of Nnpc imports 1000000 litres of petrol let say $0.5 per litre in the month of 1st January,2014($500000).
for the past six(6) months,dollar=naira exchange has been stable with a max difference of #1($1= 100).
after 3 months,CBN had pressure on the naira due to factors beyond its control and devalues the naira by 30%.
if you are the minister what will you do?

Is that an admission that nothing was done? she was helpless? for someone with the fattest CV in the financial sector, I really don't want to believe that.

Was this scenario playing out under Obasanjo, how did we wriggle out of it then?

Aura2:


Is that an admission that nothing was done? she was helpless? for someone with the fattest CV in the financial sector, I really don't want to believe that.

Was this scenario playing out under Obasanjo, how did we wriggle out of it then?

that means by you comments you would prefer to be the critique.

now let us ask ourselves what was the scenario that played out under Obj when and where he was the petroleum minister!
1.the price of oil and refined products was fair and stable( correct me if we ever had a 50% drop in revenue of crude)
2.the average rate of exchange was also a Bit stable
3.the level of imports of refined products was not 40 millions of petrol a day.(hence the noticeable hot periods of scarcity in and around that time)
4.obj tenure problem was the foreign debt crisis to Paris and co. and its effect on the economy(this was negotiated by Mrs okonjo )
5.payments by the govt was not a problem because the balance sheet at that time can absorb it.

kaboninc:


You know you should shut up.

Are you the alter-ego of jpphilips?

Are you blind that you missed this:



Did you see the bold word? TITLE?

I did not tell you that IT started with Jonathan but that the title was first used by Jonathan. Are you having problems understanding? Don't you know the difference?

Or you came here to defend your alternate, jpphilips or you're him?

I did not know that Obasanjo co-ordinated the economy "with" Soludo. Maybe in your head, he did. But you should know something and always know something - Soludo was an "adviser" and his responsibility at that time when he was an adviser was restricted to "advisory".

Please stop disturbing me about this trivial issue a JSS 3 students would attempt.

Both you and Jp were wrong, it doesn't matter what you tell yourself to feel good.

I read your post on NECONDE, jp wants divested interests returned to NPDC because NECONDE as a consortium has no pedigree.

conversely, you justified the acquisition by analysing the pedigree of it's entities, my question is why do you want it that way? How will it help Nigerians?

Before you answer consider this example;

First Atlantic bank as an Entity did so well that banks like Inland bank etc was more than glad to form a synergy with it.

Three years after the consortium was formed, finbank lost its capital base, in other words "distressed".

Today, the consortium has been acquired by FCMB.


Why do you insist that NECONDE's capabilities should be based on the entities that formed it?

baralatie:

that means by you comments you would prefer to be the critique.

now let us ask ourselves what was the scenario that played out under Obj when and where he was the petroleum minister!
1.the price of oil and refined products was fair and stable( correct me if we ever had a 50% drop in revenue of crude)
2.the average rate of exchange was also a Bit stable
3.the level of imports of refined products was not 40 millions of petrol a day.(hence the noticeable hot periods of scarcity in and around that time)
4.obj tenure problem was the foreign debt crisis to Paris and co. and its effect on the economy(this was negotiated by Mrs okonjo )
5.payments by the govt was not a problem because the balance sheet at that time can absorb it.

Nice response but at some point Soludo devalued the naira true or false?

Aura2:



Nice response but at some point Soludo devalued the naira true or false?

yes he did!
but the minister of petroleum(OBJ) and the ministry of finance where able to meet the financial claims of the importers so there was no "locking of horns".

baralatie:

yes he did!
but the minister of petroleum(OBJ) and the ministry of finance where able to meet the financial claims of the importers so there was no "locking of horns".

Interesting! !! Do you see this subsidy plan as workable?

Aura2:


Interesting! !! Do you see this subsidy plan as workable?

that is why I said earlier that the two rhinos on this thread (jpphillips and kaboninc)sizing themselves both suggested solutions on subsidy but the approach were and are different.
1.sanitization
2.sustainability

sanitization: here is about cleaning up the system true
a,probing and correction of lapses,payments,contractual lapses etc
b,developing the gas supply system to power stations(upgraded from jpphillips)
c,revamp of refineries to at 100% efficiency

Sustainability: here is where the issue you have raised
1.govt privatise the refineries and encourage the building ,running of more refineries to maximise at least 800000 barrels of crude a day.freedom of entry and exit into the refinery business.

this way the govt will not be locked with the problems of
a,payments for refined products
b,effects of devaluation or revaluation of currency payment.

BUT THE SUSTAINABLE SOLUTIONS IS HEAVILY DEPENDENT ON THE RESULT OF SANITIZATION.

For example, Nigeria needs 40million/day of petrol.
A,scenario
1.no refinery working
2.nnpc accounts cannot be verified
3.import certificates cannot be verified
4.the importers are a UNION
5.no competition
even if govt says it hands off subsidy,the risks is diverted directly into the economy because the importers will source the naira equivalent in the system to buy from abroad( naira under pressure to devalue)
6.customers at the end bear the full brunt.

B,scenario
1.the system has capacity to refine 30000000millions litres/ day (govt refineries are working)
2.NNPC account can be verified
3.PpMC,PPPRA,NPDC are broken out the control of NNPC and become accountable as individual entities
4.there is price monitoring and competition.

whether govt removes subsidy,the oil marketers are given a face lift to sell,the end consumers will be shielded from " pressure on the naira" and the end pricing risk is technically shared( even without subsidy".

C,Scenario(Capacity utilization)
1.the system refines 60000000/day
2.private refineries develop 50% of output
3.an efficient monitoring body is set up including consumer board and monitoring
4.all entry and exit (all competition but no monopoly)
5.price controlled by market forces
6.legal structure in place to protect the citizens from profiteering racket.



as you can see the answer to subsidy is not a straight forward answer but it does not favour govt!

Aura2:



Both you and Jp were wrong, it doesn't matter what you tell yourself to feel good.

I read your post on NECONDE, jp wants divested assets returned to NPDC because NECONDE as a consortium has no pedigree.

conversely, you justified the acquisition by analysing the pedigree of it's entities, my question is why do you want it that way? How will it help Nigerians?

You're funny and sill.y. I just don't have any apology for using these words on you because you really deserve it. So any time you stup.idly quote me, I'll use very insulting words on you.

You make things difficult for everyone here when you spread lies. You did not properly read my replies to jp. And you are the wrong guy here!

Jpphilips alleged that these assets were "diverted" when he made this ridiculous allegation:

All the oil blocks, production platforms,
Marginal wells diverted, sold or on lease by
madueke including the recently divested SPDC
assets should be returned to NPDC with
immediate effect.

In your timid brain, the asset (and not interest) were alleged to have been diverted - to you, Aura2 Oil Corp - and not interest.

And here you're saying "divested"?

Before I continue, what do you know about that transaction? Don't let me feel am talking to a jpphilips2.

Before you answer consider this example;

First Atlantic bank as an Entity did so well that banks like Inland bank etc was more than glad to form a synergy with it.

Three years after the consortium was formed, finbank lost its capital base, in other words "distressed".

Today, the consortium has been acquired by FCMB.


Why do you insist that NECONDE's capabilities should be based on the entities that formed it?

Before we consider your sill.y analogy and ignorant question, let's look at the status of Finbank after the merger of First Atlantic, Inland and co. What was the pedigree of Finbank? Care to tell us?

Secondly, FCMB ACQUIRED Finbank. FCMB has been existing before the merger and subsequent acquisition. So what has FCMB got to do with Neconde which is just like Finbank?

Stop mentioning me abeg. Please I beg of you.

You're asking unnecessary questions. If you have a problem with my facts, why not counter it? Is it that difficult?

baralatie:

.

For your sake, I'll clear up some things.

1. The Ministry of Finance is mutually independent from the Central Bank of Nigeria.

2. The Ministry of Finance handles fiscal issues like prudent spending of government resources, accountability, budget design, development and implementation, efficient allocation of government resources and use.

3. The Central Bank handles monetary issues such as currency management, inflation, money supply, etc.

4. Both institutions work together but are independent of each other as per their responsibilities.

kaboninc:


For your sake, I'll clear up some things.

1. The Ministry of Finance is mutually independent from the Central Bank of Nigeria.

2. The Ministry of Finance handles fiscal issues like prudent spending of government resources, accountability, budget design, development and implementation, efficient allocation of government resources and use.

3. The Central Bank handles monetary issues such as currency management, inflation, money supply, etc.

4. Both institutions work together but are independent of each other as per their responsibilities.

thanks a million!

Aura2:



Both you and Jp were wrong, it doesn't matter what you tell yourself to feel good.

I read your post on NECONDE, jp wants divested assets returned to NPDC because NECONDE as a consortium has no pedigree.

conversely, you justified the acquisition by analysing the pedigree of it's entities, my question is why do you want it that way? How will it help Nigerians?

Before you answer consider this example;

First Atlantic bank as an Entity did so well that banks like Inland bank etc was more than glad to form a synergy with it.

Three years after the consortium was formed, finbank lost its capital base, in other words "distressed".

Today, the consortium has been acquired by FCMB.


Why do you insist that NECONDE's capabilities should be based on the entities that formed it?

Great post.