Welcome, Guest: Register On Nairaland / LOGIN! / Trending / Recent / NewStats: 3,194,787 members, 7,956,016 topics. Date: Sunday, 22 September 2024 at 09:26 PM |
Nairaland Forum / Nairaland / General / Politics / Ibrahim: With CBN Printing Money, I’m Justified (3021 Views)
FG's Recovered Loot with CBN — Investigation by Punch / El-rufai's Eating Of Sugarcane In Public Justified By World Leaders (photos) / Limiting Probe To Jonathan Cannot Be Justified, Falana Tells Buhari (2) (3) (4)
Re: Ibrahim: With CBN Printing Money, I’m Justified by Ibime(m): 8:17pm On Sep 01, 2009 |
4 Play: In that case, we are as condemnable as the Yanks who also printed money for bailout. I dont think money supply is the overriding issue here (with regards to inflation/deflation argument). If it was, we still have enough leverage to cut interest rates rather than resort to borrowing or quantitative easing. I just believe the nucca had a blackhole of N420bn to fill (for bailout), and his option was between borrowing and printing. I am not saying printing is better than borrowing. I dont know. Both still have devaluating effect on the Naira. |
Re: Ibrahim: With CBN Printing Money, I’m Justified by naijaking1: 8:38pm On Sep 01, 2009 |
Can you have Sanusi print more of those How do you say inflation, Zimbabwe, or Islamic bunking? |
Re: Ibrahim: With CBN Printing Money, I’m Justified by SapeleGuy: 8:54pm On Sep 01, 2009 |
Sanusi is walking disaster, the man needs to go! may be they can transfer him to PHCN. |
Re: Ibrahim: With CBN Printing Money, I’m Justified by 4Play(m): 8:59pm On Sep 01, 2009 |
Ibime: Inflation in the US has been negative since March '09, hence the printing of money as the Fed fund rates have reached their nadir. Nigeria is absolutely not in the same position. Did anyone in Nigeria tell you that the price of goods have been falling? We're taking the copycat mentality to absurd levels. |
Re: Ibrahim: With CBN Printing Money, I’m Justified by otokx(m): 10:20pm On Sep 01, 2009 |
really absurd levels |
Re: Ibrahim: With CBN Printing Money, I’m Justified by doyin13(m): 11:32pm On Sep 01, 2009 |
well. . . . . I would like to know any suggestions as to how a collapse of the banking system would have been averted without pumping money into the banking system. Whether through printing money or through borrowing money or whatever means anyone thought was better, it was a case of damned if you do, damned if you don't. |
Re: Ibrahim: With CBN Printing Money, I’m Justified by jossyspot: 11:37pm On Sep 01, 2009 |
JOB OFFER FOR EVERY ONE INTRESTING PERSONNEL SHOULD LOG ON www.naijajobprovider..com |
Re: Ibrahim: With CBN Printing Money, I’m Justified by Beaf: 1:13am On Sep 02, 2009 |
doyin13: Don't you think thats a bit being dramatic? There are two sides to the coin, it is best to allow any dust raised to settle, as well as the resolution of all legal issues; then we'll be able to see clearly enough to make judgements one way or the other; its too early right now. |
Re: Ibrahim: With CBN Printing Money, I’m Justified by otokx(m): 5:31am On Sep 02, 2009 |
This whole drama don dey tire person. |
Re: Ibrahim: With CBN Printing Money, I’m Justified by mbulela: 6:14am On Sep 02, 2009 |
no be only you.me sef don tire |
Re: Ibrahim: With CBN Printing Money, I’m Justified by Goldmind1(m): 7:11am On Sep 02, 2009 |
I forsee the army boys coming back to power! |
Re: Ibrahim: With CBN Printing Money, I’m Justified by PapaBrowne(m): 8:21am On Sep 02, 2009 |
Sanusi is a disaster in the making. Does he have to take the whole country down with him?? |
Re: Ibrahim: With CBN Printing Money, I’m Justified by Ibime(m): 9:42am On Sep 02, 2009 |
doyin13: Truth be told, the banking system poses little risk to the economy as a whole. In quantitative terms, since the banks are suffering a credit freeze and inflation is still healthy, that means supply of money in Naija is still fairly liquid irrespective of the health of the banks. Thats because lenders (banks) do not permeate the real economy; and because nuccas still keep cash money under their pillow. Hence there is no reason to bail any bank out. I think the question of bailout is more one of preventing an unquantifiable loss of trust in the Nigerian banking system from foreign and local investors, especially considering that the banking system is still in its infancy. @ Jarus/4Play, Do you support bailout of any of these banks? |
Re: Ibrahim: With CBN Printing Money, I’m Justified by Nobody: 11:02am On Sep 02, 2009 |
Ibime: Ibime US did not print notes for the bail out. Stop mis-informing us. |
Re: Ibrahim: With CBN Printing Money, I’m Justified by Nobody: 11:26am On Sep 02, 2009 |
Thinking about it. Sanusi resumed as CBN guv in June 2009, injected 420billion (printed) on August 14,2009. How long did it take to print the money (bearing in mind that the printing was done overseas). I bet u, it took more than 4 weeks to print such huge sum of money. When did Sanusi conduct the examination of the five banks? When did he ascertain that N420 billion would be required? When was the order for the notes issued? Something tells me that the first intruction Sanusi gave as CBN guv was the printing of the N420 billion. The actor is good, but it is badly written script. |
Re: Ibrahim: With CBN Printing Money, I’m Justified by Ibime(m): 11:31am On Sep 02, 2009 |
Xavier.: What did they print it for then? Pls answer. |
Re: Ibrahim: With CBN Printing Money, I’m Justified by Nobody: 11:32am On Sep 02, 2009 |
Havent u heard of the TARP fund? Not every country spen all they earn. |
Re: Ibrahim: With CBN Printing Money, I’m Justified by Ibime(m): 11:35am On Sep 02, 2009 |
Xavier.: And buying Troubled Assets from troubled banks does not constitute "bailing them out". What did Sanusi buy from our troubled banks? 4Play made the point on inflation and liquidity of money supply which is correct. I dont know what point you're making. |
Re: Ibrahim: With CBN Printing Money, I’m Justified by Nobody: 11:41am On Sep 02, 2009 |
Ibime U re deviating frm the point. TARP fund was set aside by the US congress to address the credit crisis in the country in 2008. The Fed reserve didnt just wake up one morning and decide to start rolling out dollars. No one went to mint to print out billions of dollars. Bail out is good, but its got to be strategic and well planned, not one man's superman initiative. The big question is when was the order for the print given (weeks before August 14, I reckon)? If so, how did Sanusi know he would be needing exactly N420 billion? Or was he already planning all these before he joined CBN? These are really disturbing questions begging for answers. |
Re: Ibrahim: With CBN Printing Money, I’m Justified by Ibime(m): 12:01pm On Sep 02, 2009 |
Xavier.: Stop dribbling yourself. Since you agree that the TARP fund was a 'bailout', how can you claim that money was not created by fiat for a bailout? Your argument is incoherent to say the least. TARP is a bailout, Sanusi's buying of assets is also a bailout. Xavier.: Order for print? This thing was done electronically. Like I said, I dont get your point. The valid point against quantitative easing was given by 4Play and that concerns the fact that inflation is still healthy, meaning that the banks in question pose little risk to the supply of money in the economy. Sanusi claims supply of money was negative in the first half of the year, hence his resort to quantitative easing. I believe that there may be a disconnect somewhere because a negative supply of money should be reflected by strong disinflation or even deflation. All these leave me with a few questions, and I hope someone can answer these: (1.) Basically, what is the "strategic risk" posed to the economy by the failure of the banks? Sanusi says the risk is strong. However, is the economy that dependent on the credit they provide to it? |
Re: Ibrahim: With CBN Printing Money, I’m Justified by Nobody: 12:10pm On Sep 02, 2009 |
Ibime Apparently, u re not well informed about current happenings in Nigeria. Havent u heard that Sanusi spent N100bn printing out the N420bn, so where does electronic thing come in? Unlike in the UK, where the quantive easing was carried out via electronic injection of capital into the economy, Sanusi decided to PRINT OUT N420 billion. Dont get it wrong, am not against bail out, infact am in full support of it. But i dont think adding N420billion piece of paper to the economy consititutes a bail out. Total value of money in circulation remains constant, all u ve done is to more paper. I might not owe a PhD in Islamic Ecomonomics, nor be as articulate as Ibime, but i understand basic economics. |
Re: Ibrahim: With CBN Printing Money, I’m Justified by Ibime(m): 12:25pm On Sep 02, 2009 |
Xavier.: Are you sure about this. . . . I read the report that the process cost N100bn and I have every reason to take it with a pinch of salt. . . .you know what Nigerian journalists are like. . . Sanusis words were "We basically created extra assets on the balance sheet". . . . the printing of money may not be physical. Anyway, I await confirmation from CBN whether the money was physically printed or not. I am 80% sure it was not. It would do you good to read this post: chuckvyl: Xavier.: I would feel better if you were not in support of bailout. Im may not in support of bailout until someone answers this question: (1.) What is the "strategic risk" posed to the economy by the failure of the banks? Sanusi says the risk is strong. However, is the economy that dependent on the credit they provide to it? |
Re: Ibrahim: With CBN Printing Money, I’m Justified by FACE(m): 12:30pm On Sep 02, 2009 |
Ibime: Why do you like in getting into what you know next to nothing about or am I misunderstanding your comments ? My friend, take away the banking system and the whole economy will grind to a halt, I mean sudden halt with fully applied brakes. Actually it will go into full reverse. The other time you also thought that printing money to inject into banks would lead to a trade deficit. (Ok maybe with Germany since we print the money in Germany) You also confused affordability with availability and refused to accept that many factors like continuous employment affect continuous affordability (leading to loan defaults) and implied that demand tracked house prices rather than house prices tracking demand and available supply. Dude, go and really read that your "demand - Supply curve" page again. O.K maybe you should read the whole chapter in order to get better information. While you are at it, try Trade deficits and surpluses. Oh, lest I forget, also check how money supply expansion is mainly used as a tool of counter recession/depression. By the way, the bulk US bailout money came from govt borrowings, bonds and IOUs. |
Re: Ibrahim: With CBN Printing Money, I’m Justified by Ibime(m): 12:37pm On Sep 02, 2009 |
FACE: I think its fair to say that the latter is the case. You have completely misrespresented my positions and twisted my words to suit whatever you fancy. Hence you twisted my words in the other thread only to come back to agree with me that fallout from the mortgage crisis would be nuanced by Islamic banking. If I say banking system, I am talking about these 5 banks in particular. Ambiguous perhaps. As for all your other yarnings about affordability/availability/artificial demand, Im tired of trashing same issues with you. If you wanna continue that, you can step to the other thread. |
Re: Ibrahim: With CBN Printing Money, I’m Justified by naso2(m): 12:42pm On Sep 02, 2009 |
Xavier.:hmmmmmm |
Re: Ibrahim: With CBN Printing Money, I’m Justified by Nobody: 12:44pm On Sep 02, 2009 |
Ok own. |
Re: Ibrahim: With CBN Printing Money, I’m Justified by ADint(m): 1:14pm On Sep 02, 2009 |
The CBN did not PHYSICALLY PRINT any new notes. This money was already in the system with the banks in form of their indebtedness to the CBN through the expanded discount window. What the CBN did was to turn this to a long term loan to be paid back over a long period of time. Basically an adjustment on the CBN's and the bank's balance sheets. This is similar to your bank turning a #1m overdraft (repayable on demand) to a 10 year loan. Technically it is still called 'Printing Money' or the more modern and preferred jargon 'quantitative easing'. |
Re: Ibrahim: With CBN Printing Money, I’m Justified by Nobody: 1:21pm On Sep 02, 2009 |
Adint That was everyone's tot until Sanusi revealed "We PRINTED the money" during a press conference. The ill-effect of this unguided act cannot be over-emphasied. Imagine addional N420 billion more currency in circulation. Heard they re now mopping money from circulation. Y re we going this way and that way all at once. |
Re: Ibrahim: With CBN Printing Money, I’m Justified by 4Play(m): 8:59pm On Sep 02, 2009 |
The Nigerian economy is essentially anchored on the price of oil. We would have survived the collapse of those 5 banks. Inflation is probably running at double digits at a time GDP growth is barely positive. The last thing we need is another injection of N420bn. Looks like the lunatics are back in charge of the asylum. |
Re: Ibrahim: With CBN Printing Money, I’m Justified by doyin13(m): 9:37pm On Sep 02, 2009 |
4 Play: Lol. . . . . This reminds me of just prior to the Lehman collapse. We all know how that turned out. Regardless of how reliant the economy is on oil, I don't see how the country could go forward with uncertainty on both the domestic and foreign fronts over the health of our banks. We already have enough of a challenge attracting investment, without the baggage of the collapse of some of the most visible financial institutions in the country. There seems to be a great deal of uncertainty over the source of these funds. Some say, the money was printed, our clueless legislators say it came from money that should have been appropriated, now I hear it is from money the banks already had available to them throught the discount window. Can someone just clarify once and for all, though I suspect its the last. |
Re: Ibrahim: With CBN Printing Money, I’m Justified by 4Play(m): 9:55pm On Sep 02, 2009 |
doyin13: Nigeria is not the US with a sophisticated and outsized banking system. History shows we have had major bank failures, they are indeed a norm, without consequent shock to the economy. There is a tendency for people to juxtapose logic and events relevant in the West with Nigeria. We simply can't afford zombie banks. Not even the US can as they are bound to find in years to come. |
Re: Ibrahim: With CBN Printing Money, I’m Justified by doyin13(m): 1:58am On Sep 03, 2009 |
4 Play: Nigeria has not become quite as sophisticated as the US but it surely has matured post consolidation, whether to the extent the collapse of the five banks would have caused systemic risk, is a moot point at worst. On the topic of flooding the banks with money. Well, I do not envisage a vertiginous climb in inflation. The amounts in question is a minute percentage of GDP. I do not expect aggregate demand to jump through the roof since much of the funds would probably be gobbled up by a very very minute portion of the population. |
Picture Of Goodluck Jonathan And The 1st Lady Dancing / Know Number Of Eligible Voters In Each Six Geopolitical Zone In Nigeria By INEC / Olubadan Endorses Buhari
(Go Up)
Sections: politics (1) business autos (1) jobs (1) career education (1) romance computers phones travel sports fashion health religion celebs tv-movies music-radio literature webmasters programming techmarket Links: (1) (2) (3) (4) (5) (6) (7) (8) (9) (10) Nairaland - Copyright © 2005 - 2024 Oluwaseun Osewa. All rights reserved. See How To Advertise. 74 |