Shma:

Maybe you're in a different universe, where facts are 'nonsensical and mind-numbing submissions & vice versa. '

And stop regurgitating people's views.

come to reality and you will understand simple things.


But first, you must get an education so you'll be able to contribute to intellectual discussion

Madness. Learn to support your argument with empirical data.
Understand the difference btw Total Revenue and taxes (ordinary revenues).
They are not the same.
Taxes are 17B - but we A-I-A (other revenues) that is about 3B.
Appropriation-in-Aid or other revenues - include user fees, licensing, dividends, court fines - collected by gov agencies and regulators.
Total 21B.
Ghana revenues are not even 10B. It's total budget is 17B.

Just40:
again you're not reading

Kenya total revenue is 17 billion dollars and your annual debt servicing is 12 billion dollars according to Bloomberg.

Ghana total revenue is 20 billion dollars and annual debt servicing is 9 billion dollars.


I know economic is not your strong hold hence why you keep posting nonsense.

Because we take Commercial loans, that is why we are able to invest it into profitable businesses instead of going for slave loans from IMF and WB or China, like you. Loans that are only invested in loss making nonsense. Which is the reason why Kenya was unable to pay it debt last year and it had to take Ghana to negotiate debt relief for your country.


Even after the debt relief, today your country is in a murky situation, unable to buy fuel.

Stop talking like a hungry, frustrated f00l

rvp2018:
Ghana definitely the next Sri-Lanka/Lebanon/Zambia... they wanted to go back to Eurobond to borrow to pay Eurobond

Ghana suffered its worst credit rating downgrade post-HIPC/MDRI this year when Fitch Ratings and Moody’s Investor Services cut the country’s score to B negative and Caa1 respectively in mid-January and early February respectively.

The latest rating puts the country in the ‘red zone’ of the scale used by rating agencies to assess the creditworthiness of sovereigns across the globe.

It now means that Ghana’s debts are, for the first time since the 2000s, considered highly speculative and substantially risky by investors and analysts. In other words, Ghana’s debts are seen as junk by investors.

https://www.myjoyonline.com/isaac-adongo-ghanas-worst-downgrade-the-blissful-ignorance-and-pompous-arrogance-of-a-government-holding-on-to-straws/

rvp2018:
Madness. Learn to support your argument with empirical data.
Understand the difference btw Total Revenue and taxes (ordinary revenues).
They are not the same.
Taxes are 17B - but we A-I-A (other revenues) that is about 3B.
Appropriation-in-Aid or other revenues - include user fees, licensing, dividends, court fines - collected by gov agencies and regulators.
Total 21B.
Ghana revenues are not even 10B. It's total budget is 17B.

I posted facts


Now you're the one making appropriations ....

Just stop lying already.... One will think, now that your country is in serious trouble, you guys will start embracing truth for a change.

q

Just40:
Nothing compares to your country desperate situation right now.


Have you seen the fuel lines in your country ?
Have you seen the bread lines?


By next year, Kenya would not even be able to pay it public sector workers.

And guess what, the majority of Ghana's debt had been invested into profitable ventures that can repay the debt on their own.

Hope I can say same for your country but that's not possible because of the nonsense that happens in Kenya.

The problem Kenya has now is it's lack of essential mineral resources like Nigeria and Ghana. Mineral resources have rebounded seriously these days when most African countries are reeling seriously from the effects of covid and Ukraine war.
Before now, most African countries have racked up massive debts. Countries that lack mineral resources to export are going to have a lot of problems like Kenya is facing currently. How are they going to pay back the debts incurred to build all the Chinese infrastructures they gloat about here?
Now they can't even meet up with subsidies for fuel.

Kenya's prognosis are indeed frightening. I told them years ago that there was no way they could sustain a 50m population on a < $100bn economy. They hated and insulted me for it, calling me all kinds of names. Now the shitt has hit the fan and ordinary Kenyans are crying.

obaaderemi:
The problem Kenya has now is it's lack of essential mineral resources like Nigeria and Ghana. Mineral resources have rebounded seriously these days when most African countries are reeling seriously from the effects of covid and Ukraine war.
Before now, most African countries have racked up massive debts. Countries that lack mineral resources to export are going to have a lot of problems like Kenya is facing currently. How are they going to pay back the debts incurred to build all the Chinese infrastructures they gloat about here?
Now they can't even meet up with subsidies for fuel.

Kenya's prognosis are indeed frightening. I told them years ago that there was no way they could sustain a 50m population on a < $100bn economy. They hated and insulted me for it, calling me all kinds of names. Now the shitt has hit the fan and ordinary Kenyans are crying.

Exactly so, a country with almost the population of SA and yet it people are completely not economically productive to sustain their economy such that even if the government messes up, they can keep it going.

They've left it to the indians who will immediately run back to India at the first sign of trouble.

Kenya has survived for all these years without minerals.
We use our human capital - which is better than natural resources.
A country cannot develop with minerals going up and down.
That is just like a drug addict - one minute high - the next minute miserable.
It's now called Nigeria Natural Resource Curse.
Kenya I am happy we dont have minerals - so we can build the most important resources - HUMAN CAPITAL.
We already have Africa best HCI - capturing 58% of human potential - and we are making progress

obaaderemi:
The problem Kenya has now is it's lack of essential mineral resources like Nigeria and Ghana. Mineral resources have rebounded seriously these days when most African countries are reeling seriously from the effects of covid and Ukraine war.
Before now, most African countries have racked up massive debts. Countries that lack mineral resources to export are going to have a lot of problems like Kenya is facing currently. How are they going to pay back the debts incurred to build all the Chinese infrastructures they gloat about here?
Now they can't even meet up with subsidies for fuel.

Kenya's prognosis are indeed frightening. I told them years ago that there was no way they could sustain a 50m population on a < $100bn economy. They hated and insulted me for it, calling me all kinds of names. Now the shitt has hit the fan and ordinary Kenyans are crying.

rvp2018:
Kenya has survived for all these years without minerals.
We use our human capital - which is better than natural resources.
A country cannot develop with minerals going up and down.
That is just like a drug addict - one minute high - the next minute miserable.
It's now called Nigeria Natural Resource Curse.
Kenya I am happy we dont have minerals - so we can build the most important resources - HUMAN CAPITAL.
We already have Africa best HCI - capturing 58% of human potential - and we are making progress

But even with all your mouth, Kenya is still not a giant in manufacturing of finished goods or even export of services. South Africa is by far number one in that aspect in Africa (and even they are lagging behind seriously compared to Asia and Europe) followed by Morocco and Nigeria.

So we know that Kenya is not at the standard of Europe yet or Japan in terms of human capital so maybe the little resources you have may help if you make use of them while you build Human capital to the extent where it sustains the economy.

I looked at the record and apart from probably Morocco(but on a very small scale), more than 60% of the exports of all African countries are largely raw materials. South Africa is the most diversified economy in terms of manufacturing of finished goods but it is still resource dependent to an extent compared to Morocco with a smaller economy.

You clearly dont understand what development is or what human capital investment mean.
It doesnt mean you become a manufacturing giant (most of them export led manufacturing is only possible when there is excess labour)
It basically mean people are able to live better lives - well fed, well educated, healthy, prosperous, enjoying all the quality of life amenities like paved roads, piped water, constant electricity, great broadband connections, cable or sat tv, name them - and these are now possible in most part of kenya - including very deep in villages, good schools for kids, great enviroment, thriving economy that support small business or generate jobs.

Let me give example of what to prosper mean (kenya counties are smaller states - nigeriaspeak)

Demographic data from the 2019 Census points to some findings worth noting. I will share a number of findings in this platform, and today I focus on Nyeri County which seems to be very favorable to the GIRL CHILD.
Women in Nyeri live longer than women from any other county in the country, and also significantly longer than males in any part of the country. If Nyeri was a country in Africa, it would have the 2nd highest women life expectancy! Wow!
The life expectancy at birth among women in Nyeri was estimated as 75.8 years, which was 3 years longer than women in Kiambu County who recorded the 2nd highest life expectancy at birth; and even 9 years longer than the national expectancy rate among women
Tana River recorded the lowest life expectancy at birth among women at 58.6 years, which is nearly 18 years lesser than in Nyeri County
Interestingly, women in Nyeri also live on average 9.4 years older than their males’ counterparts in the same county whose life expectancy at birth was 66.4 years. Interesting!!
Now, when life expectancy is measured at 60 years, women in Nyeri live on average for 22.2 years more (hence likely to hit 82 years), the highest in the country; and 6 years longer than their male counterparts who live on average 16 years
Shifting to another indicator called Maternal Mortality Ratio (MMR) which is the number of women who die from pregnancy-related causes or within 42 days of pregnancy termination per 100,000 live births
Now, MMR in Nyeri is estimated as 67 per 100,000 live births, meaning that for every 100,000 live births in the county, only about 67 maternal deaths are recorded; and this is lowest nationally and is within the recommended Sustainable Development Goal 3 target of less than 70 maternal deaths per 100,000 live births (the only county where this indicator is within the SDG target).
Let me try to simplify this!
Nyeri’s Crude Birth Rate (number of live births per 1,000 midyear population) is estimated as 20.8, and with a population of 760,000; then, the number of annual births in the county is about 15,000!
With an MMR of 67 per 100,000 live births, then it simply means that it will take SEVEN years to record about 67 maternal deaths! Or, the county records about 10 maternal deaths annually!
Kiambu has the 2nd lowest MMR, and it’s estimate was 171 per 100,000 which is more than double Nyeri’s estimate, or simply put, a woman in Kiambu is twice likely to die during pregnancy and/or child birth than a woman in Nyeri.
Garissa has the highest MMR of 641 per 100,000 which is nearly 10 times more than in Nyeri; or, a woman in Garissa is nearly 10 times likely to die from pregnancy and/or child birth related complications than in Nyeri
While the national Total Fertility Rate (average number of births per woman) is estimated as 3.4; Nyeri’s estimate is 2.9 which is among the lowest nationally.
Additionally, the infant mortality rate in Nyeri is estimated as 28.3 per 1,000 live births and is among the lowest nationally, while the Under-5 Mortality Rate is 41.5 per 1,000 live births again the 8th lowest nationally.
The above quality of life among women in Nyeri could be attributed to multiple factors including; improved health care.
Nyeri County has the highest concentration of health facilities in relation to any other county nationally
As of 2020 (based on MoH Database of Health Facilities), Nyeri County had about 423 health facilities (private and public), with each facility serving an average catchment population of 1,795 people (lowest nationally).
Although the county is ideally supposed to have 8 Level 4 Hospitals (a level 4 hospital serves a catchment population of 100,000 people), Nyeri has a total of 13 Level 4 (and above) health facilities including Nyeri PGH, Karatina DH, Othaya Level 4, Othaya Level 6, Mukurwe-ini Hospital, Consolata Hospital (Mathari), Tumutumu PCEA Hospital etc. Of the 13 Level 4 (+) hospitals, 6 are Public
Nyeri County further has 5th highest number of hospital beds just behind Nairobi, Kiambu, Nakuru and Kakamega Counties.
In addition, looking at the Human Resource, Nyeri has the 2nd highest concentration of CORE HEALTH WORKERS nationally. On average, in 2020 there were 31 core health workers per 10,000 people which had doubled in relation to 2012; and more than double the national average of 15

GeneralDae:

But even with all your mouth, Kenya is still not a giant in manufacturing of finished goods or even export of services. South Africa is by far number one in that aspect in Africa (and even they are lagging behind seriously compared to Asia and Europe) followed by Morocco and Nigeria.

So we know that Kenya is not at the standard of Europe yet or Japan in terms of human capital so maybe the little resources you have may help if you make use of them while you build Human capital to the extent where it sustains the economy.

I looked at the record and apart from probably Morocco(but on a very small scale), more than 60% of the exports of all African countries are largely raw materials. South Africa is the most diversified economy in terms of manufacturing of finished goods but it is still resource dependent to an extent compared to Morocco with a smaller economy.

rvp2018:
Kenya has survived for all these years without minerals.
We use our human capital - which is better than natural resources.
A country cannot develop with minerals going up and down.
That is just like a drug addict - one minute high - the next minute miserable.
It's now called Nigeria Natural Resource Curse.
Kenya I am happy we dont have minerals - so we can build the most important resources - HUMAN CAPITAL.
We already have Africa best HCI - capturing 58% of human potential - and we are making progress

You clearly don't understand how the world works.
Russia and its leaders can afford to do most of the crazy and costly things they do because of the abundance of mineral resources. Right now, they're holding the whole of Europea by the balls because of oil and gas.

Nigeria was able to survive the global recession of 2008 because of oil. Now, crude oil prices have skyrocketed again and fuel scarcity is killing most African countries. Nigeria is sailing through because we are an oil giant. We had fuel queues this year because petrol with high methanol content was imported by spurious dealers. By the time all our private refineries start operating, hopefully this year fuel crisis will become a thing of the past in Nigeria. Remember, one of those refineries is one of the largest in the world.

Kenya does not have a refinery and is not economically stable enough to build one. Nigeria's economy is getting more diversified everyday with sectors like services, fintech, retailing and real estate. So, in a nutshell Kenya will continue to lag behind Nigeria.

Just40:
Exactly so, a country with almost the population of SA and yet it people are completely not economically productive to sustain their economy such that even if the government messes up, they can keep it going.

They've left it to the indians who will immediately run back to India at the first sign of trouble.

That's it.
And what's worse, kenyatta has borrowed against the future of Kenyans to put up a few shiny infrastructure. Like that road they keep posting here. Now the country is broke.

obaaderemi:
That's it.
And what's worse, kenyatta has borrowed against the future of Kenyans to put up a few shiny infrastructure. Like that road they keep posting here. Now the country is broke.

yeah

It is bad to put all your eggs into one basket but it is even worse to eat all of your future eggs.

rvp2018:
You clearly dont understand what development is or what human capital investment mean.
It doesnt mean you become a manufacturing giant (most of them export led manufacturing is only possible when there is excess labour)
It basically mean people are able to live better lives - well fed, well educated, healthy, prosperous, enjoying all the quality of life amenities like paved roads, piped water, constant electricity, great broadband connections, cable or sat tv, name them - and these are now possible in most part of kenya - including very deep in villages, good schools for kids, great enviroment, thriving economy that support small business or generate jobs.

Let me give example of what to prosper mean (kenya counties are smaller states - nigeriaspeak)

Demographic data from the 2019 Census points to some findings worth noting. I will share a number of findings in this platform, and today I focus on Nyeri County which seems to be very favorable to the GIRL CHILD.
Women in Nyeri live longer than women from any other county in the country, and also significantly longer than males in any part of the country. If Nyeri was a country in Africa, it would have the 2nd highest women life expectancy! Wow!
The life expectancy at birth among women in Nyeri was estimated as 75.8 years, which was 3 years longer than women in Kiambu County who recorded the 2nd highest life expectancy at birth; and even 9 years longer than the national expectancy rate among women
Tana River recorded the lowest life expectancy at birth among women at 58.6 years, which is nearly 18 years lesser than in Nyeri County
Interestingly, women in Nyeri also live on average 9.4 years older than their males’ counterparts in the same county whose life expectancy at birth was 66.4 years. Interesting!!
Now, when life expectancy is measured at 60 years, women in Nyeri live on average for 22.2 years more (hence likely to hit 82 years), the highest in the country; and 6 years longer than their male counterparts who live on average 16 years
Shifting to another indicator called Maternal Mortality Ratio (MMR) which is the number of women who die from pregnancy-related causes or within 42 days of pregnancy termination per 100,000 live births
Now, MMR in Nyeri is estimated as 67 per 100,000 live births, meaning that for every 100,000 live births in the county, only about 67 maternal deaths are recorded; and this is lowest nationally and is within the recommended Sustainable Development Goal 3 target of less than 70 maternal deaths per 100,000 live births (the only county where this indicator is within the SDG target).
Let me try to simplify this!
Nyeri’s Crude Birth Rate (number of live births per 1,000 midyear population) is estimated as 20.8, and with a population of 760,000; then, the number of annual births in the county is about 15,000!
With an MMR of 67 per 100,000 live births, then it simply means that it will take SEVEN years to record about 67 maternal deaths! Or, the county records about 10 maternal deaths annually!
Kiambu has the 2nd lowest MMR, and it’s estimate was 171 per 100,000 which is more than double Nyeri’s estimate, or simply put, a woman in Kiambu is twice likely to die during pregnancy and/or child birth than a woman in Nyeri.
Garissa has the highest MMR of 641 per 100,000 which is nearly 10 times more than in Nyeri; or, a woman in Garissa is nearly 10 times likely to die from pregnancy and/or child birth related complications than in Nyeri
While the national Total Fertility Rate (average number of births per woman) is estimated as 3.4; Nyeri’s estimate is 2.9 which is among the lowest nationally.
Additionally, the infant mortality rate in Nyeri is estimated as 28.3 per 1,000 live births and is among the lowest nationally, while the Under-5 Mortality Rate is 41.5 per 1,000 live births again the 8th lowest nationally.
The above quality of life among women in Nyeri could be attributed to multiple factors including; improved health care.
Nyeri County has the highest concentration of health facilities in relation to any other county nationally
As of 2020 (based on MoH Database of Health Facilities), Nyeri County had about 423 health facilities (private and public), with each facility serving an average catchment population of 1,795 people (lowest nationally).
Although the county is ideally supposed to have 8 Level 4 Hospitals (a level 4 hospital serves a catchment population of 100,000 people), Nyeri has a total of 13 Level 4 (and above) health facilities including Nyeri PGH, Karatina DH, Othaya Level 4, Othaya Level 6, Mukurwe-ini Hospital, Consolata Hospital (Mathari), Tumutumu PCEA Hospital etc. Of the 13 Level 4 (+) hospitals, 6 are Public
Nyeri County further has 5th highest number of hospital beds just behind Nairobi, Kiambu, Nakuru and Kakamega Counties.
In addition, looking at the Human Resource, Nyeri has the 2nd highest concentration of CORE HEALTH WORKERS nationally. On average, in 2020 there were 31 core health workers per 10,000 people which had doubled in relation to 2012; and more than double the national average of 15

Well we clearly have different ideas on what a country needs to be developed. All of these things you have mentioned are good and fancy but are they sustainable with Kenya's development? For me, development is first and foremost about being economically sustainable where:

" We ourselves (black indigenous Nigerians, Kenyans, Ghanians, Tanzanians, SouthAfricans) grow 70% of what we consume ( or at least have indigenous options), and consume 70% what we grow and that finally we can export these indigenous goods and services in large numbers.

Those things you mentioned above that bring luxury, Kenya and the majority of African countries do not have big African indigenous options yet ( e.g indigenous companies that can build more of these facilities across the country to prevent Kenya from further high debts), but some African countries are doing better in these aspects than others. If we have not developed to the extent of having great indigenous manufacturing companies ( a mix of indigenous private and Government investments), then we are not there yet and only resources can save the economy.

For me, the solution to Africa's problems is that we start training our people to produce replicas of everything the white man has brought to us and we support their investments to be big options in our countries as well.

Kenya does not have a refinery as it is not viable, we are not a oil rich nation.

Nigeria is exporting crude for decades and how many refineries do you guys have? Dangote is making the first one in now. That tells us we Kenyans are much better at planning and execution then nigerians.

I tell you why, You had Oil but did nothing. we had geothermal and Kenya is the proud nation that is making 30% of its electricity from that clean source. By 2024 Kenya will be the number one in geothermal energy.

obaaderemi:
You clearly don't understand how the world works.
Russia and its leaders can afford to do most of the crazy and costly things they do because of the abundance of mineral resources. Right now, they're holding the whole of Europea by the balls because of oil and gas.

Nigeria was able to survive the global recession of 2008 because of oil. Now, crude oil prices have skyrocketed again and fuel scarcity is killing most African countries. Nigeria is sailing through because we are an oil giant. We had fuel queues this year because petrol with high methanol content was imported by spurious dealers. By the time all our private refineries start operating, hopefully this year fuel crisis will become a thing of the past in Nigeria. Remember, one of those refineries is one of the largest in the world.

Kenya does not have a refinery and is not economically stable enough to build one. Nigeria's economy is getting more diversified everyday with sectors like services, fintech, retailing and real estate. So, in a nutshell Kenya will continue to lag behind Nigeria.

rationalhuman:
Kenya does not have a refinery as it is not viable, we are not a oil rich nation.

Nigeria is exporting crude for decades and how many refineries do you guys have? Dangote is making the first one in now. That tells us we Kenyans are much better at planning and execution then nigerians.

I tell you why, You had Oil but did nothing. we had geothermal and Kenya is the proud nation that is making 30% of its electricity from that clean source. By 2024 Kenya will be the number one in geothermal energy.

Nigeria has four refineries. Nigeria has had four refineries since 1979. We only started importing crude in the early 1990's during the military Government and it worsened in the mid 2000's. It was sabotage and corruption. Some people purposefully ensured the refineries didn't work well enough so that they can export crude instead and importing was also big business to some.
All four refineries of Nigeria together (even without the Dangote refinery) can produce 445000 barrels a day which is more than enough, because Nigeria's consumption is 340,000 barrels a day.
The problem Nigeria has at the moment, is that most of our major investments were last made in the 1970's, so in 2024, Nigeria would definitely be a much much stronger economy as well if we get the investments right.

I am not suprised that you picked Russia. A third world country with nuclear weapons. Very few countries develop using natural resources. Those that have developed and that kenya want to follow do not have any natural resources - you can majority of Asian Tigers - most of Western Europe. What those countries do - they invest in their people - they educate them, they feed them better, they have less kids - and those people can then buy natural resouces from Nigeria or Russia - add value - and get more money. Look at you oil - India that doesnt have any oil - buy them cheap - refine them - and re-sell them.

Now let move to Kenya - apart from last month of madness - we have always nailed the oil sector - and re-export oil worth 2B dollars. How do we do this - we have cornered the logistics of the downstream oil business. We have 2nd most functional downstream oil pipeline, we had refinery that is now a storage, and we have huge storage tanks - that allows us to re-export oil and it's by products from Kenya to Uganda, DRC, Rwanda, Congo, South Sudan, Ethiopia, Malawi, Zambia and even down to Moz. Kenya oil downstream companies are selling fuel in those countries.

So you see having natural resources is NOTHING to shout about. Human brains is more important - making sure you build modern economy that is not based on natural resources critical.

You're talking about 2008 - Kenya has breezed through all sort of global crisis without any worry - because we have resilient diversified NON mineral economy.

We have built africa largest non-mineral economy by investing in HCI. And Nigeria has world WORST
Did you know that Kenya's HCI is the 2nd HIGHEST IN AFRICA at 0.56? Mauritius leads at 0.64.

Nigeria has one of the lowest HCIs in the world at just 0.33 (same as Angola).

Rwanda's HCI of 0.36 is higher than Eswatini (the latter's GDP per capita is 4-5 times greater).

And really the only non-mineral investment you're now shouting about - so called FinTech/ICT - is mainly driven by diaspora Nigerians returning home - this not homegrown HCI.

obaaderemi:
You clearly don't understand how the world works.
Russia and its leaders can afford to do most of the crazy and costly things they do because of the abundance of mineral resources. Right now, they're holding the whole of Europea by the balls because of oil and gas.

Nigeria was able to survive the global recession of 2008 because of oil. Now, crude oil prices have skyrocketed again and fuel scarcity is killing most African countries. Nigeria is sailing through because we are an oil giant. We had fuel queues this year because petrol with high methanol content was imported by spurious dealers. By the time all our private refineries start operating, hopefully this year fuel crisis will become a thing of the past in Nigeria. Remember, one of those refineries is one of the largest in the world.

Kenya does not have a refinery and is not economically stable enough to build one. Nigeria's economy is getting more diversified everyday with sectors like services, fintech, retailing and real estate. So, in a nutshell Kenya will continue to lag behind Nigeria.

How do you plan to beat India and likes of South Korea very efficient refineries? You'll likely be buying very expensive oil. Kenya we had a refinery until 10yrs ago but it more expensive to buy kenya refined oil than import refined oil.

Dangote has built a refinery in Lagos - and will have to ship the crude oil from south east - and you can bet his refined oil will be more expensive that oil that land in Lagos.

And of course because you've total inefficient downstream business - by the time - oil snake itself from Dangote refinery in Lekki to your petrol station - it will have incurred days if not months of transport and storage.

In short you cannot beat Indians in refinery business - focus on building the internal downstream infrastructure.

GeneralDae:

Nigeria has four refineries. Nigeria has had four refineries since 1979. We only started importing crude in the early 1990's during the military Government and it worsened in the mid 2000's. It was sabotage and corruption. Some people purposefully ensured the refineries didn't work well enough so that they can export crude instead and importing was also big business to some.
All four refineries of Nigeria together (even without the Dangote refinery) can produce 445000 barrels a day which is more than enough, because Nigeria's consumption is 340,000 barrels a day.
The problem Nigeria has at the moment, is that most of our major investments were last made in the 1970's, so in 2024, Nigeria would definitely be a much much stronger economy as well if we get the investments right.

This most nonsensical post of the day.
The economy is not just manufacturing - it's the entire spectrum of economic activities - from agriculture, education, healthcare, transport, construction, real estate, hotels & accommodation, retail & wholesales, trading,
A country that develop sustainably does so by developing all these sectors - they diverse their economy.
So that if you get a problem in agriculture (say drought or disease) then retail & wholesale will sustain you.
If you have problem with tourism (due to covid-19) - the other sectors can sustain you.
Of course manufacturing is very important - because it's highest multiplier (of 10) - meaning one manufacturing job will create 10 jobs
And to get manufacturing working - you need basic of electricity (cheap), roads & railways, and of capital (investment).
Countries that have pursued what you're suggesting - import substitution (replacing imports with domestic goods) have not gone anywhere.
In fact those that had contrary thoughts - export led manufacturing - are the ones that have developed.
That seek first to manufacture and export - to rich countries - use the money you get from export to develop - and grow economy
Once you're rich - then you can manufacture for domestic economy.
If you start from manufacturing for your local economy - who will buy those things - yet people are POOR?
The same for food - dont grow flowers - grow yams.
But if people are poor - who will afford your yams? It's better if we grow flowers, get the dollars, use it to buy yams from you.
In short Africa countries should follow beaten path - that South Asians have proven - export led manufacturing.
Manufacture these stuff you dont need that people out there need first- for example Veitnam are making 12B dollars manufacturing bicyles for export.We dont biycle in Africa - but Europe need bicyles - and they are paying money for it. We surely can build bicyles.
From the proceeds of exports - grow your local economy until the time people are rich enough - to afford manufactured goods.
Import substitution FAILED in 1980s in Africa.
Stupid Nigeria and Ghana now are REPEATING THE SAME MISTAKES.
Nigeria and West Africa with excess labour should be doing what Veitnam and Bangladesh are doing now - export led manufacturing.
Kenya too is not seriously engaged in this....and we know have about 15M idle labour force that should be manufacturing things for export.

GeneralDae:

Well we clearly have different ideas on what a country needs to be developed. All of these things you have mentioned are good and fancy but are they sustainable with Kenya's development? For me, development is first and foremost about being economically sustainable where:

" We ourselves (black indigenous Nigerians, Kenyans, Ghanians, Tanzanians, SouthAfricans) grow 70% of what we consume ( or at least have indigenous options), and consume 70% what we grow and that finally we can export these indigenous goods and services in large numbers.

Those things you mentioned above that bring luxury, Kenya and the majority of African countries do not have big African indigenous options yet ( e.g indigenous companies that can build more of these facilities across the country to prevent Kenya from further high debts), but some African countries are doing better in these aspects than others. If we have not developed to the extent of having great indigenous manufacturing companies ( a mix of indigenous private and Government investments), then we are not there yet and only resources can save the economy.

For me, the solution to Africa's problems is that we start training our people to produce replicas of everything the white man has brought to us and we support their investments to be big options in our countries as well.

rvp2018:
This most nonsensical post of the day.
The economy is not just manufacturing - it's the entire spectrum of economic activities - from agriculture, education, healthcare, transport, construction, real estate, hotels & accommodation, retail & wholesales, trading,
A country that develop sustainably does so by developing all these sectors - they diverse their economy.
So that if you get a problem in agriculture (say drought or disease) then retail & wholesale will sustain you.
If you have problem with tourism (due to covid-19) - the other sectors can sustain you.
Of course manufacturing is very important - because it's highest multiplier (of 10) - meaning one manufacturing job will create 10 jobs
And to get manufacturing working - you need basic of electricity (cheap), roads & railways, and of capital (investment).
Countries that have pursued what you're suggesting - import substitution (replacing imports with domestic goods) have not gone anywhere.
In fact those that had contrary thoughts - export led manufacturing - are the ones that have developed.
That seek first to manufacture and export - to rich countries - use the money you get from export to develop - and grow economy
Once you're rich - then you can manufacture for domestic economy.
If you start from manufacturing for your local economy - who will buy those things - yet people are POOR?
The same for food - dont grow flowers - grow yams.
But if people are poor - who will afford your yams? It's better if we grow flowers, get the dollars, use it to buy yams from you.
In short Africa countries should follow beaten path - that South Asians have proven - export led manufacturing.
Manufacture these stuff you dont need that people out there need first- for example Veitnam are making 12B dollars manufacturing bicyles for export.We dont biycle in Africa - but Europe need bicyles - and they are paying money for it. We surely can build bicyles.
From the proceeds of exports - grow your local economy until the time people are rich enough - to afford manufactured goods.
Import substitution FAILED in 1980s in Africa.
Stupid Nigeria and Ghana now are REPEATING THE SAME MISTAKES.
Nigeria and West Africa with excess labour should be doing what Veitnam and Bangladesh are doing now - export led manufacturing.
Kenya too is not seriously engaged in this....and we know have about 15M idle labour force that should be manufacturing things for export.

One of the most sensible post you've ever made in your life. I agree, and I am happy you know Kenya is also not doing enough in terms of export led manufacturing. Only Morocco and South Africa seem to be making baby steps long enough in that aspect at the moment.

I am hoping with new gov - we will change the story. Lamu SEZ should be a priority. Export led manufacturing ideally located at sea - with special economic zones like China did in Shezhen. Kenya LAMU's now with Africa deepest sea port can be our Shezhen. Shenzhen is where China's dramatic economic transformation started. Mombasa Dongo Kundu Free port also should be priority - we need to get Japanase to build it. Those two - can provide millions of jobs, billions of exports and Kenya will move to the next step.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZuXGIQUOiGo

GeneralDae:

One of the most sensible post you've ever made in your life. I agree, and I am happy you know Kenya is also not doing enough in terms of export led manufacturing. Only Morocco and South Africa seem to be making baby steps long enough at the moment.

rvp2018:
This most nonsensical post of the day.
The economy is not just manufacturing - it's the entire spectrum of economic activities - from agriculture, education, healthcare, transport, construction, real estate, hotels & accommodation, retail & wholesales, trading,
A country that develop sustainably does so by developing all these sectors - they diverse their economy.
So that if you get a problem in agriculture (say drought or disease) then retail & wholesale will sustain you.
If you have problem with tourism (due to covid-19) - the other sectors can sustain you.
Of course manufacturing is very important - because it's highest multiplier (of 10) - meaning one manufacturing job will create 10 jobs
And to get manufacturing working - you need basic of electricity (cheap), roads & railways, and of capital (investment).
Countries that have pursued what you're suggesting - import substitution (replacing imports with domestic goods) have not gone anywhere.
In fact those that had contrary thoughts - export led manufacturing - are the ones that have developed.
That seek first to manufacture and export - to rich countries - use the money you get from export to develop - and grow economy
Once you're rich - then you can manufacture for domestic economy.
If you start from manufacturing for your local economy - who will buy those things - yet people are POOR?
The same for food - dont grow flowers - grow yams.
But if people are poor - who will afford your yams? It's better if we grow flowers, get the dollars, use it to buy yams from you.
In short Africa countries should follow beaten path - that South Asians have proven - export led manufacturing.
Manufacture these stuff you dont need that people out there need first- for example Veitnam are making 12B dollars manufacturing bicyles for export.We dont biycle in Africa - but Europe need bicyles - and they are paying money for it. We surely can build bicyles.
From the proceeds of exports - grow your local economy until the time people are rich enough - to afford manufactured goods.
Import substitution FAILED in 1980s in Africa.
Stupid Nigeria and Ghana now are REPEATING THE SAME MISTAKES.
Nigeria and West Africa with excess labour should be doing what Veitnam and Bangladesh are doing now - export led manufacturing.
Kenya too is not seriously engaged in this....and we know have about 15M idle labour force that should be manufacturing things for export.

important substitution succeeded in both Ghana, Nigeria and Ivory Coast.... Don't continue acting stupid for your country lack of manufacturing capacity.

Majority of the goods consumed in these 3 countries are made within their own country.

Because your country has failed massively and without the manufacturing capacity explains why your unemployment is so high.

Usual madness. Ghana manufacturing is 10 times less than Kenya. 0.7B dollars versus 7B dollars as of 2020.

Just40:
important substitution succeeded in both Ghana, Nigeria and Ivory Coast.... Don't continue acting stupid for your country lack of manufacturing capacity.

Majority of the goods consumed in these 3 countries are made within their own country.

Because your country has failed massively and without the manufacturing capacity explains why your unemployment is so high.

rvp2018:
Usual madness.

Just say you don't know shit, so you can't stop posting like a lunatic.

rvp2018:
Usual madness.

Just say you don't know shit, so you can't stop posting like a lunatic.

If you check these 3 countries, their import bill has consistently dropped over the last 10 years and in some cases , the rate of import has decreased.

The largest manufacturing bases in absolute terms can be found in Nigeria and South Africa, followed by Kenya, Democratic Republic of Congo, Côte d’Ivoire, Ethiopia and Tanzania
https://set.odi.org/wp-content/uploads/2018/06/Manufacturing-in-Africa-Factors-for-Success_June-2018.pdf

Just40:
Just say you don't know shit, so you can't stop posting like a lunatic.

Reducing import bill is not neccesarily a good thing.
Kenya doesnt import a lot of finished goods but imports will continue to grow.
You can expect we will continue to imports lots of machinery, refined oil, cooking oil, cars and equipment.
Why would we reduce that? China continues to grow it imports and exports. This what a growing country does.

Just40:

If you check these 3 countries, their import bill has consistently dropped over the last 10 years and in some cases , the rate of import has decreased.

Just40:
come to reality and you will understand simple things.


But first, you must get an education so you'll be able to contribute to intellectual discussion

No education is required to distinguish wits from lunatics.

You might be educated but not well learned. The moment you get the gist of this difference the better.

Fastest growing companies in Africa.

rvp2018:
You clearly dont understand what development is or what human capital investment mean.
It doesnt mean you become a manufacturing giant (most of them export led manufacturing is only possible when there is excess labour)
It basically mean people are able to live better lives - well fed, well educated, healthy, prosperous, enjoying all the quality of life amenities like paved roads, piped water, constant electricity, great broadband connections, cable or sat tv, name them - and these are now possible in most part of kenya - including very deep in villages, good schools for kids, great enviroment, thriving economy that support small business or generate jobs.

Let me give example of what to prosper mean (kenya counties are smaller states - nigeriaspeak)

Demographic data from the 2019 Census points to some findings worth noting. I will share a number of findings in this platform, and today I focus on Nyeri County which seems to be very favorable to the GIRL CHILD.
Women in Nyeri live longer than women from any other county in the country, and also significantly longer than males in any part of the country. If Nyeri was a country in Africa, it would have the 2nd highest women life expectancy! Wow!
The life expectancy at birth among women in Nyeri was estimated as 75.8 years, which was 3 years longer than women in Kiambu County who recorded the 2nd highest life expectancy at birth; and even 9 years longer than the national expectancy rate among women
Tana River recorded the lowest life expectancy at birth among women at 58.6 years, which is nearly 18 years lesser than in Nyeri County
Interestingly, women in Nyeri also live on average 9.4 years older than their males’ counterparts in the same county whose life expectancy at birth was 66.4 years. Interesting!!
Now, when life expectancy is measured at 60 years, women in Nyeri live on average for 22.2 years more (hence likely to hit 82 years), the highest in the country; and 6 years longer than their male counterparts who live on average 16 years
Shifting to another indicator called Maternal Mortality Ratio (MMR) which is the number of women who die from pregnancy-related causes or within 42 days of pregnancy termination per 100,000 live births
Now, MMR in Nyeri is estimated as 67 per 100,000 live births, meaning that for every 100,000 live births in the county, only about 67 maternal deaths are recorded; and this is lowest nationally and is within the recommended Sustainable Development Goal 3 target of less than 70 maternal deaths per 100,000 live births (the only county where this indicator is within the SDG target).
Let me try to simplify this!
Nyeri’s Crude Birth Rate (number of live births per 1,000 midyear population) is estimated as 20.8, and with a population of 760,000; then, the number of annual births in the county is about 15,000!
With an MMR of 67 per 100,000 live births, then it simply means that it will take SEVEN years to record about 67 maternal deaths! Or, the county records about 10 maternal deaths annually!
Kiambu has the 2nd lowest MMR, and it’s estimate was 171 per 100,000 which is more than double Nyeri’s estimate, or simply put, a woman in Kiambu is twice likely to die during pregnancy and/or child birth than a woman in Nyeri.
Garissa has the highest MMR of 641 per 100,000 which is nearly 10 times more than in Nyeri; or, a woman in Garissa is nearly 10 times likely to die from pregnancy and/or child birth related complications than in Nyeri
While the national Total Fertility Rate (average number of births per woman) is estimated as 3.4; Nyeri’s estimate is 2.9 which is among the lowest nationally.
Additionally, the infant mortality rate in Nyeri is estimated as 28.3 per 1,000 live births and is among the lowest nationally, while the Under-5 Mortality Rate is 41.5 per 1,000 live births again the 8th lowest nationally.
The above quality of life among women in Nyeri could be attributed to multiple factors including; improved health care.
Nyeri County has the highest concentration of health facilities in relation to any other county nationally
As of 2020 (based on MoH Database of Health Facilities), Nyeri County had about 423 health facilities (private and public), with each facility serving an average catchment population of 1,795 people (lowest nationally).
Although the county is ideally supposed to have 8 Level 4 Hospitals (a level 4 hospital serves a catchment population of 100,000 people), Nyeri has a total of 13 Level 4 (and above) health facilities including Nyeri PGH, Karatina DH, Othaya Level 4, Othaya Level 6, Mukurwe-ini Hospital, Consolata Hospital (Mathari), Tumutumu PCEA Hospital etc. Of the 13 Level 4 (+) hospitals, 6 are Public
Nyeri County further has 5th highest number of hospital beds just behind Nairobi, Kiambu, Nakuru and Kakamega Counties.
In addition, looking at the Human Resource, Nyeri has the 2nd highest concentration of CORE HEALTH WORKERS nationally. On average, in 2020 there were 31 core health workers per 10,000 people which had doubled in relation to 2012; and more than double the national average of 15

Mzee,thanks for this! Even though the target audience of Sakawa boys and Okadamen will just grin and screech their usual incantations even louder some of us are here such data. Ofc,more,much more needs to be done but the biggest takeaway is we're getting there.

rvp2018:
Madness. Learn to support your argument with empirical data.
Understand the difference btw Total Revenue and taxes (ordinary revenues).
They are not the same.
Taxes are 17B - but we A-I-A (other revenues) that is about 3B.
Appropriation-in-Aid or other revenues - include user fees, licensing, dividends, court fines - collected by gov agencies and regulators.
Total 21B.
Ghana revenues are not even 10B. It's total budget is 17B.

Dude is a ranting machine - with zero brain cells. I was wondering what the heck is he on about. The Hobbit doesn't even understand the fundamentals of taxation and he's here acting smart.

Shma:


No education is required to distinguish wits from lunatics.

You might be educated but not well learned. The moment you get the gist of this difference the better.

As usual... Doesn't contribute anything substantial and just the usual dumb twits comment