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Stats: 2,711,739 members, 6,404,832 topics. Date: Monday, 26 July 2021 at 05:13 AM
|Re: Africans Were The First People Of The Ancient Americas by morpheus24: 4:46pm On Feb 18, 2019|
Let's be clear on your above statement. You are correct in your assertion however what must be made clear is that these migrations started 150,000 to 200,000 years ago so the "Africans" you are referring to may have not looked liked or shared the same genetic lineage as contemporary Africans today. so Contemporary Africans you see today and People outside of the continent share the same lineage or descent but one did not emanate from the other.
In other words the Africans that remained in Africa also experienced a transformative morphological change both genetically and phenotypically. What I am trying to say is that the Africans that left the continent would resemble the Africans that still live in Africa today but they are not us now both phenotypically and genetically speaking. As Africans we have evolved too over that length of time to become what we are today.
|Re: Africans Were The First People Of The Ancient Americas by NileValley: 5:01pm On Feb 18, 2019|
First of all i said Africans have nothing to do with the American continent , not Black Americans , even though they are not indigenous and don't own any land. And nobody calls the United States "The Americas" you're stupid.
If you are talking America the continent then you're spewing nonsense because how can they have linguistic influence when English is a European language and most countries on the American continent don't speak English?
And when it comes to culture Latinos have their own cultures and it's the same in the Carribean.
The genetic influence you talk about comes from Africans , not Black Americans.
Lastly , how are they propping up the African identity when they hate Africans?
|Re: Africans Were The First People Of The Ancient Americas by morpheus24: 6:13pm On Feb 18, 2019|
Laughing in Yoruba
Insults will get you no where, just state facts.
The United states is included in the definition and geographical space known as "The Americas".
If you dispute please provide evidence that speaks otherwise.
Laughing in Igbo.
African linguistic influences in the Americas specifically in "North America" English is attested to in the Gullah peoples of South Carolina.
There is also evidence of African linguistic influence in "South America" as well aka Brazilian Portugese spoken by many Afro-Brazilian groups in the country.
I don't know what you are yapping on about here but if you have a personal issue with Black Americans I am not really concerned about how much they hate Africans or not. What I am concerned about is factual information that carries a topic forward.
When Black Americans speak of their identity or influence it is inescapably intertwined and an extension of African identity, they or you for that matter cannot escape this reality no matter how much they cry about it.
|Re: Africans Were The First People Of The Ancient Americas by Amujale(m): 1:22am On Feb 19, 2019|
That is totally incorrect, most Africans have retained their genetics almost entirely intact throughout the ages as the source for what is now known as the multi-cultural world of today, God endowed the African woman with the capacity to give birth to all ethnic groups available to human kind.
|Re: Africans Were The First People Of The Ancient Americas by Amujale(m): 1:34am On Feb 19, 2019|
Without a shadow of doubt Africans are indigenous to mainland Africa, however, all and every other African community that exists outside of Africa prior to 1400 B.C.E. are said to have circumnavigate the oceans and seas in order to transport themselves.
The earliest examples are given in line with the Indigenous Americans, Indigenous Australians, Indigenous European e.t.c (not meant as a chronology rather alphabetic in order)
They circumnavigated the oceans and seas, depicted themselves similar to present mainland Africans, they described themselves the same way
All people of the world can trace their roots to African history.
Simply put, all the communities in the world are born from Africa.
The image depicts a 3D reconstruction of an early African settler in the Americas said to be 10000 years old.
|Re: Africans Were The First People Of The Ancient Americas by Amujale(m): 2:01am On Feb 19, 2019|
In antiquity, there’s evidence to suggest that during a certain point in time, all humans on our planet are African; black, brown and bronze.
Two distinct phenomenon occur simultaneously:
(1)Geological phenomena i.e. Ice Age
(2)Biological phenomena i.e African women are granted a unique special ability that allows giving birth to non-African looking offspring.
These two distinct phenomenon are said to have combined to create the environment for the new ethnic groups that would later join the African on planet Earth.
Most African communities haven’t changed their genetic make-up even after marrying outside of the continent. Naturally most Africans have over-powering genes, attributes gained and retained from their rich ancestry.
|Re: Africans Were The First People Of The Ancient Americas by Amujale(m): 2:45am On Feb 19, 2019|
The Origins Of Humanity: featuring Dr Cheikh Anta Diop (Senegalese historian, anthropologist, physicist who studied the human race’s origin and pre- colonial African culture)
|Re: Africans Were The First People Of The Ancient Americas by NileValley: 5:14am On Feb 19, 2019|
Stupidity wil get you nowhere either , only your slow ass calls the United States "the Americas" you clown and no Black Americans are not an extension of Africa at all , they are just Black Americans.
|Re: Africans Were The First People Of The Ancient Americas by morpheus24: 5:30am On Feb 19, 2019|
Amujale:1. Africa is the reservoir of Human genetics -What this means is that People who lived have the most genetic diversity between two people than amongst the larger group. The further to move from the continent the less the genetic diversity which is how scientist are able to reverse engineer how old a gene is. So yes people who live in Africa carrying the oldest genetic elements
2. African genes continued to mutate long after the first adventurers left the continent to populate the rest of the world.
3. Because someone looks like an African does not mean they still have the same genes as Contemporary Africans. Case in point the Andaman islanders and the Papua new guineans look very similar to Africans yet they are the most genetically distant to Africans. They retain the phenotypical traits of Africans which is an arbitrary attribute of humans, however they diverged so much so genetically that they very distant from contemporary Africans today. If you want to understand this more I urge you to read through several articles in the Journal of Human genetics concerning this people I have mentioned.
Amujale:I am not sure what you mean here. The contemporary African carries the oldest human mutations that exist today therefore they are usually dominant in physical expression. An African and a European child would express phenotypically more similar to the African because of the dominance of the older mutation, however nature strives for perfection in its design so even though the child expresses more as the African physically, they are a perfect 50% in genetic material from both parents so they have a perfect 50% european gene distribution as they do African.
Europeans mutations are said to be some of the most recent therefore they may have the most recessive of genetical material and will be dominated physically if they mate with people with older mutations. This is not the case 100% of the time though
|Re: Africans Were The First People Of The Ancient Americas by morpheus24: 5:39am On Feb 19, 2019|
1.Yes me and every other anthropologist,, archaeologist and paleoanthropologist.
2. No rebuttal with no evidence just more abusive language to digress away from providing any evidence of his assertion.
Ahhh the hebrew Israelites my favorite delusional gibberish ranting maniacs running around the streets spreading nonsensical diatribes about black peoples origins. So what part of their gibberish do you want me to attack first?
|Re: Africans Were The First People Of The Ancient Americas by morpheus24: 5:58am On Feb 19, 2019|
Dr Cheikh Anta Diop's works are a little old and some of it has been debunked and and updated.
|Re: Africans Were The First People Of The Ancient Americas by Nobody: 11:28am On Feb 19, 2019|
I have been reading through the majority of your posts on this thread...which have been very enlightening and appear factually accurate. I say "appears" cause I like to do personal research (on certain things which I don't know about) to confirm their accuracy.
I see, though, intelligence hasn't escaped you.
|Re: Africans Were The First People Of The Ancient Americas by morpheus24: 4:32pm On Feb 19, 2019|
You must always do your research and ascertain if what someone is saying holds any water. Debate expands ones knowledge base. I share knowledge to teach and learn at the same time.
|Re: Africans Were The First People Of The Ancient Americas by jantavanta(m): 8:07am On Feb 20, 2019|
There is nothing wrong in the indigenous Australian contribution to the population of Southern America or to the population of Japan.
There is no disconnecting Africa from the founding population of any continent.
It is still Africa populating the entire World, via land and sea, #WhenTheWorldWasBlack.
|Re: Africans Were The First People Of The Ancient Americas by Amujale(m): 11:12am On Feb 20, 2019|
Debunked by whom? And what part of his work are you referring to here?
|Re: Africans Were The First People Of The Ancient Americas by Amujale(m): 11:21am On Feb 20, 2019|
Here you state absolute facts that can never be denied.
|Re: Africans Were The First People Of The Ancient Americas by Amujale(m): 11:35am On Feb 20, 2019|
Those who argue against true African history haven’t read “They Came before Columbus” by Ivan Van Sertima or books like the “Black Athena” by Martin Bernal.
Ivan Van Sertima (Guyanese-born associate professor of African Studies); Professor Martin Gardiner Bernal (also
wrote the book Cadmean Letters, devoted to the origins of the Greek alphabet., respectively.
|Re: Africans Were The First People Of The Ancient Americas by morpheus24: 5:49pm On Feb 20, 2019|
Amujale:Dr Anta Diop challenged a lot of the Eurocentric view points on race that characterized the study of Anthropology, race in ancient Egypt and racial categories in Africa as a whole during much of the 19th century.
Though most of his studies were a welcome rebuttal to many a Eurocentric pseudo science that flew around at that time, such as the concept of the "True Negro theory" advanced by Carltoon coon and the likes, Diop died in 1986 and was not privileged to see the advancements and contributions of human genetics into the field of Anthropology. This new data debunks a good number of his ascertions about the relevance of how genetics plays into the origins of "Black African peoples" and so called "black peoples" that populate or populated the rest of the world at one time.
He was very much an anthropologist and historian at heart and discarded the genotypical contributions to the idea of the human identity for the more arbitrary social classification of humans as they interact in physical spaces.
|Re: Africans Were The First People Of The Ancient Americas by morpheus24: 5:54pm On Feb 20, 2019|
I am weary of the above language because it smells of undertones of ethnocentric and racial bias, a 16th century invention by euro-centrics to control a narrative of nature and biological diversity.
The "people" that left "Africa" are both ancestors of Modern day Africans and the rest of the populations in the world so it would be more scientifically accurate to state that "it is Homo Sapien or MAN who is populating the entire World via land and sea"
|Re: Africans Were The First People Of The Ancient Americas by Amujale(m): 2:32am On Feb 21, 2019|
In a way, Diop’s findings did not talk only about the genetics of Africans, but the genetic derivatives of the early humans and that has a huge significance.
What year is this new findings suppose to have been published? Who are the authors? What is the subject of debate specifically?
|Re: Africans Were The First People Of The Ancient Americas by NileValley: 12:03am On Feb 22, 2019|
I ddn't ask you to attack anything,stop calling non-African people Africans you sound like a fool.
|Re: Africans Were The First People Of The Ancient Americas by morpheus24: 4:23pm On Feb 22, 2019|
More insults from an infantile who has not made one iorta of sense through all his write ups.
African Americans are invariably African people both in phenotype and genotype. All African Americans cluster the closest to African peoples because the separation is a mere 500 years old, not long enough to change the genotype in A.American DNA.
In aggregate AA's are in most DNA tests expressive of 75% to 99% African in genotype.
The fool is you my friend. Go back to school you've been drinking too much of that Nile river water.
Morphues : 1
Nile Valley Infant: 0 points
|Re: Africans Were The First People Of The Ancient Americas by morpheus24: 4:36pm On Feb 22, 2019|
I don't understand what you mean in the bolded part. Please elaborate.
You are going to make me dig through my journals now to find this for you but I will. A note to you, Anta Diop was not a very conventional scholar so in other words he did not publish his works for peer review as he was suspect of the methodologies of those who were supposed to review and critic his works but there are critics on his writings.
|Re: Africans Were The First People Of The Ancient Americas by Amujale(m): 8:27pm On Feb 22, 2019|
In a way, Diop’s findings did not talk only about the genetics of Africans, but the genetic derivatives of the early humans and that has a huge significance.
I think it’s self explanatory if you read into Diop’s works. He derives from his scientific conclusions the fact that the early humans (Africans) has all the building blocks of the genes present in the world today.
And? What is the precise point you are trying to make here. All historians are deemed by thier peers to be unconventional, most African academics take it as a compliment.
Name me one African historian that your type considers conventional? Socrates was unconventional during his time, yet he makes better sense in 2019.
Furthermore, Africans don’t need to proof our theories and hypothesis to anyone, because Africans academics in most cases are THE authority on their given course of study, e.g Dr Anta Diop
Before the likes of Anta Diop one of a team of academics that are still considered today the most qualified team ever to have been assembled to look into pre-colonial Africa, the only other studies been done into pre - colonial Africa was that of some mediocre scholars that had little or no background in archeology, anthropology or any of the earth sciences.
Even though Anta Diop and his team are considered unconventional, that is because they explored concepts and made use of genuine scientific aparatuses other academia refuse to , in time, you will find that they are rightfully considered the leading authorities.
|Re: Africans Were The First People Of The Ancient Americas by morpheus24: 9:57pm On Feb 22, 2019|
1.Most scientists are in agreement with the fact that modern humans aka Homo sapiens evolved in Africa and contributed to the genes inherited by their modern counter parts. Diop is neither the originator nor only source of this knowledge or scientific conclusion.
2. These Anatomically Modern humans that evolved in Africa possessed the building blocks that made "Modern AfricanS" and "NON African" peoples alike
3. All African people today do not have the same genetic material but have the most diverse. In other words those early Modern Humans that remained in Africa are closer to proximity to us than to NON Africans.
4. Africans today are not the same people as early or Modern Humans both phenotypically and Genotypical. We also evolved into different looking types of people as our NON African cousins. There are some African who are much closer in proximity in terms of genetics to the early humans that that older mutations and there are some that carry younger versions much like people outside of the continent.
5. The oldest recorded MTDNA_Mitrochondial DNA_ L0 passed on from daughter to daughter is found in Africa and present in the oldest known peoples in Africa, the Khoisan. The divergence continues throughout Africa with L1, L2, L3, M, N etc.
6. West and Central Africans carry the L2 frequency at the highest level which means an ancestor of Mdtna L or L0 diverged and produced the females that inhabit West and Central Africa today producing genetic variation between the two groups which sometimes can correlate to Physical attributes.
7. This phenomena is what happened as Humans migrated out of Africa. L2 to L3 then all the subclades of L to M in the middle east back to Africa againthen to N and so on.
8. These changes correlate with certain physical traits in Humans but is not necessarily the cause of the differences in the differing physical traits.
Conclusion the earliest Humans in Africa gave rise to all of us today Africans and NON Africans. The first humans very likely are more similar in appearance to what you refer to as "Black people" today but that does not mean they looked exactly like we do today. I don't know if you understand what that points to.
The point is to show that Diop did not follow conventional protocol in publishing his works that were reviewed as is required by the consensus of Most scientist. If you do no use scientific agreed upon methods then your work is outside the sphere of Journal review. It does not mean your works are not sound.
Again Diops work is a welcome addition to the anthropological and archaeological information that is available today, however as I said earlier, many of his conclusions have been debunked today, particular concerning ancient Egypt and the origins of its people.
Diops interpretation was tancient Africans (specifically the Natufians) were an African peoples who originated with customs from the interior of Africa who moved up the Nile and co-mingled with peoples and cultures from the Levant and West Asia. This is true to an extent but the DNA evidence collected from mummies and present in a number of Egyptians ( not Arabs) is in contention to this assertion.
|Re: Africans Were The First People Of The Ancient Americas by morpheus24: 10:29pm On Feb 22, 2019|
Africans are not a Monolith of phenotypes and genotypes much like every other group of peoples outside the continent and this is what Diop was trying to convey in his writings. That the suggestion that there is not a continuum of gradation of humans up to Ancient Egypt and all through the world as postulated by anthropologist and scientists of his time that separated peoples in terms of races and gave certain superior attributes to some was Ludacris and incorrect science. He has been justified in his works but again not all he wrote was correct. He mis-interpreted the complexity of the contributions of genetics by dismissing its relevance in his study of "social" interactions and
|Re: Africans Were The First People Of The Ancient Americas by morpheus24: 10:45pm On Feb 22, 2019|
|Re: Africans Were The First People Of The Ancient Americas by Amujale(m): 11:11pm On Feb 22, 2019|
Kindly stop trying to convey your warped interpretation of African academia to us. Instead provide us with the evidence of your initial claims.
|Re: Africans Were The First People Of The Ancient Americas by Amujale(m): 12:06am On Feb 23, 2019|
Most modern day scientist agree with Diop on that point.
That is just a nonsensical statement.
In my opinion that is one of greatest allegorical statements ever to make it to the publishers. The statement is true but insignificant compared to the TRUTH, which is that early humans are closer to proximity to us Africans.
According to African studies, that statement is completely and utterly false. Untrue.
Again, according to African studies, that statement is completely and utterly false. Untrue.
Another one of greatest allegorical statements ever to make it to the publishers. Try reading that back to yourself a few times and maybe you will understand my point.
Since much of the body of contents are based on floored assertions, the conclusion is deemed false. Your arguments are based on floored intelligence and anti-African rhetoric.
|Re: Africans Were The First People Of The Ancient Americas by morpheus24: 12:50am On Feb 23, 2019|
Here are summaries of Cheik Anta diops findings on Ancient Egyptian DNA that tie them Anthropologically, linguistically and genetically.
Here is genetic studies today that supercedes some of his assertions
"mtDNA Analysis of Nile River Valley Populations: A Genetic Corridor or a Barrier to Migration?"
"A Predominantly Neolithic Origin for Y-Chromosomal DNA Variation in North Africa"
You are a big boy, read through them but so you don't get confused basically what the articles refer to in relation to Anta diops analysis is that on a genetic level the origins of Egyptians and Africans by extension are far more complex that simply blood group tests and thus the designation of "Egyptians as black people"
|Re: Africans Were The First People Of The Ancient Americas by morpheus24: 1:02am On Feb 23, 2019|
That is what I just said, Diop is not the originator of that premise.
What specifically is nonsensical and why?
You are running round in circles her, what is true then insignificant then is now compared again to the TRUTH
What do you mean by according to African studies., Does the only information that you deem true come from African studies?
What is floored intelligence, there are floored points, floored information, floored conclusions but not floored intelligence.
Facts are verifiable and tested, if the conclusions are the same after repetition again and again there are factual so I don't know what you mean here.
As far as the anti African rhetoric, that's neither here nor there. If information emanates from and African, is tested and shown to be true I will accept and likewise anyone on this planet. Truth is truth no matter who it emanates from.
Maybe you are trying to explain what is know as "Confirmation bias" is science where before the experiment is conducted the person performing the test already has an intrinsic bias and taints the data with his own bias.
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