http://www.livingcog.com/b16.htm
http://www.daveandangel.com/CRN/WomenPreachers.html

Hello, I am currently researching for the truth on this subject. I have a friend who says women where called to preach and there is nothing wrong with it.

I on the other hand all my life have felt that its not right that this is stepping out of line placing herself over the man taking more authority as leaders. I now am trying to figure out where this feeling came from I thought all my life I learned it in church. but I asked my dad whom raised me and taught me all I currently know? My dad says woman also was called to preach.

Now I am confused due to these two scriptures. Romans Romans 16:1 this scripture says this woman had a postion of authority, but I take this to another person. and was informed that this is speaking to the gentiles. Therefore, during this era, the gentiles had pagan practices.

And here's the one that clearly says she is not to speak, 1 cor 13:34, The link above I found to be very interesting and strong facts leaning toward the not to preach. If anyone can provide scriptures they go by that makes it OK, please post them. I would like to read and study the scriptures.

what kind of question is this i thought it ia about the calling and not some male and female shiit if u is called by God or chosen by God who will stop u i don't think it matters wat d Bleep u look like to preach the word of God

Any one can preach. There is no problem with that. When it comes to priesthood, women should have nothing to do with it. It looks like feminists [angry ladies] think that women should do what ever men does.

Feminists, if you disagree, go figure.

Should women preach? Yes. The command to go ye is to everyone - women, men and this includes adults, youths and children

Should women preach? Yes. The command to go ye is to everyone - women, men and this includes adults, youths and children

@topic. It dpend on wat u mean by 'preach'. Is it preaching 2 d congregation of God were dia is a capable male? NO. If its 'preaching' 2 pple about d goodness of God. Then YES. D bible is very xplicit as 2 d positn of women in d church. Women r 2 learn in silence, while men wu r d head of d family r entrustd wit d responsibility of teachin in d church by CHRIST JESUS wu is also d head of d church.

I would suggest that you do a study (and/or research the Internet) of the people of Corinth at the time Paul visited.

It would show how sexually immoral and promiscuous the Corinthians were. They worshipped Aphrodite, the sex goddess. There were more than 1000 prostitutes.

Paul had written this letter specifically to the converted believers, and gave them rules that would set them apart from where they lived.

It was an extreme case for an extreme circumstance. These people needed to learn humility.

However, God is more than able to use whoever he pleases, male female or donkey.

It's unfortunate that people have taken this scripture so literally that it has caused some women to be in mental bondage. For example , the covering of the head etc

we should

woman who thuink they should should

yeah y do u think women sould not preach, women are very alowweed to preach they even do it better than some men. tey say some things wit emotions and experience expecially marital affiars. they could pass a message faster because people see tem as those who really know te home well i think they should be allowed to preac without discriminations

In the bible, it is said that male and female he created them and God does not recognise male or female. It is the african culture that discrimiantes. We enjoy western preachers who are female, so why this question in the first place?

1 Cor. 14:34 >> "Let your women keep silence in the church[b]es[/b]: for it is not permitted unto them to speak; but they are commanded to be under obedience, as also saith the law."

1 Tim. 2:11-12 >> "Let the woman learn in silence with all subjection. But I suffer not a woman to teach, nor to usurp authority over the man, but to be in silence."

God's Word applies everywhere to all Christians at all times. The idea that the Corinthian's case was a separate or extreme issue is negated by the fact that churches is in the plural - it was not just to the Corinthian church, but to the churches. Paul didn't make that a separate case, because he reminds us that what he preached in one church is what he preaches in every church where he went ["as I teach every where in every church" - I Cor. 4:17].

Women are to preach the Gospel as well as the men - Matt. 28:19-20. The sphere of this ministry is to all the world, in order that people might come to know Christ and come to be saved. This was the kind of ministry that several women mentioned in texts as in Rom. 16 engaged in. Besides, women are encouraged to pray in church just as the men pray - I Cor. 11:4-5. Older or more matured women can also teach younger women in church about handling issues pertaining to family life (Tit. 2:3-5). Children and donkeys are nowhere mentioned as teaching others in Church.

It is well to note that while men and women together share the grace of life on equal terms (I Pet. 3:7), they are not called to play the same roles in the home (Eph. 5:22-24) or in the church (1 Cor. 14:34). People who push certain ideas of women teaching in churches are closing their eyes to God's Word. Bottomline: women are not to betake themselves to teaching in church; but yes, they can preach the Gospel to the unsaved.

Ask them O. Why this question? Men and women can preach the gospel of God as far as he or she is called by the HOLY SPIRIT to do so. But for women to be priesthood please my hand no dey.

shahan, inas much as you've quoted the bible quite extensively, I beg to disagree with this.  So were women created to cook and clean sicne you talk about differentiated roles in the home and at the church?

Men and women are together in the priesthood of the New Covenant:

I Pet. 2:5 - "Ye also, as lively stones, are built up a spiritual house, an holy priesthood, to offer up spiritual sacrifices, acceptable to God by Jesus Christ." ["Ye" refers to both men and women; and the service of this priesthood is to offer spiritual sacrifices.]

I Pet. 2:9 - "But ye are a chosen generation, a royal priesthood, an holy nation, a peculiar people; that ye should shew forth the praises of him who hath called you out of darkness into his marvellous light" [again, "ye" refers to both males and females.]

Both can preach the Gospel, but women are not to usurp authority or teach.

ufanIma:

shahan, inas much as you've quoted the bible quite extensively, I beg to disagree with this. So were women created to cook and clean sicne you talk about differentiated roles in the home and at the church?

If you can quote the scriptures to show that my inputs were wrong, please do so. Cheers.

Morning All,

A very emotive issue.

When I first become a Christian, my instinctive (and most certainly “worldly”) reaction was given the greater proportion of women in the Church, they were grossly under-represented in leadership. Being a rookie, I held my peace.

However, over time and in searching the scripture, I came to essentially the same view as held by angelz and shahan above, noting the difference between preaching and teaching/having authority in church over male brethren.

I believe scripture outlines Gods heart on order and authority in the church quite clearly. It is also essential to note that order starts in the home and is then built on in the church. Families are the building block of Christian community.

The order in the home is clearly spelt out, 1 Corinthians 11:3. This order is replicated in the church, albeit on a larger scale. In light of this, the commands in 1 Timothy 2:12 and 1 Corinthians 13:34 are quite understandable.

God bless

@ Shahan

Rubbish!

When Paul said what he preached there he preaches in every church he was referring to the Gospel of Christ ,  geez!

If God did not sanction it, then we would know by the fruit.  There are many women in ministry that God has blessed and prospered.  I have personally sat under the teaching of women and the presence of God filled that place and it was awesome.  What about mighty women of God like Marilyn Hickey, Joyce Mayers ,  and what of men of God whose wives are actively involved as co pastors.  What of women even in the old testament who were Prophetesses?

Please cover yourself, your ignorance is showing.

@ trini_girl,
You dont need to term his own point rubbish.

We all understand in parts.

As to the question,
Should Women Preach, YES!
Should Women Teach, YES!

I stand to be taken on this point anytime.

Shahan, your scriptural imputs are all right.  what am not agreeing with is your inference that if women preach they are  

usurp authority or teach.

Women that are ordained as pastors are not in anyway usurping  authority - it is God's  gift that is not partial to male or female.  The gifts of the spirit and the ministerial gifts are not based on men or women.

If a women is blessed with the gift of teaching or prophesying and she is called or ordained, so must be silent because she is a woman?  I agree with TV01, our God is a God of order but he is not a male chauvinist.

Peace.

Shahan,

If you're using those scriptures that refer to women not teaching in the "church" so literally then it must mean that they shouldn't teach at all, since the church is not a building, but a people set apart for God.

Conversely if you believe church to be a building, then what you're saying is RELIGION as it has been created to be, shouldn't allow women to teach or preach in the church building, even if they have a word/revelation from God, or if their giftings are in the area of prophesying or the word of knowledge.

So in essence you're saying that they should be disobedient to the spirit of God and quench the Holy Spirit because of ignorant philosophy.  

Nonsense!

@ pataki


Please! I can express my views about his posts in any way I so choose.

It is RUBBISH!

This way of thinking only seeks to oppress women of God

Lol, @trini_girl

Nevermind the rubbish and nonsense parts of your rejoinders - I understand why you feel so. In anycase, those women you sat under can't teach you God's mind on the scriptures I quoted; they don't know its application, no vex.

Besides, I clearly delineated that women can teach in particular settings - and if that hasn't gone down well, what's the nonsense and rubbish about it?

Your understanding of the Corinthian case is appreciated, but not until you have gone through the whole epistle will you see the weakness of your assumptions. May I ask why you thought I Cor. 4:17 only meant the Gospel?

In all, many blessings for your inputs - I like the heat!

The debate rages.

The argument by trini-girl (and to a lesser degree ufanIma) while quite plausible on the face of it, is one that I find deeply flawed, for the following reasons.

The conclusion is that the scripture is not valid for us today. redundant. Pray tell, how many other portions of scripture were written with others or unique situations in mind? And are therefore also redundant and not applicable to us in this age? The NT is addressed to believers in all places for all time until the end.

It also suggests that one cannot understand scripture without an understanding of the cultural setting of the time it was written. It lends credence to the “Bible needs updating for our times” and “contextual interpretation” schools of thought, which have been largely responsible for the denial of the truth of the scriptures. Please don’t go there.

It is the same argument used by the gay-homosexual lobby in reference to the scriptures relating to same-sex relationships. It the thin end of the wedge. Again, please don’t.

Feminist arguments have no place in the body of Christ, no matter how PC they may sound.

@ufanIma,

ufanIma:

Shahan, your scriptural imputs are all right.  what am not agreeing with is your inference that if women preach they are  

usurp authority or teach.

No, that's not my inference. I didn't confuse preaching and teaching; and in clear terms I offered that women can indeed preach, but that the text in I Tim. 2:12 does not assume the role of teaching in church for women.

ufanIma:

Women that are ordained as pastors are not in anyway usurping  authority - it is God's  gift that is not partial to male or female.

It may shock you that I agree with you without risking the gist of my previous lines. The only point we should note is that many people have come a long way in traditional persuasions that a pastor is necessarily "the boss" of a local church - and that puts them in authority to be teachers. That simply misses the point. Pastors can shepherd a church in other ways without assuming roles that they are not called to perform.

So, while I agree that there are women pastors indeed according to God's Word, it still stands that women are "not to teach or usurp authority over the man as we read in I Tim. 2:12.

ufanIma:

The gifts of the spirit and the ministerial gifts are not based on men or women.

Sadly, I'm not one of those using that idea as an excuse to be blind to the roles of men and women in the church.

ufanIma:

If a women is blessed with the gift of teaching or prophesying and she is called or ordained, so must be silent because she is a woman?

Not necessarily, but until you find a verse that negates the clear Word on I Tim. 2:12, I stand on God's instruction and not men's persuasion.

ufanIma:

I agree with TV01, our God is a God of order but he is not a male chauvinist.

Lol, I don't think that the texts in my rejoinders make me a male chauvinist. If the roles are so confusing for many people, I could simply offer to quote loads of them without comments and ask that you explain them for us.

Bless.

TV01:

It also suggests that one cannot understand scripture without an understanding of the cultural setting of the time it was written. It lends credence to the “Bible needs updating for our times” and “contextual interpretation” schools of thought, which have been largely responsible for the denial of the truth of the scriptures. Please don’t go there.

It is the same argument used by the gay-homosexual lobby in reference to the scriptures relating to same-sex relationships. It the thin end of the wedge. Again, please don’t.

Grateful.

From your interpretation of 1 Cor. 14:34 "Let your women keep silence in the churches: for it is not permitted unto them to speak; but they are commanded to be under obedience, as also saith the law." it follows that women should not speak at all in the churches ( which means the body of Christ and not a church building). so please specify exactly in what setting women can teach, as you said Besides, I clearly delineated that women can teach in particular settings .

lafile:

From your interpretation of 1 Cor. 14:34 "Let your women keep silence in the churches: for it is not permitted unto them to speak; but they are commanded to be under obedience, as also saith the law." it follows that women should not speak at all in the churches ( which means the body of Christ and not a church building). so please specify exactly in what setting women can teach, as you said Besides, I clearly delineated that women can teach in particular settings .

Tit 2:3-5
"The aged women likewise, that they be in behaviour as becometh holiness, not false accusers, not given to much wine, teachers of good things; That they may teach the young women to be >>

       (a) sober, to love their husbands, to love their children,
       (b) to be discreet, chaste, keepers at home,
       (c) good, obedient to their own husbands,

that the word of God be not blasphemed."

Arrangements mine; and that's one example. Cheers.

Shahan and all other male chauvanists on this thread,

I wish there was a strong Igbo or pidgin phrase I could use to express my disgust! Help me, Im still learning

Nothing less than nauseating is the fact that matured christian men can fall prey to the deception of the enemy that even tho women can "teach" they don't know the "application"  of what the teach Haba!

Has it not been said that surely the letter kills, but the Sprit gives life.

Stop reading dead letters and subjecting them to your own intellect and pray that the spirit of God reveals truth to your error. Or be like the Pharisees and Saducees that are just given to much learning.

To usurp man's authority , let's use plain english shall we? To exercise authority or possession wrongfully over the man in the church, during a service for example. It was so in the Corinthina church.

How many times has Paul differentiated from what he opines in contrast to what God speaks. "I speak as a man, " he said.

These were guidelines he set for the church of that day, simple. Maybe in his opinion, because women were harlots before, and now received Jesus, they should change their form of dress and be more modest.

Maybe because they wore ribbons and such in their hair, and bangles on their feet, he admonished them to cover their head so that they won't be a distraction to the men in the chruch.

It does mean that a woman cannot teach because she does not know the "mind of God", how chauvanistic can you get?

Has God become like man that He now shows favour to men and not women who serve Him.

Is this room big enough for us and your egos?

I am not a feminist, and I believe that the woman has her place in marriage, and the man is the head. However, regarding service to God there is no favour, there is only equality for preaching AND teaching under the new convenant!

@ Trini girl
i agree with you that  you have to xpress urself the way you want, it doesn't mean that u should be insultive ok, i would have say that is the fruit of women praching in the church, but i reserve my comment.
shaham have backing from the scripture, i  think she is right, female should preach but must be under covering,  the men ie their husband, so female preacher preaching in their husband ministry is ok but if on their own hnm! , i think they should consult scripture. besides, whether women preach or not what is important is that the Christ is preached,
i therefore submit thus,
1. God is the God of order
2. His rules are general,
3. above all see phil. 4:8

Nothing wrong at all with women becoming preachers if they desire. They can not make a worse Job of it than their male counterparts and probably would be better.

At least your children would be safe from sexual abuse at the hands of Gay priests