otawa:

After all the measures of 911 and with father's WARNING:

This boy must have been a genius.

The string of cases highlights the difficulty, more than five years after the 9/11 Commission called for better communication between intelligence, law-enforcement and security agencies, of identifying relevant information that could stop a terrorist attack.

The Americans screwed-up big time!!!

And to think they deny entries to genuine Nigerian youths going to America to study/work makes it more disturbing.
I dunno how Farouk got them fooled but it's a disgrace America haven't really learnt their lesson.

Forget about security this security that, If God does not watch the city the watchman watchet in vain.

If the father did make a report about his son it is now left for the US authorities to investigate the dude and take action. They just swept it aside as if they don't care. Tomorrow they start harassing innocent Nigerian travellers or use it as a reason to deny them visa.

Why did he not detonate the bomb mid air? We are yet to know all and we might not know at all.

Kobojunkie:


Consider these . . . . .

a) This is not the ONLY father, disgruntled loved one, etc who has warned the US of a potential terrorist

while he may not be the ONLY father the fact that hes a prominent father and in our culture fathers rarely report their children, instead they give excuses of even fly them abroad when their wahala is too much! the US goofed, obama's statement and the homeland security guy have been alluding to this. every threat must be investigated. they should learn from this big time

~Sauron~:

And to think they deny entries to genuine Nigerian youths going to America to study/work makes it more disturbing.
I dunno how Farouk got them fooled but it's a disgrace America haven't really learnt their lesson.

lessons learnt 101. i agree with u my guy

wirinet:

I believed the father is a culpable as the son for many reasons;

1. The father must take responsibility for the up bringing of his son and he must have been brought up with radical Muslim indoctrination.

2. The father is responsible for the boy's extravagant life style, since we are not told the boy is gainfully employed, where is he getting the funding to be traveling everywhere. For him to be able to obtain a US multiple visa, his father must have provide some sort of backing for him.

3. Why did the father not warn the US embassy on the exact nature of the threat, in order words, why did he not provide actionable intelligence instead of the nebulous warning of a threat. Can you truly say that the son had confided in the father the exact nature of those threats.
You cannot blame the US for not taking the threat serious enough.

i disagree 100% with your views. he is 23 not 17. hes a grown ass man. a grown adult. if he had a motor accident killing people should his father be arrested about extravagant lifestyle i know many kids of the super rich in diaspora who spend lavishly and are very very alright. this guy clearly is an isolated incident and may he be the first and last, amen. the father couldnt have warned the US about the exact nature of the threat as you said because HE DID NOT KNOW IT it is botha communications and security disaster which could have resulted into a calamity. thank God

ladej:

while he may not be the ONLY father the fact that hes a prominent father and in our culture fathers rarely report their children, instead they give excuses of even fly them abroad when their wahala is too much! the US goofed, obama's statement and the homeland security guy have been alluding to this. every threat must be investigated. they should learn from this big time

Our Culture? Seriously, that argument is old.  We are speaking of his being reported to Americans who likely do not give a darn about our fabled ideas of what our culture is and what it is not. Is it also our culture to purchase 4 million pound apartments for 23 year olds? What else is our culture that this father has done on behalf of this precious son of his? ( Now you have me sounding like a bitter human being here on this). ROFLMAO!!

This has nothing to do with culture ooo!!! Make we stop with all this annoying reasons wey no even dey paper. LoL Ofcourse the US would NEVER say they did not GOOF, I mean if the man had been successful, the US would have been faced with even more hell. So they would, once again, try to beef up security but at the end of the day, we all know they will NEVER get it right until all countries, even the Netherlands, and even Nigeria, get to working together to help stop these people.

One minute we scream that the US is not world police, the next we DEMAND it act as world police. Which one we want?

Kobojunkie:

Our Culture? Seriously, that argument is old.  We are speaking of his being reported to Americans who likely do not give a darn about our fabled ideas of what our culture is and what it is not. Is it also our culture to purchase 4 million pound apartments for 23 year olds? What else is our culture that this father has done on behalf of this precious son of his? ( Now you have me sounding like a bitter human being here on this). ROFLMAO!!

This has nothing to do with culture ooo!!! Make we stop with all this annoying reasons wey no even dey paper. LoL Ofcourse the US would NEVER say they did not GOOF, I mean if the man had been successful, the US would have been faced with even more hell. So they would, once again, try to beef up security but at the end of the day, we all know they will NEVER get it right until all countries, even the Netherlands, and even Nigeria, get to working together to help stop these people.

One minute we scream that the US is not world police, the next we DEMAND it act as world police. Which one we want?

my point here is that one of the fundamental things in life is culture. Shell nigeria is diferent from Shell amsterdam even though it is the same Shell. they had to adapt to the business culture in Nigeria in order to thrive. using this analogy what i meant was, in nigeria it is rare for a prominent man to alert any authorities about a child's intended actions or even bad behaviour. the US embassy should have been pragmatic and acted quick on this fact, knowing the climate in which they operate in. i wont even comment on the 4 million pound house as it isnt relevant here. i have been watching situation room on CNN and other respected news agencies and the general consensus is that the US from a risk management perspective DID not follow procedures they set for themselves and have to re-evaluate their procedures and stop slacking. this is serious stuff. i believe in leading from the top, and if you read between the lines, or even clearly at Obama's statements since the debacle occured his primary question was ' how did he get on the plane at amsterdam'. secondly he said that the procedure had to be evaluated. the current one is over 3 years old and has to be updated before something more sinister occurs. of course 100% success is not attainable but you want to be able to look in the mirror and say, THERE'S NOTHING MORE WE COULD HAVE DONE. in this instance US cant say that because it is fact that his father reported him.

ladej:

my point here is that one of the fundamental things in life is culture. Shell nigeria is diferent from Shell amsterdam even though it is the same Shell. they had to adapt to the business culture in Nigeria in order to thrive. using this analogy what i meant was, in nigeria it is rare for a prominent man to alert any authorities about a child's intended actions or even bad behaviour. the US embassy should have been pragmatic and acted quick on this fact, knowing the climate in which they operate in.

Please stop right there. Shell Nigeria maybe different from Shell Amsterdam but at the end of the day, they are all subject to Shell International policy. US Embassy in Nigeria did what it could with the information provided and that was get the name on the WATCH LIST, which we all know happened AFTER the call from the Father( even with little else provided after that).

ladej:

i wont even comment on the 4 million pound house as it isnt relevant here. i have been watching situation room on CNN and other respected news agencies and the general consensus is that the US from a risk management perspective DID not follow procedures they set for themselves and have to re-evaluate their procedures and stop slacking. this is serious stuff. i believe in leading from the top, and if you read between the lines, or even clearly at Obama's statements since the debacle occured his primary question was ' how did he get on the plane at amsterdam'.

When people start READING BETWEEN THE LINES when the facts are not made available, then things go south, and I mean way south Fast. Watching CNN’s PERSPECTIVE on this DOES NOT IN ANYWAY constitute one has the FACTS. Please let us not get carried away here. Even CNN has to work with what is available. It DOES NOT necessarily KNOW more than the authorities have revealed to the public on these issues.

Unless you are now advocating that the US take over from Amsterdam when it comes to security, then I suggest we not jump ahead of ourselves until we get facts here. You are right about this being a serious issue and that is why I prefer we work well within the facts rather than jumping to blame the one side for it all without even considering the many holes in this story even at this point.

ladej:

secondly he said that the procedure had to be evaluated. the current one is over 3 years old and has to be updated before something more sinister occurs. of course 100% success is not attainable but you want to be able to look in the mirror and say, THERE'S NOTHING MORE WE COULD HAVE DONE. in this instance US cant say that because it is fact that his father reported him.

Procedures have to be EVALUATED in most every case where something goes wrong.

Kobojunkie:


Procedures have to be EVALUATED in most every case where something goes wrong.

my opinion is that there's too much reacting and not enough proactiveness. must something go wrong before they evaluate? perhaps updating procedures every year or even every 6 months, rather than every time something goes wrong they say oh snap, we have to evaluate. what happened to evaluating even when things dont go wrong. i know it may sound simplistic but it has to be done. the terrorists always seem to be half a yard quicker, and the only way to nip it in the bud or at least greatly minimise attacks is communication, sharing of information and updating policies and procedures quickly. one must commend the international flying community for responding quickly to any threat they see on board. one thing is for sure for me, my days of sleeping on board are OVER. i will be so ALERT

ladej:

my opinion is that there's too much reacting and not enough proactiveness. must something go wrong before they evaluate? perhaps updating procedures every year or even every 6 months, rather than every time something goes wrong they say oh snap, we have to evaluate. what happened to evaluating even when things dont go wrong. i know it may sound simplistic but it has to be done.

Have you lived in the US since 9/11? I ask because I remember we used to have threat alerts go off most every time a possible terrorist was fingered or a possible terror plot was available. At one point we got really tired of the threat level warnings and there was the push to have that put aside. We also complained of how much we were spending on KEEPING OUT TERRORISTS when some claimed there was not really enough evidence that we have had threats of the sort for a while.

What I am saying is it is easy NOW to call for it to happen every six months or two years but you and I know we could have had it even more frequent than that but we, the public COMPLAINED it was all for nothing just some years ago.

ladej:
the terrorists always seem to be half a yard quicker, and the only way to nip it in the bud or at least greatly minimize attacks is communication, sharing of information and updating policies and procedures quickly. one must commend the international flying community for responding quickly to any threat they see on board. one thing is for sure for me, my days of sleeping on board are OVER. i will be so ALERT

I agree!!!

Kobojunkie:

no i havent lived in the US but i do know that threat alerts go off when there is suspicion something bad might occur. but in the US u also have home grown terrorists like the military guy recently who killed his own peeps at a base. if the public want to complain let them complain.

REMEMBER THAT ONLY THE LIVING GET TO COMPLAIN. THE DEAD HAVE NO VOICES. me if they want to xray me sef, i no send, if that is what will make me feel safer flying. not sure about you ladies though, with machines seeing all your bits,

its not rocket science

Obama bombed Yemen last week


The boy's father said his son had extremist views and was incommunicado in yemen


hunh hunh?

red flag anyone?

Kobojunkie:

Have you lived in the US since 9/11? I ask because I remember we used to have threat alerts go off most every time a possible terrorist was fingered or a possible terror plot was available. At one point we got really tired of the threat level warnings and there was the push to have that put aside. We also complained of how much we were spending on KEEPING OUT TERRORISTS when some claimed there was not really enough evidence that we have had threats of the sort for a while.

What I am saying is it is easy NOW to call for it to happen every six months or two years but you and I know we could have had it even more frequent than that but we, the public COMPLAINED it was all for nothing just some years ago.


I agree!!!

ladej:

no i havent lived in the US but i do know that threat alerts go off when there is suspicion something bad might occur. but in the US u also have home grown terrorists like the military guy recently who killed his own peeps at a base. if the public want to complain let them complain.

REMEMBER THAT ONLY THE LIVING GET TO COMPLAIN. THE DEAD HAVE NO VOICES. me if they want to xray me sef, i no send, if that is what will make me feel safer flying. not sure about you ladies though, with machines seeing all your bits,

We live in a Democracy and Americans dey complain ooo!!! Did you hear of the former GITMO detainees who are now head AlQuida men now?

Are you watching CNN now?

Kobojunkie:

We live in a Democracy and Americans dey complain ooo!!! Did you hear of the former GITMO detainees who are now head AlQuida men now?

Are you watching CNN now?

i know its a democracy but individual or collective comfort or convenience should be balanced against security. i know americans can moan. i will watch cnn in a bit

ladej:

i know its a democracy but individual or collective comfort or convenience should be balanced against security. i know americans can moan. i will watch cnn in a bit

Did you hear that? Some STORY of a well dressed man helping the suspect board the plane in Amsterdam!!! I wonder what will come of that story.

[color=#006600][/color] dnt you think d fada knows dis wil hapen as in he is part of it, just reportd 2 us officials and nt making the threat serious just to save his face. Just thinking!

Re: US Confirmed Receiving Warning From Father - Nigerian Bomber
« #7 on: December 27, 2009, 03:57 PM »

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The official report made by the suspect's father should be sufficient to justify the good intention of Nigeria as a nation. And consequently guard against any form of humiliation that Nigerians in the diaspora could be subjected to, most especially in the US. America should begin to see its weakness as a threat to itself and as such overhaul it stategic security plans.

i seem to be coming to the conclusion that irrespective of how much the US govt investigates and follows up leads, this terrorist matter will never be fully contained.
How many people can they put on the watch list and no fly list?
they will end up putting almost every muslim on the no fly list.
how safe are they from internal terrorists?
the ones on no fly list will concentrate on US allies.
this is one messy web,whichever way, we seem screwed.
The US will keep pumping billions into their security system but i doubt it can ever be water proof.
imagine the sick boy is alleged to have flown without a passport?
after all the arguments on this site over who reported first and how much info the father reported to whether he should have been on watch or no fly lists, the scary truth is that the world is as unsafe as it was on 9/11.
inspite of the billions America nad its allies are spending, nothing change.

I watched a TV statement this week by a senior officer of "Homeland Security" in which he stated that the US has around 500,000 people on the entry-level "watch list". He went on to say that Abdulmutallab had done nothing to merit being promoted to the next level "watch list", which has “only” 400,000 names listed ?.
Who can "watch" 900,000 suspects?

mbulela:

i seem to be coming to the conclusion that irrespective of how much the US govt investigates and follows up leads, this terrorist matter will never be fully contained.
[b]How many people can they put on the watch list and no fly list?
they will end up putting almost every muslim on the no fly list.
how safe are they from internal terrorists?[/b]the ones on no fly list will concentrate on US allies.
this is one messy web,whichever way, we seem screwed.
[b]The US will keep pumping billions into their security system but i doubt it can ever be water proof.
imagine the sick boy is alleged to have flown without a passport?[/b]after all the arguments on this site over who reported first and how much info the father reported to whether he should have been on watch or no fly lists, the scary truth is that the world is as unsafe as it was on 9/11.
inspite of the billions America nad its allies are spending, nothing change.

Now you are talking!! He got PAST Nigerian security and then Amsterdam, allegedly, with no PASSPORT, for an international flight How?? Is that even possible?

A father reported his son but what did the officials do
"US sources confirm a file was opened, but say the information did not warrant placing the accused on a "no-fly" list. "
Ok!

They where alerted before the incident. They should have taken proper and adequate action since then.

dolu2007:

They where alerted before the incident. They should have taken proper and adequate action since then.

how many people can they take action against?
Did you hear that their are around 900,000 people on watch lists?

[size=14pt]U.S. Terror Watch List Surpasses 900,000 Names, ACLU Estimates - UPDATED[/size]



The government’s centralized terrorist watch list passed the 900,000 name mark this month, according to the ACLU, which estimated the new total by relying on Congressional testimony from the fall that the sprawling list was growing by 20,000 names a month.

The report the ACLU relied on to create its Watch List Counter included the following chart demonstrating the clear growth trajectory of the nation’s centralized watch lists over the last several years.

The Terrorist Screening Center runs the list, accepting nominations of new names from a large range of government agencies.

Agencies use the watch list to check persons seeking visas, traveler entering or leaving the country, domestic airline passengers and persons stopped by state, local or federal law enforcement.

Most of the positive matches on the list came from police routinely checking persons, such as speeding motorists, according to the Government Accountability Office’s report (.pdf). The number of individuals on the list is likely significantly less than 900,000, since the name count includes aliases.


Persons on the list are coded with varying suspected threat levels, so simply being on the watch list doesn’t mean one will be arrested when say a person on the list pulled over for speeding. In fact, being on list isn’t even enough to ensure that a person is denied a visa or entry into the country, according to the report.



The Transportation Security Agency exports two subsets of the list — the no-fly and selectee lists — which airlines use to decide who can get a boarding pass and who has to get hand-searched. The TSA continues to work on a much-delayed project now known as Secure Flight that would have the TSA perform the name checks in advance of a domestic flight, in an effort to reduce the number of falsely flagged travelers. Those affected over the last 7 years include many David Nelsons, a high-ranking nun, and federal employees with security clearances.

If the ACLU’s math is correct, the list should pass the million name mark sometime in early July.

UPDATE: Terrorist Screening Center spokesman Chad Kolton dropped a long response in the comments, saying that the list is useful, contains actually more like 300,000 people due to aliases and that only some 5 percent — approximately 15,000, are U.S. persons.

[T]he Terrorist Screening Database (TSDB) is now the world’s most comprehensive and, importantly, widely-shared list of known and suspected terrorists. The names it includes are there because of credible information developed by our intelligence and law enforcement agencies, or those of our foreign partners. While the vast majority of people in it likely will never attempt to enter the United States, the TSDB gives our allies, consular officers, airlines, and border screening agencies the ability to make an informed decision about granting admission to the U.S.

[, ] We work hard to ensure that the list remains effective even as it grows. The government does its best to populate the TSDB with the identities of only those who are known or appropriately suspected of being involved in terrorism. In addition, TSC employees constantly review the database to remove the identities of those who have been cleared of any suspicion of engaging in terrorist activity. During fiscal year 2007 alone, TSC employees removed over 100,000 records from the database of individuals that had been cleared of having any nexus to terrorism. [, ]

This list helps protect Americans. We’re always at work to do it in the most effective, least intrusive way we can, adhering to our important Constitutional principles in the process.

THREAT LEVEL confirmed that this was Kolton, and sent some further questions about the list and its operations to him. Due to some very reasonable extenuating circumstances, Kolton can’t immediately answer, but THREAT LEVEL will bring you more in 10 days or so.


http://www.wired.com/threatlevel/2008/02/us-terror-watch/

I wonder when our people will change!

The father should be absolved of all liabilities. At least he made a case, which was acknowledged by Americans authorities. It is the same stupidity of American security when they recevied several tips and clues to 9-11 but turned a deaf ear that is their problem.

I think we should even clap for our Nigerian SSS and the Intelligence units b/c they sniff out info faster & use them faster , at least those against the govt.

Just another strategy by the American Government to create fear in the heart of the citizens, Now i read that Al-qaeda has claimed sponsorship of the boy,

That was exactly how we were deceived in the 09/11 issue before the ILLUMINATI exposed them that the building wasn't brought down by the plane crash but bombs placed in strategic places in the building.

Let's just learn and stop believing everything the Americans sells to us.

Since when did having alleged extremist views become valid reasons to cancel your Visa? I'm pretty sure his visa would not have been renewed in 2010, but the current visa would have stood until then until more concrete evidence was available to link him with any plot to attack the United States.
The report from his father makes him a suspicious fellow who would probably have been under surveillance in the US, but not so serious as to generate a no-fly status.

Add to that the guy's profile as a wealthy Nigerian - and Nigerians have never been known to be suicidal (until now).

It's laughable to insist that the US is at fault for not canceling the guy's visa. What about Lagos and Amsterdam that allowed this fellow to board a flight carrying explosives?

US SHOULD ASK THEMSELVES WHAT THEY ARE DOING FOR PEOPLE TO HATE THEM SO MUCH SO THE EXTENT OF WANTING TO DESTROY THEM EVERY TIME.

THEY MUST LOOK AT THEIR BACKS AND GO BACK TO THEIR DRAWING BOARD AND REDRESS ALL THE WRONGS THEY HAVE INFLICTED ON PEOPLE.

I rest my case

They had infor about 9/11 but did nothing,had infor about this farouk guy but considered it nothing,did not have infor about saddam but went unto Iraq.stupid

There is one thing i am very very certain about. The international community can and must not brand us a terrorist nation, the simple reason is dat Mr Mutallab Junior acquired the art of terrorism ABSOLUTELY not from Nigeria but from the middle east (Yemen) the World Center for Terrorism and related activities.

Parenting.
Too much posh,affluence and freedom was given to this boy with perhaps not enough
guidance.