adrusa:


I run a single 1.5Hp LG AC on my system. The AC is located in my bedroom and it works in bursts of 1, 2 or 3 hours, maximum of 6 hours per night. I tend to do more of 4 hours than 6 hours. I have a total lithium power of about 600AH and I'm not shy of pushing it down to as low as 30%.

You are a man after my neighbour's heart

Dude likes to push everything to its limit. The 600AH is it running at 48V nominal voltage?

OCTAVO:

This is true for Felicity mppt, infact I did some pv series connection that totalled about 125v, still got the high voltage error.
So, 100v - 110v is the safest from my experience.

Installation indeed comes with a unique solution.

I had similar experience with PowMr MPPT. It dissapointely gave error at 130v whereas the specifications in the manual promised 150v VoC.

Valto:
ok. note it is PURE AC / DC. [b]it can be plugged to light directly. they dont need ac adapter. it comes with remote and regulator. energy efficient and very low power consumption. [/b]

You mean like 230VAC directly?
So what DC voltage does it work with, 230VDC?

Edited: Okay, I have gone thru the attached picture if the manual.

My understanding from the manual is that it is strictly DC, not AC/DC as you posited. And if it has to be used with a 230VAC source, then it will definitely require an AC to 12 VDC adaptor or 12VAC to 12VDC rectifier if it's lower AC source.

remizvxcq:


which Washpap group? kindly share.

Very interested in EVs. These will be the next accomplishment of the solar cadres. All that excess afternoon solar going into your transport!!
Then go bigger, and set up a charging station for your neighbours.

Africa will shock the world with adoption of affordable EV especially bicycles (mountain bike style for all terrain), keke trikes (for commercial taxis), and scooters (for neighborhood runs if you have smooth roads). Let me know if you want to make a business of these.
You are not alone. You are ahead.

Me, I no get money for isho, i dey plan ile-ala ja gogoro!! And not gogoro the Asian battery swap e-bike mobility business, either.

I've gotten two ebikes, we like to go renewable all the way

My WhatsApp group comment is just a way to say the brands I mentioned have similar pricing and sort of similar specification, not a real WhatsApp group.

generationz:


Did you buy it brand new on Ali express or you got it in naija?
How much is the Ali express cost for that size?

Those batteries used to fly around for dirt cheap (around 6k to 7k each) in the early days of switch to Lithium when people were just learning about that chemistry. Another good thing is that they mostly have very impressive cycles left in them for that cheap price.

There was a member here who at that time picked up around 20 pieces of that thing, if I remember quite well. I was lucky to pick up around 2 pieces but met "sold out" response by the time I realised around 2 weeks later that I should buy more. I've been using the two pieces for two straight years now with no evidence of depreciation. Connected in parallel to make 80ah, hooked to two pieces 150w panel in 2s via a MakeSkyBlue MPPT.

NiyiOmoIyunade:
I continue to do 3s with high VoC panels with the Victron 150v CCs

The capacitors inside the Victron CC are rated for more than 150v, the ambient in Lagos where we do most installs is higher than 25°C and the available solar illumination/irradiation is less than the standard reference.

This is one of those cases where one is playing on the very margins of what is possible.

I once consulted for a site who used 4S with smaller sized panels because they were locked in with available equipment and number of panels - we used thinner cable and longer route than required to achieve a suitable voltage drop so that what got to the panels was well within spec. You simply have to understand the specs and tolerances well to play safely at the edges.

You can definitely get away with 3s high VoC panels on the "Baba Victron".

Na we wey get the "pikins" Felicity, PowMr and MakeSkyBlue dem in the mix dey wonder if e go work.

Testimonies here don show say e no go werk

NiyiOmoIyunade:
Is this not just a conversion problem for the OP?

10Kva is about 8Kw where the power factor is assumed to be 0.8

Is the power factor 0.8 or 1?

NiyiOmoIyunade:


Now that I have ported to Lithium the experience is far better - 18months 100% OFFGRID running 2 units 1hp ACs 24/7 and another 5 ACs opportunistically off a 48Kwh Pylontech bank and the batteries have performed outstandingly - no discernible degradation, no capacity loss and cell level state of health in excellent shape.

I could remember when Oga Niyi was enmeshed in the heated debate of Lithium versus LA, in favour of the latter.

I guess once you go Lithium, it's like going Premium and there is no going back.

NiyiOmoIyunade:

By now, I have run out of spare internal organs to sell to afford Lithium so I had to sell off some Pylontech bricks to finance the Deye inverter and Lishen cells.

I saw an advert where clinics were willing to pay up to 1000usd to guys to donate "sp3rm" . I think they are one of the few "sperms banks" that are already operational in Nigeria. So for those that have already run outta organs, that should be an inexpensive way. The only problem is that in the future, you or madam may be running into hundreds of kids countrywide that may leave you wondering about the striking resemblance.

I'm just saying ni ò. I'm not teaching anybody to do it ò.

NiyiOmoIyunade:


The ugly truth about offgrid living with high energy consumers e.g. ACs is that you will likely need a generator from time to time - the premium inverters like Victron incorporate a power assist feature so that you can use the smallest possible generator size e.g a 5kva generator to drive a 15kva inverter AND automatic Gen start/stop based on SoC, battery voltage and AC loads so that the Gen can run the minimum possible amount of time - you can even set exercise hours so that the Gen battery and internals stay ready for use any time.

Premium validating its price, incontrovertibly. 'nuf said.

mctfopt:


I have another question for the house, is anyone here into EV or at least the younger bro electric bicycles/scooter etc? I hope I'm not alone here. Lol.

I'm only working at probably importing one, not DIY yet. I feel the imported could serve as a pedestal for future DIY.

It is possible that a CC advertises a 150v cap and is actually set for less - if I recall correctly from my Morningstar days, the CC was rated for 150v but would begin clamping the voltage at around 145v basically working the panels at less than their peak capacity at that point in time - manufacturer said this design was to protect the CC.

For an installer, it is key to know the detailed technical specs and tolerances of the products you use beyond the marketing documents - this way you can design a safe and stable system and make your money with ease and peace of mind.

For a 48v system, I am more comfortable with a 3S config as it gives me some headroom after losses and all, I don't recall ever seeing the reference VoC or VmP attained or sustained in all the systems I have installed, 2S brings me too close to the battery nominal voltage after accounting for all the losses.

If the goal is to drive the system at such a voltage as will minimise losses and cable costs, achieving a few volts drop so you get less than 150V at the CC is a relatively trivial matter.

ceaser:


You can definitely get away with 3s high VoC panels on the "Baba Victron".

Na we wey get the "pikins" Felicity, PowMr and MakeSkyBlue dem in the mix dey wonder if e go work.

Testimonies here don show say e no go werk

I think this would depend on the connected downstream loads?

But in general a PF of 0.8 is the usual assumption in practice and safer to derate your equipment this way at least - some equipment may run even worse.

Peterlove11:

Is the power factor 0.8 or 1?

I consume 50-80kwh over a 24 hour window. This is the daily picture repeated daily without fail.

At NGN70/Kwh of electric where I live, it is a no brainer to go offgrid as much as possible.

adrusa:


Wow! 60KWh of useable battery power is a lot. It is about 3 times what I use daily.

NiyiOmoIyunade:


Now that I have ported to Lithium the experience is far better - 18months 100% OFFGRID running 2 units 1hp ACs 24/7 and another 5 ACs opportunistically off a 48Kwh Pylontech bank and the batteries have performed outstandingly - no discernible degradation, no capacity loss and cell level state of health in excellent shape.

I could remember when Oga Niyi was enmeshed in the heated debate of Lithium versus LA, in favour of the latter.

I guess once you go Lithium, it's like going Premium and there is no going back.

NiyiOmoIyunade:

By now, I have run out of spare internal organs to sell to afford Lithium so I had to sell off some Pylontech bricks to finance the Deye inverter and Lishen cells.

I saw an advert where clinics were willing to pay up to 1000usd to guys to donate "sp3rm" . I think they are one of the few "sperms banks" that are already operational in Nigeria. So for those that have already run outta organs, that should be an inexpensive way. The only problem is that in the future, you or madam may be running into hundreds of kids countrywide that may leave you wondering about the striking resemblance.

I'm just saying ni ò. I'm not teaching anybody to do it ò.

NiyiOmoIyunade:


The ugly truth about offgrid living with high energy consumers e.g. ACs is that you will likely need a generator from time to time - the premium inverters like Victron incorporate a power assist feature so that you can use the smallest possible generator size e.g a 5kva generator to drive a 15kva inverter AND automatic Gen start/stop based on SoC, battery voltage and AC loads so that the Gen can run the minimum possible amount of time - you can even set exercise hours so that the Gen battery and internals stay ready for use any time.

Premium validating its price, incontrovertibly. 'nuf said.

Let me break form a little here but please do not take it personal. It is getting annoying to see people say this or that is incorrect with no hard data to back it up.

The issue I see here is one of perspective - some people have only used a fairly basic BMS that is not tightly integrated with their inverter system and it works and this is perfectly fine, but then they keep arguing the features and benefits of a system they have never used with another person who has daily access to to data from both the basic BMS systems which have no comms with the inverter as well as large commercial grade systems where BMS and inverter have communications and are tightly integrated together.

I expose the inner workings of an integrated system with data that can be independently proven or disproven but you do not argue with the data, rather just a blanket statement of this is incorrect based on how you run your own DIY system which is essentially for home use. I say yes voltage based control works but you get more features and benefits when the BMS and inverter/charger have comms but you say this is inaccurate yet provide no further info to back it up?

What we post on NL is for the benefit of a wide audience, my goal is to educate and inform and lay out possibilities and options and also learn new stuff - it would be really nice if you do not just say 'Oh this is inaccurate' rather what exactly is inaccurate? and then provide hard data to back up any claims with?

This way we can all learn from each other.

You have to ask yourself why is there a market for ICC and similar control and monitoring software to use with the Axpert type inverters? Why did the Axpert manufacturers start integrating additional hardware for comms with Lithium BMS into their inverters? why did Victron and Deye invest so heavily in the ability for their systems to have comms with various BMS? why did Schneider start rolling out systems capable of talking to the BMS when they were previously doing open loop voltage control in the past? Surely all these efforts across so many providers are not just based on idle speculation or to extract more money from the customers? No one is doubting that voltage control with no comms can work but I struggle when one argues against the facts yet has only limited experience with these complex systems.

ojeysky:


There was a time we used to talk about DIY LFP Vs premiums and there was a time I would have responded to Oga neyo that the idea he has isn't accurate. There are a few scenarios where littium cells may not charge optimally but none of them has anything to do with the inverter talking to the BMS or not.

Having the inverter talk to the BMS is a good to have as you get to see the individual cell voltages, and maybe set triggers based on individual cell status apart from that, it's a charge and stop that remains. Even when I was using Felicity and MPP which both has float bugs, I could still charge my lithium optimally by working around the voltage to avoid the float bug.

I actually voted in favour of Lithium but said entry cost was the barrier, fortunately prices keep coming down and circumstances change so that what looked unattainable X years ago becomes mainstream today.

Lithium has really been a fun and rewarding journey.

Interesting idea to monetise *seed* donations, not sure there is any surplus to sell based on the current high stress situation of the country

ceaser:

I could remember when Oga Niyi was enmeshed in the heated debate of Lithium versus LA, in favour of the latter.

I guess once you go Lithium, it's like going Premium and there is no going back.


I saw an advert where clinics were willing to pay up to 1000usd to guys to donate "sp3rm" . I think they are one of the few "sperms banks" that are already operational in Nigeria. So for those that have already run outta organs, that should be an inexpensive way. The only problem is that in the future, you or madam may be running into hundreds of kids countrywide that may leave you wondering about the striking resemblance.

I'm just saying ni ò. I'm not teaching anybody to do it ò.

Premium validating its price, incontrovertibly. 'nuf said.

ojeysky:


I have SUN-8K do you have a reference where it's stated that it's 10kva? Because I think that is actually the max PV string input.

Thank you for this. I will try and get the reference site where it was quoted that way. When I got to deye site, I saw something different. That's why I wanted to know your own specific model

ceaser:
I'm only working at probably importing one, not DIY yet. I feel the imported could serve as a pedestal for future DIY.

When you do, remember to buy the one with a good motor (Bafang, Bosch, etc). And of course a good battery pack (Samsung cells, etc though you can DIY this part).

NiyiOmoIyunade:
Is this not just a conversion problem for the OP?

10Kva is about 8Kw where the power factor is assumed to be 0.8

Lol conversion problem indeed! for me?

When someone makes a post, a lot of people are reading it. Not everybody knows all this basic stuff. This inverter has models, I prefer you giving a model number for easy references for anyone thinking of buying. The only reason why I wanted him to state the model was just that he has attached money to it(he made a reference to a price range of 860-880k).

I believe you saw it when someone made a reference to solar panels made in China and Canada. He got the impression from here.

No be everybody knows this power factor fa!

ceaser:


You mean like 230VAC directly?
So what DC voltage does it work with, 230VDC?

it have inbuilt adapter. it can be plugged directly to 220v.it does not need external 12v adapter.

Apologies and no offense intended please, I did not even note who made the comments specifically was just responding based on what I thought the question was.

My experience with Deye is still limited but I believe the inverter sizes are speced in Kw - there is a Deye 7.6kw hybrid inverter (model # Sun-7.6K-SG....) and yet another 8kw (model # Sun-8K-SG....) inverter model that is specially designed for the North American market - due to notorious Asian flexibility, we are able to access this wonderful 8kw model at a bargain price despite signed agreements 'au contraire'

Oshomo12:


Lol conversion problem indeed! for me?

NiyiOmoIyunade:
Apologies and no offense intended please, I did not even note who made the comments specifically was just responding based on what I thought the question was.

My experience with Deye is still limited but I believe the inverter sizes are speced in Kw - there is a Deye 7.6kw hybrid inverter (model # Sun-7.6K-SG....) and yet another 8kw (model # Sun-8K-SG....) inverter model that is specially designed for the North American market - due to notorious Asian flexibility, we are able to access this wonderful 8kw model at a bargain price despite signed agreements 'au contraire'

Noooo, I never took offense, my brother!
I have edited my post for better clarity. Ojey is trying to help out with a better price range, I do not want people to take advantage of it, some passive readers will just contact marketers straight, without full details of Ojey's remark.

ceaser:


How were you able to sideline the 100usd monthly limit on ATM card online transactions by some of those banks while others peg theirs at around 50 usd?

Or has the limit now been raised above 100usd?

But omo, naira don kpafuka o. PowMr used to be 28k, then it moved to 32k. Now it's 42k, and I'm sure that one na with AliExpress standard shipping, not expedited ones like UPS or FedEx which will require around another 25k for delivery charges.

I didn't order from Aliexpress but from Nigerian online store. Hoping it will be the real deal when it is delivered, max 2-weeks.

Payment Details

Items total: ₦ 33,779

Shipping Fees: ₦ 1,300

International Delivery Fees: ₦ 7,769

Total: ₦ 42,848

NiyiOmoIyunade:
Let me break form a little here but please do not take it personal. It is getting annoying to see people say this or that is incorrect with no hard data to back it up.

The issue I see here is one of perspective - some people have only used a fairly basic BMS that is not tightly integrated with their inverter system and it works and this is perfectly fine, but then they keep arguing the features and benefits of a system they have never used with another person who has daily access to to data from both the basic BMS systems which have no comms with the inverter as well as large commercial grade systems where BMS and inverter have communications and are tightly integrated together.

I expose the inner workings of an integrated system with data that can be independently proven or disproven but you do not argue with the data, rather just a blanket statement of this is incorrect based on how you run your own DIY system which is essentially for home use. I say yes voltage based control works but you get more features and benefits when the BMS and inverter/charger have comms but you say this is inaccurate yet provide no further info to back it up?

What we post on NL is for the benefit of a wide audience, my goal is to educate and inform and lay out possibilities and options and also learn new stuff - it would be really nice if you do not just say 'Oh this is inaccurate' rather what exactly is inaccurate? and then provide hard data to back up any claims with?

This way we can all learn from each other.

You have to ask yourself why is there a market for ICC and similar control and monitoring software to use with the Axpert type inverters? Why did the Axpert manufacturers start integrating additional hardware for comms with Lithium BMS into their inverters? why did Victron and Deye invest so heavily in the ability for their systems to have comms with various BMS? why did Schneider start rolling out systems capable of talking to the BMS when they were previously doing open loop voltage control in the past? Surely all these efforts across so many providers are not just based on idle speculation or to extract more money from the customers? No one is doubting that voltage control with no comms can work but I struggle when one argues against the facts yet has only limited experience with these complex systems.

Bros thanks for setting the rules of not making this personal and let's both observe it Bro, no doubt there are other features as I earlier mentioned, but my response I was specific on charging. Can a littium be charged optimally through a BMS that does not have Comms with the inverter? Is the main question.

You asked why inverter talking to BMS is invested upon, IMO opinion, it's more towards better automation and control. For instance in my DIY BMS I may get to make certain adjustment on my inverter settings depending on what is observed on the individual cells and that's why I can't use BMS that cannot inform me about status of each cells. Will I achieve an optimal charge on both? my answer remains a yes Sir, but is BMS talking to inverter not good? absolutely not and like I said it's a good to have.

ceaser:


Those batteries used to fly around for dirt cheap (around 6k to 7k each) in the early days of switch to Lithium when people were just learning about that chemistry. Another good thing is that they mostly have very impressive cycles left in them for that cheap price.

There was a member here who at that time picked up around 20 pieces of that thing, if I remember quite well. I was lucky to pick up around 2 pieces but met "sold out" response by the time I realised around 2 weeks later that I should buy more. I've been using the two pieces for two straight years now with no evidence of depreciation. Connected in parallel to make 80ah, hooked to two pieces 150w panel in 2s via a MakeSkyBlue MPPT.

.

Yeah, I was also aware of it when it was cheap and super availabe, around 25k back then. But I didn't have the funds for a full set up so I settled for a laptop power bank and praying Nepa is kind.

Do you know how much the new one (imported into the country ) costs? Maybe an average price?
How much

NiyiOmoIyunade:
Apologies and no offense intended please, I did not even note who made the comments specifically was just responding based on what I thought the question was.

My experience with Deye is still limited but I believe the inverter sizes are speced in Kw - there is a Deye 7.6kw hybrid inverter (model # Sun-7.6K-SG....) and yet another 8kw (model # Sun-8K-SG....) inverter model that is specially designed for the North American market - due to notorious Asian flexibility, we are able to access this wonderful 8kw model at a bargain price despite signed agreements 'au contraire'

I love those guys

We are getting close I think.

Let us stick to battery charging.

When the inverter can natively talk to the BMS then all the work is done for you, the BMS can ask the chargers to raise or lower charge voltage and current limits as it sees fit in response to cell level events with no human intervention.

I have a few data centers with Victron & Pylontech backup that have nearly 24/7 power - you will see the BMS instruct the inverter to absorb, float and even discharge/cycle the battery a bit to keep everything going smoothly. The charge voltage setpoints change dynamically as required to keep every single cell happy.

Can you contrive a DIY solution without comms that will dynamically adjust absorb voltages lower if no cell needs balancing? Raise the absorb voltage enough for some cells to balance where necessary? Cycle the battery a bit so that it is not on mains charging 24/7?

All these are seamlessly done when a smart BMS is controlling the charger directly in the Victron world - fixed absorb and float voltages will not cut it in these scenarios and you would have to do a lot more work to achieve thesame goal.

Again fixed voltage control without comms is okay, there is just a lot more precise control possible when inverter/charger and BMS are tightly integrated.

ojeysky:


Bros thanks for setting the rules of not making this personal and let's both observe it Bro, no doubt there are other features as I earlier mentioned, but my response I was specific on charging. Can a littium be charged optimally through a BMS that does not have Comms with the inverter? Is the main question.

You asked why inverter talking to BMS is invested upon, IMO opinion, it's more towards better automation and control. For instance in my DIY BMS I may get to make certain adjustment on my inverter settings depending on what is observed on the individual cells and that's why I can't use BMS that cannot inform me about status of each cells. Will I achieve an optimal charge on both? my answer remains a yes Sir, but is BMS talking to inverter not good? absolutely not and like I said it's a good to have.

NiyiOmoIyunade:
We are getting close I think.

Let us stick to battery charging.

When the inverter can natively talk to the BMS then all the work is done for you, the BMS can ask the chargers to raise or lower charge voltage and current limits as it sees fit in response to cell level events with no human intervention.

I have a few data centers with Victron & Pylontech backup that have nearly 24/7 power - you will see the BMS instruct the inverter to absorb, float and even discharge/cycle the battery a bit to keep everything going smoothly. The charge voltage setpoints change dynamically as required to keep every single cell happy.

Can you contrive a DIY solution without comms that will dynamically adjust absorb voltages lower if no cell needs balancing? Raise the absorb voltage enough for some cells to balance where necessary? Cycle the battery a bit so that it is not on mains charging 24/7?

All these are seamlessly done when a smart BMS is controlling the charger directly in the Victron world - fixed absorb and float voltages will not cut it in these scenarios and you would have to do a lot more work to achieve thesame goal.

Again fixed voltage control without comms is okay, there is just a lot more precise control possible when inverter/charger and BMS are tightly integrated.

Na wa for you guys, all this English just to come down to the bolded(which should have been said first).

Let me create another issue to summarize it as "simpler" this all obeys the fundamental principle, CONSERVATION OF ENERGY(In money-wise, hope we get my gist?)

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Oshomo12:


Na wa for you guys, all this English just to come down to the bolded (which should have been said first).

Again fixed voltage control without comms is okay, there is just a lot more precise control possible when inverter/charger and BMS are tightly integrated.

I agree with you, this was the very first thing I said o, but as my Ogas just dey counter with no data backup maybe I vex small, I was on my 6th cup of coffee at that ungodly hour

NiyiOmoIyunade:


There is a bit more to Lithium charging than just voltage based control .......

When the inverter/charger can talk to the battery, you are able to access more energy and charge better and faster. In the Victron world, three control parameters dynamically obtained from a smart BMS are used to manage battery charging....

adrusa:


I honestly don't believe a word of these very technical and deliberately confusing points. And I'm not talking about what you wrote, but what the battery, BMS and charger manufacturers have clearly made you to believe. I continue to believe that most of these talks are basically to make you pay more for pre-existing technology given a new name...

ojeysky:


There was a time we used to talk about DIY LFP Vs premiums and there was a time I would have responded to Oga neyo that the idea he has isn't accurate. There are a few scenarios where littium cells may not charge optimally but none of them has anything to do with the inverter talking to the BMS or not.

High quality 18650 cells available at N250 each. The average test capacity ranges between 2600 to 3000mah. Available in large quantity in Kano. Chat me up on 08034694579

To be very frank, I'm really discouraged to replace my Gen with inverter/solar system because of the rate of its failure.

I'm also aware that 80% of the system not functioning well is as a result of load mismanagement. So I decided to inform a friend about my consumption with the setup below:
3.5kva/48v genus heiwa inverter. 48v/60Ah MPPT charge controller. 8pcs of 320w mono panels and 4pcs of 230Ah/12v genus tubular battery.

His calculation is shown below:
My consumption is 500w x 24 hours = 12000/1000 = 12kwh.
Exact battery bank capacity needed is 12kwh/48v = 25 x 2(no of days) = 50Ah

Battery charge rate is C20.
DOD of 50% with 90% efficient.

Rated Ah capacity of battery/desired DOD% = Actual Ah/inverter efficiency% = Usable Ah x No of battery in parallel = Total battery bank capacity.

I've asked him the following question and I'm yet to get reply.
Does my setup above match to the calculation?
Though I was planning to make the mono panels 9 instead of 8 but I will like to get the actual battery bank capacity needed for my setup from the gurus here.
I intend to go off grid. I also intend to manage a maximum of 500w during the day and 250w during the night.
Please, put DOD and inverter efficiency into consideration.

isangjohnson:
So I decided to inform a friend about my consumption with the setup below:
3.5kva/48v genus heiwa inverter. 48v/60Ah MPPT charge controller. 8pcs of 320w mono panels and 4pcs of 230Ah/12v genus tubular battery.

His calculation is shown below:
My consumption is 500w x 24 hours = 12000/1000 = 12kwh.
I intend to go off grid. I also intend to manage a maximum of 500w during the day and 250w during the night.
Please, put DOD and inverter efficiency into consideration.

500w load for 24hrs
. pls go for lithium batteries.. 48V 280ah Lifepo4 Lithium battery will serve. thats roughly 14.5kwh. then 12pcs of 320w panels.

On today's episode of "Sell-An-Internal-Organ-For-Renewable-Energy".....