U lied when u called Jesus a liar!!

toba said:

I asked u if u believed in the stories of the bible but u ve not responded

First of all, I do not believe for a single second that God had anything at all to do with the bible.

The old testament is filled with supposedly God-ordained mass murder. In total, the bible god slaughtered millions of people - all of them completely innocent. This leads one to the obvious conclusion that whoever was commanding the Israelis to slaughter their neighbours, loot their property and ra-pe their women, it certainly was NOT the Creator. If indeed they committed these atrocities, they did so on behalf of their tribal god, whom they named Yahweh. Yahweh is NOT the Creator. Yahweh is a Jewish tribal deity.

Two: I believe the New testament is merely an allegorical story of the planetary cycle, and not the recording of real, flesh and blood events. Christianity is derived from Sun worship.

This explains why ''the lord Jesus'' is depicted with a halo (the sun) around his head. He stands for the Sun in the ancient allegory.

ROSSIKE:

toba said:

First of all, I do not believe for a single second that God had anything at all to do with the bible.

The old testament is filled with supposedly God-ordained mass murder. In total, the bible god slaughtered millions of people - all of them completely innocent. This leads one to the obvious conclusion that whoever was commanding the Israelis to slaughter their neighbpours, loot their property and ra-pe their women, it certainly was NOT the Creator. If indeed they committed these atrocities, they did so on behalf of their tribal god, whom they named Yahweh. Yahweh is NOT the Creator. Yahweh is a Jewish tribal deity.

Two: I believe the New testament is merely an allegorical story of the planetary cycle, and not the recording of real, flesh and blood events. Christianity is derived from Sun worship.

This explains why ''the lord Jesus'' is depicted with a halo (the sun) around his head. He stands for the Sun in the ancient allegory.

1. ur understanding of God is deeply flawed. if God has nothing to do with the bible. . . . .how is God revealed to us? by what means?

2. its funny how u simply assert that there was manslaughter of millions by jews in the OT. . . . but u foolishly forget the following.
a. life outside of the garden of eden was full of killings and wars and violence.

b. the israelites had to fight wars to get to the promised land. . .and by fighting wars . . they had to conquer, else the promises of God would be invalid. and to conquer they had to kill their enemies. . . . . what would it sound like to u, if on the way to the promised land the israelites were annihilated by a stronger nation?. . .what would u make of the promises of God?

c. it takes 2 to tangle. what should the israelites have done when nations rose against them to war? should they have absconded?

d. That ur deduction of manslaughter and murder is not the deduction of others (intelligent and believing Christians). . .while u see a wicked and nihilant creator. . .we see a loving God who would what it takes to protect His own from imminent enemies.

3. ur ridiculous belief that Jesus has any connection to the sun remains unsubstantiated. Its as ridiculous as what we call the end-time anti-Christ beliefs.

noetic16 said:

1. your understanding of God is deeply flawed. if God has nothing to do with the bible. . . . .how is God revealed to us? by what means?

What sort of question is this? Tell me. How was God ''revealed'' to your ancestors? I hope you know christianity is less than 200 years old in Nigeria. Do you know that civilization in Nigeria is dated to 5,000 years minimum?

This idea that you needed white slave traders and colonialists to come in and ''reveal God to you'' is almost too comical for words. Your ancestors knew about God before those slave traders knew what part of their body to pee from.  Now they are ''revealing God'' to you?

2. its funny how u simply assert that there was manslaughter of millions by jews in the OT. . . . but u foolishly forget the following.
a. life outside of the garden of eden was full of killings and wars and violence.

You know NOTHING about ''life outside the garden of Eden''.

b. the israelites had to fight wars to get to the promised land. . .and by fighting wars . . they had to conquer, else the promises of God would be invalid.

I do not accept that the Creator fashions out a ''promised land'' to a group of ''chosen people'', for which they need to commit mass murder and ra-pe to arrive at.

I also do not accept that the Creator has any ''chosen people'', any different from you, I, or Mr Okoronkwo from Arondizuogu.

The idea that the Creator has a ''chosen people'' or ''chosen race'' is ignorant and racist, and any person who falls for that lie needs his or her head examined.

and to conquer they had to kill their enemies. .

See above.

d. That your deduction of manslaughter and murder is not the deduction of others (intelligent and believing Christians). . .while u see a wicked and nihilant creator. . .we see a loving God who would what it takes to protect His own from imminent enemies.

The greatest disservice christianity and islam did to mankind is to reduce the Creator to an almost human-like entity, occupied with slaughter, revenge, physical acquisition, and ''enemies''.

Put yourself in the position of the Creator of the universes. Would YOU act in the manner attributed to God by the Jewish bible writers?

3. your ridiculous belief that Jesus has any connection to the sun remains unsubstantiated. Its as ridiculous as what we call the end-time anti-Christ beliefs.

I'll expand further on this shortly. In the meantime chew on the fact that there is not a single substantiated report, contemporary to the alleged time Jesus walked the earth, confirming his actual existence as a person. The first document written about a ''Jesus Christ'' emerged 60 years after his supposed ''ascension''.

Contrary to what most Nigerians think, the ''gospels'' were not actually written by any ''disciples'' or ''apostles''.

Their authorship is completely unknown.

Excerpts:

“The four Gospels that eventually made it into the New Testament, for example, are all anonymous, written in the third person about Jesus and his companions. None of them contains a first-person narrative (as in "One day, when Jesus and I went into Capernaum, ", and none claims to be written by an eyewitness or companion of an eyewitness.

Why then do we call them Matthew, Mark, Luke and John? Because sometime in the second century, when proto-orthodox Christians recognized the need for apostolic authorities, they attributed these books to apostles (Matthew and John) and close companions of apostles (Mark, the secretary of Peter; and Luke, the travelling companion of Paul). Most scholars today have abandoned these identifications, and recognize that the books were written by otherwise unknown but relatively well-educated Greek-speaking (and writing) Christians during the second half of the first century.”

"Lost Christianities" by Bart Ehrman (2003)

ROSSIKE:

noetic16 said:

What sort of question is this? Tell me. How was God ''revealed'' to your ancestors? I hope you know christianity is less than 200 years old in Nigeria. Do you know that civilization in Nigeria is dated to 5,000 years minimum?

This idea that you needed white slave traders and colonialists to come in and ''reveal God to you'' is almost too comical for words. Your ancestors knew about God before those slave traders knew what part of their body to pee from.  Now they are ''revealing God'' to you?

what has the above got to do with the thread?. . how does the above answer my questions?. . . how is God revealed to us and by what means?

You know NOTHING about ''life outside the garden of Eden''.

really? 
I am willing to learn. . . please inform me about life outside the garden. . .I eagerly await ur highly esteemed information.

I do not accept that the Creator fashions out a ''promised land'' to a group of ''chosen people'', for which they need to commit mass murder and ra-pe to arrive at.

I also do not accept that the Creator has any ''chosen people'', any different from you, I, or Mr Okoronkwo from Arondizuogu.

The idea that the Creator has a ''chosen people'' or ''chosen race'' is ignorant and racist, and any person who falls for that lie needs his or her head examined.

1. of what benefit is the above? . . .all u have done is to express an ill-informed opinion. ,  . . . . , unless and until u establish the fundamental basis of ur opinion using intellectually driven arguments and proofs. . . .all u are doing is to rant.

2. sounds like u have a better plan to the creator u antagonise. .  .go on let us hear u. .  . . . . .as the creator whats ur idea and basis for salvation?

See above.


The greatest disservice christianity and islam did to mankind is to reduce the Creator to an almost human-like entity, occupied with slaughter, revenge, physical acquisition, and ''enemies''.

Put yourself in the position of the Creator of the universes. Would YOU act in the manner attributed to God by the Jewish bible writers?

u miss the entire point.

The creator sees the larger picture from everlasting to everlasting. ,  . . .u and I only see the presently limited picture. . .how then do u expect me to put myself in the position of the creator?. . . . . .do u not consider it dogmatic on ur part to rule out the plan of the creator as outlined in the bible?. . . . . .why do u not find it plausible that creator would liberate a group of people (israelites) as a pathway to liberate the world?

I'll expand further on this shortly. In the meantime chew on the fact that there is not a single substantiated report, contemporary to the alleged time Jesus walked the earth, confirming his actual existence as a person. The first document written about a ''Jesus Christ'' emerged 60 years after his supposed ''ascension''.

and what does the above prove?. . . . .NOTHING.

1. the gospels were not written for historical purposes or to prove the existence of Jesus or His divinity. The gospels were written to serve as depiction of the life, times and sayings of Christ to those who were already SAVED. . . .and not to a bunch of atheists, historians or scholars.

2. If as u claim the gospels were written 60 years after the death of Jesus. . . . .there are questions we need to ask ourselves. why was there the need to write the gospels? was there a compelling need to write the gospels during the lifetime of Jesus?. . .or during the lifetime of the apostles? or during the persecution era?. . . . .unless and until u are able to honestly answer these questions u CANNOT objectively juxtapose the facts to arrive at a rich opinion/conclusion.

Contrary to what most Nigerians think, the ''gospels'' were not actually written by any ''disciples'' or ''apostles''.

Their authorship is completely unknown.

Excerpts:

“The four Gospels that eventually made it into the New Testament, for example, are all anonymous, written in the third person about Jesus and his companions. None of them contains a first-person narrative (as in "One day, when Jesus and I went into Capernaum, ", and none claims to be written by an eyewitness or companion of an eyewitness.

Why then do we call them Matthew, Mark, Luke and John? Because sometime in the second century, when proto-orthodox Christians recognized the need for apostolic authorities, they attributed these books to apostles (Matthew and John) and close companions of apostles (Mark, the secretary of Peter; and Luke, the travelling companion of Paul). Most scholars today have abandoned these identifications, and recognize that the books were written by otherwise unknown but relatively well-educated Greek-speaking (and writing) Christians during the second half of the first century.”

"Lost Christianities" by Bart Ehrman (2003)

this is a mere opinion,  . not worth a penny.

What sort of question is this? Tell me. How was God ''revealed'' to your ancestors? I hope you know christianity is less than 200 years old in Nigeria. Do you know that civilization in Nigeria is dated to 5,000 years minimum?

This idea that you needed white slave traders and colonialists to come in and ''reveal God to you'' is almost too comical for words. Your ancestors knew about God before those slave traders knew what part of their body to pee from.  Now they are ''revealing God'' to you?

what has the above got to do with the thread?. . how does the above answer my questions?. . . how is God revealed to us and by what means?

What does it mean for God to be ''revealed'' to you? God gave you  spirit and brain for you to develop a sense of morality. You do not need the bible to know it's wrong to kill or steal, do you?

Do you think your ancestors did not know it was wrong to steal and kill, and covet their neighbours's wives before a white man came along on a slave ship?

You know NOTHING about ''life outside the garden of Eden''.

really?   
I am willing to learn. . . please inform me about life outside the garden. . .I eagerly await your highly esteemed information.

It would take up too much space, and would be quite frankly, over your head. I suggest you read the Sumerian epics.

I do not accept that the Creator fashions out a ''promised land'' to a group of ''chosen people'', for which they need to commit mass murder and ra-pe to arrive at.

I also do not accept that the Creator has any ''chosen people'', any different from you, I, or Mr Okoronkwo from Arondizuogu.

The idea that the Creator has a ''chosen people'' or ''chosen race'' is ignorant and racist, and any person who falls for that lie needs his or her head examined.

Of what benefit is the above? . . .all u have done is to express an ill-informed opinion. ,  . . . . , unless and until u establish the fundamental basis of your opinion using intellectually driven arguments and proofs. . . .all u are doing is to rant.

Rant? Actually I think it's sheer common sense that the Creator not be racist. Why would you think otherwise?

Because a Jewish book says so?

sounds like u have a better plan to the creator u antagonise. .  .go on let us hear u. .  . . . . .as the creator whats your idea and basis for salvation?

There is no ''Creator'' in the bible. Salvation is universal. Everyone will ultimately enter the Light from whence we all came. We are ALL aspects of God. We are ALL ''saved''. You do not need to do ANYTHING to live in the next world, just as you were not required to do anything to live in this world. Transition is a natural process for souls. If you are especially evil or wicked, you will need to reconcile yourself with the Oneness of all before you can reach the Light. The process of doing this is not ''punishment'' - simply a learning process. The Creator does not ''punish'' anybody.

These are universal truths shared by all the traditional religions, except the recent ''modern religions'' like christianity and islam, who claim you are only ''saved'' if you follow their religion, and damned to eternal suffering if you don't. This claim of course is entirely false, and only geared to Control, and Acquisition of power by their clergy, and ruling classes.

The greatest disservice christianity and islam did to mankind is to reduce the Creator to an almost human-like entity, occupied with slaughter, revenge, physical acquisition, and ''enemies''.

Put yourself in the position of the Creator of the universes. Would YOU act in the manner attributed to God by the Jewish bible writers?

u miss the entire point.

The creator sees the larger picture from everlasting to everlasting. ,  . . .u and I only see the presently limited picture. . .how then do u expect me to put myself in the position of the creator?. . . . . .do u not consider it dogmatic on your part to rule out the plan of the creator as outlined in the bible?. . . . . .why do u not find it plausible that creator would liberate a group of people (israelites) as a pathway to liberate the world?

Liberate a group of people from what? Liberate the world from what? God IS the world (and a lot more). Why would God liberate the people from Himself? Why would he command the ra-ping of whole populations and their mass murder, in order to liberate the people from Himself?

Until you can remove from your head the false idea that we are all ''separate'' rather than individualized aspects of a WHOLE which includes God, you will never understand.

I suggest you read the accounts of Near Death Experiencers, whose accounts generally tie in with these ancient facts of life.

www.nderf.org

I'll expand further on this shortly. In the meantime chew on the fact that there is not a single substantiated report, contemporary to the alleged time Jesus walked the earth, confirming his actual existence as a person. The first document written about a ''Jesus Christ'' emerged 60 years after his supposed ''ascension''.

and what does the above prove?. . . . .NOTHING.

1. the gospels were not written for historical purposes or to prove the existence of Jesus or His divinity. The gospels were written to serve as depiction of the life, times and sayings of Christ to those who were already SAVED. . . .and not to a bunch of atheists, historians or scholars.

2. If as u claim the gospels were written 60 years after the death of Jesus. . . . .there are questions we need to ask ourselves. why was there the need to write the gospels? was there a compelling need to write the gospels during the lifetime of Jesus?. . .or during the lifetime of the apostles? or during the persecution era?. . . . .unless and until u are able to honestly answer these questions u CANNOT objectively juxtapose the facts to arrive at a rich opinion/conclusion.

Strange comments. A literal reading of the bible says that Jesus spoke to huge crowds of people, raised the dead, healed the sick, was publicly crucified after a very public trial, and generally caused a lot of fracas in his time, including making the bright sky dark upon his passing, and rising from the dead on the third day. Now if you know anything about 30 AD Hellenistic Rome and Israel, you would know there were hundreds of writers and historians in the region who wrote about and recorded even the most mundane occurences.

Doesn't it strike you as odd that not one of them wrote a single line about ''Jesus the son of God?'' Not a single line about the man until a full 60 years after his ''ascension''?

That's like nobody writing a word about Nelson Mandela or Martin Luther King until the year 2030!

Contrary to what most Nigerians think, the ''gospels'' were not actually written by any ''disciples'' or ''apostles''.

Their authorship is completely unknown.

Excerpts:

“The four Gospels that eventually made it into the New Testament, for example, are all anonymous, written in the third person about Jesus and his companions. None of them contains a first-person narrative (as in "One day, when Jesus and I went into Capernaum, ", and none claims to be written by an eyewitness or companion of an eyewitness.

Why then do we call them Matthew, Mark, Luke and John? Because sometime in the second century, when proto-orthodox Christians recognized the need for apostolic authorities, they attributed these books to apostles (Matthew and John) and close companions of apostles (Mark, the secretary of Peter; and Luke, the travelling companion of Paul). Most scholars today have abandoned these identifications, and recognize that the books were written by otherwise unknown but relatively well-educated Greek-speaking (and writing) Christians during the second half of the first century.”

"Lost Christianities" by Bart Ehrman (2003)

this is a mere opinion,  . not worth a penny.

Err, No it's not an ''opinion''. It's a fact.

If you disagree, could you then tell us who authored the New Testament based on your research?

Shame for you, dont you know the author of the old testement yet? but you believes in it.

ROSSIKE:

toba said:

First of all, I do not believe for a single second that God had anything at all to do with the bible.

The old testament is filled with supposedly God-ordained mass murder. In total, the bible god slaughtered millions of people - all of them completely innocent. This leads one to the obvious conclusion that whoever was commanding the Israelis to slaughter their neighbpours, loot their property and ra-pe their women, it certainly was NOT the Creator. If indeed they committed these atrocities, they did so on behalf of their tribal god, whom they named Yahweh. Yahweh is NOT the Creator. Yahweh is a Jewish tribal deity.

Two: I believe the New testament is merely an allegorical story of the planetary cycle, and not the recording of real, flesh and blood events. Christianity is derived from Sun worship.

This explains why ''the lord Jesus'' is depicted with a halo (the sun) around his head. He stands for the Sun in the ancient allegory.

The tales u posted isnt the answer to my question. There are many stories in the bible from Genesis to revelation, Do u believe that the stories recorded therein are true or false ?

the peeps who wrote the bible were inspired by the holy spirit, and understanding it, you have to be taught by the holy spirit. you cant use your common sense to understand the deep things of God. for it is wriiten the words i speak to you are spirit and you have to be in the spirit to understand the word of god. remember as the heavens are higher than the earth so are God's ways and his thoughts higer than ours.

you are like nichodemus who JESUS told that to enter the kingdon of God, he needs to be born again, and nichodemus took it literary to mean if he has to re-enter his mother's womb to be born again, but what Jesus actually meant was d re-birth in spirit. so you see the words are much more deeper than your common sense can understand. you need to ask for the holy spirit to teach you, and before he comes you have to be born again.

besides it may amaze you to know that many are alive today, and have seen the kingdom of God, i am a living testimony. you need to understand what the kingdom of God is to understand what Jesus was talking about, and u will see that indeed, many who were standing there, did see the kingdom of God before they died.

1 corinthians 2 verse 4-10, read.

THE KINGDOM OF GOD.

the kingdom of God is the message of saivation, and the message of salvation is Jesus, accepting him as the lord and salviour. how do i know?
check the parable of the sower in Mathew 13, and the parable of the Ten virgins. Jesus used these parables to give us an idea what the kingdom of God is.
in the parable of the sower, he said a sower ( Jesus) went to sow his seeds, ( word of God ) these seeds fell on different grounds, and these grounds represent the different kind of mind we use to receive the word of God. those that fell on unproductive minds are minds who cant understand the word of God. (Mathew 13, 11-17 ). now those who received the word are those with productive hearts, then it grows cos they water it. by watering it we can look at the second parable that talks about a second sower who sowed a mustard seed, and it grew cos it was nurtured, this shows that if you receive the word of Godw without nurturing it, by learning more, fellowship, etc, it will be stolen by the enemy, or choked out by the tares, that was mentioned in the passage ( this include the wisdom of the world). Jesus also said the kingdom of God  is like the parable of the Ten virgins as mentioned in Mathew 25, 1-13, again we see that the kingdom of God is all about receiving the word of God ( thats what the lamp signifies) Psalm 119 vs 105.  for it is written that the word of God is a lamp unto our feet. now the virgins who made it at the end where those who went with extra oil, again like the former parable this means growing the word of God by remaining steadfast. so you can see that the kingdom of heaven is actually the word Of God, ( which is Jesus) john 1 1-10

so from the above it is obvious that the kingdom of God tht Jesus was talking about, was the acceptance that he is the true saviour of the world, and it was recorded that after he was crucified and people witness the events that happened afterwards, many said that truly this was the SON of God, and many more were converted and indeed see the kingdom of God. this was the same thing that Jesus tried to tell nichodemus, that he had to believe to see the KIngdon of God, which of course by now i shld blive you understand that means believing that he is the Son of God. so many who were standing at the time Jesus made that statement were alive to see for a true that he is indeed the Son of God.

ABOUT PRAYER

Jesus never lied about prayer, for he said that if we ask anything in his name and believe, the word that is very important is ''believe, so just asking in his name is not enough for something to happen, you have to believe that what you have asked for you have received, then it will come. that is the problem with most christains today, they lack faith, i will want to ask you, that how many christains will pray for a mountain to be cast in the see and wont doubt?. NONE!. thats it and once you have entertained any form of doubt you make that prayer ineffective, remember it is written, without faith no man can please God. Heb 11 vs 6. from the passage you took your arguement from, Mark 11, you will remember that Jesus have earlier cursed a fig tree to wither, and in verse 23 the disciples seeing the next day that is came to pass, asked how it happen, and Jesus made the comments that you are holding on to, ''that if they believe, they will say to the moutain be that cast into the see, and it will cast in the sea,. now if i may ask, did Jesus or any one with ''FAITH"" ever say that and it never came to past. you must know that you need to have TOATL FAITH with no single doubt to please God. and you may not know but there are many faithful christains that are praying prayers of faith and receiving results.

THE END TIME.

God gave us many signs to look out for to know when the end is coming. one thing you shld know is that paul and co, did see this signs in their time and were almost certain that the end of time is near. they were not wrong, dou it was not to happen as soon as they thaught, cos the didnt take the most important sign to look out for, which is ''THE WORD OF GOD WILL BE PREACHED TO EVERY SOUL  MAT. 24 vs 14).  and blive me that has almost been acheived, at the time of paul, how many people have heard the word of God, God wont come till all have heard the message of Jesus, cos its what its gonna be used as a witness unto all Men. and lastly, a 1000 years is just a day in the eye of God, so if you are counting all these things of 2000 years ago, please its only but 2 days to God, so they were not all wrong to say we are still in the last days. 2 Peter 3 vs 8

Its disheartening how people can twist things to suit the lies they believe am always stunned with the level of delusion christianity has done to humanity, these are clear facts that that need no explanation pls for God's sake do you need any boby to tell you that killing/lying isn't morally good?
The case of someone that believes the bible is God's word s deliberate ignorance or absolute delusion.
TRULY WITHOUT DELUSION ITS IMPOSSIBLE TO PLEASE HIM

toba said:

The tales u posted isnt the answer to my question. There are many stories in the bible from Genesis to revelation, Do u believe that the stories recorded therein are true or false ?

NONE of the stories in the bible have ANYTHING to do with the Creator. No God ''inspired'' anything in the bible, anymore than He ''inspired'' what I'm typing here.

That's really ALL you need to know.

Once you realise that book is nothing but the work of men, then you've answered your own question.

ROSSIKE:


What does it mean for God to be ''revealed'' to you? God gave you  spirit and brain for you to develop a sense of morality. You do not need the bible to know it's wrong to kill or steal, do you?

Do you think your ancestors did not know it was wrong to steal and kill, and covet their neighbours's wives before a white man came along on a slave ship?

This has absolutely NOTHING to do with slavery.

So when did God give us this spirit? and how did u know the spirit was from God?
your argument is so lame. . .so if according to u the revelation of God is encoded in our moral values. .  . .does that not make a case of God judging us based on these same "moral revelations" ?

It would take up too much space, and would be quite frankly, over your head. I suggest you read the Sumerian epics.

really? 

Rant? Actually I think it's sheer common sense that the Creator not be racist. Why would you think otherwise?

Because a Jewish book says so?

what do u understand by racism? were the Amorites and the descendants of Jehrico not of the same race as the israelites?
where the Edomites and sons of Esau from a different race?. . . must u cook up lies to suit your ill-informed and unsubstantiated opinions?

There is no ''Creator'' in the bible. Salvation is universal. Everyone will ultimately enter the Light from whence we all came. We are ALL aspects of God. We are ALL ''saved''. You do not need to do ANYTHING to live in the next world, just as you were not required to do anything to live in this world. Transition is a natural process for souls. If you are especially evil or wicked, you will need to reconcile yourself with the Oneness of all before you can reach the Light. The process of doing this is not ''punishment'' - simply a learning process. The Creator does not ''punish'' anybody.

These are universal truths shared by all the traditional religions, except the recent ''modern religions'' like christianity and islam, who claim you are only ''saved'' if you follow their religion, and damned to eternal suffering if you don't. This claim of course is entirely false, and only geared to Control, and Acquisition of power by their clergy, and ruling classes.

says who?  . . .thats a lie from the pit of hell.

Liberate a group of people from what? Liberate the world from what? God IS the world (and a lot more). Why would God liberate the people from Himself? Why would he command the ra-ping of whole populations and their mass murder, in order to liberate the people from Himself?

your understanding of God is deeply flawed. or perhaps I am the one who just cannot see it from your point of view. . .so can u define God?. . . .and what EXACTLY makes God the world?

Until you can remove from your head the false idea that we are all ''separate'' rather than individualized aspects of a WHOLE which includes God, you will never understand.

I suggest you read the accounts of Near Death Experiencers, whose accounts generally tie in with these ancient facts of life.

www.nderf.org



Strange comments. A literal reading of the bible says that Jesus spoke to huge crowds of people, raised the dead, healed the sick, was publicly crucified after a very public trial, and generally caused a lot of fracas in his time, including making the bright sky dark upon his passing, and rising from the dead on the third day. Now if you know anything about 30 AD Hellenistic Rome and Israel, you would know there were hundreds of writers and historians in the region who wrote about and recorded even the most mundane occurences.

Doesn't it strike you as odd that not one of them wrote a single line about ''Jesus the son of God?'' Not a single line about the man until a full 60 years after his ''ascension''?

That's like nobody writing a word about Nelson Mandela or Martin Luther King until the year 2030!


Err, No it's not an ''opinion''. It's a fact.

If you disagree, could you then tell us who authored the New Testament based on your research?

your argument is LAME.

Jesus mandated that the gospel be preached round the world. . . .that was the immediate priority of the disciples and not writing books to serve as historical records for lost souls. the bible u see today was written as letters to distant churches to serve as a tool for the gospel. . . . . , what EXACTLY are u on about?

@noetic please can you explain what you said about life outside the garden of eden?ive been tryna find it in the bible

babaearly:

@noetic please can you explain what you said about life outside the garden of eden?ive been tryna find it in the bible

The Garden of Eden can best be understood as man's place of dominion. . . .God said to  man in Genesis 1:28 to be fruitful, multiply and have DOMINION. . . . . .dominion entails the ability to do "excellent things" and to have all other "things and events" under ones control.
while the bible never talks of God calling or blessing the garden as a land of dominion. . . .we could however see that while in the garden, all things that were created on earth for man were subject to the authority of Adam. . . .that includes plants and animals et all.

when man lost his place in the garden due to sin. .  . . it is debatable if man lost his dominion. but what we see is that life outside of the garden was chaotic and barbaric. Cain killed Abel, men were murderers, drunkards, fornicators and lived a very sinful life until the time of Noah. life outside of the garden was a life devoid of God and full of sin.

The bible calls satan the "prince of this world" (Ephesians 2:2). . . but this was not so in the garden of Eden. Since we know that God frequently visits Adam (in human coinage) in the garden. So deducibly ,  . , the world as we presently live in full of sin and unGodly inactions is a system of events that glorifies Satan and his kingdom. life in the garden, in which man had dominion and dwellth in harmony with nature remains the original intent of God and world of God.

The laws given to moses and The death and resurrection of JC is God's attempt to recreate the Godly world for mankind. A world without sin.

What does it mean for God to be ''revealed'' to you? God gave you  spirit and brain for you to develop a sense of morality. You do not need the bible to know it's wrong to kill or steal, do you?

Do you think your ancestors did not know it was wrong to steal and kill, and covet their neighbours's wives before a white man came along on a slave ship?

This has absolutely NOTHING to do with slavery.

Oh yes it does. If it weren't for the west's desire to acquire slaves and natural resources from West Africa, you would not be a christian today.

So when did God give us this spirit? and how did u know the spirit was from God?

He ''gave us the spirit'' the minute he 'created' us.

God did not wait for white men to desire slaves 5000 years down the line before using them to ''reveal himself'' to us,  a mere 200 years ago. USE YOUR BRAIN - or what's left of it after the brainwashing you've been subjected to.

your argument is so lame. . .so if according to u the revelation of God is encoded in our moral values. .  . does that not make a case of God judging us based on these same "moral revelations" ?

''Judging us'' in what sense? There's no ''lake of fire'' where God presides over screaming human beings being tortured for eternity, contrary to the garbage you read in your oversized Jewish book of nightmares.

Rant? Actually I think it's sheer common sense that the Creator not be racist. Why would you think otherwise?

Because a Jewish book says so?

what do u understand by racism? were the Amorites and the descendants of Jehrico not of the same race as the israelites?
where the Edomites and sons of Esau from a different race?. . . must u cook up lies to suit your ill-informed and unsubstantiated opinions?

How would you know what race those people were when you've not read a single work on Middle Eastern history?

And no, the bible doesn't count.

There is no ''Creator'' in the bible. Salvation is universal. Everyone will ultimately enter the Light from whence we all came. We are ALL aspects of God. We are ALL ''saved''. You do not need to do ANYTHING to live in the next world, just as you were not required to do anything to live in this world. Transition is a natural process for souls. If you are especially evil or wicked, you will need to reconcile yourself with the Oneness of all before you can reach the Light. The process of doing this is not ''punishment'' - simply a learning process. The Creator does not ''punish'' anybody.

These are universal truths shared by all the traditional religions, except the recent ''modern religions'' like christianity and islam, who claim you are only ''saved'' if you follow their religion, and damned to eternal suffering if you don't. This claim of course is entirely false, and only geared to Control, and Acquisition of power by their clergy, and ruling classes.

says who?  . . .thats a lie from the pit of hell.

How do you know it's a lie?

And no, ''The bible told me otherwise'' is not an adequate response.

Liberate a group of people from what? Liberate the world from what? God IS the world (and a lot more). Why would God liberate the people from Himself? Why would he command the ra-ping of whole populations and their mass murder, in order to liberate the people from Himself?

our understanding of God is deeply flawed. or perhaps I am the one who just cannot see it from your point of view. . .so can u define God?. . . .and what EXACTLY makes God the world?

Everything in existence is an aspect of God. God afterall is the Creator of all that is, unless you believe there is another Creator.

Until you can remove from your head the false idea that we are all ''separate'' rather than individualized aspects of a WHOLE which includes God, you will never understand.

I suggest you read the accounts of Near Death Experiencers, whose accounts generally tie in with these ancient facts of life.

www.nderf.org



Strange comments. A literal reading of the bible says that Jesus spoke to huge crowds of people, raised the dead, healed the sick, was publicly crucified after a very public trial, and generally caused a lot of fracas in his time, including making the bright sky dark upon his passing, and rising from the dead on the third day. Now if you know anything about 30 AD Hellenistic Rome and Israel, you would know there were hundreds of writers and historians in the region who wrote about and recorded even the most mundane occurences.

Doesn't it strike you as odd that not one of them wrote a single line about ''Jesus the son of God?'' Not a single line about the man until a full 60 years after his ''ascension''?

That's like nobody writing a word about Nelson Mandela or Martin Luther King until the year 2030!


If you disagree, could you then tell us who authored the New Testament based on your research?

your argument is LAME.

Jesus mandated that the gospel be preached round the world. . . .that was the immediate priority of the disciples and not writing books to serve as historical records for lost souls. the bible u see today was written as letters to distant churches to serve as a tool for the gospel. . . . . , what EXACTLY are u on about?

I'm not referring to what ''Jesus mandated''. You obviously do not know this, but in 30AD there were hundreds of writers around the area ''Jesus'' is alleged to have been operating, and not one of them wrote a word about him, despite all he is reported to have done, including giving sermons to thousands of people, and being made subject to a public show trial and execution.

The works of those writers are around till today. They recorded even unimportant events, and yet for some reason, not a single word about a man that claimed to be the son of God and who supposedly raised the dead?

Come on. It's obvious to all but the brainwashed that the Jesus character of the bible is a fabrication, or at best, an allegory.

ROSSIKE:

Oh yes it does. If it weren't for the west's desire to acquire slaves and natural resources from West Africa, you would not be a christian today.

He ''gave us the spirit'' the minute he 'created' us.

God did not wait for white men to desire slaves 5000 years down the line before using them to ''reveal himself'' to us,  a mere 200 years ago. USE YOUR BRAIN - or what's left of it after the brainwashing you've been subjected to.


''Judging us'' in what sense? There's no ''lake of fire'' where God presides over screaming human beings being tortured for eternity, contrary to the garbage you read in your oversized Jewish book of nightmares.




How would you know what race those people were when you've not read a single work on Middle Eastern history?

And no, the bible doesn't count.


How do you know it's a lie?

And no, ''The bible told me otherwise'' is not an adequate response.


Everything in existence is an aspect of God. God afterall is the Creator of all that is, unless you believe there is another Creator.


I'm not referring to what ''Jesus mandated''. You obviously do not know this, but in 30AD there were hundreds of writers around the area ''Jesus'' is alleged to have been operating, and not one of them wrote a word about him, despite all he is reported to have done, including giving sermons to thousands of people, and being made subject to a public show trial and execution.

The works of those writers are around till today. They recorded even unimportant events, and yet for some reason, not a single word about a man that claimed to be the son of God and who supposedly raised the dead?

Come on. It's obvious to all but the brainwashed that the Jesus character of the bible is a fabrication, or at best, an allegory.

running round in a circle. . .and ur point is?

@ROSSIKE, ARE YOU AFRAID TO SAY YOUR RELIGION? AHAHAHAHAHA. SOME ONE ASKED YOU WHAT WAS YOUR RELIGION , YOU SAID YOU WERE FREED, WELL THAT IT'S RIGHT BUT WHY CAN'T TOUCH ALL THE RELIGIONS RATHER THAN PINCHING THE CHRISTIAN ? ROSSIKE BELIEVE WHAT EVER THAT SUITE YOU OKAY WE ARE DIFFERENT AND DIFFERENT IN MENTALITY . AND YOU KNOW IN YOUR HEART YOU HAVE NO REST OF MIND . SOME WHO ARE HOPELESS WILL ALWAYS COME AND CRITICIZED THOSE THAT ARE BLESSED .PLEASE ROSSIKE WAKE UP, OPEN YOUR EYES AND SEE THE LIGHT YOU CAN ACHIEVE YOUR DREAM OKAY DO NOT LOOSE HOPE.B,COS ALL THESE YOU HAVE BEING ARE FROM HOPELESS PEOPLE.

Deep Sight:

I just cannot get over this. This is just wow! I mean evryy line is completely false and unscriptural.

And this degree of blatant falsehood is being peddled here by Nairaland's resident gospel-preacher.

Olaadegbu, you of all people could stoop this low?

Look at Jesus' words agian -

Verily I say unto you, There be some standing here, which shall not taste of death, till they see the Son of man coming in His kingdom.

Since when did the transfiguration become "the son of man coming in his Kingdom" ? ? ? ?

Everyone knows what the coming of the kingdom of God is - and you shamelessly twist scripture to state that the transfiguration was the coming of the kingdom.

I am dumbstruck.

What lies!

The Transfiguration

"And after six days Jesus taketh Peter, James, and John his brother, and bringeth them up into an high mountain apart, and was transfigured before them: And His face did shine as the sun, and His raiment was white as the light"? (Matthew 17:1,2)

This remarkable transfiguration of Christ was shown to the three disciples so that they could actually "see (Him) coming in His kingdom" (Matthew 16:28), as He will do someday, when He returns to Earth "in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory" (Matthew 24:30).  This would ever afterward be an unforgettable experience which would strengthen the disciples for their critical future ministry.

James would become the first martyr, but his brother, John, would survive to bear the testimony far and wide for almost seventy more years.  "And we beheld His glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father" (John 1:14).  Peter also wrote of the amazing event: "For He received from God the Father honour and glory, when there came such a voice to Him from the excellent glory, This is my beloved Son, in whom I am well pleased. And this voice which came from heaven we heard, when we were with Him in the holy mount" (II Peter 1:17,18).

It is therefore very significant that the word "transfigured" (Greek metamorphoo) is also applied to Christian believers in II Corinthians 3:18: "But we all, with open face beholding as in a glass the glory of the Lord, are changed (read ‘transfigured’) into the same image from glory to glory."  That is, as we behold the glory of Christ in the mirror of the Scriptures, we, ourselves, are spiritually being metamorphosed into His own image.  The marvelous transformation will be completed when He does come again and "change our vile body, that it may be fashioned like unto His glorious body" (Philippians 3:21). HMM

This remarkable transfiguration of Christ was shown to the three disciples so that they could actually "see (Him) coming in His kingdom" (Matthew 16:28), as He will do someday, when He returns to Earth "in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory" (Matthew 24:30).

Did Jesus Lie?

[flash=500,400]
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C7oWuQbgmjY&hl=en_GB&fs=1&[/flash]

Click to find out.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C7oWuQbgmjY

up with hope

@Olaadegbu: Whats there a lie when the non talking , voiceless ghost came instead of the talking in the fashion of 'he shall hear God and speak all that he heard';

correcting by it, leading by it, teaching by it, reminding by it and glorifying by it'?

when did the that prophet appeared?

finally, Jesus warned people not to abuse anyone in even so much as to call any a fool, leading to lake of fire.
then he called people fools, even worse.

Sweetnecta:

@Olaadegbu: Whats there a lie when the non talking , voiceless ghost came instead of the talking in the fashion of 'he shall hear God and speak all that he heard';

correcting by it, leading by it, teaching by it, reminding by it and glorifying by it'?

when did the that prophet appeared?

finally, Jesus warned people not to abuse anyone in even so much as to call any a fool, leading to lake of fire.
then he called people fools, even worse.

You've been lied to and it's only the Spirit of Truth that can set you free.

Did Jesus really exist as the character we have been taught about or is this just a manufactured lie that a bunch of creeps used in search of world domination?

OLAADEGBU:

You've been lied to and it's only the Spirit of Truth that can set you free.

Exactly my point, Jesus the Christ  is a back-drop of many older ancient Icons like Osiris, Horus, Krishna, Buddha e.t.c

The Missionaries - Christ Against The Indians

This is an example of the sometimes twisted ways of humankind.

There was an Indian community in the Amazon region called Panare that missionaries tried allsorts of ways to convert them to christianity but failed. The reason was simple, christianity uses some basic pricipals to stupify their audience namely:

* Sin
* Guilt
* Punishment
* Redemption/Salvation

But they had a problem, Panare linguistics doesnt have words that are equivalent to the above because they were content the way they lived; all the stories of that the bible could offer were received as mere entertainment. So, the missionaries forged a plan. Have you ever heard of the expression

"What have i done to deserve this; it wasnt me who killed Jesus"

Well if you havent, now you have because this was the story they were to go on and construct. The deduction was that  before the Indians could be made to accept repentance and salvation - both equally obscure concepts to the Panare - one had to give them something to feel guilty about. Hence, they published in excess of one thousand copies of the New Testaments that expressed that it was the Panare who killed Jesus.

Here is a few transcripts of that version:

The Panare killed Jesus Christ because they were wicked.

Let's kill Jesus Christ, said the Panare.

The Panare seized Jesus Christ.

The Panare killed in this way.

They laid a cross on the ground.

They fastened his hands and his feet

against the wooden beams, with nails.

They raised him straight up, nailed.

The man died like that, nailed.

Thus the Panare killed Jesus Christ



The New Testament continued to read:

God will burn you all,

burn all the animals, burn also the earth,

the heavens, absolutely everything.

He will burn also the Panare themselves.

God will exterminate the Panare by throwing them on the fire.

It is a huge fire.

I am going to hurl the Panare into the fire, said God.

,

God is good.

'Do you want to be roasted in the fire?' asks God.

'Do you have something to pay me with so that I won't roast you in the fire?

What is it you're going to pay me?'

It doesnt take a rocket-scientist to realize what payment was being demanded; submission to the christian doctrine , the abandonment of their traditional lives and their customs, and the acceptance of Christianity. The Indians were terrified.

This was the terrifying statement from one of the Indian women "",  I don't want to burn in the big fire. I love Jesus."

It seems it was a common practice among the Christian missionaries to accuse Indians of killing the ficticious Jesus.



In 1795 the London Missionary Society dispatched missionaries to Tahiti. It was four years before any of them learned enough of the local language to be able to preach a sermon to a puzzled though sympathetic audience.

The Tahitians built houses for them, fed them, and provided them with servants galore, but after seven years not a single convert to Christianity had been gained.

The missionaries opted for a more brutal tactic reduced the local chief called Pomare to an alcoholic and then offered him backing in a war against other islands chiefs by supplying firearms (the enemy having only wooden clubs to defend themselves). But Pomare would be backed in a war against the other island chiefs on the understanding that his victory would be followed by enforced conversion. Since Pomare was supplied with firearms to be used against its opponents' clubs, victory was certain. 'The whole nation was said to have been converted in a day.

These are the deceptive tactics used by the missionaries to sell their lies. The deceptive tactics would involve imitation of the religious ideas of other their targeted and or other philosophies, and to persecute people to win their souls for a ficticious character called Jesus.

Again you can read for yourself:

The Missionaries: god Against the Indians by Norman Lewis