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|Am Afraid Of Applying For US Visa Again by swatch72: 3:03pm On Mar 20, 2010|
Hello Everyone. i am really amazed at the huge contributions I have been reading here since I was introduced to nairaland.
In the year 2002, an uncle of mine in trying to assist me out of my jobless & broke state then, contacted a travel agent who assured us that he can help me get to the US for a fee. We were both convinced he could do it when we saw other people he had helped.
He provided documents (work, bank staements, invitation letter etc.) for me and gave me a date of birth which I used in preparing my international passport, unfortunately i was refused the visa for false documentation.
Now I am interested in going to US and fortunately, my current status has changed from a job seeking guy back then to a middle management staff in a very promising company.
My fears now are that the US would use the false information i submitted then (8 years ago) to refuse me again as my full names are the still the same, my date of birth only change in the year of birth (the agent advised us then to use an older age so as to march my false job position), my birth month and day remains the same.
I have a new passport now with my real information and have visited the UK twice lately with it, but am afraid of submitting it to the US because of my fears that they might refuse me and worst still my wife (who has never applied to them before but would jointly apply with me as her sponsor) because of this incident in my past.
because of this i have been shying away from applying for US visa. All this happened before they started finger printing.
This is my first post here and I would greatly appreciate sincere advise from experienced people here on what to do.
|Re: Am Afraid Of Applying For US Visa Again by ULSHERLAN(m): 3:55pm On Mar 20, 2010|
dey r knwn 4 dat, but wen its ur tym dey wont deny u.
|Re: Am Afraid Of Applying For US Visa Again by justwise(m): 4:30pm On Mar 20, 2010|
I can understand your situation, go and apply and be honest in your application form, apologise for that incident 8yrs ago. Since you have visited UK without any problem chances are that you will be given a visa. Good luck
|Re: Am Afraid Of Applying For US Visa Again by omega25red(m): 5:12pm On Mar 20, 2010|
go and apply be honest like justwise said but never volunteer any information if you are not asked that is the key. when you go for the interview and you can't stop talking they will suspect you of ill intentions
|Re: Am Afraid Of Applying For US Visa Again by Vicjustice: 5:25pm On Mar 20, 2010|
swatch72:Logically, apology seems good, and people who were caught in visa deception often render apologies, but in reality, such apologies are frowned upon or ignored: apology can not overrule a decision nor does it make a visa officer to temper with fundamental rules and protocols.
I will advice you from experience and not from imagination or expectation; and if you're willing to accept it, then: Contact the embassy and request for an appointment to see the manager of the visa section, and that you have personal matter to report (most likely, they will ask you to say it straight away on phone, but tell them you don't feel comfortable talking about it on phone) in that case, the manager might be glad to invite you in. Then, visit the embassy without applying for a visa. Once with the manager, then explain your situation and how you fell a victim of unscrupulous touts operating as travel agents. If you know that the meeting has redeemed your reputation, then, you may later apply for the U.S visa. But if you feel that nothing will change, then you have to consider the security of your UK visa.
Bear in mind that the U.S embassy believes that the previous (fake) data are your genuine ones, and that means, this current one will be considered fake. So, i do not recommend you to go and apply for U.S visa now, at this time because, the U.S embassy will observe your UK visas and they will most likely correspond with their UK counterpart to report your previous data, and that you probably obtained the UK visa by means of deception, and this will result in the cancellation of your UK visa with possible 10 years ban from the UK.
|Re: Am Afraid Of Applying For US Visa Again by oyewolejos(m): 12:12am On Mar 21, 2010|
Who told u that?
Responsibility for giving a US visa lies on the Consular Officer who must be satisfied beyond reasonable doubt that u will return after your visit.According to U.S. visa laws and regulations, all nonimmigrant visa applicants must demonstrate to the consular officer that they have strong ties to their country of residence and must show that they intend to depart the United States after their temporary visit. While there is no specific list of documents to be provided or things that must be done in order to demonstrate strong ties outside of the United States. Visiting UK, Germany or even heaven does not mean u would be granted a US Visa.
And as u Applicants who attempt to obtain nonimmigrant visas through fraud or willful misrepresentation of a material fact may be permanently refused visas and denied entry into the United States.
There are possibilities that u might go undetected since u applied for a visa without finger printing but there are chances that u might be detected. Since life is all about risk then take the risk and hope and pray for the best but be prepared for the worst. Just be truthful with your application this time.
I can see u getting the visa though
Best of Luck
|Re: Am Afraid Of Applying For US Visa Again by justwise(m): 12:25am On Mar 21, 2010|
oyewolejos:I'm sure you read my post very well, i said [b]chances are that he maybe given a visa. He committed the offence 8yrs ago and since then he has travelled to the Uk 2times, that can only be a good thing and may be a plus for him. I don't know why you are writing full page about something else.
|Re: Am Afraid Of Applying For US Visa Again by Vicjustice: 12:50am On Mar 21, 2010|
oyewolejos:I disagree with this claim, if only you know how their computers keep records, you would know that the moment they type in the spelling of his first name, all other people whose first names have same initials will appear, and the more letters they type, the more the search narrows until it gets to individual(s) bearing same first and last names. So, they will definitely find out when their computer produces a name that matches his, and then, they will compare the date of birth.
|Re: Am Afraid Of Applying For US Visa Again by dinggle: 3:18am On Mar 21, 2010|
You stand no chance PERIOD! the only chance you stand is likely revokation of your UK visa and if care isn't taking adding your names to the no-flight list. I'm sure you are aware that ever since the mutalab saga the number of Nigerians on no-flight list has increased with the speed of light. And if you think you have to be a terrorist to have your names on the list, then purse and think again. Last yr CNN reported a case of an average everyday american kid (6yr old) and so many others who have never flown or owned a passport but had their names on the no-flight list either by data collection error or pool process. Once u re on the list it can take forever to have your names removed and u can kiss the skies goodbye.
Manage the UK you are able to visit or better still look towards canada. By falsifying your document you have permanently denied yourself entry into the USA for life as a primary candidate, if you like become a senator of Nigeria or governor in the future. The phone convo with the visa manager wont work for your case now, because even if u blame the falsification of docs on a visa agent how do u explain the falsification of your birth certificate?, infact that will make them add your names to the no flight list before u spell J.A.C.K. Ever since 9/11 visa process with USA embassies changed drastically. The VO has the final say to a visa than the consular chief. Cos' the VO answers directly for any visa issuance that end up becoming a disaster in the flesh of America.
See it this way, Americans seeing their land as an opportunity, cos they have tasted it first hand. They know everyone wants to atleast visit America. They also knw there isnt enough visa to go round everyone, why would they give their visa to someone with a tainted record when there are millions with untainted record waiting for the same visa?
Take responsibilities for your the decisions you took 8yrs ago and move on.
I hope you dont take it as being hard on you, I feel is better u can visit the UK than have your UK ability striped from you in a giffy.
However one process MIGHT work for you!!!, lol
Your wife wins an American lottery visa as the primary candidate with you as the secondary candidate, then you can now make that phone convo. But even if they still decide not to give you the visa or and add your names to the no-flight list which is likely, your wife goes to USA gets her permanent residence card or even become a citizen, works hard with a good record, then gets a lawyer and fight the system within the system! that is a 50/50 chance they might end up delaying your coming to America for 5-10yrs but fingers crossed! you might eventually come in, the down side you must have grown grey hairs before u enter, (lol)
|Re: Am Afraid Of Applying For US Visa Again by Vicjustice: 9:58am On Mar 21, 2010|
dinggle:You're entirely correct with this post. I know that he doesn't stand a chance if he applied for the U.S. visa again, not even after 50 years as long as there's this record of deception against him, therefore i've suggested that he meets the manager and see how he can redeem himself by coming clean. If he goes to apply for the U.S. visa, he will be caught and this would cost him his UK visa and the 10 years ban will be applied.
But however, theses might might interest him:
. . .Mr. Kaestner highlighted the strict procedures the U.S. Mission follows to catch and prosecute people seeking to obtain U.S. visas with false or fraudulent information, emphasizing that not only could the use of fake documents make a person permanently ineligible to enter the United States, it could also lead to criminal prosecution in India. . .http://newdelhi.usembassy.gov/pr051607.html
INA section 212(a)(6)(c)(i) essentially covers fraud related to efforts to obtain any immigration benefit. The result of a fraud finding is that the individual is "inadmissible" (not allowed to enter the U.S. or adjust status to permanent residence). Specifically, the section states the consequence of fraud or misrepresentation as follows: “Any alien who, by fraud or willfully misrepresenting a material fact, seeks to procure (or has sought to procure or has procured) a visa, other documentation, or admission into the United States or other benefit provided under this Act is inadmissible.”http://www.murthy.com/news/n_misrep.html
|Re: Am Afraid Of Applying For US Visa Again by joxiri: 2:28pm On Mar 21, 2010|
Regardless of all this visa issue and all what not I dont believe just because he falsified his document he can never go to the us, that is just wrong and advising him to not bother applying is wrong as well
It is possible if he applies and comes clean this time and can prove he will return to nigeria he may not be initially granted a visa but with time he may get his visa as persistence tends to pay off sometimes with visa applications and that is provided the applicant uses the same details all the time, and as another chap has said possibly going to canada doing more travel to europe, he can get a visa in future
I am not an expert on american immigration but my own contribution to this topic, is that poster dont just rule out never applying again that is just wrong anything is possible, I have heard and sometimes seen people getting visas in the most impossible situations
|Re: Am Afraid Of Applying For US Visa Again by dancewith: 3:10pm On Mar 21, 2010|
This is a tricky issue. if you had your finger prints taken, it becomes a lot harder. However I have seen some folks here, not one or two, who used fraudulent docs in the past, were detected and visa refused
They applied sometime later and got approved!!!
Some are not so lucky. My take is that the database is not as omnisceince as we assume
This is a fact. I am not sure about what goes on inside the embassy but it does happen
Goodluck though and may other learn from this and to the poster I will leave you with my Dad's famous saying ' when you loose, don't loose the lesson'
|Re: Am Afraid Of Applying For US Visa Again by segzeybaba(m): 6:02pm On Mar 21, 2010|
I think its all depends on the retention period for all biometric details collected. As for the UK border agency, they delete biometric details 10years after every visa application in relation to the Freedom of information and data act.
I dont know but i think United states should have the same procedures.
But you can always try, they cant revoke your UK visas, but they can make negative recommendation to the British embassy. As i learned, prior to 2004, US only collect 2fingerprints details, compared to now they collect all the ten prints, so i learned theres some technical problems before 2004 and thats why they introduce collection of all ten prints few years ago.
More experts can shield more light on this, this is an opinion.
|Re: Am Afraid Of Applying For US Visa Again by Busybody2(f): 7:11pm On Mar 21, 2010|
Hmmm, akiika, i bow for una oh . . .
|Re: Am Afraid Of Applying For US Visa Again by Busybody2(f): 7:28pm On Mar 21, 2010|
No one has advised the OP not to apply, all of you have been saying the same thing which is - apply at your own peril i.e. he might be lucky to get it or he might be banned indefinitely or the visa might be delayed for a very long time or that they could snitch on him to their UK COUNTERPART to revoke his UK visa.
And as for those talking about his luck based on his fingerprint being on the system or not, having no prints hasn't EVER stopped these people from detecting fraud. Like Vicjustice already said, they have their impeccable foolproof way of data matching to deal with that.
And as for Baba alaye claiming Visa application records are destroyed after 10 years under the FOI act, one question, if i wanna apply for permanent residency on the basis that i have been an illegal immigrant for the past 14 years, do they now only have recourse to hearsay because my records had been destroyed 4 years ago? Lol.
Do you even know they have backlogs of asylum seeker's claim still dating back to more than 10 years, hence reason they sometimes offer amnesty to clear it. At present they have a backlog of around 600,000 (na dem own "official" figure be this so add *5 to it, lol) and they are managing to deal with around 70,000 cases a year, finding out that barely one in 10 cases is genuine, yet only managing to deport just about 3000 overstayers a year.
|Re: Am Afraid Of Applying For US Visa Again by segzeybaba(m): 8:00pm On Mar 21, 2010|
Dont get me wrong, i never said, they delete Visa application records are destroyed after 10 years, i said biometric data is destroyed.
How long will you keep my biometric data?.
if i wanna apply for permanent residency on the basis that i have been an illegal immigrant for the past 14 years, do they now only have recourse to hearsay because my records had been destroyed 4 years ago? Lol.
Applying for a permanent residency based on 14years, is different, as they normally request the passport or the travel document you use to enter the country, they routinely also send people 'questionaire' to check the method of entry and to calculate time spent outside the country.
They dont destroy personal records, but they destroyed your biometric data, which is the fingerprint and digital photograph they take at the VFS office. so dont get me wrong.
|Re: Am Afraid Of Applying For US Visa Again by Busybody2(f): 8:22pm On Mar 21, 2010|
They don't destroy visa application record, they only destroy the biometrics used to determine the case, DOESN'T THIS EVEN SOUND LUDICROUS TO YOU, i laugh in BSL sign languages. Okay oh, siddon dia dey look.
Not only do they not destroy nada, they also pass it on to the Police. Or how else do you think Police can stop you, ask for your fingerprint and then detain you till you are handed over to immigration cos you have violated some terms and condition of the immigration rules and is wanted for deportation?
Even countless number of Human Rights Organisation have been fighting the Police for a number of years now to stop keeping innocent people's DNA on the NAtional Computer to no avail.
And what have the Met Police's response been, we need it for crime detection because even if you don't commit a crime, if your Brother or cousin or a relative commits a crime, we can use the "familial dna thingy" to trace them through you. AND THEY HAVE BEEN SUCCESSFUL IN USING THIS METHOD SEVERAL TIMES TO CAUGHT CRIMINALS.
And again, biometrics is not limited to one's fingerprint or iris scan only. People have to apply for a new passport every 5-10 years so that if they detect you are using someone else's passport or viceversa, they would upload your current passport, take a passport pix of you too and upload this too and use some mapping program to measure vital points on your face, like distance between your more to your forehead, distance between your eyes, etc to confirm whether it is the same person in the two picture, AND THIS IS A FORM OF BIOMETRICS READING TOO, so if they ain't destroying this, what makes you think they are actually destroying fingerprints like you have been fed?
|Re: Am Afraid Of Applying For US Visa Again by segzeybaba(m): 8:42pm On Mar 21, 2010|
UKBA and Met police have a different fingerprint database, IDENT1 and IAFB, but they do share intelligence and biometric when needed, dont be decieved, its not a rocket science, for instance when applying for a visa letsay in Nigeria, your fingerprint is scanned and cross-checked with the police database and immigration fingerprint bereau.
Police DNA and fingerprint is also quite a different thing, but u can write them to wipe off your data, ofcourse that discretionary, but certain people has been lucky to get their DNA off the NPC, or wait till your 'stepped down' date, which depends on the crime you committed or the age of the offender.
If you so wish to get a first hand information about this scenario, get yourself arrested and you will see how it works. Then you will know police need only name, date of birth and nationality to give to the immigration, thats why bare illegals always have a confirmed name firsthand to give to police when arrested, so when they pass it to their immigration counterpart, they know their legit, and just release you on bail, like the PIG FARMER ON UK BORDER FORCE on SKY lol
|Re: Am Afraid Of Applying For US Visa Again by Busybody2(f): 9:12pm On Mar 21, 2010|
I never said UKBA consults the same record as the Police, i said the Police have access to immigration whacchumacallit in case they need to detect crime. So although UKBA on paper would tell you what you want to hear, they can't destroy it cos they need it to share with other agencies under the Data Protection Act and this is permissible under section fifty something of the DPA act.
|Re: Am Afraid Of Applying For US Visa Again by Busybody2(f): 9:27pm On Mar 21, 2010|
Hey i love living life on the edge, i wanna get arrested, got any crime in mind that i could commit?
We only live once and i wanna try it all, lol
|Re: Am Afraid Of Applying For US Visa Again by AjanleKoko: 11:38pm On Mar 21, 2010|
I would go with Vicjustice's recommendation, but the US Consulate is rather cynical about such things. I'm not sure the apology thing would cut it.
Not even with recent developments a la Mutallab. You might want to forget about the US for now. Maybe in the next 5-10 years, but not right now.
Don't jeopardize your chance of visiting other countries in the EU, or Canada. 2 Visits to the UK usually is not that much of a comforter for these countries. Just fashy for now.
|Re: Am Afraid Of Applying For US Visa Again by segzeybaba(m): 12:54pm On Mar 22, 2010|
since ur 95, i was thinking of you, getting on the train without proper the fare, but bet you got your freedom pass or assault, even shoplifting are all minor offence but u can try paedophilia! that will only get your name on the sex offender register, and ofcourse your DNA and fingerprint will be on the NPC and if lucky they police might not call immigi lol
|Re: Am Afraid Of Applying For US Visa Again by swatch72: 2:16pm On Mar 24, 2010|
Thank you for your immense contributions on my issue. i guess the bottom line is 50-50 chances. I will take time and decide the way forward. left for me alone, I would not mind not applying there again but i would not want my wife and baby to loose their chances because of my past misdeed.
Really appreciate NL. Great people here. Thank you all once again.
|Re: Am Afraid Of Applying For US Visa Again by tunnytox(m): 5:01pm On Mar 24, 2010|
I pray that God will lead you to take the right decision BUT IF I WERE YOU I honestly won't bother to apply to the US, I'll rather just keep on with my UK visa and possibly get Canada too.
I really don't know why most of us Nigerians are crazy about the US, the first time I applied for the US visa was 2002 but I lost my first passport with which I booked the appointment so when I turned up at the embassy with my new passport they simply turn me back at the entrance, lol, but at the end I was happy I didn't apply cos as I was waiting for my sister who also applied on the same date (she was later denied) i could see some applicant who dressed like Traditional rulers too being refused, lol. Since then i have not even ever think of applying to go to US despite having so many families there, I'll rather wait till I'm qualified for UK passport and visit the US then visa free than wasting my money and time to travel to London only to be messed up by some overzealous visa offcers who failed to notice ppl like Mutallab,
|Re: Am Afraid Of Applying For US Visa Again by dancewith: 6:38pm On Mar 24, 2010|
I just had a discussion with a guy who works with a bank in Lagos who just came over for a holiday. This guy was denied visa in 2005 when he was sheduled to attend a comference in Florida. It turned out he was being scammed as the Nigerian organiser collected $1,000 from them and of course there was no conference
When he went for the interview the embassy found out the conference was bogus and denied the application. Since he was the first applicant, the others didnt bother to attend their interviews. He discarded the passport and got a new E passport
His interview was in January 2010 and he was granted a 2 yr multiple visa. No question was asked about the 'fraudulent' application in 2005 nor was he queried about the old passport
What does this tell us?
1 Like 1 Share
|Re: Am Afraid Of Applying For US Visa Again by Vicjustice: 8:52pm On Mar 24, 2010|
dancewith:Your story is not the same thing as the story of Swatch72 (the original poster). The guy in your story doesn't seem to have had his fingers scanned in 2005, and he must have used a different data information in his other passport; that was very possible before this finger scanning era. But Swatch72 is using same names but different date of birth, so that makes him open for detection and the implications.
|Re: Am Afraid Of Applying For US Visa Again by Vicjustice: 9:41pm On Mar 24, 2010|
tunnytox:My friend, you might not qualify for the Visa Waiver Program even if you turned a British and hold the British passport, the VWP is intended for original citizens of the countries involved and not for naturalised citizens who might not have comprehensive reasons to visit the US.
Bear in mind that when you become a british citizen by naturalization, your passport will definitely indicate that you're a British Subject or that you were born outside the UK: A passport indicating that the bearer is a British Subject, British Dependent Territories Citizen, British Overseas Citizen, British National (Overseas) Citizen, or British Protected Person does not qualify for travel without a visa. A passport which states holder has Right of Abode or indefinite leave to remain in the United Kingdom does not qualify for visa free travel to the United States
|Re: Am Afraid Of Applying For US Visa Again by segzeybaba(m): 11:04pm On Mar 24, 2010|
Sorry to bust your bubble, but how can someone go for an interview at the US embassy in Lagos without been fingerprinted in 2005? Fingerprinting started in 2004 with 2thumbprints. so gather your facts right before saying things you aint sure of.
My friend, you won't qualify for the Visa Waiver Program even if you turned a British and hold the British passport, the VWP is intended for original citizens of the countries involved and not for naturalised citizens.
If you get british citizenship through naturalisation or by birth or descent, the passport is all the same, the only difference ofcourse is the your birthplace. ofcourse a British Overseas Citizen, British National (Overseas) Citizen, or British Protected Person does not qualify for travel without a visa under the visa waiver program, but all those are different from holding a british citizenship, which make you eligible to travel without a visa to the United states, ofcourse subject to security and health requirements.
NOTE 2 ALL.
Can people stop coming on here to give misleading detailed informations
|Re: Am Afraid Of Applying For US Visa Again by joxiri: 11:48pm On Mar 24, 2010|
AH AH Vicjustice how can you say this
british passport is british passport and it lets u travel wherever you want regardless of how you obtained it, its obtaining it that is the main issue
|Re: Am Afraid Of Applying For US Visa Again by tunnytox(m): 9:05am On Mar 25, 2010|
I have at least 2 friends who have travelled to the USA with their British passport obtained after naturalisation even another friend of mine with Irish passport also obtained via naturalisation has travelled to the USA under the visa waiver program
|Re: Am Afraid Of Applying For US Visa Again by Vicjustice: 9:22am On Mar 25, 2010|
Vicjustice does not say things out of assumptions, whatever contribution he makes, he genuinely make them from genuine source, and having facts to back same up, it is not in his personality to give misleading misinformation. Please, read the posted article from a reliable website and pay attention to the bold line.
/ 25MAR10 / 0802 UTC
- Nationals of the above travelling under the U.S. Visa Waiver
Program (V.W.P.) must meet the following conditions:
- holds ESTA authorisation, submitted via
https://esta.cbp.dhs.gov/. The carrier has to validate ESTA
- holds own machine-readable passport (MRP) (issued for each
individual accompanying family member, including infants);
- holds a passport (incl. Emergency/Temporary passport), if
issued (or has been extended):
on or after October 26, 2005; but prior to October 26, 2006,
containing digital photograph or integrated chip (biometric
e-Passport with information from the data page; or
on or after October 26, 2006, containing integrated chip
(biometric e-Passport), and
- is arriving on a carrier that has signed the agreement
I-775 with the U.S. Immigration; and
- is holding a signed Form I-94W, if required (Visa Waiver
arrival/departure form issued either by a carrier having
signed the agreement I-775, see above, or by a travel
- is holding onward/return tickets (or electronic ticket
record or return passages) with a final destination to a
country other than Canada, Mexico or contiguous (adjacent)
countries/islands situated in or bordering the Caribbean
Sea, TIRULES/R36 unless passenger holds proof of
residence in or is transiting to such country/island, in
which case onward/return tickets to that country accepted.
Ticket validity is considered 1 year, regardless of fare
- is a non-immigrant;
- waives any right to protest any action for deportation.
Total period of stay in the U.S.A. may not exceed 90 days.
No additional time is given (extension) based on the
departure to contiguous (adjacent) territory. Passenger is
admitted for up to a 90-day period and a specific date of
departure is given on the Form I-94W (05/08).
Deportation on the delivering carrier will follow if the
Immigration officer determines that the passenger is
Passenger can make side trips to Canada, Mexico or Caribbean
countries/islands, provided first entering the U.S.A. on a
carrier participating in the V.W.P. and provided all other
conditions of the V.W.P. are met.
Timaticweb Version 1.3
25 March 2010
|Re: Am Afraid Of Applying For US Visa Again by Vicjustice: 9:41am On Mar 25, 2010|
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