“Imagine that a group of curious bees lands on the outside of a church window. Each bee gazes upon the interior through a different stained glass pane. To one bee, the church’s interior is all red. To another it is all yellow and so on. The bees cannot experience the inside of the church directly; they can only see it. They can never touch the interior or smell it or interact with it in any way. If bees could talk they might argue over the color of the interior. Each bee would stick to his version, not capable of understanding that the other bees were looking through different pieces of stained glass. Nor would they understand the purpose of the church or how it got there or anything about it. The brain of a bee is not capable of such things.
“But these are curious bees. When they don’t understand something, they become unsettled and unhappy. In the long run the bees would have to choose between permanent curiosity—an uncomfortable mental state—and delusion. The bees don’t like those choices. They would prefer to know the true color of the church’s interior and its purpose, but bee brains are not designed for that level of understanding. They must choose from what is possible,either discomfort or self-deception. The bees that choose discomfort will be unpleasant to be around and they will be ostracized. The bees that choose self-deception will band
together to reinforce their vision of a red-based interior oyellow-based interior and so on.”
“So you’re saying we’re like dumb bees?” I asked, trying to lighten the mood.
“Worse. We are curious.”

EmperorHarry:
“
“But these are curious bees. When they don’t understand something, they become unsettled and unhappy. In the long run the bees would have to choose between permanent curiosity—an uncomfortable mental state—and delusion. The bees don’t like those choices. They would prefer to know the true color of the church’s interior and its purpose, but bee brains are not designed for that level of understanding.

“So you’re saying we’re like dumb bees?” I asked, trying to lighten the mood.
“Worse. We are curious.”

The colour of the glass is irrelevant to bees. Their sole purpose is to find nectar, take it to the hive and produce honey. If they stand in front of stained glass being curious, they will not be dumb bees for long for eventually they will drop down dead, their type will not propagate, and such curious bees will become extinct.

Human beings though have bank accounts with savings in it and food in the fridge, so they have excess time, not only to be curious about stained glass, but to go in and join in with the worship of said stained glass. But even they are not dumb. I think humans set aside a few hours every seventh day for stained glass staring at. The more than six-sevenths is spent gathering nectar to make honey to store in the fridge or bank account or they too shall die and their sort will become extinct.

Basically, dumb bees become extinct bees as do dumb human beings.

budaatum:

The colour of the glass is irrelevant to bees. Their sole purpose is to find nectar, take it to the hive and produce honey. If they stand in front of stained glass being curious, they will not be dumb bees for long for eventually they will drop down dead, their type will not propagate, and such curious bees will become extinct.

Human beings though have bank accounts with savings in it and food in the fridge, so they have excess time, not only to be curious about stained glass, but to go in and join in with the worship of said stained glass. But even they are not dumb. I think humans set aside a few hours every seventh day for stained glass staring at. The more than six-sevenths is spent gathering nectar to make honey to store in the fridge or bank account or they too shall die and their sort will become extinct.

Basically, dumb bees become extinct bees as do dumb human beings.

I really don't understand what your getting at,no matter how many times i read your comment
I sense sarcasm but that's only an assumption
If you could kindly shed more light on your perspective

You and I have shown sufficient respect for one another for you to expect that I would not be sarcastic towards you. If I were sarcastic towards you then I would be the worst sort of hypocrite considering what I recently said to someone else. Please remove the sarcasm. I found your thought experiment interesting. My response is as written. If there's any part you need me to explain, be specific.

budaatum:
You and I have shown sufficient respect for one another for you to expect that I would not be sarcastic towards you. If I were sarcastic towards you then I would be the worst sort of hypocrite considering what I recently said to someone else. Please remove the sarcasm. I found your thought experiment interesting. My response is as written. If there's any part you need me to explain, be specific.

I'm glad you see reason in the thought experiment...And also know that we respect each other enough...
I've observed since the first time we talked that sometimes you say things that tend to make a stranger see you as a Christian without actually knowing your just being sarcastic...Hence my assumption but I now understand what you were insinuating
Been off nairaland for some days now hence the late reply

EmperorHarry:

I'm glad you see reason in the thought experiment...And also know that we respect each other enough...
I've observed since the first time we talked that sometimes you say things that tend to make a stranger see you as a Christian without actually knowing your just being sarcastic...Hence my assumption but I now understand what you were insinuating
Been off nairaland for some days now hence the late reply

It is a pity you think that, though I understand how you may come to that conclusion. The general attitude on here seems to be campish, as in, one must belong to a religious camp and adopt the beliefs that go along with the camp one belongs to, and God forbid that an atheist see any merit in Christ, or a Christian see any merit in Islam! Yet each camp claims they are told to love their neighbour. I guess the landlord has to check that those he rents to believe the same thing! (Yep, sarcasm).

I just don't do camp. I find I difficult to align my thought with the general public and I refuse to delegate to someone else my ability to reason. If i have a rule, it is to do unto others as they do unto me. We began in good faith, and I intend to continue.

Welcome back.

budaatum:

It is a pity you think that, though I understand how you may come to that conclusion. The general attitude on here seems to be campish, as in, one must belong to a religious camp and adopt the beliefs that go along with the camp one belongs to, and God forbid that an atheist see any merit in Christ, or a Christian see any merit in Islam! Yet each camp claims they are told to love their neighbour. I guess the landlord has to check that those he rents to believe the same thing! (Yep, sarcasm).

I just don't do camp. I find I difficult to align my thought with the general public and I refuse to delegate to someone else my ability to reason. If i have a rule, it is to do unto others as they do unto me. We began in good faith, and I intend to continue.

Welcome back.

Thanks mahn
I tots get what your saying...
I've being reasoning lately about the whole issue of religion and i was wondering about what could happen if there wasn't religion? Or religion is finally eliminated from socoety? It's maybe unlikely that I'd be able to predict what would happen correctly but my guess is that if humans knew that we end it all here,that there's no afterlife,no punishment after you die etc,there would be a serious crisis in the world...Even with religion,people are still doing the most sickening things in the world,even tho they may take the theory of eternal punishment lightly,it still rings at the back of their minds...Imagine everybody is now free to do as they please with only the justice system left to instil fear and maintain a balance between good and evil in the society? Do you think it'll be enough? Do you think people would deter from commiting evil because they could die or spend years in prison?Even if they would be executed won't they be consoled by the fact that they just cease to exist which everybody is still gonna do at some point? Take Hitler for example,the dude literally murdered millions of lives because he didn't like jews. Imagine?This could happen even at a more frequent rate if the fear of eternal damnation is eliminated...Which is why I'm still inconclusive as to whether it's the universe trying to balance the difference between good and evil(maybe that's why the efforts of atheists etc are continuously futile in trying to convince theists of their delusion) or if it's religion is something created a long time ago by the wisest generation to keep humanity in check...What i think is we should prolly be grateful for it...What do you think?

EmperorHarry:

I've being reasoning lately about the whole issue of religion and i was wondering about what could happen if there wasn't religion? Or religion is finally eliminated from society? What i think is we should prolly be grateful for it...What do you think?

There is a general misconception that morality would not exist without the concept of a judging god. Atheists would of course laugh at the idea that one cannot have due regard for one's fellow human being without the motive of a reward (a blissful existence in the afterlife), or the fear of punishment (eternally burning in hell). So, lets put this to the test.

I respect you. I respect you because you respect me. You probably would claim you respect me because you have religion, but I would argue that neither a reward nor punishment made you respect me. You just did, and continue to do so. But we could still argue that your God made you respect me. I, however, am godless. My motivation for respecting you is solely that I tend to respect people, and especially those who respect me, and I end up with the reward of being respected by those I respect which rubs my vain ego positively. It is a huge reward. You might understand by considering the amount of thought that goes into your responses to me. The fact you consider me so much says tons about you! Thank you.

So, we both seem to be treating one another with respect. Where did the ability to respect come from? I was not brought up with religion, but my parents taught me to be polite. I have morals, it was taught to me by my parents, and I have found it to be efficacious in my interactions with other human beings. I have, for instance, managed staff, and found that I get the best out of them when I treat them fairly. And people who respect me get the best out of me.

That however does not stop me robbing people, one might say, or killing people. So, why don't I rob others or kill them? My conscience, is the answer. I have stolen in the past. I have however found that I become uncomfortable afterwards and would rather not be in the presence of those I stole from. I have also found that I tend not to enjoy the proceeds of my theft because a voice inside me reminds me how I got what I stole. So, for my own peace of mind, I do not steal. You cannot imagine the peace with which I walk around in my hometown, for instance, a place where I refuse to assist in stealing government funds.

Imagine though how bad I would feel if I just happened to kill someone! My neighbour has not gotten over killing a drunk person who ran out in front of his car 30 years ago. He suffers from agoraphobia, he is constantly depressed, and he feels the world is plotting against him. Now imagine if he had killed someone intentionally. I am not a believer in karma per se, but it can't but prey on the mind, is what I find. Life is just too hard for me to add such agony to my existence, is how I see it. But I guess some people need cogent rewards and punishments to walk the straight and narrow path.

If there was no 'religion', we humans would have to create it, I am afraid, and I agree, we are better off for it. It is how we educate people to refrain from that which is bad and do that which is right and proper for humans to dwell in peace. And since we know there is no hell, we create hell (prisons) to throw the criminals into. As to petty sins, like not going to church on Sunday, or sex without marriage, I have not yet come across a hell that is greater than the human conscience, or the opprobrium of ones fellow human beings.

@budaatum First off I'm only a supporter of religion due to it's many advantages which outnumber it's disadvantages... I'm in no way a follower of religion cos it seems you view me in the light
Secondly,I believe it's erroneous to think that without religion and it's doctrines, there won't be morality in society because i believe like you've mentioned we humans have l a conscience,right?...So somehow it's supposed to help in creating a balance btw good and evil without a reward or punishment theory
But now that's from my perspective is a mistake atheists make,just like i once did...But after careful consideration I realized that atheists are people who have to a extent in most cases a higher IQ than the average human so this people tend to understand the world differently,from a broader perspective...You mentioned that you respect me because I respect you but then there are still people who would still disrespect you when you respect them... It's not reciprocated cos they decided to put reasoning aside... Now how many people in the world are atheists?How many have the intellectual capacity to understand life on the level of atheists?...Imagine the level of corruption in our country currently even tho religion is very important part of our nation...Yet we still have a very alarming level of criminal activities,hideous crimes fod that matter...Now there are people who are hungry and without a dime to their names, they've contemplated suicide, involvement in crimes and all that but there's this constant reminder of that reward and punishment cos you can't say it's their conscience alone...
There could be a surge in the rate of suicide,people would do things without giving a f***,cos I'm gonna die anyways so why don't i live for now and enjoy everything right now because there no greater consequence...If the justice system catches up with me I'd kill myself before anything happens.. I'm sure your familiar with the statement "God will judge you"...This statement holds a lot of weight to the people saying it(hope,that even though they can't/won't do anything to the offender,they believe that there's a much higher power that will do so on their behalf)...People say things like this even when the justice system is unjust and unfair...They could have reacted immediately but chose not to and leave everything to "God"...Imagine if they now know there's no other greater justice which they assumed there was,how would this affect society... I'm guessing it would be an eye for an eye kinda world...This are just a few examples of what could become if it happened...
My point is most atheists do not realize that people don't have the same mind as they do... I'd like to believe that most atheists do good and I've seen a lot of them(identified as one once) but then the major problem is that most people don't ppssess the kind of mentality atheists have or view things from their perspective...This is why I'm afraid that religion would one day be eliminated from society,i believe its already leaving the system and people(even it's followers) are taking eternal damnation very lightly...This has given rise to a new generation of crisis and conflicts...You can see the difference btw religious people before and now, there'sa very clear picture as to how this people now take the basis and foundation's of their religion lackadaisically...The end of religion could just as much be the beginning of the end of the world,i don't know for sure I'm only guessing or maybe humans would now realize that there's really nothing special about this life and be more reasonable (This i deem almost impossible)