ReysonDrabek:


Only reason i can think of for a hausa muslim not going to a yoruba mosque is most yorubas are salafs and most hausas are sunni muslims and staunch sunnis avoid salaf mosques even in the north. Other wise this whole idea that we see yorubas as inferior muslims is a myth. Yes maybe a good percentage of yorubas arent as devout as northern muslims and you may even meet some that visit both mosques and churches but that doesnt disqualify yoruba muslims as a whole as they are sometimes even more religious than northern muslims. Anyone who discriminates mosques based on ethnicity is on his own.

The salaf sunni divide is why you rarely find many yorubas named after Abubakar or any of the caliphs and companions.

As for differences in names, yes northerners tend to stick to the original pronunciations but even then the names arent perfect in many instances, like Adam in arabic is Adamu in hausa. But these deviations are less noticeable because hausa and arabic belong to the same language family.

Thank you very much for your contribution.

You might just have hit the real reason why some name a not given in some sections of the country- the various sects those sections belong to.

I had guessed it had to be a denominational thing like the Roman Catholic-Protestant thing but wasn't sure.

If a name is closely associated with a particular sect, faithfuls belonging to other sects will not give their children those names.

I will conduct some more research on the subject and give an update here.

I also appreciate your thoughts on the issue of Yoruba muslims not worshipping in northern mosques and vice versa.

This can also be situated in the different denominations (or movements) that founded the mosques and not because the northerners are superior to the Yorubss or vice versa.

Obviously a northern Muslim of one denomination will eagerly worship in a Yoruba mosque founded by the movement he belongs to and vice versa.

And then, there are people like you (who I place at a higher pedestal) who do not allow the divisions to affect your worship.

Unfortunately, many are deceived into believing that others are inferior to themselves. These unfortunate ones do not bother to educate themselves to discover that the bigotry they are fed and wallow in is nothing but a device to control people.

Once again, thanks!

MetaPhysical:


Thanks OP.

This is all I can offer you on the subject. I know someone that could have helped but I learnt he travelled to remote area. Give shout to imperial Yoruba and see if he has idea.

This might surprise you but there are many Yoruba names that are hard to tell who the original owner is.
Abubakar - Bakare. (Bukar in Kanuri)
Badhmus - Badamosi or Gbadamosi
Al Amin - Lamina
Dawud - Dawuda
Al Awiy - Alawiye
Mustafa - Tafa
Adam - Adamo

Abubakar is actually Abubakar Sadiq. Yoruba call it Abu Sondoko.

In christianity
Peter - Apata
Gabriel - Gebu
Solomon - Salome

Thank you so much!

johnie:


Thank you so much!

Add to the christian name list..
Israel - Asarailu.

There many Yoruba lores that have not been told and anyone qith scholarship can make good money telling these cultural stories.

MetaPhysical:


Add to the christian name list..
Israel - Asarailu.

There many Yoruba lores that have not been told and anyone qith scholarship can make good money telling these cultural stories.

Did I have a conversation with you once in which you pointed out to me that Yoruba is a script language and not an alphabet one?

I had raised the question of why Ifa has not been written down in text form for people to read like the Bible or Quoran.

Then you pointed out that Yoruba was originally a script language.

I found that discussion enlightening.

ReysonDrabek:


Only reason i can think of for a hausa muslim not going to a yoruba mosque is most yorubas are salafs and most hausas are sunni muslims and staunch sunnis avoid salaf mosques even in the north. Other wise this whole idea that we see yorubas as inferior muslims is a myth. Yes maybe a good percentage of yorubas arent as devout as northern muslims and you may even meet some that visit both mosques and churches but that doesnt disqualify yoruba muslims as a whole as they are sometimes even more religious than northern muslims. Anyone who discriminates mosques based on ethnicity is on his own.

The salaf sunni divide is why you rarely find many yorubas named after Abubakar or any of the caliphs and companions.

As for differences in names, yes northerners tend to stick to the original pronunciations but even then the names arent perfect in many instances, like Adam in arabic is Adamu in hausa. But these deviations are less noticeable because hausa and arabic belong to the same language family.

Salaf means practice Islam as that of how the Sahabas, tabi'een practice Islam so Salaf is not a sect in Islam so anyone that practice Islam without doing shirk like visiting babalowo in Yoruba land in the North know as boka ,and not visiting church I'm general practice pure Islam then he's is a Salaf so a Sunni is a Salaf in Nigeria we have Salaf organisation like IZALAH ETC so I would like to tell you that Salaf are not divided they are united any person that refuse to name his son with abubakar then he's a Shi'ah not a Sunni u have to know this we have alot of sunni/salaf in Yoruba land and Sufi Muslims in Yoruba land and also ahmadiyya in Yoruba land but in the North we have Salaf /sunni, Sufi, Shia no ahmadiyya In the north

labani06:


Salaf means practice Islam as that of how the Sahabas, tabi'een practice Islam so Salaf is not a sect in Islam so anyone that practice Islam without doing shirk like visiting babalowo in Yoruba land in the North know as boka ,and not visiting church I'm general practice pure Islam then he's is a Salaf so a Sunni is a Salaf in Nigeria we have Salaf organisation like IZALAH ETC so I would like to tell you that Salaf are not divided they are united any person that refuse to name his son with abubakar then he's a Shi'ah not a Sunni u have to know this we have alot of sunni/salaf in Yoruba land and Sufi Muslims in Yoruba land and also ahmadiyya in Yoruba land but in the North we have Salaf /sunni, Sufi, Shia no ahmadiyya In the north

"Sufi" was the word i was looking for not "salaf". These are the adherents of the original creed of islam brought by Usman Dan Fodio, the same creed found in most west african countries like mali and senegal. Better known as "yan darika". As you know these are huge divide between sufis and "izalas" who are purer sunnis.

You should also know that among sunnnis, the name "abubakar" is less prevalent among sufis and more prevalent among the izalas. I said less common, not completely absent. Sufis prefer the usage of the names of prophets. Among sects in islam various groups have certain tendencies as far as names are concerned.

ReysonDrabek:


You should also known that among sunnnis, the name "abubakar" is less prevalent among sufis and more prevalent among the izalas. I said less common, not completely absent. Sufis prefer the usage of the names of prophets. Among sects in islam various groups have certain tendencies as far as names are conerned.

Finally!

We are getting to the bottom of this.

Thank you labani06 and ReysonDrabek!

I found this interesting piece from which I will share some excerpts:

“Sufism is the mystical dimension of Islam based on the esoteric understanding of the Qu’ran.” The term Sufi derives from the Arabic word Sufi meaning wool such as garments woven from wool which were generally worn by early Muslim mystics knows as Sufis.

The Sufi orders first emerged when Sufi masters started to form brotherhoods around 1200 CE. Individual Sufi scholars contributed to the Islamization process of many African tribes in the West. Through this creation, Sufism became one of the major sources through which the Muslim philosophic thought is gleaned.

The goal of each Sufi is to emulate their Saint to show their level of commitment and to observe the same rituals, practices, rites and obligations as their Saint did, to gain enlightenment and to get to know their maker better.


Sufism is represented primarily in Northern Nigeria. Muslims in Nigeria can be divided into two groups: Sunni and Shia. Under the Sunni division comes: Sufi, Wahhabi, and the Muslim Brotherhood.

This leads to the two brotherhoods in Sufism: Qadiriyya and Tijaniyya, which emerged in Ilorin, Nigeria, that encompass a rich array of traditions, practices and beliefs that form a distinct stream of thoughts in Sunni Islam.

The Qadiriyya order, founded by Sheikh Abdul-Qadir Gilani, spread throughout Northern Nigeria after Usman dan Folio, who led a revolution against Pagan leaders, adopted this order. It became an ideology and a practical way to implement political change and reform.

Qadiriyya has programs built around education such as a nursery, primary and secondary schools, and a college that is accredited to award diplomas. All classes are co-educational which is unusual in Northern Nigeria.

Similarly, the Tijaniyya brotherhood teaches children and youth of all ages and also helps adults learn to read, write and study the Qu’ran.

Qadiriyya and Tijaniyya continue to finance and a run a range of religious and social programs that have the effect of preventing men, women and children from turning to these radical factions that pose a serious threat to Nigeria and surrounding countries.


Qadiriyya and Tijaniyya are able to do this in Northern Nigeria because of the widespread respect they have come to command over the past two centuries. In addition, their links to the Sokoto Caliphate (which claimed descendance from Prophet Muhammad) have provided them with legitimacy in more ways than one.

However, there is one issue that Sufism in Nigeria cannot seem to combat despite their various contribution of services. How can these brotherhoods still assist those that do not want to pick a side but still expect full access to their services?

https://navigatingnigeria./2015/04/06/sufism-in-nigeria/

MY COMMENTS

From the excerpts above, we can see why Ilorin and by extension the western parts of the Middle Belt and northern parts of the South West seems to have a distinct trait which we can trace to the sects which emerged there.

This supports my earlier assertion that the middle belt (now read that as the Ilorin axis) should be viewed as distinct from the Yoruba or northern sections.

Those outside the Tijanniya, Quadriyya and Wahhabi movements will definitely not name their children Tijani, Quadri (or kadri/ kadiri) or Wahab, respectively the names of the founders of the Tijaniyya, Quadriyya and Wahhabi movements.

The same logic applies to other names associated with each of these sects.

The various movements (sects)

From the chart, names like Ismail, Ambali, Malik, Quadi and Tijani will be common among people who belong to those sects.

ReysonDrabek:


"Sufi" was the word i was looking for not "salaf". These are the adherents of the original creed of islam brought by Usman Dan Fodio, the same creed found in most west african countries like mali and senegal. Better known as "yan darika". As you know these are huge divide between sufis and "izalas" who are purer sunnis.

You should also know that among sunnnis, the name "abubakar" is less prevalent among sufis and more prevalent among the izalas. I said less common, not completely absent. Sufis prefer the usage of the names of prophets. Among sects in islam various groups have certain tendencies as far as names are concerned.

Sufi is the esoteric dimension of Islam. The ones that deal in the mysteries of nature and its secrets....the babalawos of Islam! Yoruba Sufis are the followers of Qadhriya Sufism, which originated in Mali and had been in Yorubaland since about 1700. Dan fodio was not even born then.

MetaPhysical:


Sufi is the esoteric dimension of Islam. The ones that deal in the mysteries of nature and its secrets....the babalawos of Islam! Yoruba Sufis are the followers of Qadhriya Sufism, which originated in Mali and had been in Yorubaland since about 1700. Dan fodio was not even born then.

I dont understand how your insecurities are relevant to my comments. Did i claim dan fodio created sufi islam or that it was exclusive to him? Didnt i make it glaringly clear that it was this creed that dominates/dominated west africa? There is no such thing as babalawo in islam, anyone who claims to be that is committing shirk and is the gravest sin in islam. Would hardly describe someone like that as a muslim.

ReysonDrabek:


I dont understand how your insecurities are relevant to my comments. Did i claim dan fodio created sufi islam or that it was exclusive to him? Didnt i make it glaringly clear that it was this creed that dominates/dominated west africa? There is no such thing as babalawo in islam, anyone who claims to be that is committing shirk and is the gravest sin in islam. Would hardly describe someone like that as a muslim.

Not everything is fight. Learn to intelligently articulate points.

I did not say Babalawos are in Islam. Sufiam is the awo or mysticism or esoteric of Islam. The mystics of Yoruba are called Babalawo, so i used it to give sense, nothing more.

Sufism did not start in West Africa. There have always been practice of mysticism since creation of mankind. Sufis are the mystics of Islam. Dan fodio was a mystic but introduction of Sufi into Yorubaland preceeded him. Simple!

Johnie, its time for me to step out of thread so this good aubject is not derailed. Like i said im unable to further the point past my initial submission.
Cheers!

MetaPhysical:


Not everything is fight. Learn to intelligently articulate points.

I did not say Babalawos are in Islam. Sufiam is the awo or mysticism or esoteric of Islam. The mystics of Yoruba are called Babalawo, so i used it to give sense, nothing more.

Sufism did not start in West Africa. There have always been practice of mysticism since creation of mankind. Sufis are the mystics of Islam. Dan fodio was a mystic but introduction of Sufi into Yorubaland preceeded him. Simple!

Johnie, its time for me to step out of thread so this good aubject is not derailed. Like i said im unable to further the point past my initial submission.
Cheers!

Truth is theres always a charlatan that will misunderstand even the most well thought out comments like you did with your need to tell me dan fodio wasnt born when sufism started. So saying something dominates west africa means it started in west africa? Did i claim dan fodio introduced sufism to yoruba land? So you want articulate points but you cant understand even the simplest of statements? LOL! Stop being so insecure man.

schoolboij:


You are discussing an intellectual matter with an iboman whose only reasoning in life is hate and bigotry. Don't expect an intelligent conversation. That's the way they are.

There are also variations in the North; Muhammad, Muhammed, Muhammadu; Adam, Adamu; Yari, Kyari; Yusef, Yusufu, Yesufu, etc.

Even Yorubas in Benin Republic and Togo use French to pronounce and write their names, eg Tope - Toupe, etc, just as Niger Republic Hausas use French to spell theirs.

Mischief makers want Yoruba Muslims to be fanatical just like some northerners so that they can be burning their shops every now and then in the West.

Most Yoruba and Hausa Muslims are Sunnis just as most Turkish and Afghan Muslims are Sunnis. Because a Turkey man is bearing Muhammet doesn't make him inferior Muslim to an Afghan named Muhammed. Better still, that UAE Muslims are peaceful don't make them inferior or lesser Muslims to Somalis.
People decide the congregation they want and prefer to attend even within a denomination. I may decide to attend RCCG model parish to normal classic parish, etc

ReysonDrabek:


"Sufi" was the word i was looking for not "salaf". These are the adherents of the original creed of islam brought by Usman Dan Fodio, the same creed found in most west african countries like mali and senegal. Better known as "yan darika". As you know these are huge divide between sufis and "izalas" who are purer sunnis.

You should also know that among sunnnis, the name "abubakar" is less prevalent among sufis and more prevalent among the izalas. I said less common, not completely absent. Sufis prefer the usage of the names of prophets. Among sects in islam various groups have certain tendencies as far as names are concerned.

sheik Usman Dan fodio is not a Sufi because he has ban A lot of what the Sufi muslims do nowadays like maulud birthday of the prophet S A W and many more and in the world of Islam only the sunni don't practice maulud.

labani06:

sheik Usman Dan fodio is not a Sufi because he has ban A lot of what the Sufi muslims do nowadays like maulud birthday of the prophet S A W and many more and in the world of Islam only the sunni don't practice maulud.

LOOL I have never read a more inaccurate statement than this mate. Go and do your research. He was a bonafide Qadariyya sufi.

ReysonDrabek:


LOOL I have never read a more inaccurate statement than this mate. Go and do your research. He was a bonafide Qadariyya sufi.

Ahh I am a muslim from the north woo I have read his history for several times

labani06:

Ahh I am a muslim from the north woo I have read his history for several times

And you dont know dan fodio is a Qadariyya sufi?

labani06:

Ahh I am a muslim from the north woo I have read his history for several times

And you dont know dan fodio is a Qadariyya sufi?

Pure sunni or "izala" as its known is a more recent phenomenon in the north. Ushered by Sheikhs like the late Abubakar Gumi and Jaafar Adam. Especially the wahhabism you find is starting to dominate the north. Before recent times most northern muslims were sufis and thats why when you look at your grand parents, they are very likely sufis.

ReysonDrabek:


And you dont know dan fodio is a Qadariyya sufi?

Pure sunni or "izala" as its known is a more recent phenomenon in the north. Ushered by Sheikhs like the late Abubakar Gumi and Jaafar Adam. Especially the wahhabism you find is starting to dominate the north. Before recent times most northern muslims were sufis and thats why when you look at your grand parents, they are very likely sufis.

but do you know before the jihad of Dan fodio there is Islam in the North

labani06:

but do you know before the jihad of Dan fodio there is Islam in the North

I know, but thats islam mixed with paganism or "maguzanci".

Even though I am a Christian, I love this thread