When was raps greatest lyrical point?

80's
90's
00's.

i dont think 'lyricsism' has necessarily went away, its just that lyrical tracks dont have as much appeal to the MAINSTREAM audience as it used to in the 90s. In the 90s you had Nas, Pac, Biggie, Wutang, etc making hit songs/albums and the mainstream was more aware of these artists.
Today in the 2000's you still have lyrical artist like Jay Electronica, J Cole, Talib Kweli, etc. but you won't hear these guys getting their music played on 106 and Park for the most part (with the exception of J Cole)
popular music today is about catchy beats and hooks rather than raw lyrics thats why guys like Gucci Mane, Waka Flocka, Roscoe, Lil Wayne, Drake are what the mainstream media presents .

probably the mid-to-late 90's.

and for example, we saw the best music from the best lyricists in the 90's. Talib Kweli was on some other sh-it along with Mos Def in Blackstar, with Hi-Tek, obviously '94 - '99 Nas, Wu, ALL the Wu debut albums, etc.

ebeledi's right.

we just hear the wrong sh-it on the radio now. i could say there are even MORE ill cats out there right now.

Ok, where were we?

I was listening to some old school hip hop released back in the 90's, i realized rappers rap about real issues and relatable events. Tupac for instance: brenda's got a baby, changes, hit "em up, etc etc.

I'm beginning to appreciate rap music, there's more to rap than singing about b**ches, in love with a stripper, drugs, robbing a bank, being a gansta in a club and violence.

Complete rappers have a broad range of vocabulary and writing skills, flows, creativity and originality (definitely not for retards ) which most mainstream rappers doesn't have.

Hate him or love him, lil wayne is one of the ill cats right now. Boy is sick and he got flows i mean smooth flows, hehehehe . His lyrics aren't that deep but he's good.

What mainstream rappers rap about is wht the youths want to hear, it sells record and buys more blings .

Who knows these few good rappers like j . Cole might help influence future rappers and it might even get better than the so called "golden era".

listening to some underground hip hop

nellaluv:

Hate him or love him, lil wayne is one of the ill cats right now. Boy is sick and he got flows i mean smooth flows, hehehehe . His lyrics aren't that deep but he's good.

you lost me at that point dear.

you just talked about rapping about real issues and relatable events, and good rappers having broad range of vocabulary and skills.

and you mentioned lil wayne.

NO.

having smooth flows and wide vocabulary isn't going to do much when you're talking about rubbish. examples- encore/relapse eminem and lil wayne generally. especially when lil wayne spits punchlines like 'i'm hot like dogs'. 'winter hating on me cos i'm colder than y'all'. wack/cliche punchlines, no/repetitive subject matter, no metaphors, etc

if anything, lil wayne and the whole young money crew is what is wrong with the game. if they could fast-track drake and make him such a big star, they could use the young money name alone to promote a really sick lyricist on some bouncy commercial beats for the singles, at least, and leave the serious sh-it for the rest of the album . people would want to listen to the newest young money star, and the heads would appreciate lyricism taking the centre stage for once on a young money song. add a nicki minaj verse and a catchy drake hook on the lead single would still appeal to the 1 million little kids that buy their albums. but they won't. they'd rather push more wack commercial cats like birdman and gudda gudda and tyga and lil twist and co into the centre stage just so they'll make more money off them.

no. not good enough!

singing about bi-tches, drugs and robbing IS a main part of rap. Biggie did it, Big L did it, it's the manner of delivery. Big L spat the sickest punchlines and multies before he died. no one could touch him at that time apart from Nas. listen to Big L's 'Street Struck'. he knows it's wrong, and he tells the kiddies not to do it, but that doesn't mean he shouldn't talk about it. that's HIS life. that's the world HE lives in. that's the world he's going to tell you about. look at it from their perspective. if you sold drugs, you'd want to rap about it. music is a form of release. you'd want to tell the world about how hard life was on the streets, how many cats you lost, how many cats are locked up, etc. that's what your life is about. you'd pick up a pen and pad and try to write about something else, but it'd STILL pop up in your brain. that's just the way it is. no matter the subject matter, just do it right. paint a vivid picture, tell a nice story, brag, do a club joint, sick flows, sick wordplays, sick metaphors, whatever. just do it right. make it sound like you actually put alot of thought into it, make it complex, but just easy enough so everyone could understand. that's what Biggie was good at. and that's why i would never agree with anyone that says Pac > Big.

or just go over their heads like Lupe. it's your choice.

[flash=452,312]
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cwff61MTOUo[/flash]

[big l]
Yeah, it's the big l
Comin at you once again, in nine-five
And I dedicate this one
To all my peoples from uptown,  and everywhere
Check it!

Yo where I'm from it ain't cookies and cream
There's a lot of peer pressure growin up as a young teen
You never know when you gonna get wet
Cause mad clowns be catchin wreck with a tec just to get a rep
Instead of cool friends, they'd rather hang with male thugs
Instead of goin to school, they'd rather sell drugs
It's best to go the right route and not the wrong one
Because it's gonna catch up witchu in the long run
Brothers be all up on us, actin silly, gettin lifted
They life is twisted, and most of them are quite gifted
In other words, they got talent; but they'd rather sell cracks
And bust gats and run the streets actin violent
To them it's all about hittin skinz and makin some easy green
Cause that's all they show you on the tv screen
All they care about is a buck or bustin a sweet nut
They don't give a (what? ) cause they street struck

Chorus: big l

You betta listen when l rhyme; cause bein street struck'll
Get you nuttin but a bullet or jail time
So pay attention when l rhyme; cause bein street struck'll
Get you nuttin but a bullet or jail time

[big l]
Before the rap contract, I was sellin crack
Stay strapped with a mac, I was into alla that
I started rappin and got nice as hell
If it wasn't for this I might be doin life in jail
[size=15pt]And some of my peeps are still in the game sellin 'caine
If that's what you gotta do to maintain, go 'head and do your thang
But with the cash profit make an investment
[b]And try not to go to the grave like the rest went
Cause you can be rich with crazy loot, own a house and nine cars
What good is that, if you're dead, or behind bars? [/size]
[/b]And yo it's not even funny
I've seen a lot of my peers give up they careers for some fast money
They could've been boxers, ballplayers or rap singers
Instead they bank robbers and crack slingers
Aiyyo they used to be legit kids, now they corrupt
They had dreams but gave em up cause they street struck

Chorus: repeat 2x

[big l]
I still chill with my peeps in the streets; but most of the time
I'm in the crib, writin rhymes to some dope beats
Or either callin up some freaks to bone
But word up, I try to leave the streets alone
But it's crazy hard kid, in other words, it's spooky
The streets be callin me, like the crack be callin pookie
It ain't a dumb joke, listen to this young folk
Cause where I'm from -- you can choke from the gunsmoke
Stay off the corners; that might be your best plan
Before you catch a bullet that was meant for the next man
Or end up with a deep cut
Or relaxin on a hospital bed, from bein street struck

Chorus: repeat 2x

[big l]
Worrrd up!
Aiyyo take it from me, the big l
Cause I been through it all, youknowhati'msayin?
Stay off them corners you'll stay out of trouble
And I gotta say rest in peace to all the cats teasin streets
I'm outta here

if you're not going to listen to it, at least appreciate the lyrics. especially the bolded part. and compare it to the sickest weezy verse you've heard. i'm guessing it won't come close.

Hiphop was mearnt to b underground. Wen it went mainstream,it got perverted!

To me,wayne used to be bad but he's good now.he's not bad at all.you may pick out some of his flaws but he's only a human being.he drops more simillies than any other rapper out now.few of 'em may not be too dope but a lot are great.

I'm counting[money] all day like a clock on the wall

I keep her runing back and forth like the soccer team

They say I couldn't play basketball cos I was not tall/
They say I couldn't play football cos I was small/
They say I couldn't play baseball . . at all/
But now . everything in my life . . i ball/

Tyga is still growing.he's got potentials plus his a powerful delivery


underground cats aren't getting enough airplays though but,hihop of these days is trendy.in the sense that an artiste have to put both the hooks and beats into consideration while spitting his sick lines.

hax:


having smooth flows and wide vocabulary isn't going to do much when you're talking about rubbish. examples- encore/relapse eminem and lil wayne generally. especially when lil wayne spits punchlines like 'i'm hot like dogs'. 'winter hating on me cos i'm colder than y'all'. wack/cliche punchlines, no/repetitive subject matter, no metaphors, etc

Cause I'ma murder 'y' I kill 'O' and even you
Man, I got Summer hatin' on me cause I'm hotter then the Sun
Got Spring hatin' on me cause I ain't never sprung
Winter hatin' on me cause I'm colder than ya'll
And I would never, I would never, I would never fall
I'm being hated by the seasons
So bleep ya'll who hatin' for no reason

. . . and you call that wack , obviously you know it's a figure of speech and he's trying to make a point.

Ok, you're just hatin' for no reason if you say weezy doesn't make use of metaphors. He's one of the few rappers that make {over}use of metaphors and similes in his rap verse. His flow and delivery is overwhelming hehehehe . Didnt say he was the best but he's what's up .
 

hax:



if anything, lil wayne and the whole young money crew is what is wrong with the game. if they could fast-track drake and make him such a big star, they could use the young money name alone to promote a really sick lyricist on some bouncy commercial beats for the singles, at least, and leave the serious sh-it for the rest of the album . people would want to listen to the newest young money star, and the heads would appreciate lyricism taking the centre stage for once on a young money song. add a nicki minaj verse and a catchy drake hook on the lead single would still appeal to the 1 million little kids that buy their albums. but they won't. they'd rather push more wack commercial cats like birdman and gudda gudda and tyga and lil twist and co into the centre stage just so they'll make more money off them.

It would make a whole lot of sense if they actually do that, 'cos young money crew now is what's up .

hax:


singing about bi-tches, drugs and robbing IS a main part of rap. Biggie did it, Big L did it, it's the manner of delivery. Big L spat the sickest punchlines and multies before he died. no one could touch him at that time apart from Nas. listen to Big L's 'Street Struck'. he knows it's wrong, and he tells the kiddies not to do it, but that doesn't mean he shouldn't talk about it. that's HIS life. that's the world HE lives in. that's the world he's going to tell you about. look at it from their perspective. if you sold drugs, you'd want to rap about it. music is a form of release. you'd want to tell the world about how hard life was on the streets, how many cats you lost, how many cats are locked up, etc. that's what your life is about. you'd pick up a pen and pad and try to write about something else, but it'd STILL pop up in your brain. that's just the way it is. no matter the subject matter, just do it right. paint a vivid picture, tell a nice story, brag, do a club joint, sick flows, sick wordplays, sick metaphors, whatever. just do it right. make it sound like you actually put alot of thought into it, make it complex, but just easy enough so everyone could understand. that's what Biggie was good at. and that's why i would never agree with anyone that says Pac > Big.

Didn't say there was anything wrong with it. Street struck has more or less formed part of their culture

hax:


if you're not going to listen to it, at least appreciate the lyrics. especially the bolded part. and compare it to the sickest weezy verse you've heard. i'm guessing it won't come close.

weezy won't ever come up with anything close to this
even if he's high on the dopest s.h_it

Really, there's no basis for comparism

iice:

There are still good lyrics these days, it's just not as popular as before and mostly you can find it with the underground/noncommercial artists. There was a time, Weezy was more underground, i liked him then. Anyway, i like some of the commercial stuff, good beats and a great verse here or there.

Rap Music has evolved . . . there was an era of boom-bap, another of gangsta rap . . . we also had G-Funk and all 'em rest . . . early Hip-Hop had DJs who just 'toasted' over beats . . . Old School Rap (late 70s to early 80s) was nutin seriously lyrical . . . it was basic . . . it used to be all about partying and having fun.

The late 80s/early 90s witnessed the emergence of rappers who focused more on lyrics (the likes of KRS-One and Rakim) . . . emcees like the Notorious B.I.G then emphasized the other very important leg of Rap . . . Flow (/Rhythm/Rhyme/Cadence) . . . most emcees during this era were managing the dual ends of lyrics and rhythm well . . . and that's why it's often referred to as the "Golden Age of Rap".

How emcees flow on a beat is attimes overlooked all in the bid to spit 'sick' lyrics . . . a message is as important as its delivery . . . Rap ain't all about talking on beats . . . it is Music . . . as such, it must have rhythm and melody . . . that's what makes it different from reading Martin Luther's "I Have A Dream" speech over a background beat . . .

However, rappers of nowadays seem to be focusing more on dope delivery/rhythm, sick beats, and what-have-you . . . this ain't bad in its entirety - I believe that both the rhythmical and lyrical endz of Rap must be handled well . . . a handful of them still use metaphors, imagery, similes et al . . . but I always tell folks, lyricists are folks who know how to tell a story with so much graphics, imageries, etc to make you feel like you’re part of the story . . . folks that’ll pick a topic as simple as water and make it come alive in our minds . . . it ain’t all about bragging, boasting or battling.

I think such rappers still exist - emcees who handle topical issues well (like Common, Mos’ Def, Nas, etc) . . . they rarely get played on TV/radio though.

Most of the ones that get played are not necessarily dope . . . but they may also not be classed as wack . . . they might be lyrically inept but fascinating with mad-a[/i]s[i]s delivery.

One thing I miss is 80s,90s Gangsta rap.

nellaluv:

When was raps greatest lyrical point?

80's
90's
00's.

80s,90s and early 2000s. These days Hiphop is something else.

Lyricism hasn't died. People of these days are just too wack-music-lovers no Terry G . . They'd rather listen to wack wrappers like Ludacris, Drake, South Grunge rap, bling bling rappers, ice rappers, platinum-toothed rappers. . . Instead of Canibus, Joel Ortiz, Crooked I, Joe Budden etc
which makes them un-mainstreamed

Bamsyle.:

Rap Music has evolved . . . there was an era of boom-bap, another of gangsta rap . . . we also had G-Funk and all 'em rest . . . early Hip-Hop had DJs who just 'toasted' over beats . . . Old School Rap (late 70s to early 80s) was nutin seriously lyrical . . . it was basic . . . it used to be all about partying and having fun.

The late 80s/early 90s witnessed the emergence of rappers who focused more on lyrics (the likes of KRS-One and Rakim) . . . emcees like the Notorious B.I.G then emphasized the other very important leg of Rap . . . Flow (/Rhythm/Rhyme/Cadence) . . . most emcees during this era were managing the dual ends of lyrics and rhythm well . . . and that's why it's often referred to as the "Golden Age of Rap".

How emcees flow on a beat is attimes overlooked all in the bid to spit 'sick' lyrics . . . a message is as important as its delivery . . . Rap ain't all about talking on beats . . . it is Music . . . as such, it must have rhythm and melody . . . that's what makes it different from reading Martin Luther's "I Have A Dream" speech over a background beat . . .

However, rappers of nowadays seem to be focusing more on dope delivery/rhythm, sick beats, and what-have-you . . . this ain't bad in its entirety - I believe that both the rhythmical and lyrical endz of Rap must be handled well . . . a handful of them still use metaphors, imagery, similes et al . . . but I always tell folks, lyricists are folks who know how to tell a story with so much graphics, imageries, etc to make you feel like you’re part of the story . . . folks that’ll pick a topic as simple as water and make it come alive in our minds . . . it ain’t all about bragging, boasting or battling.

I think such rappers still exist - emcees who handle topical issues well (like Common, Mos’ Def, Nas, etc) . . . they rarely get played on TV/radio though.

Most of the ones that get played are not necessarily dope . . . but they may also not be classed as wack . . . they might be lyrically inept but fascinating with mad-a[/i]s[i]s delivery.

Yeah, and it will continue to evolve for the better hopefully.

Nice write up by-the-way

nellaluv:

Yeah, and it will continue to evolve for the better hopefully.

Amen! . . .

Nice write up by-the-way

Thanks, nice topic . . .

How do I feel? I feel good

Still smokin' that thing erhh??

Bamsyle.:

Still smokin' that thing erhh??

Always pon the matter!!!!!

Ema prince:

To me,wayne used to be bad but he's good now.he's not bad at all.you may pick out some of his flaws but he's only a human being.he drops more simillies than any other rapper out now.few of 'em may not be too dope but a lot are great.

dropping too many similes isn't actually special. that's when it begins to sound like a nursery rhyme. like this, like this, more than that, as hot as this, etc, etc. just my opinion.

I'm counting[money] all day like a clock on the wall

I keep her runing back and forth like the soccer team

They say I couldn't play basketball cos I was not tall/
They say I couldn't play football cos I was small/
They say I couldn't play baseball  .  .  at all/
But now  .  everything in my life  .  .  i ball/

i'd congratulate a 15-year old if he did that. not a grown-ass professional rapper. not when he's spat this 2 years before that:

Protect Me From My Friends
I can take care of my enemies
I come from where da niggas jus' kill to save energy
Sorry world but my mommy told me where the clinic be
So if u try to mimic me u prolly catch some sick disease

Six degrees leanin' on dat prometh-th-th-th-th-sine
I'm a centipede these men move at women speed
I'm bout my
"Spinach"
"Cheese"
"Dough"
"Cheddar"
"Fetti"
"Gwap"
"Money"
"Mula"
"Mozzarella"
Etcetera, Etcetera
F-uck competitors
F-uck These rappers
F-uck These editors
F-uck The Head of the State
F-uck The Gates surroundin' the prisoners
These MuthaFuckas tha prey I'm the predator
See me "Dreadlocks"
Tough as Bam-Bam from Bedrock
I'm tied to the game like wedlock
Say "hello red dot"
Say "goodbye life"
And say "hello, Satan"
A devil in the flesh
A rebel at his best
No complainin' we live in hell and I'm blessed

underground cats aren't getting enough airplays though but,hihop of these days is trendy.in the sense that an artiste have to put both the hooks and beats into consideration while spitting his sick lines.

nope. all they need is special favour from the almighty. i can list 10 underground rappers with great production, verses and hooks who are STILL not getting airplay.

------- I typed a longer post but my pc ate it up. this is going to be short (er)---------

nellaluv:

Cause I'ma murder 'y' I kill 'O' and even you
Man, I got Summer hatin' on me cause I'm hotter then the Sun
Got Spring hatin' on me cause I ain't never sprung
Winter hatin' on me cause I'm colder than ya'll
And I would never, I would never, I would never fall
I'm being hated by the seasons
So bleep ya'll who hatin' for no reason

. . . and you call that wack , obviously you know it's a figure of speech and he's trying to make a point.

It is wack, imo.  
Everybody uses figures of speech. Only the ones used properly are actually praised. like 'like short sleeves I bare/bear arms'- jay-z.

Ok, you're just hatin' for no reason if you say weezy doesn't make use of metaphors. He's one of the few rappers that make {over}use of metaphors and similes in his rap verse. His flow and delivery is overwhelming hehehehe . Didnt say he was the best but he's what's up .

EVERY rapper uses metaphors. not every rapper uses them right though. 'i'm fire, i burn niggas' is using it wrong.

Bamsyle.:

Rap Music has evolved . . . there was an era of boom-bap, another of gangsta rap . . . we also had G-Funk and all 'em rest . . . early Hip-Hop had DJs who just 'toasted' over beats . . . Old School Rap (late 70s to early 80s) was nutin seriously lyrical . . . it was basic . . . it used to be all about partying and having fun.

The late 80s/early 90s witnessed the emergence of rappers who focused more on lyrics (the likes of KRS-One and Rakim) . . . emcees like the Notorious B.I.G then emphasized the other very important leg of Rap . . . Flow (/Rhythm/Rhyme/Cadence) . . . most emcees during this era were managing the dual ends of lyrics and rhythm well . . . and that's why it's often referred to as the "Golden Age of Rap".

Nas perfected it before Big did. Illmatic nigguh. lol

How emcees flow on a beat is attimes overlooked all in the bid to spit 'sick' lyrics . . . a message is as important as its delivery . . . Rap ain't all about talking on beats . . . it is Music . . . as such, it must have rhythm and melody . . . that's what makes it different from reading Martin Luther's "I Have A Dream" speech over a background beat . . .

However, rappers of nowadays seem to be focusing more on dope delivery/rhythm, sick beats, and what-have-you . . . this ain't bad in its entirety - I believe that both the rhythmical and lyrical endz of Rap must be handled well . . . a handful of them still use metaphors, imagery, similes et al . . . but I always tell folks, lyricists are folks who know how to tell a story with so much graphics, imageries, etc to make you feel like you’re part of the story . . . folks that’ll pick a topic as simple as water and make it come alive in our minds . . . it ain’t all about bragging, boasting or battling.

I think such rappers still exist - emcees who handle topical issues well (like Common, Mos’ Def, Nas, etc) . . . they rarely get played on TV/radio though.

nah. when they do it right, it gets lots of play eg one mic, can't forget about you, etc

Most of the ones that get played are not necessarily dope . . . but they may also not be classed as wack . . . they might be lyrically inept but fascinating with mad-a[/i]s[i]s delivery.

disagree strongly.

list all the mainstream rappers you know right now. now list the ones with mad deliveries.

i have errmmm. . . eminem. who else?

Bamsyle.:

The late 80s/early 90s witnessed the emergence of rappers who focused more on lyrics (the likes of KRS-One and Rakim) . . . emcees like the Notorious B.I.G then emphasized the other very important leg of Rap . . . Flow (/Rhythm/Rhyme/Cadence) . . . most emcees during this era were managing the dual ends of lyrics and rhythm well . . . and that's why it's often referred to as the "Golden Age of Rap".

How emcees flow on a beat is attimes overlooked all in the bid to spit 'sick' lyrics . . . a message is as important as its delivery . . . Rap ain't all about talking on beats . . . it is Music . . . as such, it must have rhythm and melody . . . that's what makes it different from reading Martin Luther's "I Have A Dream" speech over a background beat . . .

However, rappers of nowadays seem to be focusing more on dope delivery/rhythm, sick beats, and what-have-you . . . this ain't bad in its entirety - I believe that both the rhythmical and lyrical endz of Rap must be handled well . . . a handful of them still use metaphors, imagery, similes et al . . . but I always tell folks, lyricists are folks who know how to tell a story with so much graphics, imageries, etc to make you feel like you’re part of the story . . . folks that’ll pick a topic as simple as water and make it come alive in our minds . . . it ain’t all about bragging, boasting or battling.

Seriously . . . I couldn't have said this any better.
Some people will not agree that hiphop has evolved, there's a limit to how many uncreative gangster stories we can stomach.
Not that there's anything wrong with that, but at one point in time people will definitely get bored, diversity is the only thing that's made hiphop last this long.
Blueprint 2, Jay-Z was saying he wasn't going to ever get his doorag off, Blueprint 3, he's all 'white Louis boat shoes' . . . and you wonder why he's more successful than any other rap artiste?? There's a reason why he has 8-10 super-producers on his albums, he respects the fact that to some people, hiphop is just music and nothing else, to the others, it's lyrics and fuckall and sees the need to attend to both sides of the divide.

Just to add to that, hiphop would have died without the overtly commercial side to it, the MC Hammers, Young MCs and Lil Waynes actually sponsor this genre of music.
They're the reason why people like Nas and Common haven't been dropped yet by their respective record labels, they're the reason rap is on TV and radio, they're the reason all these rappers still get sponsored to produce albums, and the reason people outside black America can still get access to hiphop.

Now even if you disagree(which I don't see any reason to) with how hiphop's packaged these days, the big picture still shows that P. Diddy is that uncle that molested you as a kid but still paid your way through college.