As discourse continues over the issue of restructuring to achieve true federalism, Ebonyi State Commissioner for Information, Barr. Uchenna Orji in this encounter with Vannesa Obioha cautions that some states may go into extinction if Nigeria embraced true federalism.

Years ago, the founding fathers of Ebonyi State came up with what they coined ‘The Charter of Equity’. The objective was to ensure that no bloc in the state was left behind especially in the light of the dominant role played by people of Abakaliki bloc who control two senatorial districts with eight local government councils as against Afikpo bloc with just five councils. Now that Governor Dave Umahi emerged from Afikpo bloc, do you think it has fulfilled objectives of the charter of equity?

It really did. And I can say that it is divine. Of course, it came from the platform of the Divine Mandate and when he was going to contest, the whole story everywhere was that you have never seen a deputy governor that ever succeeded his boss when the boss’ own establishment said no. That was the story all over the country. Of course, he became the first in our clime to become a governor from his position as a deputy even when the establishment was totally against him. And so, it would be as if it was God’s decision that this equity should be respected because at that point it was going to be abused, it was going to be disregarded, or discountenanced. But God, through a means I cannot comprehend to date had to bring him on board. He brought him on board and made him a governor to beat, made him a governor that every other state would want that he be their own governor. Some will say they want to borrow our Governor for six months, some one year. I can tell you that we are most amazed that in our time, we are seeing a Governor like that. A man that within the shortest record of time in Nigeria’s political history, was able to transform a state, from grass to grace, from zero to something. I have never seen within the shortest record of time, a governor that did that. And that’s why today you cannot compare Ebonyi with other South-east states in terms of development.

There is the raging discourse on restructuring the country to achieve true federalism. Is Umahi more concerned about restructuring the mindset of Nigerians than the country itself?

The governor has a concept about this restructuring. He’s talking about economic restructuring first of all, before we go into administrative restructuring. Economic restructuring in the sense that it is better that every state, every zone, be made to really harvest its area of comparative advantage. Today in Ebonyi State, we have a comparative advantage in solid minerals. And so what can we do to devolve the powers given to the Federal Government in solid minerals to devolve into the state so that we can take advantage? What can we do to see that there is deliberate funding of agriculture because in the South-east we have a lot of advantage in agriculture? What can we do also to create empowerment programmes through social investment programmes or other programmes, so that our teeming entrepreneurs, youths, women can take advantage and fend for themselves through MSMEs programmes, liaising with financial institutions? So, that is the restructuring the governor is thinking about. The governor is thinking about restructuring that will take care of equity in the sharing of the national cake. If a Minister for Works can come from Lagos, then a minister can also come from Ebonyi State or vice versa. The President can come from the North, he can also come from the South. These are all the restructuring measures that the governor thinks will make it possible.

When people say that they want a true Federation and you are still talking about independence of the local government system, that is not true federalism. So these are restructuring issues that the government is also looking at. A situation whereby the judiciary should also be given the environment, the necessary funding. In Ebonyi State, we are giving the House of Assembly, the judiciary, a level playing ground. Whatever is due to them, the governor releases. The governor doesn’t buy vehicles or whatever for them, he releases the money for them to build houses or to do whatever they like. Of course, our governor doesn’t want a situation whereby we can just say ‘restructure’ without providing for the states, because if you do that, all the states that are not viable will go into extinction. That will be another form of colonisation, and neocolonialism, that will impact states, Ebonyi inclusive because we’ve got no Internally Generated Revenue (IGR), other states have got their own IGR. We’ve not gotten full industrialization, other states are a step ahead of us. We have not got so many facilities that will make for independence- the kind people think. The governor thinks that we need to be given time, through economic restructuring so that we can meet up with other states.

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A northern group recently said that the north developed the South-east and the South-south. How do you react to this?

I am not aware of that. If it is a quotation from them, I do not know. But all I know is that we should, at this point, de-emphasise inflammatory publications, conferences, or press conferences that are very inflammatory across the north and the south, because no two wrongs can make a right. So the words of the mouth and the works of the weapon are the same before the eyes of God. But I can say that we have our individual differences, individual mannerisms. In the South-east, we are known to be entrepreneurs, we are known to be very enterprising, we are known to be good business people, we are known to be republicans, whenever we go outside our place and we develop that place, and we cannot say that we have all the advantages. In the north, they have advantage in agriculture, they have the land, they have the passion, and they are doing that, they have the funding from the Federal Government, and these are all things that you cannot rule out. In the South-south, you have the oil there, and if you are saying, you want restructuring and if you’re not looking at how you can fend for yourself after the restructuring, then they may be in a total disadvantage because South-south cannot give you the oil because you are South-east, that is not possible. They can’t give you because you are South-west. They will have to make use of what they have and if we are looking at federating units, Bayelsa will say no, my oil cannot go beyond Bayelsa. Then we have problems. I think that all of us are one under God, and from far north, far east to far west, where we are helping one another. We must keep it that way, and move forward.

The youths come up in conversation about violence in Ebonyi State and a recent report showed that the state has the highest rate of drug abuse. The governor has likewise said that the youths are brainwashed and susceptible to hard drugs. How is the government addressing these and ensuring there is reorientation of values among the youths?

The problem we have now is the issue of value reorientation, Ebonyi State, inclusive. Our youths have derailed and this has been brought about by long years of bad leadership. Ebonyi State is not an exception. I agree that before the governor came on board, our youths and women have been in the streets of major cities of Nigeria hawking and that is gradually being attended to in Ebonyi State under our Governor. But beyond all of these things, the Governor thinks that the creation of a conducive environment will do a lot in reorienting the youths and women through engaging them in a dignified means of livelihood, keeping them busy. A couple of months ago, the governor hosted a seven-day youth Summit, we called it EndSARS Summit. It was arising from the Federal Government directive that every state must engage her citizens, to ensure that the young ones would have a say in the affairs of the nation. So the governor has done that and has got to see that the creative industry will do a lot to bring them on board. We’ve got to see that the entertainment industry will do a lot to bring them on board. The governor did not only create this initiative through the creative industry, he also introduced a policy of what we call ‘catch them young’ or talent initiative, and that is happening through sporting events. Recently, we introduced a sporting competition for different events in a school, primary and secondary, and there will be competition across the local government, competition across the zone, and within the state, and this will make for a talent hunt and will make for people to also identify their talents, that way, they will be built. In our individual capacity, we are introducing what we call Talent Hunt Initiative whereby we look at all trades of life and engender a kind of competition, a fair competition in all trades, ward-by-ward, local government-by-local government and at the state level, we wrap it up. The idea is to raise the best in each of these fields and give that person empowerment. We call it the Vertical and Horizontal Empowerment Programme. Now, apart from this, the governor is also ensuring that school education is really fortified, especially at the primary level. What did the government do? The government injected N7.5 billion for out-of-school children programmes, and taking away children who are drop-outs from the streets and taking them back to school, that is, by giving them counselling, and also giving them scholarships, giving them free education, but it’s going to be compulsory. And this is working in every local government and development centres are given a task: look at the minimum number of students you must take away from the street before you are given a pass mark. And this is actually helping a lot because the governor is building a lot of infrastructure in the area of education to make them comfortable. Of course, he is training our teachers, and giving them necessary equipment that will make them do better, as it were. So these are the things the government is doing. But beyond this empowerment programme that’s ongoing, the governor declared that 2021 through the budget, which is citizen participatory budget, empowerment was given the pride of place. It is the most funded sector in our budget and the idea is to use the opportunity to raise the human capital of our teeming youths and women. That way, they will leave all those idle kinds of businesses, I can assure you in no distant time, you will see an Ebonyi State that would be really an example of excellence in terms of human capital development. Let me mention that we’re beginning to see the impact. The inferiority complex that we’re wearing before, the governor has pulled it out and has given us a new cloth of some sense of self esteem and self worth, and that is what is really helping us to compete and talk favourably with everybody, no matter where you’re coming from, no matter where they are from; Lagos or from the UK. I can confidently say if you are from the UK, come to Ebonyi and do a sleepover. I won’t be afraid to invite you from Lagos or from Akwa Ibom to come to my state.

Recently, the State Chairman of PDP Caretaker Committee, Fred Udeogu, said in an interview that the governor is yet to employ any civil servant since he took office and this has affected the IGR. How do you react to this?

Fred Udeogu was an employee of the governor for four good years. He was chairman of State Capital Development Authority, and he knows the empowerment policies of the government. But come to think of it, the Governor’s idea about creation of white collar job opportunities is that you need to do it in such a manner that it will be useful, both to the individual, to the society, and the government. The governor when he came on board, he looked at the level of civil service and decided that the first port of call would not be to inject more recruits or more persons into civil service, but the best thing would be to enhance their performance, to train and retrain and to ensure that promotion is on merit. And the governor also believes that a welfare package for the civil servants is all there is for them to grow. What did the governor do? The governor injected a N4 billion credit scheme for the civil servants. A minimum of N200,000 was accessed by every civil servant who showed interest and a maximum of N4 million was accessed. Now, the governor is looking at ensuring that the civil service should be very efficient, effective, and there should be no reason to use the civil service to siphon scarce resources in the state by injecting more numbers that have got nothing to do. Now that the governor has seen the need to inject more numbers into the civil service, he is injecting 5000 civil servants; 2000 at the local government level, 3000 at the state level and it is already working. I want to ask you to disregard and to discountenance that very statement credited to one Elder Udeogu, as most unfounded, irresponsible, irritable, and most fallacious. I can call it a concoction of fabricated mendacity that has got no basis at all.

When you talk about cooperation between security agencies and states, how do you react to the viral video of some Igbo-speaking persons who survived the recent attack in Benue and claimed that they alerted security agents about the attack but they didn’t get any response. Is that cooperation?

If they reported to security agents in Benue, then the Benue State government will have to answer that. Actually these are jurisdictional issues. I know that cooperation issues are usually between states and it is an extraordinary thing. Because, it’s either you report to that state or you don’t.

But you’ve also asked your people to come back home

The truth of the matter is that the delineation that made for the creation of Benue State made it possible for Ebonyi people to live in that part of Benue. As far as we are concerned, there are Ebonyi people in Benue. Ordinarily, the issue of lives and security is the duty of Benue State government, but where cooperation lies, is in the fact that when they (Ebonyians) have a problem, Ebonyi State will always ask questions, so we’ll always interface or engage the government of Benue to ensure that our people are taken care of. But come to think of it, it is the responsibility of every government to take care of the people in that state, whether they are indigenes or non-indigenes.

Whether they are there by any circumstance of creation of state or by whatever means, you are meant to take care of people within the confines of your state, even if it’s a disputed place. As far as the record is in your favour, you still need to take care of lives until otherwise stated. No matter the discouragement that greeted some of our people in the face of those security challenges, we need to continue to do our best to give information to security, whenever there is any problem.

Rather than asking them to come back, why don’t you ask the federal authorities to adequately delineate that place so you can have your people back because where they are domiciled, they don’t recognise or protect them and they are exposed to danger?

I agree with you that this is the agitation of those residents there to make a choice of coming back to Ebonyi where there is light, good roads and the government is close to the people. However, it is a constitutional issue. We are looking at the constitutional amendment process to see how opportunities can be given to people through referendum and through choices to elect to go to any place of their choice, especially where they have their descendants. This may augur well for people who are having situations like that of Ebonyi people in Benue State.

You hinted earlier that the PDP will be a forgotten issue in Ebonyi in 2023 and the governor is likely to determine who succeeds him. Are you implying that he already has a successor?

The issue of who succeeds our governor belongs to God. We have three zones that make up Ebonyi State, and the zone that the governor comes from is actually my zone. And so we are looking forward to, you know, having God decide who comes, but the governor believes in equity. He believes in equality. He believes in fairness, he also believes in zoning arrangement. And again, the governor also believes that as succession depends on God, whatever God says will be, but as human beings, we’ll be looking at a successor that will have at least 50% of the governor’s stamina. Stamina in governance. The passion to deliver on the mandate given to him by the people. We will be looking at people yearning for a governor that would have undergone the tutelage of this current governor. This current governor for me is an institution in all senses. A man of passion, who works day and night, who takes all text messages and also replies, who also ensures monitoring and evaluation, who also ensures quality assurance, also ensures that there’s no waste, who also is so vibrant, a good example of leadership. He is educated, experienced and exposed. When he goes out of the state, he really brings back whatever he sees outside the state that is better. This is the kind of person we should be looking at that will succeed the governor. Above all, it is God who decides who succeeds the governor.

QUOTE

The governor injected a N4 billion credit scheme for the civil servants. A minimum of N200,000 was accessed by every civil servant who showed interest and a maximum of N4 million was accessed. Now, the governor is looking at ensuring that the civil service should be very efficient, effective, and there should be no reason to use the civil service to siphon scarce resources in the state by injecting more numbers that have got nothing to do. Now that the governor has seen the need to inject more numbers into the civil service, he is injecting 5000 civil servants; 2000 at the local government level, 3000 at the state level and it is already working

I see

Ppl discover themselves in seemingly hopeless situations. Don't be surprised that those states will invent ways to survive better than others when necessity necessitates


Laziness is our bane in this part of the world. Mental laziness

26 out of 36 states won't be able to pay salary or complete any project without Niger Delta Oyel money

Poverty would chase many back to villages to begin farming like their ancestors

AKANKE79 THE HERDSMAN, WHEN YOU GO GET SENSE

No state will die if we opt in for Regional,Government.

Benue will die first
No lie
Anyways I’m officially an Igbo guy now
So it won’t affect me

Nonsense!
If they can't improvise and survive then let them die. Even the Bible admonishes us to always work hard so we can eat and there is no food for a lazy man.

Ebonyi State has vast solid mineral resources it can always rely on as well as agricultural potentials, so I don't see how they can't survive with ease if they're focused.

Enough of all these nonsense feeding bottle and parasitic form of governance.

It is well

Kyase:
Benue will die first
No lie
Anyways I’m officially an Igbo guy now
So it won’t affect me

Really ? I'm from imo but benue stand a good chance to be the first state in Nigeria to earn a trillion a year in Nigeria

Buy improved seeds , provide farming equipments , farmers gets higher yield u tax them 15% which they would gladly pay

Develop 200,000 hectares of land for farming , with processing facility around

Cassava to ethanol ,cassava chips ,garri glucose , starch etc ... government tax farm produce 10% leavy , finished product 10% tax

:oa

Jerryherd:
26 out of 36 states won't be able to pay salary or complete any project without Niger Delta Oyel money

Poverty would chase many back to villages to begin farming like their ancestors

Is poverty not crushing Nigeria already? We reduced ourselves to a wretched country when we all started relying on crude oil sales without any form of value. How can 200 million people be relying on crude oil sales of less than 2mbpd even when most of the proceeds are stolen at source. Countries of just 6 million people sell more crude oil than us!

It's only in Nigeria that you will see thousands of so-called workers in ministries and local governments who do nothing except to watch television and gossip all day only to wait for salary at month end. The Chinese didn't become great by being so lazy and corrupt like Nigeria. Every damn person out of their 1 billion plus population is doing something, that's why their GDP and GNP is staggering!!

Of what use is the overbloated civil servants, many of whom rarely do anything and thus adds very little value to the GDP yet only to take up most of the revenue in terms of salary payments?

The government of Nigeria is very useless. Otherwise, cities like Aba, Lagos, Onitsha, Kano, Nnewi ought to have dedicated power plants built for industrial clusters. If a city like Aba should have such power supply at affordable rates, it would be able to produce enough consumer goods that will serve the entire SSA instead of exporting our jobs to China.

FreeIgbos:
Nonsense!
If they can't improvise and survive then let them die. Even the Bible admonishes us to always work hard so we can eat and there is no food for a lazy man.

Ebonyi State has vast solid mineral resources it can always rely on as well as agricultural potentials, so I don't see how they can't survive with ease if they're focused.

Enough of all these nonsense feeding bottle and parasitic form of governance.

Why do u people talk about resources n agriculture ...the only way a nation or state can survive is similar... providing enabling environment for private persons to do business then tax them ...tax is the surest way to grow

only few will die

Y

Kyase:
Benue will die first
No lie
Anyways I’m officially an Igbo guy now
So it won’t affect me

Benue won't die. It is the activities of Herdsmen that is affecting the state

No they will not die sir.

This is what happens when your reasoning is revolving around federal allocations.

The current crop of politicians will loss relevance, most would probably take up another nationality or end up in jail.

It will give rise to politicians who can really make things work.

mrvitalis:

Why do u people talk about resources n agriculture ...the only way a nation or state can survive is similar... providing enabling environment for private persons to do business then tax them ...tax is the surest way to grow

You're not being realistic. There is a difference between advanced countries with high purchasing power and GDP and poor underdeveloped countries. A country like UK can tax itself and survive on it and similarly, a state like Lagos that houses virtually almost the entire Nigeria economy can also survive on tax but the rest of Nigeria can't.

Providing enabling environment is important but it's not the only way to grow and neither will tax do that in an underdeveloped country. Every state in Nigeria has comparative advantage in one area or another they can harness. It can be in agriculture (mechanized), it can be in solid minerals, it can be in industrial production. However, the key will be to produce enough for not just the local market but for exports because we do not have the sort of local purchasing power that can trigger self reliance and optimal growth.

FreeIgbos:


You're not being realistic. There is a difference between advanced countries with high purchasing power and GDP and poor underdeveloped countries. A country like UK can tax itself and survive on it and similarly, a state like Lagos that houses virtually almost the entire Nigeria economy can also survive on tax but the rest of Nigeria can't.

Providing enabling environment is important but it's not the only way to grow and neither will tax do that in an underdeveloped country. Every state in Nigeria has comparative advantage in one area or another they can harness. It can be in agriculture (mechanized), it can be in solid minerals, it can be in industrial production. However, the key will be to produce enough for not just the local market but for exports because we do not have the sort of local purchasing power that can trigger self reliance and optimal growth.

If u can pay #100 tax when u have #1k u can't pay 100k when u have one million

If u have 5 million people paying #100 tax that's 500 million

Tax is with respect to what u earn it make simple

FreeIgbos:


You're not being realistic. There is a difference between advanced countries with high purchasing power and GDP and poor underdeveloped countries. A country like UK can tax itself and survive on it and similarly, a state like Lagos that houses virtually almost the entire Nigeria economy can also survive on tax but the rest of Nigeria can't.

Providing enabling environment is important but it's not the only way to grow and neither will tax do that in an underdeveloped country. Every state in Nigeria has comparative advantage in one area or another they can harness. It can be in agriculture (mechanized), it can be in solid minerals, it can be in industrial production. However, the key will be to produce enough for not just the local market but for exports because we do not have the sort of local purchasing power that can trigger self reliance and optimal growth.

So how can a government generate revenue from mechanized agriculture u all keep talking about if not through tax ,

Give it a try and see how it works out over time

Freeigbo and Mrvitalis.

No state will die if we practice regional government (with the 6 regions)

Someone said Benue will die, if Benue wants to die we have states like Plateau, Kwara, to push em up (North Central)

If state like Ekiti want to to die, we have states like Ogun, Lagos, Oyo, Ondo to push her up

If state like Eboyin wants to die, if have states like Anambra, IMO, Abia to push her up.

Etc.
Regionalism is the way forward with 6 regions.

mrvitalis:

Really ? I'm from imo but benue stand a good chance to be the first state in Nigeria to earn a trillion a year in Nigeria

Buy improved seeds , provide farming equipments , farmers gets higher yield u tax them 15% which they would gladly pay

Develop 200,000 hectares of land for farming , with processing facility around

Cassava to ethanol ,cassava chips ,garri glucose , starch etc ... government tax farm produce 10% leavy , finished product 10% tax

Don’t whine us ooo
We don’t have leadership for that

It's not the States that will die but dark area called Nigeria, let's end Nigeria now.

achiever12:


Benue won't die. It is the activities of Herdsmen that is affecting the state

Before herdsmen what was the achievement
Nothing, absolute nada

Kyase:

Don’t whine us ooo
We don’t have leadership for that

When allocation no come then they would Begin to ask for help then ideas would come

Kyase:


Before herdsmen what was the achievement
Nothing, absolute nada

Benue is a farming state

Omoluabi1stborn:
Freeigbo and Mrvitalis.

No state will die if we practice regional government (with the 6 regions)

Someone said Benue will die, if Benue wants to die we have states like Plateau, Kwara, to push em up (North Central)

If state like Ekiti want to to die, we have states like Ogun, Lagos, Oyo, Ondo to push her up

If state like Eboyin wants to die, if have states like Anambra, IMO, Abia to push her up.

Etc.
Regionalism is the way forward with 6 regions.

Regional government alone won't solve our problem ...we need province that are independent ... regional government might work for yorubas and igbos because we are one tribe

But what of middle belt and Niger delta

Each tribe should be independent as a province handle their resources and security then pay tax to the regional government simple