An atheist affirmed during our discussion today that 'our argument should be based on facts and logic' Alright, the theists has always being at the receiving end of all manners of questions,its only fair that the atheists reciprocate. OK here we go. what are the facts and logic behind atheism? what makes the atheists feel so strong about their beliefs? is their any scientific facts behind atheism? I'm assuming that most of u weren't born into atheism, so what prompted u into atheism? ill pause for now

Th4is is based on curiosity and prob2ably to learn fro6m the atheists. We await ur response(s)

you go wait tire. That's if they dont recommend amazon books to you.

For the millionth time., atheism is not about ANY BELEIF. There are no beliefs. We have nothing to prove simply because there is nothing to prove. Atheists , like scientist, simply ask common sense questions such as : what? who? when? how?and says " show me the evidence". Athiest just exhibit what should come natural to all thinking humans: a healthy sceptism and suspicion of claims and asertions that cannot  be proven or verified.  An athiest is a free person who is not burdened or held hostage by any dogmatic belief. There is no rigidly held opinion or belief.

globexl:

For the millionth time., atheism is not about ANY BELEIF. There are no beliefs. We have nothing to prove simply because there is nothing to prove. Atheists , like scientist, simply ask common sense questions such as : what? who? when? how?and says " show me the evidence". Athiest just exhibit what should come natural to all thinking humans: a healthy sceptism and suspicion of claims and asertions that cannot  be proven or verified.  An athiest is a free person who is not burdened or held hostage by any dogmatic belief. There is no rigidly held opinion or belief.

Ah another one in the long list making the false link between atheists and science. Has the atheist asked commonsense questions OF science like what did we evolve from? who did we evolve from? When did we start evolving? How was the first RNA designed? Has the atheist asked scientists to "show him the evidence"?

My dear, atheism is itself FAITH in pseudo-science.

We all that the presence of clouds, air temperature, atmospheric pressure and wind direction will determine when its going to rain, where it's going to rain, how much rain and the intensity of the rainfall. We can now calculate and predict weather with great accuracy because we collate observable data to make such predictions. Now ,if on the other hand someone tell me that god or some invisible spirit is going to make the rain to fall tomorrow, I will first of all laugh at that person before I ask for proof of that claim.

globexl:

We all that the presence of clouds, air temperature, atmospheric pressure and wind direction will determine when its going to rain, where it's going to rain, how much rain and the intensity of the rainfall. We can now calculate and predict weather with great accuracy because we collate observable data to make such predictions. Now ,if on the other hand someone tell me that god or some invisible spirit is going to make the rain to fall tomorrow, I will first of all laugh at that person before I ask for proof of that claim.

and will you also laugh at scientists who say you came from gas and water?

globexl don't u know that all u have said above show how indoctrinated atheists are. Holding to one form of belief. Now u would tell me that u require some incredible proofs/evidence to back down on yr conviction isn't it? pity I'm posting on mobile, would have shown u flaws in your 1st and 2nd post. this kind logic is questionable

Interestingly, you are today using ur computer( a product of science) to voice out ur distrust of scientific rationality. Do you know who the designers of and how the microprocessors in your pc are designed and how they work to perform the billions of calculation sper second that help you do all that fancy stuff on ur pc? I  bet you dont know. But you have  enough faith in the abiliy of the pc to do these things for you. That's because others had already devoted their intellect to do that work for you, and so u have faith in those that did it. right?
Science and knowledge are  growing and evolving(thanks to the imasculation of religion over the past two centuries). Wat we dont know today, we may get to know tomorrow or in the next 100 yrs.
Science(emperical thinking) has NEVER EVER claimed absolute knowledge of anything.
Let me quote again wat a great man once said: " It is always best to start from a position of doubt to arrive at certainty than to start from a position of certainty and then arrive at doubts".
That says it all. Am just trying to point out how and what atheist think. Unlike theist and religious people, I am not trying to convince anyone of anything.
Who am I to tell you how good or bad your opium taste? You are the one smoking it, so you are very free to bask in whatever illusions or delusions that your opium creates for you. Just try not to hate others who don't share it with you.

You guys are hilarious. I dont hold any beliefs. Let me give you another example. when i was in form science class, we were told that matter exists in three states namely solid, liquid and gas. Today, more than 30 yrs later, other states of matter have been discovered such as plasma and other sub-atomic states. So we know know that matter in many more states than we originally knew. So we have upgraded our thinking to the new knowledge. PLS WAT IS WRONG WITH THAT?
Honestly , religious belief remains very big mystery to me.

Let me give you another analogy: if I come to you and ask you to invest N1m of your money with me and I promise to increase it to ten million naira in one month, what would be your natural response? let me answer for you, you be sceptical because you know that it almost imposible to turn N1m into N10m in a month. You would suspect fraud and you at least demend to know How I'm going to do it and proof that I have done it before. ABI? But If I tell you that you dont need proof , all that you need is to look at the expensive clothes and jewelry am wearing as proof then have faith in me, would any of you posters have over your hard earned N1m to me on blind faith? If your answer is no, then we have something in common: HEALTHY SCEPTISM. The only diffeence is that when it comes to religion, your defences are easily broken because, like most humans, you need something to believe.

toba:

globexl don't u know that all u have said above show how indoctrinated atheists are. Holding to one form of belief. Now u would tell me that u require some incredible proofs/evidence to back down on yr conviction isn't it? pity I'm posting on mobile, would have shown u flaws in your 1st and 2nd post. this kind logic is questionable

dont mind him. he's too narrow-minded to see his own FAITH.

globexl:

Interestingly, you are today using your computer( a product of science) to voice out your distrust of scientific rationality. Do you know who the designers of and how the microprocessors in your pc are designed and how they work to perform the billions of calculation sper second that help you do all that fancy stuff on your pc? I  bet you dont know. But you have  enough faith in the abiliy of the pc to do these things for you. That's because others had already devoted their intellect to do that work for you, and so u have faith in those that did it. right?
Science and knowledge are  growing and evolving(thanks to the imasculation of religion over the past two centuries). Wat we dont know today, we may get to know tomorrow or in the next 100 yrs.
Science(emperical thinking) has NEVER EVER claimed absolute knowledge of anything.
Let me quote again wat a great man once said: " It is always best to start from a position of doubt to arrive at certainty than to start from a position of certainty and then arrive at doubts".
That says it all. Am just trying to point out how and what atheist think. Unlike theist and religious people, I am not trying to convince anyone of anything.
Who am I to tell you how good or bad your opium taste? You are the one smoking it, so you are very free to bask in whatever illusions or delusions that your opium creates for you. Just try not to hate others who don't share it with you.

Oh dear, the same old boring recycled garbage. Yes i use a computer because i have at no point said science is nonsense. i am a scientist myself, that would be odd if all i did was disparage science and cling to the bible.

you base your FAITH in evolution on the fact that someone has been able to make a microprocessor? na wa o. how these folks reason is a mystery, that's if they do at all.

globexl:

You guys are hilarious. I dont hold any beliefs. Let me give you another example. when i was in form science class, we were told that matter exists in three states namely solid, liquid and gas. Today, more than 30 yrs later, other states of matter have been discovered such as plasma and other sub-atomic states. So we know know that matter in many more states than we originally knew. So we have upgraded our thinking to the new knowledge. PLS WAT IS WRONG WITH THAT?
Honestly , religious belief remains very big mystery to me.

when are we going to "upgrade" our thinking to figure out if we were made of gas and water? What is the relevance of your "examples"?

globexl:

Let me give you another analogy: if I come to you and ask you to invest N1m of your money with me and I promise to increase it to ten million naira in one month, what would be your natural response? let me answer for you, you be sceptical because you know that it almost imposible to turn N1m into N10m in a month. You would suspect fraud and you at least demend to know How I'm going to do it and proof that I have done it before. ABI? But If I tell you that you dont need proof , all that you need is to look at the expensive clothes and jewelry am wearing as proof then have faith in me, would any of you posters have over your hard earned N1m to me on blind faith? If your answer is no, then we have something in common: HEALTHY SCEPTISM. The only diffeence is that when it comes to religion, your defences are easily broken because, like most humans, you need something to believe.

incoherent rambling.

Blind faith - the "belief" that you appeared by random earthly events.

Narrowmindedness is locking myself inside a dark closet and believing that to be the beginning and end of the universe. Soon, I begin to see images and forms inside the closet, and  then  I  begin interpret the images and forms in the dark closet to suit my imaginations. Soon, I would forget that the closet is just a small part of a room which is a small part of a house, which is a small part of a street, which is small part of a town or city and which is a small part of a state or province and so on and so forth.

Indoctrinated in what? You keep saying that. If the conviction that 1+1+1=3 is indoctrination, Then I PLEAD GUILTY as charged.
I dont know why you people choose this debate if you have nothing to offer but derogatory remarks.

globexl:

Narrowmindedness is locking myself inside a dark closet and believing that to be the beginning and end of the universe. Soon, I begin to see images and forms inside the closet, and  then  I  begin interpret the images and forms in the dark closet to suit my imaginations. Soon, I would forget that the closet is just a small part of a room which is a small part of a house, which is a small part of a street, which is small part of a town or city and which is a small part of a state or province and so on and so forth.

Indoctrinated in what? You keep saying that. If the conviction that 1+1+1=3 is indoctrination, Then I PLEAD GUILTY as charged.
I dont know why you people choose this debate if you have nothing to offer but derogatory remarks.

narrow-mindedness is having "faith" that you "evolved" from gas and water then going on to mock those who believe they came from sand while crowing about being "logical".

I can see that your heart is already filled with hate. I wonder if this forum is about healthy debates or about venting hate to people who dont share your beliefs.
You have written zero to buttress your beliefs. I 'm eager to learn too

globexl:

I can see that your heart is already filled with hate. I wonder if this forum is about healthy debates or about venting hate to people who dont share your beliefs.
You have written zero to buttress your beliefs. I 'm eager to learn too

1. Where have i expressed "hate"? I doubt you understand what you are talking about.

2. Written zero to buttress my beliefs? where have you buttressed yours?

toba:

An atheist affirmed during our discussion today that 'our argument should be based on facts and logic' Alright, the theists has always being at the receiving end of all manners of questions,its only fair that the atheists reciprocate.

This is because it is the theist that always lay claim to special knowledge. . . . .There was never a time when the God does not exist arguments was made until the theist came with the God exist argument. . .Its funny when the theist always use what people don't know as evidence for his/her God. . .The God that is supposed to answer prayers, heal believers, equip believers with special special signs so that unbelievers will see and believe has now been relegated to the God of the gaps. . . .You are a Christain and when you read the bible the God it talks about is very CLEARLY defined and his role is not the vague nonsense that you guys are always portraying here. . . .Atheism is simply a lack of belief in Gods based on lack of credible evidence. . . Do you have any evidence to show that the creator of the universe assuming the universe has a creator is male, a single entity, has a son and came down as a human to sacrifice himself to himself so that humans can be with him when they die?. . . Do you have any evidence to show that there is any form of consciousnesses that exist outside the brain, which goes on to survive bodily death?. . . .If you do then pls show us. . If you don't then why are you making such claims in the first place?. . .Pointing to a book that was written by so many different authors which so full of contradictions to support your arguments is another waste of time, no?. . .

OK here we go. what are the facts and logic behind atheism? what makes the atheists feel so strong about their beliefs? is their any scientific facts behind atheism? I'm assuming that most of u weren't born into atheism, so what prompted u into atheism? ill pause for now

The facts and logic are very simple, humans have always been inventing Gods to help explain things away to them. . . .There are so many Gods that humans have invented and worshiped some have died and some are alive, example Jesus the son of God that is 3 in one did NOT exist 4000 years ago, that God idea came into existence like 2000 years ago based on older beliefs, Allah the God that is one and wants people to go to Makka and throw stones every year did not exist 2000 years ago,that God came into existence about 1400 years ago, Zeus the ancient Greek God is now dead because nobody believes in him any more, same with Ra the God of the ancient Egyptians  . . .Back in the days Ra was the one and only God, the pyramids and other temples were built by the ancient Egyptians based on their religious beliefs, now we look at those monuments and laugh at their false beliefs of life after death. . . .What about the pantheon of Greek Gods?. . .They all exist as well, no?. . . .

Unbelief is the default position because no body was born with any religious belief, you have to be indoctrinated from childhood to hold unto such beliefs, and the indoctrination is mostly done with fear, believe or you will suffer for eternity when you die, once you believe it becomes your reality . . .What prompted me into atheism is nothing but the FACT that all religions and Gods are man made and as such no God can be shown to exist on its own independent of man made stories, man made cultural and societal acceptance, all the Gods rely on men to do everything for them, they rely on men to teach other men about them, fight for them, build their temples for them, speak on their behalf etc because they are all man made and as such men have to do everything for them,NO God can do and has ever done anything for his/her self its men that are always doing everything for them. . . .The existence of many religions and the fact that people always self project themselves as God shows that the entire thing is man made. . . . .There is no evidence to show that the God you believe in is real and Allah God is false, but because of indoctrination you some how feel your own God is real while the Allah God is false. . . .

mazaje:

This is because it is the theist that always lay claim to special knowledge. . . .

not really. the theist lays claim to a relationship with his God. you are free to ignore this. why does it affect you so?

and which is your god? Ra, Ahura mazda, Amadiora, Kamalu, Shango or Ogun?

If your relationship with your god makes you a better citizen of humanity, then that is great for you and for humanity.

davidylan:

not really. the theist lays claim to a relationship with his God. you are free to ignore this. why does it affect you so?

FALSE. . . . .What is all these claim about personal relationship? It affects me because people from where I come from disparage, call me all sorts of names like devil, say am bad, because I don't believe in this nonsense they call personal relationship and STOP lying because your religion is NOT about personal relationship but about seeking converts,one of its greatest messages to go into the world and convert others, no?. . .How do you convert them without robbing these you personal relationship on their faces?. . . .Your religion tells you that those that do not accept its stories are condemned already and believers go about treating unbelievers as condemned people since their religions say the same, no? Why are kids in Nigeria that are branded as witches killed?. . .The bible says people should kill witches, no?. . .Why are gays maimed in Nigeria, because the bible and Koran say that they deserve it, no?. . .Why are Muslims killing infidels, because the Koran sanctions it, no? Why are christians robbing their religion on people's faces all over Nigeria,because the bible tells them, no? Enough of your personal relationship with God nonsense because it is NOT. . .Look around you and see if it is. . . . .

I prefer to put my faith in Observation, experimentation and analysis than on the tales by moonlight of some tent-dwelling semi-neantherthals some four thousand years ago.

mazaje:

FALSE. . . . .What is all these claim about personal relationship? It affects me because [b]people from where I come from disparage, call me all sorts of names like devil, say am bad, because I don't believe in this nonsense they call personal relationship [/b]and STOP lying because your religion is NOT about personal relationship but about seeking converts,one of its greatest messages to go into the world and convert others, no?. . .How do you convert them without robbing these you personal relationship on their faces?. . . .Your religion tells you that those that do not accept its stories are condemned already and believers go about treating unbelievers as condemned people since their religions say the same, no? Why are kids in Nigeria that are branded as witches killed?. . .The bible says people should kill witches, no?. . .Why are man-loving-men maimed in Nigeria, because the bible and Koran say that they deserve it, no?. . .Why are Muslims killing infidels, because the Koran sanctions it, no? Why are christians robbing their religion on people's faces all over Nigeria,because the bible tells them, no? Enough of your personal relationship with God nonsense because it is NOT. . .Look around you and see if it is. . . . .

because your family chooses to disparage you doesnt mean the rest of us are lying.

Christianity is about a personal faith but it also involves sharing that part of the faith to friends and loved ones as we see fit. When you love something, your first instinct is to share it . . . you're deliberately being spiteful when you say it is about "converting" others like that is some sort of horrible crime. Like i said, deal with your family problems.

davidylan:

because your family chooses to disparage you doesnt mean the rest of us are lying.

Not my family alone, even people here on nairaland keep making statements like imagine this foool saying that there is no God,what kind of foool says that. . .I don't have time going back to quote such. . . . .I am talking about Nigeria a country where some people were fired by a christian governor in Taraba state in 2010 for not attending the normal morning devotion. . . .You are LYING when you say that people do not prosecute atheist in Nigeria just for being atheist. . .After all your bible says its only a foool that says there is no God and your fellow deluded God believers treat those that not believe as fool, cos their religious book says so, no?. . .

Christianity is about a personal faith but it also involves sharing that[b] part of the faith to friends and loved ones as we see fit[/b].

Another lie, when have Muslims, Hindus, Buddhist and other people that do not believe in christianity become friends and loved ones? Where does the bible say that your should teach the faith to friends and loved ones?. . .After all a lot of the stories in your bible are about your God commanding his chosen men to kill others because they worship other Gods, no?. . . .I have a Muslim background and even as a young Muslims christian strangers used to come and "minister" the word of their God to me teling me that I was lost and needed to be saved. . .They still do it all over the world. . .

When you love something, your first instinct is to share it . . . you're deliberately being spiteful when you say it is about "converting" others like that is some sort of horrible crime. Like i said, deal with your family problems.

Sure it is about converting others and one of the ways is by belittling their religions first and foremost. . .All Gods are powerless and Jesus is the only God that is powerful is what they always say, no?. . . .What evidence is there to show that the Jesus God is more powerful than Allah God?. . .If there is no evidence for that then why do christians keep saying it?. . .Its not a family issue but a societal issue, right now in Nigeria religion is destroying the country no?. . . .

toba:

An atheist affirmed during our discussion today that 'our argument should be based on facts and logic' Alright, the theists has always being at the receiving end of all manners of questions,its only fair that the atheists reciprocate. OK here we go. what are the facts and logic behind atheism? what makes the atheists feel so strong about their beliefs? is their any scientific facts behind atheism? I'm assuming that most of u weren't born into atheism, so what prompted u into atheism? ill pause for now

Everybody was born an atheist!!!!!!   It is the indoctrination children get from their parents that turn them into religion.  Sometimes the indoctrination descends to the level of child abuse - the koranic school or madrassas, the sunday schools where stone age myths are drummed into the poor child's brain repeatedly until it becomes second nature.  Very few are brave enough after that to even challenge the basis of these myths because of the fear built into the faith system.  I am happy I have been able to break free of religion.  Another note: You don't need to understand evolution to free yourself of religion.

alaper:

Everybody was born an atheist!!!!!!   It is the indoctrination children get from their parents that turn them into religion.  Sometimes the indoctrination descends to the level of child abuse - the koranic school or madrassas, the sunday schools where stone age myths are drummed into the poor child's brain repeatedly until it becomes second nature.  Very few are brave enough after that to even challenge the basis of these myths because of the fear built into the faith system.  I am happy I have been able to break free of religion.  Another note: You don't need to understand evolution to free yourself of religion.

If he was born into a muslim family from kano, I bet he will be here telling us that there is no God but Allah and muhammed was his last prophet. . . .

mazaje:

Not my family alone, even people here on nairaland keep making statements like imagine this foool saying that there is no God,what kind of foool says that. . .I don't have time going back to quote such. . . . .I am talking about Nigeria a country where some people were fired by a christian governor in Taraba state in 2010 for not attending the normal morning devotion. . . .You are LYING when you say that people do not prosecute atheist in Nigeria just for being atheist. . .After all your bible says its only a foool that says there is no God and your fellow deluded God believers treat those that not believe as fool, cos their religious book says so, no?. . .

Your family is your problem bro.

mazaje:

Another lie, when have Muslims, Hindus, Buddhist and other people that do not believe in christianity become friends and loved ones? Where does the bible say that your should teach the faith to friends and loved ones?. . .After all a lot of the stories in your bible are about your God commanding his chosen men to kill others because they worship other Gods, no?. . . .I have a Muslim background and even as a young Muslims christian strangers used to come and "minister" the word of their God to me teling me that I was lost and needed to be saved. . .They still do it all over the world. . .

matthew 28

mazaje:

Sure it is about converting others and one of the ways is by belittling their religions first and foremost. . .All Gods are powerless and Jesus is the only God that is powerful is what they always say, no?. . . .What evidence is there to show that the Jesus God is more powerful than Allah God?. . .If there is no evidence for that then why do christians keep saying it?. . .Its not a family issue but a societal issue, right now in Nigeria religion is destroying the country no?. . . .

since there is no evidence for evolution why do you and your ilk keep bleating it?

These religious people really have no case to present. They are just here to vent their anger and hate for people who do not share the belief in their stone age fairy tales. They are just here to lash out. You can see it in their choice of words. They never offer any rebuttals to point raised by the other side nor offer anything to buttress their tighlty held beliefs.
Pls Pls pls. Hold on tight to your beliefs if it is what makes and defines your personality. We non-beleivers have no problems with that. Its only when you expect everyone to smoke your opium and bask in your delusions that we fight back with simple questions like: what?who? how? and when? And for two thousand years now, blind faith religion is yet to offer any coherent answer?
You need to get your story straight. You have been editing and redacting (the supposed word of the infallible god)that same story for 1700 yrs now and you have not gotten it straight. An orange tree cannot yield a mango fruit. Truth cannot emanate from something that is fraudulently contrived. To we non-beleivers, it comes as no surprise that there are more than 1000 sects, denominations and versions of this so-called truth, with each one claiming the supremacy of it's own truth over all others. What a monsterosity.

globexl:

These religious people really have no case to present. They are just here to vent their anger and hate for people who do not share the belief in their stone age fairy tales. They are just here to lash out. You can see it in their choice of words. They never offer any rebuttals to point raised by the other side nor offer anything to buttress their tighlty held beliefs.
Pls Pls pls. Hold on tight to your beliefs if it is what makes and defines your personality. We non-beleivers have no problems with that. Its only when you expect everyone to smoke your opium and bask in your delusions that we fight back with simple questions like: what?who? how? and when? And for two thousand years now, blind faith religion is yet to offer any coherent answer?
You need to get your story straight. You have been editing and redacting (the supposed word of the infallible god)that same story for 1700 yrs now and you have not gotten it straight. An orange tree cannot yield a mango fruit. Truth cannot emanate from something that is fraudulently contrived. To we non-beleivers, it comes as no surprise that there are more than 1000 sects, denominations and versions of this so-called truth, with each one claiming the supremacy of it's own truth over all others. What a monsterosity.

its really the other way around. Did anyone drag you away from bed to this place? Why are you here? Forced to listen to stone age tales?

Why are you "fighting back"? Why is this a war in the first place? Is anyone forcing stone age ideas down your head?

Again back to the false claims of you simply asking what? when? who? where? Really? Pls stop that nonsense . . . most of you are brainless braying sheep just parroting misguided opinions of your science gods. Run along and worship at the altar of science . . . you know that science many of you merely struggled to pass in high school.