₦airaland Forum

Xmuslim:
what I have proven on this first verse quoted

1. it was also in the christain bible (not a new quranic invention)

2. it is not 100 percent accurate because the crust is never stable. it is in constant motion. thus, mountain as peg stabilising the crust is a fallacy

3. thee verse is vague. what does it mean by stability. what does the peg mean. it is not self explanatory unless we read our meaning into it. we all know that peg is something driven into the ground from the surface. mountain are not formed that way

We are not yet done

Now you are one going against your own rules and trying to twist narrative to suit your position.

The verse states that:

Wal Jibala awtaddan (And the mountains as pegs)

The preceding verse states that:

"And we have made the earth as a resting place"

Connect the two and figure it out


On the contentious issue of a what a peg is, a peg isn't necessarily driven from the top downward. Whether driven from top downward or down upward, the purpose is what makes it a peg.

According to my we dictionary definition, a peg is a wood, metal or material used to hold or fasten things

Xmuslim:
christian bible came before quran. check out these verses that mention similar thing

Psalm 18:7 The earth trembled and quaked, and the foundations of the mountains shook; they trembled because he was angry.

Job 28:9 : People assault the flinty rock with their hands and lay bare the roots of the mountains.

I also read some stuff about greek or roman civilization regarding this issue and the issue of earth and heaven being together before they were splitted. unfortunatrly I can;t see the reference at the moment so we can coencentrate on the one I gave from the bible.

Muslim argument regarding similarity in the bible is not unknown. ALLAH also reveal the bible so anything that is similar is because it is from the same author but anyting difference is because of the curruption of the bible. I disagree with this.

However, let us concentrate on the validity of the meaning of the verse. whether tafseer and hadith infer the meaning you are giving to the verse[. and whether it is actually inline with the modern geological understanding

Are you trying to equate all those metaporical excerpts from the bible to an undisputable statement of fact in the Qur'an.

Are those the civilizations that you are referring to?


The Qur'an referred to the mountains as pegs on the earth's surface giving it stability in many of its verses, and it takes modern geology over a millennium to discover that, and you are trying to equate that fact with an observe quaking and trembling of the earth which ancient mythologies have already tied to the anger of some gods.

Xmuslim:
any evidencet from islamic tradition to support this claim?

i want us to be as honest as possible. I dont care if there is a verse that support geological phenomenom, but lets stick y to our methodology without reading our own meaning into the quran. perhaps you may quote the tafsir of the verse to support your claim

The word used in that the verse is "Jibala" which is the plural form of mountain. (mountains). "Jabal" is the singular (mountain).

Therefore you are one bringing in your own understanding of weathering which does not apply in this context. I have no need of delving into tafsir to understand a basic concept as this.

In the light of this, what you quoted stand valid still

Xmuslim:
And the mountain as peg. The verse you quoted.

It is in agreement with our understanding of today's geology.

However, it is not 100% correct. Although civilization before Muhammad know about this phenomenon (reference coming).

Mountains are formed due to the eruption of magma usually at convergent plate boundary. These mountain stabilise the crust temporarily (thousands or millions of years) until the mountain develops faults and other structures that may lead to another earthquake especially if it is close to the plate boundary.

My points here are two

1. Civilization knew this before Muhammad

2. It is not 100% correct that mountain stabilise the crust permanently as suggested by the verse quoted

When the Qur'an refers to mountains as pegs, it is not just talking about an individual mountains in solitary, but rather all the entire networks of mountains that define the architecture of the earth's surface..

Therefore, the Idea of the loss in stability of the earth surface due to the wearing off of an individual mountain is inconsistent with logical reasoning. Mountains are the greatest illustrations of stability on the face of the earth. How then could it be possible that the destruction of a mountain which is equally been cancelled by the formations of others can translate to mean temporary stability.

The stability referred to in that verse is permanent till the day that Allah decide to overturn this earth. That is the reason why the crust is still stable beneath you till this point despite is thinness relative to the mantle and core combined.


Which civilization spoke about it before the revelations? I want to learn pls. As a geologist, I am aware that it takes the development of sophisticated geophysical techniques few decades ago to understand the concept of mountain roots which that verse and other similar verses were giving hints about centuries ago.


Your two objections successfully debunked

Xmuslim:
I didn't forget the evidence you requested yesterday. I think I've once quoted on nairaland but I will find it. Just kinda busy ni.

OK.. I will be waiting

Xmuslim:
I would like us to define our approach/methology first.

My proposal. For a verse to be considered a scientific fact. It must pass these tests.

1. No civilization ever mentioned it before Qur'an

2. Muhammad never travel to any civilization that says similar thing in the past

3. It must be explicit (self explanatory) and not generic

4. Early scholars must interpret it to mean what we're infering

What do you think about this proposal. Any ammendment?

I pray that this proof beneficial to you, me and every other observers. Your proposal is fine to work with

Which verse shall we start with ?

I suggest Qur'an 78 vs 7

Xmuslim:
It may interest you guys to know that I was the ameer of my departmental MSSN in my undergraduate. I was also one of the core member of the main MSSN body in the university. I was the ameer of the MCAN of the local government where I served during my NYSC. I don't need your validation but my point is I know Islam more than an average Muslim.

Which institution did you graduate from.

In all honesty devoid of all forms of insults, I am hopeful that you can be helped. Your case is not that bad.

Can we relate off NL?

Xmuslim:
OK. Few hours I will bring the verses.

I'm also a geologist by the way with bachelor and masters degrees. Discussing the geology related verses of the Qur'an between us will be interesting. I will probably open a thread for it

It will be my pleasure

Xmuslim:
too many. Let start from the description of the heavenly bodies. Early Muslims believed the earth is flat and the sky is solid body. They got this interpretation from the Qur'an. Today we know this is a fallacy. Do you need quran verses? Or you know where it's stated in the Qur'an?

Yes I need the Qur'an verse(s).

Xmuslim:
too many. Let start from the description of the heavenly bodies. Early Muslims believed the earth is flat and the sky is solid body. They got this interpretation from the Qur'an. Today we know this is a fallacy. Do you need quran verses? Or you know where it's stated in the Qur'an?

Yes I need the Qur'an verse(s). You should have deemed that necessary.

By the way, I am a geologist, and the Qur'an dealt with the subject matter of geology with pinpoint accuracy touching many of its numerous branches several centuries before the acclaimed father of modern geology

motayoayinde:
I REALLY DON'T KNOW FOR NOW. BUT I'M SURE IF YOU GO TO A GOOD ISLAMIC BOOKSHOP THEY SHOULD BE ABLE TO HELP.

IT'S ACTUALLY AN OLD BOOK, WRITTEN MORE THAN 30 YEARS AGO.

BUT I ASSURE YOU, IT'S A LIFE-CHANGING BOOK.

I will try it out in shaa Allah

May Allah reward you

Xmuslim:
I have read the book when I was a Muslim and it was a very good book. But the book undermine Hadiths and claimed that Hadiths are unscientific.

Well, learned Muslims have moved on because of the fallacy in the claim of the scientific miracles in the Qur'an. Snap out of it


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fyf4gecrY8c

Thank you for your kind response.

Can you kindly point at a scientific point of the Qur'an that is inconsistent with reality?

Let's engage.

motayoayinde:
Dr MAURICE BUCAILLE IS THE AUTHOR OF ONE OF THE MOST FANTASTIC ISLAMIC BOOKS EVER WRITTEN.

THE BOOK IS TITLED "THE BIBLE, THE QUR'AN AND SCIENCE"

IT INVESTIGATES THE SCIENTIFIC FACTS OF THE QUR'AN AND COMPARES WITH THE BIBLE .
IT'S A MUST READ.

How can I get this book my brother.

Very much interested in reading

perdollar:
I can see dt u don't understand Hausa. u can do well to hide like a coward but I wl stl get u. ISIS an Islamic cult wl b learning how to torture to death from me. I saw ur dm on my nairaland statue but when I logged into my email to get ur msg, I saw nothing. paste wat u wrote here on NL n blurry d sensitive one. I want u to die in piece and u r making it more difficult for u. u don't want to die a martyr?

Since you have run out of your borrowed 1mb of senses, this might probably be my last response to you.
But before I go, this is the summary of what I have for you.
1): You can hate islam for all we care, never come online to be constituting e-nuisance in your characteristic nature.
2): Your are just a lousy empty barrel with nothing intelligent to offer.
Now you are permanently ignored till we meet in again. If you are really interested in killing for Christ, explore any of the many available options at your disposal.
May whatever your deserve fall upon you

perdollar:
a useless coward is having a sleepless night bc he would av a nightmare. I wl violate ur body violently. all I need is where u r staying, then trust me to confirm. once my target has been verified I wl send u to hell's way in a most unbelievable way for an unbeliever called kapri. Sai na ci kaniyanka

Empty barrel.

perdollar:
bc u r a coward, u don't want to listen to a simple instruction. if u want to die a martyr without bombing urself in midst of ppl, I am ready to help u. I wl only kidnap u, take u to outskirt of wherever I found u into a thick forest. I wl unbind u, remove d blindfold, give u a dagger while I wl av none and we wl fight, of course ur chances of winning is minus zero. I wl get d knife from u, use it to remove ur two eyes, cut ur two hands, feed u wt ur eyes n hands. I wl open up ur bowel while u r screaming in pain and light it up. finally I wl
behead u and send ur dismembered body to muric, sultan of sokoto, ur worthless family n d security, wt a msg that ' I martyred ds SOAB'

Drop your number let me call you. If you cannot drop your number here, reply to my DM so that I forward my number or you forward yours to mail. I will get it immediately. Or rather send me a DM and I will reply you immediately with my contact, my detailed address, and we schedule a neutral meeting point with date and time. It will really be my pleasure dying at your hand. You got that?

Every possible permutations at your disposal right? If you still have any complaint, you are bloody empty barrel making the loudest noise.

By the way, replying my DM is not a show of friendship. To the contrary, it to consolidate our enmity.. You rather think I would ordinarily sent you a mail as well?

Coward

perdollar:
y r u scared, I gave u my full address, spammers or not. even in ur comfort zone just like in ur fucking religion u r not feeling secured. if u aren't a coward put down ur address as I did and see hellfire catch u n ur entire generation. can u imagine this follower of a generation of a cursed Abraham's son call Ishmael down to a prophet who died on a woman's body after being poisoned is telling me to give him notice, in ur life av u ever bn serious? I want to sacrifice u to allah ASAP. I want to make u a martyr so dt u go to hell and enjoy ur 77 virgin Mr bastard nigga

Bloody idiot! Which of the issue arising about your cultist and blood sucking religion have you been able to address.
I won't get emotional like your "would never do well in life" unfortunate and doomed soul on the issue of wishing hell fire as that is beyond the doing of your entire generation. However, I cannot be so sure that you are one of it candidates since your death has not been announced. If you are unfortunate enough to close eye in death upon this rubbish, then it has finally be you.

perdollar:
y r u scared, I gave u my full address, spammers or not. even in ur comfort zone just like in ur fucking religion u r not feeling secured. if u aren't a coward put down ur address as I did and see hellfire catch u n ur entire generation. can u imagine this follower of a generation of a cursed Abraham's son call Ishmael down to a prophet who died on a woman's body after being poisoned is telling me to give him notice, in ur life av u ever b serious?

Your generational heritage is curse. That is the reason why you are already accursed from your first to the last generation.
You expect my home address or phone contact on this forum because of your goddamn forsaken self, you have a brain tumour then. Where I gave you is location in Nigeria. Meet me there since you have a long reach as you claimed
Drop your contact if you can so that I can give you a call as soon as possible if your cirrhotic liver hasn't gone dysfunctional at this instant.

I have have been man enough. Now the joke is on your doomed soul. I repeat, let see how much you can give against islam since Paul has replaced your brain with that of a fowl.

You are forsaken!

perdollar:
u r just quarreling wt ur keyboard. give me ur address and I wl surprise u. u can surprise me too, u av my address. I am a very long reach. u wl just found ursef in hell suddenly that I assure u. give me ur address n by God, b4 this year, u wl b a concluded issue, no dey scatter mouth yet until we jam. ur pm na useless to me. I sincerely wl waste u.

If you don't or cannot waste me as threatened then you are a bloody bastard. You have a pm sent already, now this the address you are using as an escape mean. Come if you can, I will be expecting you

My address: Meet me at the main gate ABU Zaria at your convenience. I cannot drop my contact here because of spammers but you can use this medium to inform me a day or two before you come.

I repeat, if you don't come as promised, you are bloody bastard.. Before the end of the year right? I will put that in mind.

God punish you. You this accursed soul

LebenNG:
you guys just wanna twin with christians *tongue out*

Shut up! You are talking absolute nonsense.
Look at the hypocrites trying to use their warped logics in posing as virtual Islamic scholars shedding crocodile tears in failed attempts to denounce old testaments from their crafty porn books. But they still refer to the old testaments on the issue of tithes and others that favour, but denounce it when it comes to blood letting.

Remove it from all bible versions then, and give us the updated 2020 latest. I forgot, book of Luke is also in old testament where your god and prince of peace called for the head of those that don't believe him.

Dumb head bible students

LebenNG:
see who is talking about slavery, when the arabs still regard you black headslammers slaves... ouch sorry it hurts. You guys only get things done with force and not grace as christians enjoy, i know how excruciating and muscle-snapping that could be.

And you, don't think that you have made any senses. That your trash didn't warrant any response from me as you did virtually nothing to savage the battered image of your Paul invention called Christianity. None of what I raised in what you quoted were you able to address apart from using the nearest escape route of a see through digression in your characteristics hypocritical nature . Head slammers bla bla?

Yes I am a head slammer for my Creator if you that makes you feel happy. I prefer that to being an hypocrite and a swine eater like you.

We know everything about that nonsense called christianity. Its origin, development, and your so called holy book. Yet, it doesn't appeal to us.

Provoke me enough to get my attention, and you that brother of yours that you are supporting against me will be most welcomed.

perdollar:
he is a working corpse wt hopelessness as his future. am not going on d offensive, I want him to come to my area, I wl only defend myself.

Let start over again.
I would have overlooked all your foolishness and those of your sheep brethren, but the foolishness flowing in your God forsaken and condemned soul would not just allow you.

Be informed that you are not the first and the toughest of christian fanatics, but you only happened to be the most unfortunate. If you are so sure of your true father, curse your soul again with a hopeless hope that it is me, and I will reply that in a million fold to teach you that you don't have the monopoly of foul languages and curses. I will use you to send a message to your fellow accursed brothers and sisters on this forum.

You think I can ever get tired of you or intimated? No you goofed. I only want your deeply situated madness to ooze to the surface so that your fellow accursed souls will see whose is at fault..

By the way, you keep making mouth to be able to deal with me and defend yourself and yet, your are so coward enough to accept my pm so that you can get chance to proof that which you claim. You expect me to be so foolish like you to come to your hut..

Mad man.. God forsake you in your whole pathetic being
Bring it on

heniford2:
if i have the opportunity to kill u muslim believe me ur guys are gonna i would have killed all muslims, but u see my religion do not permit so but believe me soon you muslims will see your waterloo stop quoting me i hate talking with uncircumcised infidel

I wanted to reply you in like tone before to fulfil the principle of an eye for an eye, and blood for blood, but I decided to let you bask in the euphoria of the moment..

But if you make such mistake one more time, I shall have to knock senses into your head.

By the way, you can also kill Muslims, you are only waiting for the right moment.. so why the fuss

perdollar:
ur pm is worthless if u r not going to visit me wt ur allah n mohd. r u tired? SOAB don't be, u must defend ur archaic practice till ur last breath which I intend to fast tract for u so that u go n meet allah, mohd n ur share of d 77 virgins in Al jana

Thank you for wishing me to be with Allah and Muhammad in Jannah... That is my ultimate aim

A big amen to that

Xmuslim:
was it not same Yahweh that revealed those laws. Was he out of his mind during the revelation

I am happy that you have not embraced Christianity my brother. Insha Allah, you will be guided back to islam.. I will love to meet you in the highest level of paradise.. Both of us as neighbors.

Can we meet off NL

perdollar:
u av roasted me online, come over and roast me offline. after u roast me in my place, I wl come to ur place to get roasted too. shey u chop juju instead of quran, u n ur juju or quran wl see proper roasting no b e-roasting. SONOFABITCH. if my insult dey spark sense inside ur head take it.

No! I couldn't make any sense of your craps.
I can see that you are very emotional.. Farewell till meet again in another thread.

My challenge still stand valid, we are not fighting, but you are the one wanting to kill. For you to able to actualise your aim, reply my pm

makjo900:
They know nothing about their religion. How many of them knows the Bible isn't complete and some verses were removed? How knay knows the catholic Bible, protestant Bible, jw Bible etc are all different? Bunch of hypocritical haters

Lol.. You are too much bro.

JUDGEMENT DAY!!!!.

This is what they get when don't follow the injunction of their lord whom they called Jesus when he spoke these words on marble..


"Judge not, so that you shall not be judged. For the measure that you used on others shall be used against you"

In another place in their books, he also said

"Why do you see the specks in your brothers eyes while you have a log in your own eyes"


Instead of them to concentrate on understanding their acclaimed book of God, they are busying fighting against islam which is not aware of their existence.

perdollar:
if u run away again like u did from d other post then u r a loser. I am bigger than islam. so what ever form they come, I simply conquer them. woe betide u if u no show up for my house, I give u 1month to come if not I wl declare u n allah n mohd that I invited, cowards

I will always roast you to death both online and offline. But very soon, some of my brothers will speak word of wisdom to me, and I must oblige because I am not like. Why should I run away from you.

Hey!! Stop cursing me for the last time. Your woe is on you.. I sent you a pm, let's schedule a neutral meeting point from there, I can't come to your house

heniford2:
just tell me one place where christian killed anybody in the name of jesus or God and i will show you millions of where your worthless blood sucking religion killed innocent people in the name of stupid Muhammad,your a foolish ignorant who will never understand how foolish his been brain washed

Let me help the guy out!!
Christians killed thousands of Muslims in the battle of the crusade. Out of your love for blood in Christianity, you went ahead to assimilate the term "crusade" as a major vocabulary and key component of your religion in order to be commemorating the evil deeds of your beloved brothers.

Lord resistance army of Ugadan, Anti Balaka terrorists group of Central African Republic and many other Christian terrorist groups all killed for your god with many scriptural back ups from the books of Lukes, Deuteronomy, Leviticus and many biblical verses.

So what is your point

perdollar:
u r too lazy to b gainfully employed. Jesus approved d stoning to death of d adulterous woman! when u read d Bible like novel just d way u read ur quran,this is d outcome. u av decayed sense Mr jihad

Hahaha haha. Sorry Sir.


Why do you also read Qur'an like novel. Why don't you have the same kind of open mind towards the Qur'an like you do your bible.

Do you think that if islam preaches terrorism, you will still be alive till today... Let me just pity you I have stressed you enough.

jmoore:
Antichristians and their ridiculous obsession with Leviticus.

Which news have you heard of one beheaded because he/she insulted Jesus?


John 18:10 Then Simon Peter, who had a sword, drew it and struck the high priest's servant, cutting off his right ear. (The servant's name was Malchus.)

18:11Jesus commanded Peter, "Put your sword away! Shall I not drink the cup the Father has given me?

Luke 9:53 But the people there did not welcome him, because he was heading for Jerusalem.

9:54 When the disciples James and John saw this, they asked, "Lord, do you want us to call fire down from heaven to destroy them?

"9:55 But Jesus turned and rebuked them.


The above verses shows Jesus Christ showing us example to live as Christians.

Only terrorists will be quick to make reference to Leviticus.

Pls kindly reedit your bible and give us the 2020 latest edition.

Leviticus is actually an embarrassment to your book. Don't forget to remove other war messages in the book of Lukes and the likes

jmoore:
Koran is actually a blasphemy against Jesus. Jesus is the son of God. Islam was founded later and wrote that Jesus was a prophet, which is false and against the Bible.


If you can blaspheme against Jesus, why can't you tolerate others blaspheming against your prophet?

Who wrote the bible? Answer that question first maybe we can pick it up from there.

How is not believing that Jesus is a son of your so called god a blasphemy.. Must I belief in what you belief? Who forced you to belief in Allah or Muhammad.

So insulting a personality hold in reference by billions of follower since 1400 years ago till the end of the world is equivalent to not believing in Jesus share of divinity which you ascribed to him?

I think Nigerian Christians are the real cancer to the world because of your stinking hypocrisy.. Even your slave masters that shoved your acclaimed religion down your throats are not this pitiful