₦airaland Forum

Ihedinobi: Ah thank you for that bit of Scripture from Titus 3:5, that was what I was trying to remember. However, I think that a discussion of regeneration will overburden this little discussion of ours, so I will gladly work with the meaning you provided in the other post.

You do know that the Scriptures say we are saved by grace through (not by) faith. But, that's just hair-splitting sha, although it should help us understand the issue here.

If we believe the Gospel, we will be saved. That is the promise. If we believe, we shall be born from above. And so on. Faith is the hand with which we receive God's Salvation.

When we have believed, God saves us by baptising us with the Holy Ghost. That is what the Scriptures say.

Again, I say, there are two sides to the issue, neither can occur without the other. To be saved,

1. we must believe the Gospel

2. we must be given the Holy Ghost.


Accepting the Gospel is what leads to the pouring out of the Spirit upon the one accepting. But such an one is not saved or born anew until God has poured forth His Spirit. Again, I am not making any inferences, I am stating unbreakable Scriptures.

[size=15pt] At the text in bold where in the Scripture? I want to learn

I believe God saved us by washing of regeneration and renewing( rebirth) of the Holy Spirit...Titus 3:5

Like i said earlier, you are mixing up this experience with baptism...
They are different..at some instances they happen simultaneously( but they are different) and at other instances there is obvious time lapse...

The text in red is very correct...
The only area we need to get clear is that rebirth by The Holy Spirit is different from Baptism of the Holy Spirit.

we have the Scripture as our proof
I say this again..
You cannot be saved but by Rebirth of the Holy Spirit;...but that does not mean you have received the baptism of the Holy Spirit( gateway to power)
Thank You Sir [/size]

Ihedinobi: No sir, that Scripture says clearly that the thing that the disciples should rejoice over is having their names written in heaven. It does not even explicitly state that their names were already written there.
But if we assume that their names were, the Bible also says that names were written in the Book of Life even before the foundation of the world. Do we then conclude that such names were saved before ever they even heard the Gospel?

[size=15pt] I referred you to John 3:15...i can quote lots of scriptures that confirm to us that salvation comes when we believed.
And since the disciples had believed in Jesus before Luke 10:20...I believe Luke 10:20 is another confirmation that these fellows were already saved. Mind you they could not have been saved unless they were born of the Spirit.
(Read Rom 10:9; Mark 16:16; John 6:47, John 1:12)
John 1:12-13...Helps us to understand that to be Born Again( Born of the Spirit, Born of God, New life, regeneration, rebirth, re-born etc.) is by receiving and believing in Jesus Christ.

This goes on to tell us that what happened in Acts 2: 1-4 is a separate experience from salvation.

I want us to look at the scenario in Acts 8:4-17.

Acts 8:12 (KJV)... says..." But when they believed Philip preaching the things concerning the kingdom of God, and the name of Jesus ...they were baptized, both men and women"
We can quickly run to John 1:12-13, Mark 16:16; John 6:47...to know if these guys are saved or not.

Verse 14-15...tels us that the Apostles( Peter and John) had to come all the way from Jerusalem, of course not by plane or any kind of automobile, so you can imagine the time lapse..

Assuming one of those guys (who have received the gospel and believed), had gone to the market to buy guguru or ewedu , when the Apostles came around and he/she didnt not come back until the Apostles had left. Do you know that person) would not have experienced what happened in Acts 8:17, until perhaps another time.
We would be very wrong to say that person is not saved...based on the scripture
This goes on to tell us that salvation and The baptism are separate experiences [/size]

Ihedinobi: I have not opined that receiving the Holy Spirit and believing the Gospel are the same thing. I have said that receiving the Holy Spirit is how we are born again.

Ihedinobi: However, I will add now that believing the Gospel is what allows God to give us the Holy Spirit by Whose entry into our lives we are saved.

Ihedinobi: Well, that is pretty much what we have been saying, that to be saved, two things must happen - we must believe the Gospel and God must respond to our faith with the gift of the baptism of the Holy Spirit.

The latter follows upon the former and is how we are saved. We are not saved until God has fulfilled His Own Part in baptising us in the Holy Ghost.

Ihedinobi: Well, not exactly. The moment we believe God is no longer hindered from giving us the Gift of His Spirit and, in fact, will give us that Gift quickly. But it is the moment we receive this Gift that we are saved.

Ihedinobi: Where does it say in that bit of Scripture in Acts 19 that they were saved? Is that not a conclusion you have drawn based on a conception you have about how we are saved? I'd hoped you could show us using the Scriptures. But it is well.

Ihedinobi: If we accept the New Birth to be the regeneration (I think I remember something that suggests that it is not, but I have to check when I get home from work), then how is the mere fact a human being believes the Gospel the same as being born anew? Or do we birth our own selves?

Ihedinobi: I don't think we are in disagreement here...or are we?

Ihedinobi: My brother, what we have seen must agree with Scripture to count. The baptism of the Holy Spirit is how we are born into the House of God per the Scriptures.



Indeed, there are both.



Amen! And it is by this baptism that men are saved.

[size=15pt] Bro, we are not saved by baptism we are saved by our faith when we believed

John 3:15. Ephesians 2:8
Titus 3:5bKJV)....He saved us by the washing of regeneration and renewing of the Holy Spirit...

This happens when we believed...but it does not mean we av received the baptism...

At least we saw d happenings in Acts of the Apostle...Hope you get it bro [/size]

Ihedinobi: Luke 10:20
Nevertheless, do not rejoice in this, that the spirits are subject to you, but rejoice that your names are written in heaven.

Ihedinobi: John 17:8
For I have given unto them the words which thou gavest me; and they have received them, and have known surely that I came out from thee, and they have believed that thou didst send me.

Acts 2:1-4
And when the day of Pentecost was fully come, they were all with one accord in one place.
2 And suddenly there came a sound from heaven as of a rushing mighty wind, and it filled all the house where they were sitting.
3 And there appeared unto them cloven tongues like as of fire, and it sat upon each of them.
4 And they were all filled with the Holy Ghost, and began to speak with other tongues, as the Spirit gave them utterance.

Ihedinobi: My brother, these Scriptures are one with

Romans 8:9
But ye are not in the flesh, but in the Spirit, if so be that the Spirit of God dwell in you. Now if any man have not the Spirit of Christ, he is none of his.

Do you agree?

Ihedinobi: If you do, can we say that Jesus's words that the Holy Spirit would come to dwell in His disciples later mean that their salvation only became actual at the Pentecost in the third bit of Scripture that you provided?

Ihedinobi: The little problem here is that "and were born again" is actually an addition to the Scriptures here as the quote of that passage below shows

Acts 19:1-6
 And it came to pass, that, while Apollos was at Corinth, Paul having passed through the upper coasts came to Ephesus: and finding certain disciples,
2 He said unto them, Have ye received the Holy Ghost since ye believed? And they said unto him, We have not so much as heard whether there be any Holy Ghost.
3 And he said unto them, Unto what then were ye baptized? And they said, Unto John's baptism.
4 Then said Paul, John verily baptized with the baptism of repentance, saying unto the people, that they should believe on him which should come after him, that is, on Christ Jesus.
5 When they heard this, they were baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus.
6 And when Paul had laid his hands upon them, the Holy Ghost came on them; and they spake with tongues, and prophesied.

Ihedinobi: 1. It is indeed true that the Gospel operates by the power of the Holy Ghost, but the choice to believe and accept it or reject it is entirely the human target's to make.

Ihedinobi: 2. What is regeneration, according to the Scriptures?

Ihedinobi: We agree. The service of the Lord requires the very Life of the Lord Himself, none other is equal to the task.

justsmile: All the same, I know barca can do it! Barca all the way!

[size=15pt]Barca will end up in the Barc-yard [/size]

justsmile: nice to know u know where am coming from!
Just read that passage now..... I can relate to the part that says 'till death do we part' cos that was what that scripture was trying to say. But pls again..... Where in scripture do we. Find 'for better for worse?!'
I think the person that wrote that vow wrote it on it on his/her own understanding and it has no scriptural backing!
Well, since someone wrote that vow, we can also write our own. Its not complusory to use that phrase!
Sincerely, am not a fan to that phrase!
Pls tell me marriage is honourable, its beautiful, its a gift from God to man etc...... Ehen, na that kind thing I wan hear biko!
Pls am not denying the fact that there are no challenges in marriage..... In fact in life generally, we will always face challenges but pls and pls and pls, IMO, there no worse in marriage!
I think my issue here is just the choice of word used in that vow! I just hate the sound of that 'worse' lol......and the way I see pple use it is soooooo annoying! Lol

toba: moi name sounds English.

Meanwhile Bayern vs Barca. Im really nervous.

I pray God allows all German final

[size=15pt] English ko, Arabic ni...u forgot wen u were throwing Yoruba proverbs at HBG abi...NL Toba is not saying d truth

Meanwhile...I see Madrid, bayern for final....Madrid celebarating after d match @wEMBLEY [/size]

justsmile: Thank you in yoruba language 'ose'

[size=15pt] You try [/size]

justsmile: Hey guys
I hv a personal 'beef' with this phrase....'For better for worse'
Pls where in the bible is it written?!
Who even brought this phrase out.... What's the origin?!
Why do some peeps still use it in their marriage vows?! In fact are people still using it in their vows?!
Yea,I know this thread is for singles........am just asking as a concerned single!
Am just being curious!

[size=15pt] u can take it to this thread for discussion https://www.nairaland.com/1114515/christians-chatbox

Meanwhile, i think is just a vow to validate I Corinthians 7:39...i know where u are coming from and ur points [/size]

musKeeto: Have a lovely weekend guys.. Ive got exams.. Sob

delkuf: There is nothing like Holy Ghost baptism. sori for tying like this. any is much it wouldnt go through

justsmile: Oh yea......bring it own!!! Oh pls....is chelsea a club?!! Mtsheww!

[size=15pt] Well I dont know if Chelsea is a club...
But I know we beat Arsenal home and away dis season
We won d UCL and we are d defending champions ( something arsenal has never done )[/size]

justsmile: Yea,arsenal might be trophyless but its just for a while.....we will still bounce back!

justsmile: Is just that this Prof Wenger of ours seem to have some 'spiritual' problem'....lol. Don't just understand him atimes!

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CFCfan: Real Madrid is winning a 10th UCL title, and Mourinho will be the greatest UCL coach of all time!

Hala Madrid!

justsmile: Huh?!!! Say what?!!! Anti-barca?!!!.......nahhhh....this chick right here is a barca fan o! And a correct arsenal fan!..... Let this be the first thing u knw about me!
Well, am glad barca made it!

[size=15pt]Huh! The battle line is drawn.......this young man here as you can see is blue and likes Mourinho...so am partly 4 Madrid and fully Chelsea.

How come u are supporting a trophy-less club Well is good Arsenal fans are loyal [/size]

toba.:
same here. Barca just made it to their sixth successive RECORD semi.

They shd be paired against madrid or Bayern

toba.:
Guys im so happy. For the first time in the history of UCL, 2 German teams makes it to the semi final.

Dortmund Bayern

[size=15pt] And am not happy Barca made it 2 the semi...am anti-Barca ...[/size]

justsmile: What muskeeto needs is an encounter just like Saul.....that's my prayer for him!

musKeeto: lol, my man, whats d condition?

justsmile: Let me give th honour of starting first.....btw, u already hv an overdose of smile, my adding to it will put u at risk!
So what's it gonna be.....NL dag8 or real life dag8........over to young man!

toba: why?

justsmile: My pleasure! Don't worry abt the 'upper cut'....one or two kicks won't hurt u know!
For Toba..... I was also 'joking in a serious a way'..... Anyway....my apology to toba...guess I didn't get his so called 'NL character'....

[size=15pt] Oya na, let it start...who is justsmile? Will she make me smile always, though i already have overdose of that [/size]

HumbledbYGrace: lie

usermane: I hate to say this @camydoll, but your thread is drifting out of it course, that is if its not absolutely gone astray yet. I know, i know, the thread is applaudably 94 pages but it better maintain it purpose for the sake of those who wants it.

toba: i would like to meet that Uj_sizzle. tell her to see me

[size=15pt] Huh? She does not like me [/size]

justsmile: So you see that as an insult huh?!!! Now how is that an insult?!! In case u didn't notice I used the word 'stubborn' in parenthesis..... Meaning it was out of context... Didn't really co note what stubborn literally means. Well, I guess I hv to gv u a lil lecture just to explain that my using 'stubborn' was not insulting! Perhaps u find it difficult to grab a joke or to read things out of context.
And why re u even purporting being insulted. Didn't u claim u could be stubborn atimes?!!!.... Ok, perhaps I should hv written 'stubborn Toba atimes'....
Oh plssss....if I really wanted to insult u... I for just settle down, chop proper fufu before I even start with u....to the extent that u know that u know that u hv just been insulted by Justsmiles!
For ur info, I don't insult people....esp faceless beings on the net. Am too 'cultured' for that. Simply make my contribution and walk away.
But if u actually saw that as insulting.....pardon me. I guess I should just focus on addressing any concern raised on the thread and leave Toba out of it to avoid someone getting 'insulted' again. #straight face#

[size=15pt]Plssss...can I meet you based on d text in bold? but me dey fear upper cut o

BTW...i believe Toba was joking...u got a bit serious [/size]

CFCfan: There's always uj sizzle for toba

[size=15pt] Biko, Uj_sizzle belongs to Muskeeto...i personally endorse that

@Muskeeto...There is a condition attach to it o [/size]

Guitarlife: justsmiles i hope you remember this ? Heheheee toba please don't whip her ooooo. She seems like what you are looking for plus.....

[size=15pt] Where did u fish out dat post from? So Justsmiles sabi Mortal Kombat - This one she wants to give u upper cut...

As for Toba,hmmm...Justsmiles will not fit him, i still insist on Slimyem [/size]

toba.:
thats it. we're now operating on the same frequency.

Im not perfect. l have my buts, one is that im very very stubborn at times. Someone (or even pple) can attest to this. I have to marry my exact opposite in terms of being gentle. i ve always prayed to God to help me overcome. Lots of folks get scared of me as if im a god(online& offline) Aside this, toba is the best package to take home to mama/pastor.